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Old 10-09-2019, 08:45 AM
Sigene is offline
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I don't understand the Alec Baldwin scam


https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/celebri...cam/ar-AAIu0B9

please explain, why taking a shuttle to New Jersey indicates that this is a scam.

the articles I've read seem to assume that everyone is as familiar with New York and the situation as a New Yorker might be.

I'd appreciate more details of the event.

Last edited by Sigene; 10-09-2019 at 08:46 AM.
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Old 10-09-2019, 09:09 AM
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The Statue of Liberty is on Liberty Island. Baldwin bought tickets to Liberty Park.
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Old 10-09-2019, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Terminus Est View Post
The Statue of Liberty is on Liberty Island. Baldwin bought tickets to Liberty Park.
I've read a couple of news articles that really didn't explain this at all. They mention this:

Quote:
The tour will take passengers past the statue -- but first you've got to go to Liberty City, New Jersey.

The actor took to Instagram to explain that he bought tickets for a "boat tour" around the Statue of Liberty, but no one ever told him he'd have to leave New York first.
The word "first" implies that New Jersey is a previously unannounced (and unacceptable) waypoint on the way to the desired destination, and the article even explicitly says the tour will take passengers "past" the statue. The word "past" is certainly ambigious, but it's never made clear (in the article, or by Alec Baldwin) that these tickets were never going to get them anywhere near the statue. Baldwin's main point of rage in his tweet is New Jersey:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alec Baldwin
We buy tickets for the "boat tour of the Statue of Liberty.
We are escorted to a shuttle bus.
To New Jersey!
I kid you not.
We paid. Then we read the tickets.
NO ON EVER MENTIONED NEW F***ING JERSEY!!!
This is a scam.


If the scam is as you describe (and I don't doubt it is), then basically we're dealing with some shitty writing by Alec Baldwin and the journalist(s) who covered the incident.
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Old 10-09-2019, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigene View Post
https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/celebri...cam/ar-AAIu0B9

please explain, why taking a shuttle to New Jersey indicates that this is a scam.

the articles I've read seem to assume that everyone is as familiar with New York and the situation as a New Yorker might be.

I'd appreciate more details of the event.
From his account, Baldwin bought tickets from South Ferry, which is at the south end of Manhattan. This is where the ferries that go to Liberty Island itself depart from. Given the point of sale, one might assume that the boat tour would depart from there. However, the tour actually departed from Liberty Park, New Jersey, on the other side of the harbor, and required taking a shuttle bus to there via (probably) the Holland Tunnel. I don't know how long this would take, but I would assume maybe a half hour at least depending on traffic. So this would be rather inconvenient.

I'm not sure I would call this a scam, exactly, since the tickets indicate "Liberty Park, New Jersey," and mention a free shuttle bus (which would be unnecessary if the tour left from South Ferry), unless the seller verbally misrepresented them. Baldwin was guilty of not finding out exactly what he was purchasing, not reading the tickets, and being generally inattentive. (Never a good idea in New York.)

Last edited by Colibri; 10-09-2019 at 09:41 AM.
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Old 10-09-2019, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Colibri View Post
I'm not sure I would call this a scam, exactly, since the tickets indicate "Liberty Park, New Jersey," and mention a free shuttle bus (which would be unnecessary if the tour left from South Ferry), unless the seller verbally misrepresented them. Baldwin was guilty of not finding out exactly what he was purchasing, not reading the tickets, and being generally inattentive. (Never a good idea in New York.)
I'd call it a scam on tourists in the sense that no one in their right mind would ever do that tour, if they were given full information on what it includes & doesn't include, and what other tours are no doubt available from South Ferry. But yes, shame on NY resident Baldwin for not knowing what he was buying.
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Old 10-09-2019, 09:57 AM
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Originally Posted by muldoonthief View Post
I'd call it a scam on tourists in the sense that no one in their right mind would ever do that tour, if they were given full information on what it includes & doesn't include, and what other tours are no doubt available from South Ferry. But yes, shame on NY resident Baldwin for not knowing what he was buying.
I agree that they have to be targeting people who are ignorant of the better options. I note that the operator Tours R Us NYC has an 84% "Terrible" rating on TripAdvisor.
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Old 10-09-2019, 10:58 AM
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please explain, why taking a shuttle to New Jersey indicates that this is a scam.
Because you end up in New Jersey. No one wants that.
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Old 10-09-2019, 11:01 AM
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Because you end up in New Jersey. No one wants that.
And I presume you don't get a free shuttle bus back to the point where you bought the tickets, either.
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Old 10-09-2019, 11:20 AM
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And I presume you don't get a free shuttle bus back to the point where you bought the tickets, either.
Checking the TripAdvisor reviews, apparently the ride back is nominally included in the price. However, everyone complains about long waits for the buses and boats, and in some cases the return bus never came or was so late they decided to take another ferry or Uber back to Manhattan.

It is clear from the reviews that the agents selling the tickets are blatantly misrepresenting the tours as an "Express" one hour tour, which may seem attractive when you see the lines for the legitimate tours, but fail to deliver this. There aren't enough buses or boats (even if this was a reasonable way to do a tour) so it takes many hours in total.

