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  #751  
Old 12-19-2019, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
We already have that. It's called an Ignore List.
An ignore list does not accomplish that goal, it avoids contact with a particular poster who may more often be offensive, but it does not prevent the digression, the hijack of the thread that such behaviors cause.

It fails, completely fails, as a means to accomplish the goals, if those are the goals (they are in my mind but maybe not yours or in the minds' of MrDibble let alone those like Der Trihs).
  #752  
Old 12-19-2019, 05:05 PM
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No one is forcing you to debate anything if you don't want to.
A brilliant riposte to something ... absolutely nobody has said.
  #753  
Old 12-20-2019, 12:40 AM
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Why do we have to keep going over the same ground??


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Originally Posted by Max S. View Post
For the record I have never heard these terms before in my life. I'm learning every day.

I would like to take this opportunity to apologize to you, margin, and anyone else who was offended by my absolute ignorance on what are probably multiple subjects. Margin, I view you and others as sort of my window into the mysterious world of women who are more... aware of women's issues. I hope my anecdote about "hysterical" gives you a little perspective as to where I'm coming from.
There are books. I recommended one elsewhere about sexist language.

And your perspective? You have rejected all explanations. You are exactly like every OTHER guy who dismisses women when they talk about what they experience-----and refuses to inform himself.

Quote:
won't mind personally if all of these sensitive subjects are put off limits. I can talk to locals about that stuff, and there's plenty else to do here other than debate sensitive subjects. It's just that, I come here for exposure and I guess I have been projecting my own motivations on the rest of you. I acknowledge that I am a new member and really, some of you have put like twenty years into this community. I've barely spent that much time breathing. Evidently you don't want to debate things like whether homosexual relations are moral, or why segregation is bad/diversity is good, or whether gender choice is a human right, etcetera. Normal, sober people usually don't want to talk about that stuff when I bring it up in real life (pastors/rabbis excepted, they like talking about sensitive issues). If you don't want to, by all means your voices about the future of these boards should be heard more than mine. I knew I would be in the minority before even opening this thread.
What you want to "debate" is recognizing whether I and everybody else who's not a white guy are human. Whether we're perverted or not. Whether we lie about everything. WE NEVER MOVE ON.

Our basic humanity is never accepted. It's never, "okay, this is settled, let's move on." And how come every last one of these JAQ offs is on the internet but refuses to research and even read anything? It's always, "BUT WHY can't I tell women to wear burkas if they don't want to get raped? Free speech!" It's always having to defend the most basic territory.

There's always some dude who's never bestirred himself to look up anything-----and who absolutely refuses to listen-----demanding for the millionth time that we explain why it's not okay to accuse all rape victims of lying and prove that gay guys aren't recruiting.
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  #754  
Old 12-20-2019, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by margin View Post
It's always, "BUT WHY can't I tell women to wear burkas if they don't want to get raped? Free speech!" It's always having to defend the most basic territory.

There's always some dude who's never bestirred himself to look up anything-----and who absolutely refuses to listen-----demanding for the millionth time that we explain why it's not okay to accuse all rape victims of lying and prove that gay guys aren't recruiting.
No one on the SDMB tells women to wear burkas or says that all rape victims are lying. The problem of defending that territory doesn't exist.

In my view, much of the problem is Dopers reacting as if someone said those things. Even when that is not a reasonable interpretation of anything posted.

Regards,
Shodan
  #755  
Old 12-20-2019, 10:40 AM
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And sometimes when it is.

Pretty sure you understand that margin was being slightly hyperbolic.
  #756  
Old 12-20-2019, 11:02 AM
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Even to the extent that that's true, it's still a problem. Hyperbole changes reasonable to unreasonable, positions worthy of discussions to positions unworthy of discussion, inoffensive (or less offensive) to highly offensive. It's a very substantive difference.

Engaging in hyperbole detracts significantly from the ability to have discussions about the particular issue at hand. It's not always (in fact it rarely is) obvious at which point the hyperbole ends and what represents the genuine point being argued. So on the one hand it's fundamental to the issue at hand, as above, but on the other it's virtually impossible to address other than to just take it at face value, for those who have the patience for that or find it amusing.
  #757  
Old 12-20-2019, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
No one on the SDMB tells women to wear burkas or says that all rape victims are lying. The problem of defending that territory doesn't exist.

In my view, much of the problem is Dopers reacting as if someone said those things. Even when that is not a reasonable interpretation of anything posted.

Regards,
Shodan
This is why people call you dishonest, when you pretend sarcasm doesn't exist.

And it's funny how "we don't say all women lie about rape" gets used as a defense when every rape topic gets filled with men protesting that women lie unopposed by other men. (With or two notable exceptions.) Sure, they don't say, "I hearby declare and announce that I believe all women lie about rape," but they NEVER read the cites, never change their position, never avail themselves of the Internet's incredible resources. They never read books. Plus it helps that there's a very elastic definition of lying when it's a woman. Not proven? Lie. Doesn't remember every last detail perfectly? Lie. Other people don't remember? Lie. It's almost like they avoid that actual facts about rape because they're afraid of what they might find.

I've recommended, "Against Our Will", by Susan Brownmiller; "Men on Rape," by Tim Beneke; "A Woman Scorned," by Peggy Reeves Sanday; "The Gift of Fear," by Gavin de Becker; "Why Does He Do that?" by Lundy Bancroft; and if anybody picks one book, it should be, "Virgin or Vamp" by Helen Benedict.

Other women cite the FBI, the CDC, (and the CDC's correction of the way MRAs are lying about the CDC's research) but the dialogue never changes. By way of example, there's a topic in great debates where people really, really, REALLY want to blame rape on womens' clothes, drinking habits, womens' clothes, party attendance, bar patronization, womens' clothes, and womens' clothes and womens' clothes. It's, what, thirteen pages by now?
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  #758  
Old 12-20-2019, 11:59 AM
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I doubt if your assumption holds.

And even if it does, not every generalization involves bigotry. If someone believed Ford because "women rarely lie about rape", I doubt if you would be calling that bigotry.
If you were purely betting on the odds, you'd win if you bet on Ford, just by the numbers.


The sheer number of men who pile on to rape discussions to accuse women of lying reminds me of an odd phenomenon in my old unit.

We had one (1) girl who slept around.

We had fifteen (15) guys who talked about her and two (2) women who demanded why we couldn't discuss something else. The 15 guys claimed they'd each slept with her. They criticized her for that.

If you listened casually, you'd think it was fifteen different women who the guys were talking about. It was so pernicious that when the two women who fought back each got pregnant later on, they concealed their condition for months while doing ruck marches and PT tests, till they were visibly pregnant.
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They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.
  #759  
Old 12-21-2019, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by MrDibble View Post
the mods have made it painfully clear by direct statements that if you're polite, you can say what you like about African intellectual inferiority in GD.
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Originally Posted by DrDeth View Post
In GD? Since when? That's been a long time. .
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Originally Posted by DrDeth View Post
I post in GD nearly daily and I dont remember any such stuff for quite some time.
Since right now.

Go look over here: https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb...d.php?t=887052

It starts off trying to hide under a political/cultural argument but eventually becomes pretty blatant:

https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb...&postcount=135

So far, at least, the mods haven't said anything about it.
  #760  
Old 12-21-2019, 03:27 PM
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Really not seeing anything remotely resembling that there. Mind you I didn't read every post but the general arguments there are more just inane and poorly articulated than anything else.

I'll comment in the thread though.
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