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Old 05-16-2019, 07:07 AM
monstro is online now
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Richmond, VA
Posts: 20,965
Originally Posted by you with the face View Post
Neither [bVelocity[/b] nor msmith537 are particularly known for acting “woke”, but they are engaging the subject receptively.

You are probably not going to see that clearly when you start out biased, though. Everyone you disagree with is going to look female and progressive if you’re in the habit of dismissing females and progressives.
I think this is a true. The whole concept sounds like "liberal hogwash" to the conservative ear because their minds have already been poisoned against feminism and feminist theory.

But if someone like Jordan Peterson--someone with conservative bonafides-- preached against "toxic masculinity" and framed it in the context of being a better father, brother, citizen, or Christian, there's no doubt in my mind that the denialists here would be more accepting of it.

Because there is nothing controversial about, "Look, brothers. Stoicism is wonderful, but it's also wonderful to admit you need help. We guys often think have to take on all the problems of the world with a stone face. But that's so not healthy. It's not healthy for us or the people who love us. It's toxic."

Someone needs to start preaching this. The skyrocketing suicide rate among middle-age white guys indicates that someone needs to start doing something differently. Denial certainly isn't helping anyone.

Maybe it's not even necessary to say "toxic masculinity" to call out problematic behaviors. But I really do think this is a case of a term being OK for some people to use (conservative men) and not OK for others to use (liberal women). In other words, it's not the message that's problematic. It's the perceived messenger.