Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #551  
Old 10-11-2018, 08:37 AM
Knowed Out's Avatar
Knowed Out Knowed Out is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: North Kakkalakee
Posts: 13,277
Are Biotop and snfaulkner trying to avoid falling into some sort of post-count formula?

and why are you guys camel humping date terms?
  #552  
Old 10-11-2018, 08:44 AM
snoe snoe is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 1,063
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo View Post
I think these two posts don't match up. If Mahaloth feels scum tends to play just like town, then thinking somebody is "definitely" town because they're making a case is sketchy.

Regarding Biotop, I'm having a lot of trouble viewing his posting last night as anything other than post-padding, which feels scummy to me. Objectively, post-padding is perhaps a null tell since town could also benefit from it, but any kind of game manipulation feels scummy to me in a general sense.

As town, we have zero tools at our disposal outside of the lynch. I currently feel that a Biotop lynch, as scum or town, will give us the most potential information. It will tell us about Hi, Neighbor and will tell us about Mahaloth.

I'm not at all certain that Biotop is scum, but he's at least got a weak case sticking to him. I do feel that he's our best lynch in a very bad situation.
Sounds good to me. And good point about post-padding too; I had forgotten that was a thing to worry about. I just thought Biotop’s recent stuff might be chaff — or down to booze, or severe nostalgia, or...

(I mean, if you want to scum-hunt based on “how so and so always plays,” maybe that’ll work for you. It seems like a hard pull to convince others who lack your specific experiences, though. And it should be trivial to game other players who do this — it’s easy to change up your persona/style/whatever on an online game.)
  #553  
Old 10-11-2018, 08:56 AM
Mahaloth Mahaloth is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: 地球
Posts: 28,967
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biotop View Post
And yet, even after the recent Ghost Game, Mahaloth is so convinced of my honesty that he posts over and over he thinks I am Town. You don't find that odd?
Uh...I did say that I have some doubt, but really I find sometimes I have to just take chances and go forward with my feeling.
  #554  
Old 10-11-2018, 10:23 AM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoe View Post
Sounds good to me. And good point about post-padding too; I had forgotten that was a thing to worry about. I just thought Biotop’s recent stuff might be chaff — or down to booze, or severe nostalgia, or...

(I mean, if you want to scum-hunt based on “how so and so always plays,” maybe that’ll work for you. It seems like a hard pull to convince others who lack your specific experiences, though. And it should be trivial to game other players who do this — it’s easy to change up your persona/style/whatever on an online game.)
Post padding in this type of game is not Scummy. It is beneficial to your team and thus neutral.
  #555  
Old 10-11-2018, 10:30 AM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mahaloth View Post
Relevant, but his case on me is genuine enough to still convince me he is Town. I admit you do give me doubts, though.
Mahaloth, you are convinced and you have a doubts. You can be one or the other, but not both.
  #556  
Old 10-11-2018, 10:31 AM
Hi, Neighbor!'s Avatar
Hi, Neighbor! Hi, Neighbor! is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: PA
Posts: 1,130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biotop View Post
Post padding in this type of game is not Scummy. It is beneficial to your team and thus neutral.
Simply posting to get your post totals up does seem scummy, though, since it is THE tie-breaker. So all other things being equal, a scum player who has amassed some votes would want a high post total, no?

It makes lynching scum slightly more difficult, because not only do we have to vote for scum, we also have to make sure there are 1.) no ties in the votes, and 2.) if there are ties, that the scum we are targeting has less posts.

Question to the veterans - is post count the standard tie-breaker? Or is that unique to this game?
  #557  
Old 10-11-2018, 10:39 AM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi, Neighbor! View Post
Simply posting to get your post totals up does seem scummy, though, since it is THE tie-breaker. So all other things being equal, a scum player who has amassed some votes would want a high post total, no?

It makes lynching scum slightly more difficult, because not only do we have to vote for scum, we also have to make sure there are 1.) no ties in the votes, and 2.) if there are ties, that the scum we are targeting has less posts.

Question to the veterans - is post count the standard tie-breaker? Or is that unique to this game?
It is unique to this game.

Why wouldn't Town also want to have the most posts in a tie-breaker?
  #558  
Old 10-11-2018, 10:49 AM
Hi, Neighbor!'s Avatar
Hi, Neighbor! Hi, Neighbor! is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: PA
Posts: 1,130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biotop View Post
It is unique to this game.

