#1  
Old 10-10-2019, 01:54 AM
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Powerful post on Reddit


I thought this was a great perspective from a younger person:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reddit Post
BikeDoctor137
I get that she's highly efficient. My question was more on the lines of not fucking killing yourself while still understanding just how FUBARED everything is, and how preventable this current shit-show was.



WhyYouGottaBeSoRude9
Oh, thatís easy

First, start out by your first full memory being 9/11

Second, the next few years of your life are spent watching some of the younger but older than you members of your family go off to fight some goat farmers in a desert and watch them come back broken, mentally and physically (if they come back at all)

Third, that college thing that everyone has been saying is the only way to make something of yourself? Well, the economy just shit itself worse than it has in decades, so it turns out that college isnít going to be as big a help as anyone thought it would be. Also, owning a house? Not even in your dreams

Fourth, youíre now old enough to actually go die in that same desert your older family members went to a decade ago, and you might actually get the chance to die in that very same desert because we never left!

Fifth, youíre old enough now to realize how prohibitively expensive fucking everything is and that a single medical emergency can bankrupt you for life, so hopefully that pain on your left side isnít actually anything important and will go away on its own

Sixth, turns out that youíre just in time to witness the last time the planet can be saved if corporations would just stop trying to kill it, but they wonít because money! And thereís dick all you can do about it because you barely have enough energy to keep yourself alive on ramen, water, and that lamp that you convinced yourself is hot enough to keep you warm at night, let alone worry about the seven billion other people on the planet

Seventh, by now, youíve realized that your political leaders are basically all corrupt to varying degrees which is why most of them refuse to do anything that would actually fix any of our issues today. This is compounded by the fact that a racist rapist moron got elected to the most powerful office of the most powerful country in the world, despite openly bragging about assaulting women and mocking a disabled report on live television.

Iím 25 years old. Every single day, the world has gone further down the shitter than it was the day before, and it was already pretty far down there to begin with. Every day, humanity as a whole reaches some new low. Every hour, some horrific act happens and gets splashed our collective consciousness.

We only have one planet and we canít even agree on just not killing it. Tell me, why the hell would I kill myself over this? Why would any of my generation?

Weíre used to the world being this shitty because as far as weíre all concerned, itís always been this shitty. As far as Iím concerned, Iím here to go down with the ship, playing my violin all the way down to the bottom of the ocean.
  #2  
Old 10-10-2019, 06:50 AM
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Wow, that's a...really real take on like, life man. Nobody ever thought of felt that way before, at least not from my pre-911 generation, where'd this dude like come up with this amazing insight man?!?!?!@!!

Sorry, I know thats the wrong way to post that, but, that quoted post is not powerful, or new or original in anyway that matters what so ever. Sure sure, the details differ from generation to generation and each has had its civilization ending existential crisis or so. Hell in my lifetime I can recall famine brought on by overpopulation, man made ice age, population crash by way of thirst as we were going to run out of potable water any day now and nuclear war. All of these were popular emergencies for humanity in the last 50ish years, several pushed by Carl Sagan Himself.

Yeah the world is a shitty place, get over it.
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Old 10-10-2019, 09:04 AM
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I think Darren nailed it down fairly well. Having the perspective of time tends to do that to an extent. A quick read through Jared Diamond's World Until Yesterday can give one a real understanding of just how good we actually have it overall. At least, until the next Dark Age anyway...
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Old 10-10-2019, 09:21 AM
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After the routine savagery, brutality, and endless wars of the 20th century, we're practically living in Shangri-La now. Sure, a lot of things are fucked, but when are they not?

