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Old 01-17-2020, 02:44 PM
BeepKillBeep is offline
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Canada
Posts: 3,042
I thought I would jot down some of my own thoughts on this since I have a bit of time.

There are about 300,000,000 people in the USA. Suppose that 1% of the American population thinks that the list I provided (or whatever else) rises to an attack on America worthy of violent uprising. That, 3,000,000 people. It is estimated that about 40% of Americans own a firearm. [1] So, 40% of 3,000,000 is 1,200,000 revolutionaries. Let's say 1% is too high and lower it to 0.1%. That's still 120,000. or 0.01%, that's 12,000. Where are the revolutionaries?

There's only, in my mind, two possibilities. Neither are good for the argument that civilian firearm ownership stops a the American gov't from taking your rights and freedoms.

1. Civilian gun owners won't revolt over the erosion of rights and freedoms; or,
2. Nothing on the list rises to revolt worthy.

Obviously, if it is the first option, then civilian firearm ownership doesn't protect other rights and freedoms. So, let's examine the second option.

If the items on that list are not serious enough, then what is? And how does a gun owner know that's they've reached that critical point? How does a gun owner know they've reached the critical mass of people to be successful (yes I've conceded that a violent civilian uprising would succeed but certainly not by one dude with a red bandada and an M60)?

This is a really critical issue. It is already quite clear that the government is quite capable of intercepting and decrypting (domestic) terrorist messages. We just saw one on the news where they busted up a violent white nationalist cell (I'm disgusted to say a former Canadian soldier was involved). How do you get a resistance started when the government has already gone as far as they have? Is it already too late?

If you act on your own, then you lose. If you act too late, then you lose. There's a critical point where a resistance needs to act, but it seems impossible for such a resistance to start. The government is already capable of monitoring a hypothetical revolutionary cell and branding them terrorist. And Americans have already been indoctinated to accept that when the governments brands somebody terrorist, then they are a terrorist. Not that they would need much convincing. Certainly a news article say, 50 guys and gals with red bandanas and AR-15s planned to shoot up the, I don't know, state legislature aren't going to get much sympathy from the American public.

In other words, they time to act, enough is enough, is incredibly subjective. There's no real objective measure to say, ok, they've eroded enough of my freedoms. So for any individual gun owner to act is incredibly difficult. And for gun owners to organize is already very difficult. There's a whole apparatus designed to keep domestic terrorists from becoming a threat to the state.

So I maintain, that gun owners cannot act. There's never a clearly sensible objective point to go for it. No, rather is is subjective, and then requires coordination. It requires the would be revolutionary to gather like-minded people (ideally with their own red bandanas). It is very difficult, if not impossible, to organize with the actions already taken by the government. Soooooo, if I think this way, then where are the revolutionaries? Where are the people who think the government has already gone too far? They've taken away your right to violently rise up!

Ultimately, I just think this idea that a bunch of civilians with guns will rise up to overthrow a tyrannical government is impossible in practice in the real-world. It is quite clear that Americans, like everybody else I'm not picking on Americans, are quite content to have their rights eroded so long as they can have a 65" TV, potato chips and watch Bonanza reruns. People revolt when they're starving. People do not react to a slow erosion, as we're currently seeing, and by the time you might want to act, it is incredibly difficult. The entire government apparatus is already designed to stop small groups of terrorists.