Why wouldn't Town also want to have the most posts in a tie-breaker?
Nothing wrong with having a high number of posts. I thought we were discussing padding specifically. Goes back to the quality over quantity thing. It's sometimes hard to discern who is intentionally padding, though.
  #559  
Old 10-11-2018, 10:53 AM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi, Neighbor! View Post
Nothing wrong with having a high number of posts. I thought we were discussing padding specifically. Goes back to the quality over quantity thing. It's sometimes hard to discern who is intentionally padding, though.
Again, padding is not Scummy. If you find yourself in a tie, you want to have the most posts regardless of your side.
  #560  
Old 10-11-2018, 10:59 AM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
If you find yourself in a tie, quality won't mean squat.
  #561  
Old 10-11-2018, 11:05 AM
Hi, Neighbor!'s Avatar
Hi, Neighbor! Hi, Neighbor! is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: PA
Posts: 1,130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biotop View Post
Again, padding is not Scummy. If you find yourself in a tie, you want to have the most posts regardless of your side.
Padding = posting for the sake of posting. Posting in itself isn't bad, per se. But if you are just posting to get your count up, it doesn't really do much in terms of helping out your side.

Here is when post padding can look scummy:

Say someone had no votes or perhaps very few Day 1. Also, they were mostly silent and didn't post much.

Now Day 2 comes along and they have some votes. They might even have the most votes. All of a sudden their post count shoots up. I could see that as being a bit scummy. Now all of a sudden post count matters for them.
  #562  
Old 10-11-2018, 11:20 AM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi, Neighbor! View Post
Padding = posting for the sake of posting. Posting in itself isn't bad, per se. But if you are just posting to get your count up, it doesn't really do much in terms of helping out your side.

Here is when post padding can look scummy:

Say someone had no votes or perhaps very few Day 1. Also, they were mostly silent and didn't post much.

Now Day 2 comes along and they have some votes. They might even have the most votes. All of a sudden their post count shoots up. I could see that as being a bit scummy. Now all of a sudden post count matters for them.
We will have to disagree on this, and I see it as a flaw in this type of rule.

Let's say you are Town and not posting much. You get votes and find yourself in a possible tie situation. Post count suddenly DOES matter to you. Should you just resign yourself to losing a tie and creating a mislynch? What about if you really consider the other candidate Scum?

Sure everyone should post a lot. But they don't. That's why "lynch the lurker" does not work very well.
  #563  
Old 10-11-2018, 11:31 AM
Hi, Neighbor!'s Avatar
Hi, Neighbor! Hi, Neighbor! is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: PA
Posts: 1,130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biotop View Post
We will have to disagree on this, and I see it as a flaw in this type of rule.

Let's say you are Town and not posting much. You get votes and find yourself in a possible tie situation. Post count suddenly DOES matter to you. Should you just resign yourself to losing a tie and creating a mislynch? What about if you really consider the other candidate Scum?

Sure everyone should post a lot. But they don't. That's why "lynch the lurker" does not work very well.
Yeah, I can agree with you that it's a bit of a flaw.

At the end of Day 1, I was in a tie with Stranger, but he had me beat in post count. I could have spammed like 30+ posts or something to break the tie, and I guess wouldn't have broken the rules, but it would have looked ridiculous. And he could have just spammed right back. I don't really think that's how it should be played out, but desperate times call for desperate measures I suppose.

Gonna try to do a quick vote/post tally before lunch.
  #564  
Old 10-11-2018, 11:40 AM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
Here is why padding is bad practice for both town and scum:

A townie should have lots of posts because they are posting lots of good content which can later be analyzed for clues. Remember that a townie has nothing to fear from making good faith arguments, even if they're bad.

If all townies are only writing substantive posts, then scum will also have to write substantive posts. The problem is that scum are always making bad faith arguments, so the more they post the worse it is for them.

If town declares that padding is good (or neutral) because everyone should want a high post count, they are creating camouflage for scum. And that's bad.
  #565  
Old 10-11-2018, 11:49 AM
Hi, Neighbor!'s Avatar
Hi, Neighbor! Hi, Neighbor! is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: PA
Posts: 1,130
Post count for JUST DAY 2. These don't include Night 1 posts.