That poor, tormented Holden Caulfield on reddit should contemplate the rule of King Leopold in the Congo Free State. Hardship and adversity? Modern day America is a picnic.
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Old 10-10-2019, 09:28 AM
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Great, so as the world burns and our metropolises flood, we can all chant "at least we have it better than King Leopold's Congonese subjects, amiright?"
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Old 10-10-2019, 10:56 AM
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I think it's all relative. Daily life for me at least isn't so bad compared to many people in the past or in less stable parts of the world. I don't have to work in a mine, do back-breaking or dangerous labor, worry about getting shot at, or anything like that. I think corporations have enabled large numbers of middle class that aren't rich but don't have too many large complaints either. A steady stream of semi trucks brings gas, goods, and food into the Walmarts and McDonalds etc and we get by just fine. But is this sustainable? One hiccup in my income and I'm toast. One hiccup in the flow of food into my area and suddenly I have to drive 80 miles round trip for basic needs.
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Old 10-10-2019, 11:06 AM
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Great, so as the world burns and our metropolises flood, we can all chant "at least we have it better than King Leopold's Congonese subjects, amiright?"
The world is not burning. Most metropolises are not flooding. And while we have it better than King Leopoldís Congolese subjects, we also have it better than almost any subject of any ruler, ever.

We are faced with real issues. But even if the Netherlands, Bangladesh, a bunch of islands and chunks of Ireland and England get flooded, in aggregate the world population will still be better off than it was 60 years ago. It doesnít mean the problems arenít real, or serious, it just puts them in perspective. Growing up in the Netherlands in the 70ís and 80ís the prevailing attitude of many younger people was that it was kinda silly to be too involved in school etc, since we were all going to die in WW3 anyway. This, in hindsight, was stupid. We didnít die in WW3, and our lives were better than those of previous generations by almost any measure.
Mid-20th century, global life expectancy was around 45 years. Now itís over 70. That is a massive improvement.
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Old 10-10-2019, 11:36 AM
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Sounds like an overly-entitled crybaby whining about world that is better than any time before now because he can't buy a house when he is 22 years old.
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Old 10-10-2019, 01:53 PM
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Fortunately, a significant number of people of his age are holding down jobs, collectively addressing many of the problems he's moaning about.

In ten years, one of them will be his landlord, while he bemoans his fate as a renter.
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Old 10-10-2019, 01:55 PM
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Sounds like an overly-entitled crybaby whining about world that is better than any time before now because he can't buy a house when he is 22 years old.
Buy a house in a prime spot in San Francisco when he is 22 years old. And you know what? Neither can I, at 47 with a pretty damned good salary.
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Old 10-10-2019, 03:19 PM
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hmmm....methinks the 25-year old needs to get laid.

Last edited by chappachula; 10-10-2019 at 03:21 PM.
  #12  
Old 10-10-2019, 03:33 PM
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Too late. The Chads already took all the Stacys.
  #13  
Old 10-10-2019, 03:46 PM
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I thought this was a great perspective from a younger person:
My first memories predate 9/11/01, despite being a couple years younger than the redditor in question. I mean yes, all of those things actually happened and have importance in how I view the world. But compared to my parent's generation... whose first fully formed memories were watching the assassination of the leader of the free world, or ducking under gradeschool desks in anticipation of a nuclear strike, or seeing your family members being shipped off across the world to murder despirate farmers in the jungle, getting your license and then not being allowed to drive because of gasoline rationing, being unable to marry your soulmate because of anti-miscegenation laws, first learning about politics when the President of the United States covers up for a political crime, etc.

And don't then there's the generation before that... born into a world engulfed in the bloodiest war in history, growing up during the single greatest economic disaster in modern times, coming of age just in time to be shipped out for a second world war, winning that war only to see the rise of communism...

~Max
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Old 10-10-2019, 04:47 PM
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I think Darren nailed it down fairly well.
Are you...are you from the future? I hadn't even read the thread yet when you posted this!
(For the record, my reaction to the Reddit post is "What a Drama Llama!")
  #15  
Old 10-10-2019, 04:53 PM
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Me, I see his post as the first step into...joining the 3%ers and setting off a bomb somewhere. Or shooting up something. Because if there's nothing to live for, then why care? You can shoot yourself, or shoot someone else. Which is easier?

