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  #501  
Old 06-08-2019, 08:21 AM
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So say the Raptors win the next game and Durant isnít playing. Does this increase the urgency with which the Warriors pursue Durant? Right now, it is assumed he is all but gone (I have no idea, but the opinion is pretty universal). Do the Warriors say screw the cap hit, we need him back? Or do they try to reload.
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Old 06-08-2019, 08:49 AM
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So say the Raptors win the next game and Durant isnít playing. Does this increase the urgency with which the Warriors pursue Durant? Right now, it is assumed he is all but gone (I have no idea, but the opinion is pretty universal). Do the Warriors say screw the cap hit, we need him back? Or do they try to reload.
I think Durant and the Warriors are headed for a divorce. There's no point in even trying to keep him as he clearly doesn't want to be there with Green and would much rather play with Lebron and another superstar if the Lakers can deal.
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Old 06-08-2019, 08:53 AM
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That makes it much more like Los Angeles. Apart fro LA proper there are 13 other cities in LA County with populations in excess of 100,000. The largest is Long Beach which is just under 500,000. That doesn't count the adjacent Orange County whose population is over 3,000,000. This is where Anaheim is located,
The Metroplex is like that as well. Dallas is the main population center at 1.3 million, but hardly anyone notices that Ft Worth is rapidly closing in on 900,000 residents and being in the top 10 largest cities in the country. Then you have Arlington, Plano, Irving, and Garland, all with over a quarter million (Arlington has almost 400,000).
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Old 06-08-2019, 08:59 AM
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I'm going to count this as a correct prediction. It went like I was picturing, and just like I said, I didn't really believe the Raps would win until about 2 minutes were left .

What I said before about the Warriors not taking the Raptors seriously wasn't phrased well. Psychologically I think it was in the back of their minds during game 3 that Klay was being saved for the rest of the series. I think it's hard not to let that sap your determination a little bit. Tonight, however, it sure looked like they just got beat. I wonder if resting Klay gave Steph such a big workload that it affected him tonight. Easy to say that in hindsight.
I don't think the Warriors have saved anything. They had to know that without KD they were going to be tested by Leonard and a very solid Toronto defense. The Raptors are the most complete team the Warriors have faced since 2016 when they lost to Cleveland. They pose many of the same problems, and I'd actually submit that Leonard is better than Lebron at driving to the basket.
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:53 AM
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I think Durant and the Warriors are headed for a divorce. There's no point in even trying to keep him as he clearly doesn't want to be there with Green and would much rather play with Lebron and another superstar if the Lakers can deal.
You mean Durant play with LeBron? I thought he made a point of saying no star would choose to play with LeBron. Or was that optics?

I know itís almost a zero chance, but it would be great if Durant landed on Utah or Denver.
  #506  
Old 06-09-2019, 10:16 AM
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I don't think the Warriors have saved anything. They had to know that without KD they were going to be tested by Leonard and a very solid Toronto defense. The Raptors are the most complete team the Warriors have faced since 2016 when they lost to Cleveland. They pose many of the same problems, and I'd actually submit that Leonard is better than Lebron at driving to the basket.
The thing is, I don't think Golden State would be winning this series with KD. They would be doing better for sure, but no way they'd be winning. Maybe it would be tied, but the notion this is some sort of asterisk situation is nuts. The Raptors aren't just squeaking out some lucky wins, they're utterly kicking the shit out of the Warriors. Golden State is actually kind of lucky they weren't swept.

Anyway... I am surprised how how much shit Steve Kerr is taking from GS fans online right now. "Durr durrr, he can't adjust." Jesus, it's their fifth year in the Finals and they've already won three. They're the most transformative team in modern basketball history, by which I mean no team has so change the way pro basketball is played. Yeah, things aren't working in this series, but I don't see the armchair geniuses proposing any better plans. I'll take Steve Kerr if you don't want him.
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  #507  
Old 06-10-2019, 01:44 PM
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Anyway... I am surprised how how much shit Steve Kerr is taking from GS fans online right now. "Durr durrr, he can't adjust." Jesus, it's their fifth year in the Finals and they've already won three. They're the most transformative team in modern basketball history, by which I mean no team has so change the way pro basketball is played. Yeah, things aren't working in this series, but I don't see the armchair geniuses proposing any better plans. I'll take Steve Kerr if you don't want him.
I know...to break it down.