Biotop: 43
snfaulkner: 29
snoe: 21
Mahaloth: 16
Hi, Neighbor!: 11
Johnny Bravo: 9
Knowed Out: 6
Sunny Daze: 5

Voting remains:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronos View Post
Mahaloth: 2 (Biotop 421, Hi, Neighbor 432)
snfaulkner: 0 (snoe 449-451)
Knowed Out: 0 (snoe 451-495, Sunny Daze 485-504)
Hi, Neighbor: 2 (Mahaloth 452, snfaulkner 460-529, Knowed Out 474)
Biotop: 4 (snoe 495, Johnny Bravo 503, Sunny Daze 504, snfaulkner 529)
  #566  
Old 10-11-2018, 12:08 PM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo View Post
Here is why padding is bad practice for both town and scum:

A townie should have lots of posts because they are posting lots of good content which can later be analyzed for clues. Remember that a townie has nothing to fear from making good faith arguments, even if they're bad.

If all townies are only writing substantive posts, then scum will also have to write substantive posts. The problem is that scum are always making bad faith arguments, so the more they post the worse it is for them.

If town declares that padding is good (or neutral) because everyone should want a high post count, they are creating camouflage for scum. And that's bad.
Yes. But the rule encourages it. The rule also encourages Scum to kill the highest post count player who is not Scum.

So if Town were to post only quality substantive posts and Scum were forced to compete in that way, we have then the normal way Mafia should be played anyway. A special rule that encourages gaming the system is not helpful.
  #567  
Old 10-11-2018, 01:20 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
The rule encourages us to game the system, but if town refuses to pad then padding becomes a strong scum tell. Therefore I will state that I consider padding a scum tell and will refuse to do it myself. I see no other good solution.
  #568  
Old 10-11-2018, 01:55 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
Oh, and snfaulkner is correct: my game was on an island, not on a planet.

I mean, most islands are on planets. But you get what I mean.
  #569  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:08 PM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo View Post
Oh, and snfaulkner is correct: my game was on an island, not on a planet.

I mean, most islands are on planets. But you get what I mean.
I played that whole game thinking the ship was a spaceship I am pretty sure.
  #570  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:22 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
Well, skimming is a scum tell. :P
  #571  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:40 PM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
I am disappointed Sunny Daze did not come back.

Suspect list in this order (from most to least). If I have not commented on the players it is based on gut reads with regards to their overall tone. I would have suspected those who know me to have taken my thoughts more seriously.

1. Mahaloth
2. SNF
3. Sunny Daze
4. Johnny Bravo
5. Snoe
6. Knowed Out
7. Hi Neighbor!
  #572  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:47 PM
Sunny Daze's Avatar
Sunny Daze Sunny Daze is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Bay Area Urban Sprawl
Posts: 11,307
I am back. I find it interesting that your list is so different from everyone else's, Biotop.
  #573  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:53 PM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunny Daze View Post
I am back. I find it interesting that your list is so different from everyone else's, Biotop.
I find it interesting too. I hope someone does something with the list. I was on vacation and still managed to play and give it my best shot. I played and tried. Those who remain owe it to me to finally consider my posts.
  #574  
Old 10-11-2018, 02:59 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
Biotop, if you flip town I promise to look very closely at Mahaloth tomorrow.
  #575  
Old 10-11-2018, 03:09 PM
Hi, Neighbor!'s Avatar
Hi, Neighbor! Hi, Neighbor! is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: PA
Posts: 1,130
Just as a last minute plea here to reconsider your votes on Biotop - think about what we'd be losing if he's lynched.

I think he really stepped up today. I know I talked about post padding and how I it doesn't really help much... I wouldn't consider Biotop's posts today as padding. He's been very active and has answered and acknowledged everyone in Day 2. It really might be a quiet Day 3 if he's lynched.

And I firmly agree with Johnny Bravo's sentiments:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo View Post
Here is why padding is bad practice for both town and scum:

A townie should have lots of posts because they are posting lots of good content which can later be analyzed for clues. Remember that a townie has nothing to fear from making good faith arguments, even if they're bad.

If all townies are only writing substantive posts, then scum will also have to write substantive posts. The problem is that scum are always making bad faith arguments, so the more they post the worse it is for them.

If town declares that padding is good (or neutral) because everyone should want a high post count, they are creating camouflage for scum. And that's bad.
Take Biotop out of the equation, and what do we have? Not a whole lot, I'm afraid. Not only is he chiming in, but he's also doing a good job involving everyone else.

Although if the vote goes through and Biotop ends up being scum, it's admittedly going to look very bad for me.
  #576  
Old 10-11-2018, 03:10 PM
Biotop's Avatar
Biotop Biotop is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Faber, VA
Posts: 7,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo View Post
Biotop, if you flip town I promise to look very closely at Mahaloth tomorrow.
Why are you and SNF both so sure you will be around toMorrow?