And yes, I swear I read that post decades ago.
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Old 10-10-2019, 05:02 PM
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Are you...are you from the future? I hadn't even read the thread yet when you posted this!
(For the record, my reaction to the Reddit post is "What a Drama Llama!")
I was a bit confused, too. swampspruce probably meant to write DorkVader.

~Max
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Old 10-10-2019, 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Isosleepy View Post
The world is not burning. Most metropolises are not flooding. And while we have it better than King Leopoldís Congolese subjects, we also have it better than almost any subject of any ruler, ever.

We are faced with real issues. But even if the Netherlands, Bangladesh, a bunch of islands and chunks of Ireland and England get flooded, in aggregate the world population will still be better off than it was 60 years ago. It doesnít mean the problems arenít real, or serious, it just puts them in perspective. Growing up in the Netherlands in the 70ís and 80ís the prevailing attitude of many younger people was that it was kinda silly to be too involved in school etc, since we were all going to die in WW3 anyway. This, in hindsight, was stupid. We didnít die in WW3, and our lives were better than those of previous generations by almost any measure.
Mid-20th century, global life expectancy was around 45 years. Now itís over 70. That is a massive improvement.
You can keep ignoring what the science says if you want, but as we have been told over and over again over the last two years, we have a very short window of time to prevent irreparable damage.
  #18  
Old 10-10-2019, 10:19 PM
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I was a bit confused, too. swampspruce probably meant to write DorkVader.

~Max
It was my dorkside sith bunny powers clouding everyone's vision, yeah, that's the answer.

Thats right, the Easter Bunny is a Sith Lord, think about it.

Does that make the world better or worse?
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Old 10-11-2019, 08:14 AM
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I'm not sure why people are ridiculing the author, these are valid complaints.

Maybe they're not as bad as what people went through in ww2 but they exist.

And what makes them so miserable is they are avoidable. We could have higher wages, universal health care, do something about climate change, do something about foreign investors driving up real estate prices. But we don't do anything about it because we live in a plutocracy and the rich like our broken system.
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Old 10-11-2019, 08:46 AM
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The reason for the ridicule is that there is nothing substantially new. The realizations in the complaints are the exact same ones every generation has had going back...forever maybe? And many of them really are not that different from the Boomers and GenXers
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Old 10-11-2019, 09:02 AM
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Are you...are you from the future? I hadn't even read the thread yet when you posted this!
(For the record, my reaction to the Reddit post is "What a Drama Llama!")
Sorry about that. Yes, I meant Dork Vader, and I didn't use the chrono-visualizer illegally again. Really. And I still agree with Darren in this case.
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Old 10-11-2019, 09:07 AM
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Wesley, it's not ridicule as I see it, it's more about perspective. Are things bad, yes they are. Could things be better? Absolutely. The thing is, for most of the world things are leaps and bounds better than they were, and in order to preserve that instead of being bitter, maybe do something about it rather than whinging about what's already occurred. It's always easier to blame Someone Else rather than deal with what's in front of you.
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Old 10-11-2019, 09:08 AM
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I'm not sure why people are ridiculing the author, these are valid complaints.
It's not that the complaints aren't valid, it's that they aren't unique or unprecedented. It's more like they're simply part of the human condition and the person writing that post thinks that no other generation has ever faced similar issues.

That doesn't mean we shouldn't be working on fixing those valid problems, or that we should diminish their impact because other generations had worse. We can be better, but we also need to look at this in context.
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Old 10-11-2019, 10:50 AM
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The reason for the ridicule is that there is nothing substantially new. The realizations in the complaints are the exact same ones every generation has had going back...forever maybe? And many of them really are not that different from the Boomers and GenXers
Right.

There is a LOT of panicky, whiny drama on Reddit about how the world is going down the tubes, how corporations are the root of all evil, and so on...

It's just the same old stuff as we (Gen-X) saw when we were younger, except that they're not concerned in large part with being 30 minutes from nuclear war, or some sort of escalation of hostilities in Europe starting a conventional WWIII, but instead, it's global warming, inequity, etc...

