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Old 11-30-2019, 01:49 AM
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Are Silent Gen less right winged leaning than Boomers?


Quick question, is this at all true?

I know, the silent gen republicans are the lowest of support for marijuana legalization, however most silent gen people I've met have been democrats leaning further left than most boomers and gen X. Off the top of my head I can cite Bernie Sanders and Tom Willett.

Assuming my the premise Silent gen is more left leaning than boomers, why is that? Is it because they lived under FDR and saw the fucked up shit the world was doing before we established the UDHR and basic human and civil rights?
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Old 11-30-2019, 04:47 AM
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Am I the only one who never heard of "Silent Generation"? From Wikipedia, with each "generation" spanning very roughly 20 years of birth-dates:

"Major generations of the Western world"
Lost Generation
Greatest Generation
Silent Generation
Baby boomers
Generation X
Millennials
Generation Z
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Old 11-30-2019, 05:55 AM
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The Silent Generation is the most conservative-voting of all the groups.
https://www.people-press.org/2018/03...raphic-groups/

Another interesting point in the above survey is that the younger the group, the wider the gap between men and women, with women voting more and more Democratic until you see Millennial women voting 70% Dem while Millennial men are only 49%. Men always vote more Republican than women in every group, but Silent men are the only group which the majority votes Republican. All the others, Dems have the edge.
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Old 11-30-2019, 12:58 PM
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Silent gen and greatest gen are the ones who attacked hippies with tear gas, and shot anti-war college students.
The earlier you go, the wingnuttier they get.
Gen. Z is sometimes called the "doomed generation".

Last edited by Squink; 11-30-2019 at 12:59 PM.
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Old 11-30-2019, 02:12 PM
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Working from Ulfreida's link:

Millennial (1981-1996) 44% I, 35% D, 17% R
Generation X (1965-1980) 39% I, 31% D, 25% R
Boomer (1946-1964) 32% I, 35% D, 30% R
Silent (1928-1945) 27% I, 33% D, 38% R

So the percentages of independents has slowly grown, the percentage of Democrats hasn't changed much, and the percentage of Republicans has slowly decreased. This isn't a perfect reflection of liberalism and conservatism, but it's clear that there has been a steady decrease in liberalism and a steady decrease in conservatism. Incidentally, there are a fair amount of Lost Generation and Greatest Generation people still alive in the U.S., although it's hard to tell what their political beliefs are because it's hard to sample a group that small relative to the overall U.S. population. Does anyone have a source for how many Americans born in 1927 or earlier are still alive?
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Old 11-30-2019, 04:13 PM
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This website says that 1.9 million Americans were 90 and older in 2010. That number has presumably increased since then. So, to answer my question, I suspect that the number of Americans born in 1927 or before is somewhere in the range of 700,000 to 1,700,000:

https://www.census.gov/newsroom/rele.../cb11-194.html
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Old 11-30-2019, 05:19 PM
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May I suggest that one's politics are more influenced by socioeconomic status than age cohort?
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Old 12-01-2019, 08:32 AM
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Got any numbers to back that up?
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Old 12-01-2019, 09:21 AM
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People's political opinions are affected by (among other things) gender, income level, marital status, employment, race, religion, region, age, union membership, and parental politics. How much each one affects one's political opinions is harder to say. Does anyone have any statistics on how much each affect it?
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Old 12-01-2019, 09:35 AM
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So, one stat shows us Boomers as almost as D-leaning as the Xers. Yay, Boomers!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RioRico View Post
May I suggest that one's politics are more influenced by socioeconomic status than age cohort?
Socioeconomic status (more socio than economic) might be a better indicator than age, but the simple income-to-party correlation is long gone: the D-R split is now almost the same across income cohorts. Two decades ago, religiosity was the one of the strongest indicators: church-goers tended to vote R. Now, education is one of the strongest indicators: college-goers tend to vote D. Gender is also a strong indicator; hence the D's frequently blaming "white males" when R's are elected.