-He has a hobbled Cousins (who doesnít really play defense when he is 100% anyhow)
-is missing a player who was having a fabulous playoffs and is top 3 in the league.
-has no real depth outside of the core
-one of the splash brothers missed a game and may be less than 100%.
-is facing the best defense he has ever faced.
-has a team that has played ball into June for 5 straight years (so they are likely worn down)

And he made the finals from the west.

Just to be clear, I too think the Raptors couldíve won with a healthy Durant, but it certainly would be a different series. I also donít subscribe to asterisks. Every team has injuries at this point in the season and you could argue the Warriors were lucky with injuries the previous 4 years. You face the team in front of you.
  #508  
Old 06-10-2019, 07:14 PM
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KD will play tonight. But will it be enough? I guess we'll find out in a few hours.
  #509  
Old 06-10-2019, 08:05 PM
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Nurse better let OG Anunoby out there then...at least one possession. The guy lost quite a bit of weight apparently, so who knows if he's a complete liability. I just think it would be a shame if OG didn't get off the bench this series, especially in light of this development.
  #510  
Old 06-10-2019, 09:14 PM
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If the Raps lose they are in serious trouble. The Warriors will have the momentum and home court for G6, and likely win that - then it's all on the line in Game Seven.
  #511  
Old 06-10-2019, 09:35 PM
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Well, without Durant, I suggest that even if they manage to win tonight, the series will end at Oracle.

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  #512  
Old 06-10-2019, 10:38 PM
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Raptors had this and let the moment overtake them at the end, allowing GS to go on that killer 9-0 run. Disappointing.
  #513  
Old 06-10-2019, 10:42 PM
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I mean, I’m not really sure what you can do when Curry and Thompson can just shoot contested threes from anywhere and make half of them. That the Raptors had a shot to win at all was amazing.
  #514  
Old 06-10-2019, 10:42 PM
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Oh bother...
  #515  
Old 06-10-2019, 10:42 PM
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That the Raptors lost isn't the problem, but how they lost this game may haunt them for years to come. Sorry, but with a 6-point lead with under 2 minutes, Kawhi Leonard is *the* man. Pushing Lowry toward the rim to throw it to Gasol at the top of the key? Having Gasol drive to the rim? A total cluster fuck of a 2-minute drill.

Give the Warriors credit though. Especially Cousins, who could have been the goat tonight, but overall, had a solid game. There had to be someone to step up big in the absence of Durant and the mediocre play of Klay and Curry. And Cousins played well.

Last edited by asahi; 06-10-2019 at 10:43 PM.
  #516  
Old 06-11-2019, 12:10 AM
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Something that was reported in The Athletic two days ago:

"At the very least, Durant's absence that began back on May 8 is causing a mixture of confusion and angst among several of his teammates that simply can't be helpful to their overall cause. Sources say there was a very real hope that Durant would be able to play in Game 4, to push through in much the same way that Thompson, Cousins, Iguodala and Looney have done of late. When that didn't happen, and when they saw their season compromised more than ever without him after they'd grown hopeful of his return after seeing him on the court, the irritation grew in large part because they simply didn't understand why he wasn't there.

Warriors officials aren't running from the reality that there's frustration among some players, but they're also quick to point out that trainer Rick Celebrini – not Durant – is making this call. And until Celebrini gives Durant the go-ahead, his long and painful stretch of absences will extend into this pivotal Warriors summer where his free agency future remains unclear. What's more, two sources insist that the Warriors have believed for quite some time that Game 5 was the earliest time in which he would likely return."


Think they understand now?

Part of this is basketball has an ongoing tradition where gutting it out through injuries in the playoffs is glorified and with some injuries that can be okay, with others it's really nothing to celebrate beyond the effort and courage.