And after you look at Mahaloth toMorrow (assuming you live), be prepared to answer why you did not look at it before toMorrow. And ask Sunny Daze the same. And also ask why Scum kill whomever they kill toNight. And why they didn't kill someone else.

I'm done now.
  #577  
Old 10-11-2018, 03:14 PM
snoe snoe is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 1,063
I’ll be on a flight without WiFi. Hope the EOD and flip go well. I am of course second-guessing but I still think it’s our best choice.
  #578  
Old 10-11-2018, 03:17 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biotop View Post
Why are you and SNF both so sure you will be around toMorrow?
I find it tiresome to always append forward-looking posts with "if I survive the night."

Like a teenager in a movie about racing his dad's car down Dead Man's Bluff in the middle of the night to impress his girlfriend, I'm pretty sure I'm going to live forever.
  #579  
Old 10-11-2018, 03:55 PM
Hi, Neighbor!'s Avatar
Hi, Neighbor! Hi, Neighbor! is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: PA
Posts: 1,130
No flurry of activity to end the day like last time? It seems the scum are content with the day's result.
  #580  
Old 10-11-2018, 04:05 PM
Hi, Neighbor!'s Avatar
Hi, Neighbor! Hi, Neighbor! is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: PA
Posts: 1,130
If Biotop ends up being town, here is who voted for him:

Biotop: 4 (snoe 495, Johnny Bravo 503, Sunny Daze 504, snfaulkner 529)

Johnny Bravo got things going (#503).

Sunny Daze immediately followed (#504).

snfaulkner with the insurance vote (#530).

That all happened recently and in rapid succession. So yeah, just make a mental note of that.
  #581  
Old 10-11-2018, 04:07 PM
Chronos's Avatar
Chronos Chronos is online now
Charter Member
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: The Land of Cleves
Posts: 80,131
So, hey, how about that Biotop guy? Maybe he made that last-minute vote switch to save a Scum teammate! Or maybe he was just engaging in some crazy scheme to make it look like he was saving a Scum teammate! Or maybe it wasn't a crazy scheme, and that's just what he wanted us to think... That's exactly the kind of convoluted plan a Scum Biotop would come up with. So we'd better lynch him!

Or maybe he wasn't Scum after all. Yeah, that one's possible, too.

Biotop, Townie, is dead

Night 2 begins now, and will end on Saturday at 12 noon.
  #582  
Old 10-11-2018, 04:12 PM
Chronos's Avatar
Chronos Chronos is online now
Charter Member
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: The Land of Cleves
Posts: 80,131
Post totals for Day 2:

snfaulkner 29
Biotop 48
snoe 22
Johnny Bravo 14
Hi, Neighbor! 15
Sunny Daze 6
Mahaloth 16
Chronos 5
Knowed Out 6
  #583  
Old 10-11-2018, 06:22 PM
snfaulkner's Avatar
snfaulkner snfaulkner is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: 123 Fake Street
Posts: 6,943
Well shit. Sorry Biotop!
  #584  
Old 10-11-2018, 06:58 PM
Sunny Daze's Avatar
Sunny Daze Sunny Daze is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Bay Area Urban Sprawl
Posts: 11,307
Damnit. I wanted to ask him a question. Sorry Biotop.
  #585  
Old 10-11-2018, 08:04 PM
Mahaloth Mahaloth is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: 地球
Posts: 28,967
Sorry, Biotop.
  #586  
Old 10-11-2018, 08:07 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
Hopefully your death will not be in vain, Biotop.

Despite my earlier bluster I do intend on posting an analysis before the night is over. We're going to be very close to the wire toMorrow and I want to get my thoughts out there in case I don't make it.
  #587  
Old 10-11-2018, 08:25 PM
Mahaloth Mahaloth is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: 地球
Posts: 28,967
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo View Post

Despite my earlier bluster I do intend on posting an analysis before the night is over. We're going to be very close to the wire toMorrow and I want to get my thoughts out there in case I don't make it.
It might be wise, maybe we all should share our thoughts.

Mine would be that we should lynch someone in that rush of Biotop votes.

Or Hi, Neighbor, who I still suspect. Neighbor and someone in that Bio vote-block is where I think scum are.
  #588  
Old 10-12-2018, 08:22 AM
Knowed Out's Avatar
Knowed Out Knowed Out is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: North Kakkalakee
Posts: 13,277
So we've lynched two townies, and the third one died under mysterious circumstances. Salem all over again.