Last edited by septimus; 12-01-2019 at 09:36 AM.
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Old 12-01-2019, 11:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell Wagner View Post
Working from Ulfreida's link:

Millennial (1981-1996) 44% I, 35% D, 17% R
Generation X (1965-1980) 39% I, 31% D, 25% R
Boomer (1946-1964) 32% I, 35% D, 30% R
Silent (1928-1945) 27% I, 33% D, 38% R

So the percentages of independents has slowly grown, the percentage of Democrats hasn't changed much, and the percentage of Republicans has slowly decreased. This isn't a perfect reflection of liberalism and conservatism, but it's clear that there has been a steady decrease in liberalism and a steady decrease in conservatism.
I get a different interpretation. Rather than looking at it as a synchronous effect, look at it as how people change politics as they grow older. It looks like most people, when liberal or conservative in their youth, don't change their politics as they age, but the middle-of-the-roaders tend to get more conservative. Of course, virtually everyone gets somewhat more conservative as they age; that's unavoidable. And there'll be individual exceptions, but it's a general pattern.
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Old 12-01-2019, 11:08 AM
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If old people are more conservative than young people, though, that could be a result of the people changing, or it could be a result of the environment which defines "liberal" and "conservative" changing. An idea that was considered liberal once, could be considered conservative now.
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Old 12-01-2019, 11:19 AM
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If old people are more conservative than young people, though, that could be a result of the people changing, or it could be a result of the environment which defines "liberal" and "conservative" changing. An idea that was considered liberal once, could be considered conservative now.
Or vice versa. Reagan was considered a conservative, but his rhetoric on, for instance, illegal immigration was enormously softer than anything I've heard from the Republican party for more than a decade.

As a nation we have grown more liberal regarding inter-racial marriage, same-sex marriage, and pot. But we've grown more conservative regarding pretty much anything financial as best as I can tell.
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Old 12-01-2019, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtilque View Post
I get a different interpretation. Rather than looking at it as a synchronous effect, look at it as how people change politics as they grow older. It looks like most people, when liberal or conservative in their youth, don't change their politics as they age, but the middle-of-the-roaders tend to get more conservative. Of course, virtually everyone gets somewhat more conservative as they age; that's unavoidable. And there'll be individual exceptions, but it's a general pattern.
That people get more conservative as they get old is conventional wisdom, true, but I don't know of any good evidence that it's true today.

Gallup has a page on conservative/liberal self-identification by age group. The second chart on that page shows that for the past 20 years, the cohorts have identified fairly steadily within margin of error.

Quote:
Baby boomers have been less conservative than traditionalists, but more conservative than Gen Xers and millennials each year since 1994, spanning the period when baby boomers moved from being in their 30s or 40s to now when they are in their 50s or 60s.
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Old 12-01-2019, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtilque View Post
I get a different interpretation. Rather than looking at it as a synchronous effect, look at it as how people change politics as they grow older. It looks like most people, when liberal or conservative in their youth, don't change their politics as they age, but the middle-of-the-roaders tend to get more conservative. Of course, virtually everyone gets somewhat more conservative as they age; that's unavoidable. And there'll be individual exceptions, but it's a general pattern.
That's what I was going to say. (Though I would say that most people get more conservative once they have families and property and become more invested in the status quo). To have a fair comparison, you would have to look at the political distribution when the cohorts were the same age.

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If old people are more conservative than young people, though, that could be a result of the people changing, or it could be a result of the environment which defines "liberal" and "conservative" changing. An idea that was considered liberal once, could be considered conservative now.
That's another confounding factor. In the 1950s, interracial relationships or marriage were not just shocking, they were illegal in much of the country. The same goes for homosexual relationships between the 1960s and now. What were once liberal positions have now become mainstream.
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Old 12-01-2019, 01:27 PM
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This was an amazingly sloppy typing error on my part. I wrote "it's clear that there has been a steady decrease in liberalism and a steady decrease in conservatism." What I meant was "it's clear that there has been a steady increase in liberalism and a steady decrease in conservatism."
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Old 12-01-2019, 01:36 PM
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dtilque writes:

> Of course, virtually everyone gets somewhat more conservative as they age; that's
> unavoidable.