But it does seem to me that the bitching and whining and general pessimistic attitude on the part of the Millenials and Gen-Z types is more widespread and bitter than that of years past. I recall an overall undercurrent of hopefulness when I was in high school and college about the world- that maybe detente, glasnost and the SALT treaties might actually be helpful. And that things would probably be better in the future.

But this bunch seems to be a huge bunch of Eeyores who are convinced that in 20 years, we'll be lucky to be living in a Mad Max-esque post-apocalyptic hellscape, or that it'll be some sort of super-corporatized hell a-la William Gibson.

What gets me is that they totally discount all the historical progress we've made in getting where we are, much of which has been in the past 20 or so years.
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Old 10-11-2019, 12:23 PM
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...

But it does seem to me that the bitching and whining and general pessimistic attitude on the part of the Millenials and Gen-Z types is more widespread and bitter than that of years past.

...
I think part of that is that the complaints are online and widely visible. Being online also pushes attitudes towards the extremes. Any and all bad news from around the world gets seen.

I heard plenty of whining from my high school (mid-'90s) classmates about how the world was shitty now and the older generations had it easier. Still, the was a general feeling of hope and accomplishment between the breakup of the Soviet Union and 9/11, plus some good economic years.

I don't blame them for feeling screwed over; what annoys is them thinking they're the only ones.
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  #26  
Old 10-11-2019, 02:35 PM
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Yeah the world is a shitty place, get over it.
Thanks boomer who lived his life with half of the worlds labour market closed off in a different economic/political bloc.
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Old 10-11-2019, 04:06 PM
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I'm not sure why people are ridiculing the author, these are valid complaints.
Yes, because everyone has been reduced to surviving on Ramen and tap-water, huddled around the warmth of a light bulb.
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Old 10-11-2019, 06:42 PM
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I'm not sure why people are ridiculing the author, these are valid complaints.

Maybe they're not as bad as what people went through in ww2 but they exist.

And what makes them so miserable is they are avoidable. We could have higher wages, universal health care, do something about climate change, do something about foreign investors driving up real estate prices. But we don't do anything about it because we live in a plutocracy and the rich like our broken system.
It's the usual reasons. It's easier to ridicule that which you don't like than to actually engage. You don't have to worry about them actually maybe having good arguments and having to change your views, and you don't have to worry about having to put in the mental effort to debunk that which is wrong.

Also, it's the usual generational animosity. That's why the whole "we had it bad, too" argument is being used. There will always be those who see the newer generation as opponents to defeat. Rather than listen to what is concerning them, you can tell them "we had to deal with something worse." It's about winning against them, for some reason.

The argument is fairly good. The latest generation grew up in a more pessimistic world than at least the past generation. You have their most foundational memories being made soon after 9/11, followed by the economic crisis, followed by the election of the single most transparently evil president we've ever had, undermining all the progress that one generation prior took for granted. The wealth gap is largest it's been since the 1950s at least. And we're actually to the tipping point where global warming could actually seal the fate of humanity.

Nothing about the fact that we made it through things in the past mean will make it through this time. Nothing about the past means that we'll be able to make people listen to us like happened throughout the Civil Right era.

Ridicule, like taking obvious rhetoric literally, is the low hanging fruit. It's easier to say "no one actually subsisted on Ramen and a lamp to keep warm" than to actually engage in understanding this latest generation or why we need to fix things.

Yeah, my post may seem pretentious. I don't know how else to convey the sentiment. You tried the less direct "I don't see why," but no one listened. Part of why I may seem more lectury than others is that I often come in after the less direct methods have been tried.

Last edited by BigT; 10-11-2019 at 06:43 PM.
  #29  
Old 10-11-2019, 08:46 PM
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It's the usual reasons. It's easier to ridicule that which you don't like than to actually engage. You don't have to worry about them actually maybe having good arguments and having to change your views, and you don't have to worry about having to put in the mental effort to debunk that which is wrong.
Sorry, but sometimes ridicule is all that is required. As an example, those who say "False accusations of rape against men are something all men should be worried about" or "Antifa is a greater threat than any right wing violence!"

