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  #51  
Old 12-02-2019, 08:05 AM
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Of course there is no arguing about taste, but I'm wondering if most of the arguing here is perhaps more about arguing for the sake of arguing than the merits of the movie.
Wonder away. I watch movies primarily for entertainment (which can take several forms.) To use one comparison, I found Goodfellas entertaining, and have watched it several times. I could not say the same about The Irishman. And personally, I was not as bothered by the CGI as some were.
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  #52  
Old 12-02-2019, 09:54 AM
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Lots of comments about the futility of a criminal life and the losses that Frank suffered, but I think it was done much better in Blow.

Overall, it just seemed like a tired film made by tired actors for a tired director. Perhaps it's a product of meditating on their own ages, but the result was much less than what I had been hoping for.
  #53  
Old 12-02-2019, 12:53 PM
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Rejuvenation


I haven't seen the movie, but from the comments here it looks as if it either a monumentally boring film to those who don't know the references and don't know the (now aging) stars, and and on the other a tribute to all the mob movies, played by the same old crew, and showing their stuff. Well, I'll see it one day, but 3.5 hours requires some serious stamina.

I suppose that the director chose to CGI the characters to look younger becuse we all know what they looked like when young because they got famous early on. I have not seen how well it worked, but I can only say that it is very rare for someone to be able to play someone much older than yourself without something looking wrong. And rejuvenating from 70 to 30? Too much of a jump. You can do it in the opposite direction, up to a point, but you get thicker and heavier with age and you don't have the same fluidity of movement. (Said he, creaking painfully.) I think you really do need wetware actors to play younger people. If you know the actor, you immediately say: "Ha, he didn't look like that when he was young!"

I notice that many adverts use CGI. Sometimes the faces are either CGI or heavily edited human. Either way I find it creepy and impersonal, but then nobody asked me. The same goes for adding dead actors to films with CGI. Yes, Gladiator and Oliver Reed. They do say that the living and the dead should never try to meet, and I think they have a point.
  #54  
Old 12-02-2019, 01:14 PM
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Link to older thread

https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb...d.php?t=885678
  #55  
Old 12-02-2019, 01:21 PM
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A movie is a vast undertaking. It is never just one thing.

I wanted to see it, and found it to be masterful fimmaking. I won't second guess MS. I wanted especially to see his take on all the historic events in the timeline.

It took almost 15 years to get it made, so deniro was 59 then.

It was a reasonable length for say a UK series, 4 episodes maybe. I watched it in two sessions.

The technical stuff and the strange feeling of having robert mueller be a punk kid gangster is so off. Pesci and deniro are too known as quantities.

It is very depressing to realize that robs movements in the film are what is happening to me and won't get any better. Thanks guys.

And Robert Deniro is not Irish. He sounds like a heavy new york accented man whose second language is italian. Frank Sheeran was a big blond imposing presence. It was very noticable that there is no threat in the physical presences of deniro or pesci anymore.

I suppose that objections to this film can be countered by saying that it's really all about the decay, or the lameness of being bad, or something.
  #56  
Old 12-02-2019, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by GreenWyvern View Post
Of course there is no arguing about taste, but I'm wondering if most of the arguing here is perhaps more about arguing for the sake of arguing than the merits of the movie.
I'm not a populist, and fact someone else thinks it's a great movie doesn 't mean I have to.

As long as we're accusing others of not presently honest arguments, I really think a lot of the over-the-top praise for the movies is unthinking and reflexive; the assumption that, well, it's a Scorsese movie with guys like Robert DeNiro and Al Pacino, so it must be great.
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  #57  
Old 12-02-2019, 01:35 PM
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I really hope we aren't in for a whole generation of movies featuring actors who have been CGI-modified to play parts they wouldn't otherwise suited for. Call me crazy, but I don't want to see Julia Roberts in CGI-brownface playing Harriet Tubman. Or a 70-year-old Tom Hanks playing a 25-year old Larry Bird. I loved the CGI used to make Margot Robbie into Tonya Harding, so I am not anti-CGI. But I don't like the idea of using CGI as a gimmick or as a way to maximize the star power of a film. Like, I think a lot of people are watching the Irishman just to see what a de-aged blue-eyed De Niro looks like. Why wouldn't they? That is what most of the internet buzz has been focused on.