I'm not convinced of that at all. My supposition has always been that society as a whole is getting more liberal. The positions that fifty years ago would have been considered typical of a somewhat liberal person are now considered typical of a somewhat conservative person. So without anyone changing their opinions at all, some people (who were around fifty years ago) who were considered liberals then are now considered conservative. I don't see any evidence that people change their opinions very much as they age.
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Old 12-01-2019, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell Wagner View Post
dtilque writes:

> Of course, virtually everyone gets somewhat more conservative as they age; that's
> unavoidable.
As an adolescent I backed Goldwater but then I grew up and have been a green rad-lib ever since. Conservative? I want to conserve the best and change the rest.

(Consider cerebral function. Before morning coffee, I'm Republican; after the first cup, I'm a Democrat; after the second cup, I'm a Green. Think of it as evolution in action.)

Quote:
I'm not convinced of that at all. My supposition has always been that society as a whole is getting more liberal.
I sense a continuing disjoint between society and the scope of political power, now worsened by suppression and disenfranchisement. What benefits a liberal society when many are denied the franchise? Have we numbers, by age cohort, of those excluded?

I also object to stereotyped "age cohorts". I grew up in an old (for Southern California) farming town with a newer missile factory. In my parent's era, Hollywood tested films here because it was the most "average" American town. We moved to a nearby town hosting farms, dairies, and a state prison. Many of my classmates' parents there were guards, prisoners, or farmworkers.

My schoolmates ranged from pobrecitos, to scions, to a child TV star. Varieties of White, Black, Latino, Indian, Mayan, Hindu, Jewish, Catholic, Lutheran, Quaker, Baptist, Adventist, you name it. They're my age cohort. Gone in many directions, they're certainly not all my social cohort now. Can we be meaningfully generalized?
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Old 12-01-2019, 04:50 PM
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I also object to the claim that American society can be neatly broken up into standard generations like these:

Lost Generation
Greatest Generation
Silent Generation
Baby Boomers
Generation X
Millennials
Generation Z

I only used them in my post because someone else had already used them in a previous post. Also, it's possible to find them discussed in various websites with useful statistics. The changes in society are always slow and gradual without any sudden breaks. We should all quit thinking of ourselves as nothing but a member of a generation.
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Old 12-01-2019, 06:22 PM
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Quote:
Quoth RioRico:

(Consider cerebral function. Before morning coffee, I'm Republican; after the first cup, I'm a Democrat; after the second cup, I'm a Green. Think of it as evolution in action.)
No, an example of evolution in action would be when those who can't figure out the differences between the different forums on this message board eventually get banned, leading to a board population who mostly can figure out the differences.

The misunderstanding of evolution isn't a violation of board rules, but the political jab is. As you already know, or at least should, because you already got an official Warning for it yesterday. And now you have a second one. Learn more quickly.
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Old 12-01-2019, 06:45 PM
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It seems in Britain the people who were old enough to fight or at least remember WW2 as it happened are less right-wing than the boomers who were born after the war but chant "two world wars and one world cup".
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Old 12-02-2019, 01:34 AM
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I saw a video by Morris Massey (who is very entertaining and talks a mile a minute). His thesis is that your core values are established at an early age by what's happening in your world and who your adolescent heroes are -which is why each generation (in general) has these different outlooks on life. He goes into this in a lot more detail - but for example, "The Greatest Generation" had WWII and "win at any cost" was their value; the previous generation had the depression and getting a job, income stability, having a livelihood was most important. Whereas the boomers grew up with everything available, so they were not worried about whether they would have a job, money, or feed on the table - it was always there.

He related one story from the 70's about older management trying to figure out the front line workers. They screw up, management tells them "take a day off to think about your job." The Boomer worker replies "Hell, I'll take three, thanks!". It drove management crazy, because they could not understand how someone could care so little about having a steady job. Massey's solution - don't suspend them, make they stay on overtime and do the work to fix the problem. The younger workers hated it, they stopped screwing up so much. They didn't care much about the extra money, they wanted leisure time.