I'm not going to waste my time engaging and debunking that. It's just easier to pointedly laugh at such a person.

Perhaps I'm just old now (46), but kids complaining about the state of the world when they are just out of college know little more than they did in college. It's especially grating when they complain about house buying, or in-affordability of a two-bedroom apartment or something similar, but without discussing why they think they SHOULD be able to get that.

Also, I wish they would get off my lawn!
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Old 10-12-2019, 01:20 AM
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To me, this kind of stuff is just an indictment of how the current generation is having their brains broken by social media and 24 hour news.

Horrible shit has ALWAYS happened in the world. You just didn't hear as much about it in the old days because you weren't seeing it all over Facebook and on the news all the time. Clickbait news emphasizes the worst and scariest stuff so that people are now constantly outraged and terrified about things that they never would have heard about 30 years ago.

Imagine living during the days of the Black Death and seeing like 60% of the population around you dying. Don't you think those people were scared as shit that the world was ending? Rape and murder used to be much more common than they are now and far easier to get away with than they are now. It used to be normal to have several of your children die in infancy or early childhood of diseases that can now be prevented with a simple vaccine. Nowadays most people have a reasonable expectation that ALL of their kids will survive to adulthood, which wasn't the case as recently as when my own grandmother was born. Corruption has been a part of "politics" for as long as politics have existed. Life really isn't that bad right now in many ways. Anyone who thinks this is a uniquely awful time to be alive just hasn't been alive long enough to have perspective on things.

Last edited by skyr; 10-12-2019 at 01:21 AM.
  #31  
Old 10-12-2019, 01:50 AM
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To me, this kind of stuff is just an indictment of how the current generation is having their brains broken by social media and 24 hour news.
To me, this kind of stuff is just an indictment of how certain members of the "older generation(s)" will take any chance they can get to curb stomp "the current generation."

Honestly, I’m not even sure what the point is of discussing this if the OP (the actual OP) isn’t here to discuss it and the proxy OP (who copied it to this forum) doesn’t seem too interested in highlighting just what exactly they found "powerful" about it.

Is it possible to thread-shit a topic that basically started out as a chance for old folks to yell at clouds?

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  #32  
Old 10-12-2019, 08:51 AM
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It is ridiculous to completely ignore that life as a whole is significantly better than it has ever been. Being poor today in a western country beats being wealthy in most of history anywhere. Being in a poor country today beats being in a poor country any other time, for most people. Life in almost any country is better today than any time before. This isn’t bitching about how tough we had it when I was x age, because when I was x age the exact same things were true. When I whined, at x age, about no future and The Bomb and whatever else provided existential angst, that was ridiculous too.
So to me, the post quoted in the op is anything but profound. It is trite, and the only thing profound about it is its profound unoriginality.

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  #33  
Old 10-12-2019, 01:35 PM
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Yes, because everyone has been reduced to surviving on Ramen and tap-water, huddled around the warmth of a light bulb.
Not even that. We replaced the comfort and warmth of an incandescent bulb with efficient LED's to reduce our carbon footprint so he's reduced to discussing his plight to the whole world by the cold glow of computer monitor.

Remember the good old days of drought, financial collapse, plague, and massive world wars in the first half of the last century. Good times. Good times.

I'd suggest the author petition his parents for papers giving him safe passage from their basement but this looks like a mental health issue.
  #34  
Old 10-12-2019, 04:21 PM
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The Reddit writer has a point, which some people have missed. He sees his life as being more hopeless than, say, someone a decade or so older, and that's his experience. To date. He doesn't have a lot of it.

Now I too remember being in my 20s. Graduating from college into the worst job market since the depression. There were wage and price controls and hardly anyone was hiring, and few of my college friends were attaining jobs "in their field."

Things got better. But when you're in the thick of it, you don't know that things are going to get better.