In the meantime, Hi Neighbor is still sitting in his rocking chair, smiling a "what, me worry?" grin, wearing his joyful red sweater, reading stories to children. How has this person successfully diverted attention and caused some poor innocent to suffer the fate intended for him? Hmmmm?
  #589  
Old 10-12-2018, 08:24 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
I promised Biotop that I would look closely at Mahaloth, so let's do that.

Mahaloth only had one vote on D1. It was the first vote on Stranger, who we know was town. Mahaloth was the quietest overall poster on D1 as well. Basically, full-on lurking. Let's look at every single one of his posts. These notes are purely stream-of-consciousness with no filter or analysis.

D1

#85: Mahaloth strongly defends snfaulkner from Stranger on a Train. "Come on, no way."
#96: Votes Stranger for the vote previously mentioned. Comments that it's a very quiet game.
#178: Says D1 is a crapshoot.
(#159: this is where Prof. P votes Mahaloth for being so quiet)
#179: Says he's really busy, and doesn't have "any big response" for accusations of being quiet.
(#180: this is where Biotop votes Mahaloth for being so quiet)
#183: More talk about D1 being a crapshoot.
#194: Says he wishes he hadn't started the crapshoot conversation because it made Biotop "jump [on him] like a maniac."
#227: Just some talk about the huge game.
#281: Mahaloth doesn't understand why he has votes on him.
#285: Mahaloth still doesn't understand why he has votes on him.

D2

#425: Biotop is probably town because he's being way too aggressive to be scum.
#427: Mahaloth says he was quiet because he didn't want to get lynched early for saying something wrong.
(#428: this is where Johnny Bravo points out that's not the reason Mahaloth gave earlier)
#431: Mahaloth says he had two reasons for being quiet.
#433: Mahaloth has "no way to respond" to the votes on him. Also, Biotop is still town.
#436: Doesn't regret voting for stranger. Can't stop the Biotop vote train on him.
#441: Has zero readon Johnny Bravo.
#452: Votes Hi, Neighbor! for "fabricating a vote on me."
#455: Gives justfication for said vote.
#456: I'm not sure what this is.
#458: Tells snoe that "it's cool" if he doesn't agree with the vote on Neighbor.
#486: That Biotop guy? He's still town.
#498: Scum tends to play just like town. "Is this pretty much everyone's experience?"
#501: Have I mentioned that Biotop is town?
#507, #509: Biotop-led post-padding party.
#553: Mahaloth has "some doubt" about Biotop being town, but is going with his gut.

Analysis to follow, maybe sooner or maybe later.

Last edited by Johnny Bravo; 10-12-2018 at 08:25 PM.
  #590  
Old 10-12-2018, 08:31 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
The main thing that jumps out at me is that Mahaloth was early, strong, and consistent in his defense of Biotop as town. He says in post 553 that he has 'some doubt' about it, but this does not line up with his posting record.

I'd also like to bring up the D1 lurking. Mahaloth has two stated reasons for being quiet.

Reason 1: he was very busy and has no big response for why he was lurking.
Reason 2: This wasn't given until Day 2 - he was quiet because he didn't want to be lynched early.

It is fair to point out that these reasons are not contradictory.

I also notice that Mahaloth said a number of times that he simply had nothing to say about/no way to defend himself from votes on him. He did it in 281, 285, 433, and 436.

Followup to follow.
  #591  
Old 10-12-2018, 08:38 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
Okay. Let's read Mahaloth's as scum and see what fits.

The Biotop defense.

This was too strong, too consistent, and too sure of itself. In post #452 he votes Hi, Neighbor for "fabricating a vote" but refuses to consider Biotop town despite what Mahaloth acknowledges to be very aggressive play, accusing him of jumping on him like a maniac, and attempting to lead a train against him.

Verdict: consistent with scummy perfect knowledge.

Day 1 Lurking:

Mahaloth's reasons for lurking evolved over time. Despite having apparent multiple reasons for the lurking, he still (per his last two D1 votes) doesn't understand why he's being voted for. If his lurking was intentionally defense, as he claims, then posts 281 and 285 ring false.

Verdict: consistent with scummy shifting motivations.

The no-defense defense.

Mahaloth says several times that he can't defend himself from votes, even when things are looking kind of bad for him.

Verdict: consistent with scum not wanting to give the appearance of "flailing."