Unfortunately, the lecture tape was made decades ago, and I would love to see an updated version with the Gen X and Gen Y life outlooks included... Apparently he's a motivational speaker and these tapes can cost hundreds of dollars.

IMHO as a Boomer it seems that the latest generations have been screwed over by the globalization trend, have become less financially secure and more anxious about their future, and have a genuine distaste for "business as usual" politics, which might explain a lot.
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Old 12-02-2019, 06:42 AM
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Obviously you'll see differences issue to issue but the OP can see generational trends wrt same sex marriage here: https://www.people-press.org/2019/05...marriage_a-05/
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Old 12-02-2019, 12:06 PM
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Whereas the boomers grew up with everything available, so they were not worried about whether they would have a job, money, or feed on the table - it was always there.
This is such a ridiculous myth. I graduated college in the midst of a recession. My now wife and I started on food stamps. I couldn't find any work in my field so I clerked in a store for a year. Nixon, of all people, inaugurated the CETA Program, a modern WPA that created jobs for the unemployed. It lasted through Carter, and I was fortunate to get a couple of jobs under it to give me a resume for a permanent job. My wife started with a job as a temporary secretary before getting hired permanently and working her way up the company.

Boomers did not have it all. The majority of boomers who went to college were in the first generation of their families to do so. Lots of working class kids went on scholarships or else their families had to make sacrifices to pay for tuition. Yeah, I was one of them. So were most of the kids in my freshman dorm. I dropped out of grad school because I had zero money. My wife picked up a MBA through night classes. We did not go from college straight into the suburbs. Like every succeeding generation, we lived in apartments and saved to buy a starter home, not a McMansion.

I have no idea whether today's world is better or worse for young college grads, and I don't think anyone can quantify that. My guess is that every generation comes out of school with uncertainly. The 70s were horrible economically and the 80s seemed better only until the reality that Reagan was driving the economy into the ground hit and knocked Bush 1 out of office. Go back and read the newspaper headlines from any time in history. They are always filled with how bad things are "today." Don't get your history from memes.
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Old 12-02-2019, 01:50 PM
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This is such a ridiculous myth. I graduated college in the midst of a recession. My now wife and I started on food stamps. I couldn't find any work in my field so I clerked in a store for a year. Nixon, of all people, inaugurated the CETA Program, a modern WPA that created jobs for the unemployed. It lasted through Carter, and I was fortunate to get a couple of jobs under it to give me a resume for a permanent job. My wife started with a job as a temporary secretary before getting hired permanently and working her way up the company.

Boomers did not have it all. The majority of boomers who went to college were in the first generation of their families to do so. Lots of working class kids went on scholarships or else their families had to make sacrifices to pay for tuition. Yeah, I was one of them. So were most of the kids in my freshman dorm. I dropped out of grad school because I had zero money. My wife picked up a MBA through night classes. We did not go from college straight into the suburbs. Like every succeeding generation, we lived in apartments and saved to buy a starter home, not a McMansion.

I have no idea whether today's world is better or worse for young college grads, and I don't think anyone can quantify that. My guess is that every generation comes out of school with uncertainly. The 70s were horrible economically and the 80s seemed better only until the reality that Reagan was driving the economy into the ground hit and knocked Bush 1 out of office. Go back and read the newspaper headlines from any time in history. They are always filled with how bad things are "today." Don't get your history from memes.
I tell people that when I was going to college (early to mid-70's) you could walk into Ford or GM and ask for a job and get one... by the late 70's the recession was in full swing and that was not the case. And yes, for every hippie drop-out living on who-knows-what there was probably a silent majority who were like me (and you, I presume) working their asses off and terrified things would change and they would have nothing a year down the road. But... there were enough of the rebellious I-don't-work-I-don't-care types to create a social movement, and that is what shaped the world those decades.

But what I can say is a lot of what I got for living in that age - like defined benefit pension plan, full time work, ability to own a house and create retirement savings, education I could pay for with a summer job... I don't see those being easily available to today's generation.

Last edited by md2000; 12-02-2019 at 01:51 PM.
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