Last edited by Covfefe; 06-11-2019 at 12:13 AM.
  #517  
Old 06-11-2019, 12:34 AM
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Oh my god, they're saying it's an Achilles injury for Durant. That's absolutely terrible. It makes me feel even worse about the idiots who were cheering when he was down on the court.

Golden State is going to get pilloried for their decision to play him tonight and they'll absolutely deserve it.
  #518  
Old 06-11-2019, 02:21 AM
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I avoided all spoilers and watched the game ó wow!!!!!

A great Warriors win.

A humongous Raptors choke. Kawhi gives up the ball on that last play when heís doubled? Weak move. A choke move. I thought the Raptors would win it on that last possession but no, Kawhi gives up the ball way too easily.

The Warriors showed their grit and determination tonight. Great game!
  #519  
Old 06-11-2019, 02:32 AM
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Besides a very good game from the Splash Brothers, Cousins and Loney contributed well. For game 6 we need Green and Iguodala to step up their games, and Livingston and Bogut too.

Winning game 6 is not a foregone conclusion for Golden State. This Raptors team is strong and deep.

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Oh my god, they're saying it's an Achilles injury for Durant. That's absolutely terrible. It makes me feel even worse about the idiots who were cheering when he was down on the court.

Golden State is going to get pilloried for their decision to play him tonight and they'll absolutely deserve it.
No way. Playing KD was a great call and the way this ended up, the Warriors have something stronger to rally around and add to their fire.
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Old 06-11-2019, 04:43 AM
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Warriors motivation to win going forward aside, I do worry about KD's future. An Achilles injury requires a very long rehab, and while it's probably not as bad as an ACL, it's an injury that will no doubt take some of his athleticism away from him as he approaches the twilight of his career. It will also no doubt impact how he's viewed on the free agent market.
  #521  
Old 06-11-2019, 07:19 AM
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Golden State is going to get pilloried for their decision to play him tonight and they'll absolutely deserve it.
The decision to play was likely a mutual one. with the team physician, trainer, management, player, and his agent all signing on... if Durant didn't want to play, he would not have played. There were multiple workouts, sport-specific and not, and I am sure he made basketball moves in workouts, and warm-ups and in the 11mins he played that all showed he was ready, and he played like the former Finals MVP until he was hurt.

Unfortunately, and in hindsight, his lack of conditioning likely contributed to what would otherwise be called a "freak injury" given that his foot appears to be moving laterally rather than in a linear path or a push-off. The GM was classy though:

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"He was cleared to play tonight," Myers said. "That was a collaborative decision. I don't believe there's anybody to blame, but I understand in this world and if you have to, you can blame me. I run our basketball operations department. And to tell you something about Kevin Durant: Kevin Durant loves to play basketball, and the people that questioned whether he wanted to get back to this team were wrong.
  #522  
Old 06-11-2019, 07:23 AM
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Sorry, but that was a catastrophic choke job by the Raptors. To score just two points in the last three minutes of a game you have a six point lead in is simply not what a winning team does. They had the championship in their hand and couldn't close the deal. The Warriors will win the series; they are at worst a ten to one favourite.

The final possession was an unmitigated disaster - I don't know how you give the ball there to the worst clutch shooter in playoff history (Lowry in his career in late-and-close situations is 2 for 30, that's not a typo) but the blame must largely go to Nick Nurse, whose inexplicable decision to call a timeout when his team was on a run and the other team was gasping for air was an incredible choke move.

They're screwed, folks. Golden State will destroy them in Game 6, and will win a close one in Game 7, probably a fourth quarter comeback/Raptors choke. Take it to the bank.

As to the KD decision, Kevin Durant chose to play. He wasn't out there at gunpoint and he played great until his leg blew up so he probably felt okay. If injuries were predictable they wouldn't be injuries.

