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Old 05-15-2019, 10:43 PM
DSeid's Avatar
DSeid is online now
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 22,959
Originally Posted by you with the face View Post
I’m seeing more and more men talking about this stuff. Men of all stripes saying that they too were raised to believe and act in certain ways that are pretty crappy when sit back and think about it. They don’t seem to shy away from the term toxic masculinity either. Male posters in this thread are examples. The discourse is hardly dominated by a bunch of liberal gals wagging fingers at misbehaving fellas.

At a certain point, one’s reluctance to add to the discourse in a receptive, constructive way does suggest there is more going on than failure to use just the right words to term the phenomenon of concern. In this very discussion, we’re seeing posters deny that men are even socialized to act differently than women. It should make you wonder: Do these posters genuinely believe that gender stereotypes are not applied to men and don’t affect how they are judged? Or is it more likely that their denials are simply knee jerk reactions to anything that validates the idea that those feminists were right and patriarchy is a problem?

And most importantly, would coining just the perfect replacement term for “toxic masculinity” do anything to change their view? I’m going to say no.
I'm not so sure that the discourse is not dominated by "liberal gals" and guys who hope to be considered "woke."

But no question that there will be some who will be unreceptive to these concepts no matter how they are presented, likely a big overlap with people who are unreceptive to the concepts of institutional and implicit racism no matter how they are presented. And some who will be receptive no matter how poorly a concept is popularized.

Most importantly, would some hypothetical perfect other term do more to help some significant additional number be open to consideration of the concepts? My WAG is that most people are somewhere between those two groups and that some significant number would be more open to thinking about the concept in that case. Just like I think that there are some who would be less likely to understand implicit and institutional racism if we referred to the issues as "toxic whiteness" than the terms we do use.