I think the turning point for me was the headline "NIXON RESIGNS!" That was the point at which I figured things were going to get better. Or anyway, that there was a chance.

I'm hopeful that this young person will also receive a sign that things are gonna get better. It probably won't be a headline. Maybe a tweet.
  #35  
Old 10-12-2019, 04:37 PM
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I love that people terrified to go to Wal-Mart without concealed carrying a pistol, because AOC is turning America into Venezuela, are confidently judging the over-dramatic kids these days. Comedy gold, dudes.
  #36  
Old 10-12-2019, 04:46 PM
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Lot of boomer nonsense in this thread.
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Old 10-12-2019, 05:05 PM
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Thanks boomer who lived his life with half of the worlds labour market closed off in a different economic/political bloc.
Uh, are you calling me a boomer, or is that directed at baby boomers in general? I'm not a baby boomer, I'm a GenXer. I agree though, its all the baby boomer generation's fault
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  #38  
Old 10-12-2019, 05:30 PM
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You don't 'farm' goats.
  #39  
Old 10-12-2019, 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Gatopescado View Post
You don't 'farm' goats.
Well, not with Ramen and tap water you don't!
  #40  
Old 10-12-2019, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by chappachula View Post
hmmm....methinks the 25-year old needs to get laid.
I know the *perfect* 16 year old for him! Ehh? Oooh, but she might have a bo-what the fuck am i smoking! She's free to court. Free as, well, free as air.

(assuming they are both in countries that allow such conduct).

Last edited by Ambivalid; 10-12-2019 at 07:00 PM.
  #41  
Old 10-12-2019, 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted by HMS Irruncible View Post
I love that people terrified to go to Wal-Mart without concealed carrying a pistol, because AOC is turning America into Venezuela, are confidently judging the over-dramatic kids these days. Comedy gold, dudes.
LOL. It reminds me of something David Hogg said after people got upset that Gillette said 'its good to be a decent human being'.

https://pics.me.me/david-hogg-o-davi...e-40338637.png

Quote:
Its kind of funny how the same people that call us snowflakes for not wanting to be shot in school can be this mad at a razor.
Young people have problems. Jobs are disappearing, but more importantly good jobs are disappearing. The economy is filled with temp work, contract work, part time work, etc. Full time jobs with living wages, benefits and job security are becoming a smaller and smaller % of jobs out there.

We're looking at massive debts due to pension crisis, health care crisis, etc.

Its going to be rough. People today are going to have a lower standard of living.

What pisses a lot of younger people off is that these are all manmade disasters. We could address shitty jobs, income inequality, shitty health care, climate change, etc. via legislation, Its just that the rich and powerful (and their bought and sold politicians) have no desire to do so.
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  #42  
Old 10-12-2019, 09:17 PM
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Yes, because everyone has been reduced to surviving on Ramen and tap-water, huddled around the warmth of a light bulb.
But today's LED lights produce far less heat than the incandescent ones we grew up with.

And isn't it great that the people who accuse us of wanting to turn the country into Venezuela are the same ones who want to turn it into Yugoslavia?

Last edited by E-DUB; 10-12-2019 at 09:20 PM.
  #43  
Old 10-12-2019, 09:59 PM
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We could address shitty jobs, income inequality, shitty health care, climate change, etc. via legislation
Suuuuuure we can!
  #44  
Old 10-12-2019, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Darren Garrison View Post
Suuuuuure we can!
I don't see what the problem is.

We could pass universal health care. Rebuild labor unions. raise the minimum wage. Pass progressive taxes. Fund redistribution projects. Drastically increase public funding for renewable energy. Restrict the use of permatemps and contract work.
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  #45  
Old 10-13-2019, 01:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Gatopescado View Post
You don't 'farm' goats.
I used to live on a goat farm, so I'll have to disagree.
  #46  
Old 10-13-2019, 01:33 AM
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I don't see what the problem is.