---

Final verdict: a scum read of Mahaloth holds up.
  #592  
Old 10-12-2018, 08:47 PM
Mahaloth Mahaloth is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: 地球
Posts: 28,967
I never know what to say. I still think it is Hi, Neighbor! and one of the Biotop voters. No idea which Biotop voter, but one of them.
  #593  
Old 10-12-2018, 08:54 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
There are current six living players who are not you. If I bold everyone in that list who is also in your scum pool (Hi, Neighbor and the Biotop voters), we get this:

SNF
Sunny Daze
Johnny Bravo
Snoe

Knowed Out
Hi Neighbor!

In other words, everyone except Knowed Out.
  #594  
Old 10-12-2018, 08:55 PM
Mahaloth Mahaloth is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: 地球
Posts: 28,967
Well, I would start by lynching Hi, Neighbor! tomorrow. Can we at least wait to see who survives the night, though?
  #595  
Old 10-12-2018, 08:56 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
By the way, to everyone else:

The only reason I'm posting this is because I felt I had some insight that was worth adding before the scum kill order went in. Whether you agree or disagree with my analysis, it's probably best to wait until dawn to say so unless you also feel the value of your comment is worth painting a target on your back.
  #596  
Old 10-13-2018, 01:37 AM
Sunny Daze's Avatar
Sunny Daze Sunny Daze is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Bay Area Urban Sprawl
Posts: 11,307
Johnny thank you for putting all of that together. I'll keep my thoughts to myself until toMorrow, as you suggest.
  #597  
Old 10-13-2018, 12:10 PM
Chronos's Avatar
Chronos Chronos is online now
Charter Member
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: The Land of Cleves
Posts: 80,131
Vinnie: Hey, Books, what was that execution method you were telling me about?
Books: Scaphism, Boss. The ancient Persians used it to kill those guilty of regicide.
Vinnie: Ah, yes. Now let me see... We need to stick snoe to a tree with honey, and then force-feed him nails and flies, right?
Books: Uh, Boss, I think you might mean that the other way around?
Vinnie: Are you saying I'm mistaken? After all we've been through, you doubt my decisions?
Books: No, no, you've got it exactly right, Boss. Just like you say.

The villagers awoke just in time to see the honey gluing snoe to the tree finally give way, whereupon he fell to the ground and cracked his skull open. Three flies obligingly flew over to investigate the splattered brain matter.

snoe, a Townie, is dead

Day 3 begins now, and will end on Thursday, 18 October, at 4:00 PM.

Current post counts:
snfaulkner 91
Biotop 87
snoe 77
Stranger On A Train 66
Prof. Pepperwinkle 65
Johnny Bravo 51
Hi, Neighbor! 39
Mahaloth 33
Sunny Daze 33
Chronos 29
Knowed Out 21
Dead Cat 3
Pleonast 1
  #598  
Old 10-13-2018, 12:31 PM
Johnny Bravo's Avatar
Johnny Bravo Johnny Bravo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: The Swamp
Posts: 7,563
vote Mahaloth
  #599  
Old 10-13-2018, 02:28 PM
Knowed Out's Avatar
Knowed Out Knowed Out is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: North Kakkalakee
Posts: 13,277
Snoe may have been innocent, but he serves as example for what happens when you cast the wrong aspersions. >:-)

I've suspected a certain bad apple all along, and my vote has not changed.

Vote Hi, Neighbor
  #600  
Old 10-13-2018, 03:24 PM
Mahaloth Mahaloth is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: 地球
Posts: 28,967
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo View Post
vote Mahaloth
Why?

Just kidding, I read it. Are we about to potentially lose here? I mean, are we at lynch-or-lose at this point? Because you make a very well laid out case, but like so many, it really just stuff that happened, not stuff that means I'm scum.

I won't be around this Thursday at all, much like the last ones. This week, I have a very late Cross-Country meet that will take me away almost the entire day. I hope we don't have a bunch of last minute shenanigans. Watch for people moving votes late.

Oh, get this. I am putting Bravo in the "town" side because his case seems like one Town would make. Kind of like Biotop's did. I could be wrong, but I really think I have a diffrent thought for today.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Knowed Out View Post
Snoe may have been innocent, but he serves as example for what happens when you cast the wrong aspersions. >:-)

I've suspected a certain bad apple all along, and my vote has not changed.

[COLOR"Blue"]Vote Hi, Neighbor[/COLOR]
Yes, I think Neighbor is the way to go today. I still can see him scrolling back to find a reason to "second vote" me the other Day.

Vote Hi, Neighbor!
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:29 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@straightdope.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Copyright © 2018 STM Reader, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017