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Old 12-02-2019, 01:43 PM
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Or a 70-year-old Tom Hanks playing a 25-year old Larry Bird.
TBF, Bird looked 70 when he was 25. It will also take a whole bunch of CGU(gly) to makw any actor look like Bird.
  #59  
Old 12-02-2019, 04:56 PM
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I enjoyed it for the most part, though I thought Pacino-as-Hoffa was the weakest link. I'll echo what others have said about Pesci -- his restraint in the role is fantastic, especially since we've been trained to expect his characters to be completely out of control.

Having just read the Slate article -- which makes a pretty good case that Sheeran's story is 100% fiction -- it occurs to me that the entire thing could be viewed as the fanciful, wishfully enhanced memories of a
SPOILER:
peripheral mob character who didn't commit any of the murders he claims but, desperate for significance in his later years, invents a bigger role for himself.
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Old 12-02-2019, 07:10 PM
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. . I really think a lot of the over-the-top praise for the movies is unthinking and reflexive;
FTR, I was thinking when I saw the movie and even more after I watched it.
  #61  
Old 12-02-2019, 07:14 PM
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I haven't watched it yet, but did Scorsese use "Gimme Shelter" by the Rolling Stones? It just wouldn't be one of his mob movies without that song on the soundtrack!

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Old 12-02-2019, 07:15 PM
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And Robert Deniro is not Irish. He sounds like a heavy new york accented man whose second language is italian. Frank Sheeran was a big blond imposing presence. It was very noticable that there is no threat in the physical presences of deniro or pesci anymore.
DeNiro is actually 1/4 Irish, 1/4 Italian, and the rest is a mixture of English and German. But I agree the cadence of his New York accent has always sounded more NY Italian-American than NY Irish-American (there's a subtle difference.)

After re-watching some of the scenes I do agree that his physical presence is too aged-looking to be convincing as a younger man. It is a flaw in the movie, no doubt. But it's outweighed by the positives, IMO.
  #63  
Old 12-02-2019, 07:52 PM
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It's funny but I was a bit bumped by Anna Pacquin playing against her age. There was one scene in which she looked like she was old enough to be the mother to her sisters. If she only spoke 7 words for the entire movie...why cast a name who is closer to 40 to play 20? I get DeNiro, Pacino and Peschi...they are carrying the thing but Anna?
  #64  
Old 12-02-2019, 08:06 PM
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I haven't watched it yet, but did Scorsese use "Gimme Shelter" by the Rolling Stones? It just wouldn't be one of his mob movies without that song on the soundtrack!
No. It's not listed on the soundtrack.
  #65  
Old 12-02-2019, 09:46 PM
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It's funny but I was a bit bumped by Anna Pacquin playing against her age. There was one scene in which she looked like she was old enough to be the mother to her sisters. If she only spoke 7 words for the entire movie...why cast a name who is closer to 40 to play 20? I get DeNiro, Pacino and Peschi...they are carrying the thing but Anna?
I thought that was pretty strange too. But this article argues that Peggy's silences are key to the film, and that a good actress was needed to communicate even without dialogue.
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Old 12-03-2019, 12:15 PM
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Well, if you think the movie was too much about Hoffa...it was based upon the book "I Heard You Paint Houses" which is mostly about Jimmy Hoffa and his relationship with Frank Sheeran. The movie followed the book very closely.
  #67  
Old 12-04-2019, 07:43 AM
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I thought that was pretty strange too. But this article argues that Peggy's silences are key to the film, and that a good actress was needed to communicate even without dialogue.
I wasn't posting that the role of Peggy's silence bumped me, I thought the casting of Anna Pacquin as Peggy bumped me. She's was too old to play a teenager. Surely they could have cast a more age appropriate actress to convey fear/disgust/resentment to Frank as a father.
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:04 AM
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I wasn't posting that the role of Peggy's silence bumped me, I thought the casting of Anna Pacquin as Peggy bumped me. She's was too old to play a teenager. Surely they could have cast a more age appropriate actress to convey fear/disgust/resentment to Frank as a father.
I understand. I was just discussing why they might have chosen Paquin despite the age incongruity because the role was more significant than it might have appeared.
  #69  
Old 12-04-2019, 09:15 AM
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I haven't watched it yet, but did Scorsese use "Gimme Shelter" by the Rolling Stones? It just wouldn't be one of his mob movies without that song on the soundtrack!

MtM
The soundtrack was annoying and unnecessary, IMO.
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