If I may be brutally capitalist, Golden State has no downside to playing him. He has given every indication he doesn't want to play for them anymore. They gain nothing from playing it safe, and had everything to gain by taking a chance. Playing him might well have won them the game - he was spectacular while he was out there and they won by one point. They got the Raptors to choke and will now win the series and hoist the trophy. Sucks for Kevin Durant, to be sure, but if you're Golden State you got out of him what you needed to collect another ring.
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Last edited by RickJay; 06-11-2019 at 07:28 AM.
  #523  
Old 06-11-2019, 07:33 AM
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Warriors motivation to win going forward aside, I do worry about KD's future. An Achilles injury requires a very long rehab, and while it's probably not as bad as an ACL, it's an injury that will no doubt take some of his athleticism away from him as he approaches the twilight of his career. It will also no doubt impact how he's viewed on the free agent market.
Heíll have an MRI today. Letís not jump the gun on exactly what the injury is.
  #524  
Old 06-11-2019, 07:38 AM
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... the blame must largely go to Nick Nurse, whose inexplicable decision to call a timeout when his team was on a run and the other team was gasping for air was an incredible choke move.
This too! Besides the choke job, GSW was reeling at that point, and TOR calls a timeout! Total idiot move! Iím glad you mentioned this too.

Toronto choked big time.
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Old 06-11-2019, 08:34 AM
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They're screwed, folks. Golden State will destroy them in Game 6, and will win a close one in Game 7, probably a fourth quarter comeback/Raptors choke. Take it to the bank.
Way to be a fan.

They choked, no question. But to say theyíre screwed? Hell no.

Durant certainly wonít be back. He had 11 points in the 12 minutes he played. GS also made 20 three pointers last night, and we still only lost by one.

Have some faith. Itís going to be a long three days, but they will close it out on Thursday night.
  #526  
Old 06-11-2019, 08:39 AM
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Itís going to be a long three days, but they will close it out on Thursday night.
Keep telling yourself that.
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Old 06-11-2019, 08:47 AM
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Keep telling yourself that.
Iím going to, thanks.
  #528  
Old 06-11-2019, 08:50 AM
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Kawhi choked in the clutch.
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Old 06-11-2019, 08:56 AM
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Way to be a fan.
Being a fan has nothing to do with facts. The facts are they're huge underdogs now.
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  #530  
Old 06-11-2019, 09:02 AM
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Being a fan has nothing to do with facts. The facts are they're huge underdogs now.
I feel like that's factually incorrect. I haven't seen updated odds after last night, at least not yet, but with the Raptors still up 3-2 and no Durant, I would guess that Toronto remains a strong favorite to win the title. If you think the professional gamblers have it that wrong, there's definitely some cash to be made betting on the Warriors.
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Old 06-11-2019, 11:20 AM
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Warriors motivation to win going forward aside, I do worry about KD's future. An Achilles injury requires a very long rehab, and while it's probably not as bad as an ACL, it's an injury that will no doubt take some of his athleticism away from him as he approaches the twilight of his career. It will also no doubt impact how he's viewed on the free agent market.
I expect he gets the max either this summer or next one. Be it opt in this year and be healthy next free agency or opt out this year. Either way, a desperate team like the knicks talks themselves into the max. Count on it.

As far as the series go, I still feel the Raps are just better (Iím an impartial Spurs fan, was a fan before the Raptors existed). Now that they know for sure Durant wonít be back, you load up on the splash brothers and let the others beat you, and they have proven themselves unreliable thus far. Play solid D and the Raps win. Less pressure in Oakland.
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Old 06-11-2019, 03:36 PM
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In fairness to the Warriors, they essentially had no choice but to play Durant. With it being Game 5 and an elimination game, they would have faced an entire off-season of "what if Durant had played" questions if they had kept Durant benched. There was much less to lose by playing him than by not playing him........until his Achilles caved in.
  #533  
Old 06-11-2019, 06:35 PM
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I feel like that's factually incorrect. I haven't seen updated odds after last night, at least not yet, but with the Raptors still up 3-2 and no Durant, I would guess that Toronto remains a strong favorite to win the title. If you think the professional gamblers have it that wrong, there's definitely some cash to be made betting on the Warriors.
Looks like the official betting line puts Toronto at somewhere between a 67 and 75 percent chance to win, not really sure how to read the odds.
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Old 06-11-2019, 06:54 PM
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I also feel like this is still very much in Toronto's favor, and in some ways, it's easier now because the Raptors know that they won't have to prepare for Durant. It will be interesting to see how Cousins factors in this series going forward.
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Old 06-11-2019, 08:45 PM
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Nurse is probably really regretting that timeout. Cost the Raptors valuable momentum. They had Golden State beaten, were on a 14-5 run, and everything was going swimmingly. Should have kept it going until or unless there was a need for a timeout. Raptors went cold after that timeout.
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Old 06-11-2019, 09:26 PM
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Nurse is probably really regretting that timeout. Cost the Raptors valuable momentum. They had Golden State beaten, were on a 14-5 run, and everything was going swimmingly. Should have kept it going until or unless there was a need for a timeout. Raptors went cold after that timeout.
The time out was smart. Talk about how you're going to work the final 2-3 minutes - makes sense. It's just the decision-making of a team that, except for Leonard, has never had the chance to finish off a finals.