Even if Baldwin was a bit of a bozo in falling for this, if it helps publicize how bad the company is it may help.
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Old 10-09-2019, 01:21 PM
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This map will make the geographical relationships clearer. Obviously if you are already at Battery Park (South Ferry) then it would be better to take a Statue of Liberty Tour from there rather than haul all the way out to Liberty Park in New Jersey. This is especially true since you would have to take a roundabout route via the Holland Tunnel fighting traffic. And the free Staten Island Ferry goes right by the Statue of Liberty anyway. So if all you want to do is see the Statue relatively close, and don't want to visit the island, this is the best option.
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Old 10-09-2019, 02:54 PM
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Because you end up in New Jersey. No one wants that.
8.9 million Jersey residents can't be wrong!
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Old 10-09-2019, 02:54 PM
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The article mentions ďLiberty CityĒ which doesnít exist except in Grand Theft Auto. Iím assuming they mean Jersey City. And Iíve only ever heard it called Liberty State Park never just Liberty Park.


Quote:
Originally Posted by muldoonthief View Post
I'd call it a scam on tourists in the sense that no one in their right mind would ever do that tour, if they were given full information on what it includes & doesn't include, and what other tours are no doubt available from South Ferry. But yes, shame on NY resident Baldwin for not knowing what he was buying.
Right, itís not a scam in the sense that they are stealing your money. Itís a scam because they are offering a shitty product and are counting on the ignorance of tourists.
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Old 10-09-2019, 03:13 PM
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Taking the ferry or tour from Liberty State Park would be a sensible option if you are coming from New Jersey, Pennsylvania, or anywhere else west of the Hudson. So the tour itself isn't ridiculous. However, it is ridiculous if you are already in Manhattan.
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Old 10-09-2019, 05:10 PM
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Taking the ferry or tour from Liberty State Park would be a sensible option if you are coming from New Jersey, Pennsylvania, or anywhere else west of the Hudson. So the tour itself isn't ridiculous. However, it is ridiculous if you are already in Manhattan.
Itís not ridiculous if all you want is to near near the statue and not go on the island. $40 is a lot for just that. The Circle Line goes close to the statue and also goes all the way around Manhattan for $44.
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Old 10-10-2019, 12:03 AM
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I'm amazed that someone like Alec Baldwin, who has lived in Manhattan for decades, would be taken in by something like this, which everybody else learns to avoid after 30 seconds. I guess he doesn't spend much time below Union Square.
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Old 10-10-2019, 02:14 PM
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The spiel last December as we walked from the metro station to the ferry terminal was, and I’m paraphrasing, “Hey, did you already buy your tickets?” Then he went on to exaggerate the waiting time of the line through security, how crowded the island would be, and offered instead a ride on a ferry that would go near the island, but not actually dock on it. He was upfront about that. There was no mention of having to cross into New Jersey; that would have pissed me off. Additionally, the barker wasn’t selling the tickets himself; we was trying to direct us to a kiosk somewhere nearby.

We did the real one, because we also wanted to go to Ellis Island.
  #17  
Old 10-10-2019, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Just Asking Questions View Post
8.9 million Jersey residents can't be wrong!
Nope, kind of like The Terminal they're stuck there & can't get out.

Unlike amusement parks, ball games, concerts, movies, & other fun & entertaining things where one pays to get in, NJ lets you in for free & then holds you captive, making you pay to leave.
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Old 10-11-2019, 12:53 PM
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I'm pretty sure someone who glanced at the tickets and saw "See NY from the water" in prominent lettering should've realized they wouldn't actually be docking and getting off on Liberty Island.

It's not a "scam" - it's just not a good deal and Baldwin wasn't paying attention.

"Savvy" indeed.

*wonder if he got into any three-card monte games while on the S.I. Ferry.
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Old 10-11-2019, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Jackmannii View Post
I'm pretty sure someone who glanced at the tickets and saw "See NY from the water" in prominent lettering should've realized they wouldn't actually be docking and getting off on Liberty Island.
Baldwin's tweet indicates he knew he bought a ticket for a "boat tour" of the Statue of Liberty. Nothing in the story suggests he thought he was going to land on the island.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alec Baldwin
We buy the tickets for the 'boat tour' of the Statue of Liberty.
The things on the ticket that should have cued him in that something wasn't right were "Liberty Park, NJ" and "Free Shuttle Included." But those may not have registered because as has been said it makes no sense to do it that way.

Of course, native New Yorkers almost never visit the tourist attractions in the city. I visited to the Statue of Liberty once maybe 50 years ago and haven't been back since.
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Old 10-11-2019, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Colibri View Post
Baldwin's tweet indicates he knew he bought a ticket for a "boat tour" of the Statue of Liberty. Nothing in the story suggests he thought he was going to land on the island.
I wasn't referring to Baldwin, but rather to this part of the story:
Quote:
Visitors to the area downtown are often targeted by shady operators selling tours that don't go to Liberty Island. A spokeswoman for New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio told the Daily News the city "continues to fine sellers who scam customers."
  #21  
Old 10-11-2019, 04:49 PM
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Is anyone else surprised that he didn't arrange (or have his assistant arrange) some sort of VIP tour?
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Old 10-12-2019, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Dewey Finn View Post
Because you end up in New Jersey. No one wants that.
"I sued Delta Airlines
'Cause they sold me a ticket to New Jersey
I went there, and it sucked"


-- "Weird" Al Yankovic, "I'll Sue Ya"
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Old 10-12-2019, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Jackmannii View Post
I wasn't referring to Baldwin, but rather to this part of the story:
Then I wouldn't agree that a tourist would automatically realize that the tour didn't land on Liberty Island just from that phrase. You "see NY from the water" if you take a tour that goes to the island as well.
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