We could pass universal health care. Rebuild labor unions. raise the minimum wage. Pass progressive taxes. Fund redistribution projects. Drastically increase public funding for renewable energy. Restrict the use of permatemps and contract work.
You are very eager to spend other people's money and run other people's businesses and personal lives.
  #47  
Old 10-13-2019, 09:00 AM
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Here's another drama queen whining about about the dark state of things in the US.

Quote:
ďBy any honest assessment the consequences of this moral upheaval have been grim. Virtually every measure of social pathology continues to gain ground. Along with the wreckage of the family we are seeing record levels of depression and mental illness, dispirited young people, soaring suicide rates, increasing numbers of alienated young males, an increase in senseless violence and the deadly drug epidemic.Ē
Oh my mistake, that's William Barr, Attorney General of the United States.

But go on, tell us about how millennials are too spoiled by circumstance to understand that things are really gonna be okay.
  #48  
Old 10-13-2019, 10:33 AM
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You are very eager to spend other people's money and run other people's businesses and personal lives.
Thats how government works.

Also the only reason its 'their' money is because they changed all the laws so all the wealth created goes to the top.
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  #49  
Old 10-13-2019, 10:57 AM
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Here's the thing, and I thought I pretty directly said this, but in review, maybe not.

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

If you want to nationalize healthcare, make education mandatory through grade 17 (this one might actually have small possibilities) and give a basic income to everyone, well ok. Tons of issues there, but K suppose it could possibly be managed, maybe.

But you wouldn't solve the real problem. You'd just be putting a different shade of lipstick on the pig you're being forced to kiss.

Today's youth aren't the first to see mass migration of good jobs to other countries. That's been happening since the 80s at least. Poverty, homlessness, all of it, there isn't anything new in the plaint, we ALL went through that phase. Global Warming (sorry climate change) is on the verge of destroying human civilization? Ok, so what? There is always a climate ot nuclear war or terrorist or cosmic interdimensional portal or alien invasion that is about to wipe out mankind. We're still here. That's the beauty and strength of humanity as a whole, we're smart enough and flexible enough to adapt and innovate and invent and dominate and control and manipulate our enviroment to the point that now, I'm not entirely certain that you could wipe away civilization with anything short of a planet killing asteroid. You know "Nothing would survive, not even bacteria"

Maybe its a harsh way of saying it, but the world IS a harsh place, its cold and unforgiving and can seem cruel, but only if you are so petty and small minded that you don't see the larger picture. Grow up, put yer big pants on and get out there and make a mark on the world tiger. Don't do what amounts to complaining that nobody finds you significant enough to pay attention to or bow before
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Last edited by DorkVader; 10-13-2019 at 11:01 AM.
  #50  
Old 10-13-2019, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Wesley Clark View Post
Also the only reason its 'their' money is because they changed all the laws so all the wealth created goes to the top.
You mean so that the people who earned the money get to keep more of it? That's the American Dream: "Build a better mousetrap and the world will beat a path to your door. Then decide that you don't deserve to keep the money from all those mousetraps you sold and demand that it be taken from you and be spent on what they want."

There are two problems with the "tax the hell out of the rich" solution to everything. The first is philosophical--for the modern super-rich,the bulk of their money is virtual, tied up in the moment-by-moment vue of their companies' stocks. I believe that people have a ethical and moral right to retain control over a company that they created as long as they want to and can hold on to enough shares of their company and not be forced to give up the company that they have built to success to pay extreme taxes. Don't punish people for creating something that lots of people are willing to pay money for. The second problem is practical--the money rich people have is a limited resource. It is like fossil fuels--something that took a long time to accumulate but will be replenished far more slowly if ever at all. Everybody that wants to solve problems by taking all the rich people's money are imagining spending the same money. You can't spend all of the rich people's money to fix the environment and spend all the rich people's money to fix healthcare and spend all the rich people's money to fix wage inequality and spend all the rich people's money to fix the national infrastructure and spend all the rich people's money on whatever other pet project you want to take their money away from them for.
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