Contrary to some, I don't think this is necessarily the end for the Raptors. I think they'll in some ways be a lot more mentally focused and sharper coming into game 6 than they were this game. Before game 5, they had to wonder about KD, how long he'd play, what kind of contributions he'd have. They don't have to worry about that now. They do have to worry about Demarco Cousins, but while Cousins *is* a good player near the rim, he's not the same kind of player that KD is. Even if they drop game 6, I won't even write off the Raptors in game 7. I think they'll figure it out in these next 2 games.
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Old 06-11-2019, 10:02 PM
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If Draymond Green gets a technical foul Game 6 then he'll be suspended for Game 7. Part of me is hoping that happens, know what I mean? Leave it in the hands of the adults.
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Old 06-12-2019, 10:23 AM
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Well, the series ain't over, but GS is really hard to beat 4 times. So when you blow one like that, not to mention a clencher, it could really kill momentum. They've got to be mentally tough, which has not been their strength in the past (looking at you, Kyle Lowry).
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Old 06-12-2019, 11:06 AM
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I feel like that's factually incorrect. I haven't seen updated odds after last night, at least not yet, but with the Raptors still up 3-2 and no Durant, I would guess that Toronto remains a strong favorite to win the title. If you think the professional gamblers have it that wrong, there's definitely some cash to be made betting on the Warriors.
I will not bet big against my favourite team... but I've made a small bet. Most places will give you roughly 3-1 to 4-1, which is crazy; the Warriors are even money AT WORST. The Raptors are choking. Bet on the Warriors if you can get those odds, it's an excellent bet.
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Old 06-12-2019, 07:02 PM
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Not that crazy. If you assume the teams are absolutely evenly matched Toronto should be a 3-1 favorite just because they only need to win one more game, while the Warriors need two. For this to be even money, you need to think the Warriors have a 70 percent chance of winning each game, which seems over the top to me.
  #541  
Old 06-13-2019, 06:13 PM
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All right, if Raptors lose tonight, how mad will the panic be?
  #542  
Old 06-13-2019, 10:05 PM
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What a game! Hope that Thompson is ok.
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Old 06-13-2019, 10:23 PM
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Come on rapppps
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Old 06-13-2019, 10:27 PM
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Well, the Raptors are up 3 with 4 minutes to play. Klay Thompson is out of the game and not returning. If Toronto loses this one, I really don’t think they’ll recover.
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Old 06-13-2019, 10:39 PM
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Wow
  #546  
Old 06-13-2019, 10:49 PM
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The dinos did it!
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Old 06-13-2019, 10:51 PM
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Could not be happier for Serge Ibaka and Marc Gasol.
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Old 06-13-2019, 10:54 PM
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Goaltending should be a reviewable play, like shot clock and 3 point shots (re Green's illegal tip in that wasn't called).
  #549  
Old 06-13-2019, 11:09 PM
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Congrats to Toronto . Wherever Kawhi may go from here, even if he just ends up being a one year rental that trade paid off BIG TIME.
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Old 06-13-2019, 11:19 PM
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Congrats to the Raptors. Such bad luck for the Warriors with injuries, I hope Klayís injury is minor. It was a really interesting series.
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