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Old 04-25-2019, 11:13 AM
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Joe Biden's in


Biden pulls off duty tarp covering old campaign motorcycle.

"You hear that baby purring into third gear, your vote isn’t the only thing Uncle Joe’s gonna get."

Will be interesting now that he's finally in. Half of the pundits are saying his candidacy will pull all the energy and money from the middle candidates like Booker and Klobuchar. Others are saying he's gonna have a real hard time keeping up with everyone else as far as fundraising goes.

But as far as endorsements go, he leapfrogs the entire field in a matter of hours.
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Old 04-25-2019, 11:35 AM
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I'll be honest: I'm not sure this is the right focus & tone for a winning campaign:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Biden
We are in the battle for the soul of this nation. If we give Donald Trump eight years in the White House, he will forever and fundamentally alter the character of this nation — who we are. And I cannot stand by and watch that happen.
Bad move, IMO, and it's his first real campaign statement. Nothing like starting stupid, I suppose.

Last edited by Snowboarder Bo; 04-25-2019 at 11:36 AM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 11:42 AM
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I see very similar statements two dozen times a week around here. Are you sure it's stupid?
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Old 04-25-2019, 11:46 AM
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I don't think him being officially in really changes things, because everyone's been assuming right from the start that he was going to run. I guess this means he can officially start fundraising?
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Old 04-25-2019, 11:52 AM
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I see very similar statements two dozen times a week around here. Are you sure it's stupid?
You see very similar campaign statements two dozen times a week around here?
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Old 04-25-2019, 11:53 AM
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I see very similar statements two dozen times a week around here. Are you sure it's stupid?
Most of the posters on this board aren't running for national office. Speaking personally, Trump makes me want to let out a constant, unending scream of inarticulate rage. But I'm still not going to support a candidate whose opening campaign statement is "ARARRRRRAGGGHHSHITGGGLLLLFUCKGRAAAAAAACOCKDICKS!"
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Old 04-25-2019, 11:57 AM
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I think the far-left wing of the party has taken over more than Joe realizes, and he's positioned himself as too much of a moderate to win the nomination.
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Old 04-25-2019, 12:11 PM
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If the peckerhead wins, it will amaze me even more than when the buffoon won the last election. Good Christ, I miss when our politicians weren't all cartoon characters.
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Old 04-25-2019, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Miller View Post
Most of the posters on this board aren't running for national office. Speaking personally, Trump makes me want to let out a constant, unending scream of inarticulate rage. But I'm still not going to support a candidate whose opening campaign statement is "ARARRRRRAGGGHHSHITGGGLLLLFUCKGRAAAAAAACOCKDICKS!"
I love how you think you're taking a stand for not supporting a candidate whose opening campaign statement is "ARARRRRRAGGGHHSHITGGGLLLLFUCKGRAAAAAAACOCKDICKS!" I also love how you think that's relevant to this thread.
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Old 04-25-2019, 12:32 PM
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Awesome, fantastic news.

We FINALLY! have a centrist candidate that has a chance of winning.

Hot damn, finally a Democrat that isn't uktra left wing.

I had early hopes for Kamala Harris she had an outstanding reputation as AG of California. Tough on crime. Tough, no nonsense pragmatic politician. She's been backpedaling and apologizing like crazy. Letting her political minders reshape her image. Shifting left. A damn shame.

I'll be crushed if Biden lets those PR clowns do that too him.
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Old 04-25-2019, 12:41 PM
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Biden needs to run as his own man. Quit apologizing for hugging people.

Run on his excellent record and stick to it. Don't apologize or show any weakness. Show some backbone and Resiliency.

That's so important. Trump never apologizes or kisses anyone's ass.

Biden has to have that same take it or leave it attitude.

Last edited by aceplace57; 04-25-2019 at 12:43 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 12:50 PM
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Most of the posters on this board aren't running for national office.
Most of them are voting for someone for national office so I fail to see what's stupid about saying what voters are saying.

Last edited by CarnalK; 04-25-2019 at 12:51 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 12:53 PM
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Thanks; I'm drawing a conclusion now, based on what you've written in this thread.
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Old 04-25-2019, 12:56 PM
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I still don't understand the appeal of Biden and how he jumps to 1# in mere hours. He is an old white man and a throwback to the 1980s-1990s instead of the 2020s. What is generating the fireworks exactly?
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:00 PM
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I still don't understand the appeal of Biden and how he jumps to 1# in mere hours. He is an old white man and a throwback to the 1980s-1990s instead of the 2020s. What is generating the fireworks exactly?
Because that old "white man" will appeal to many Trump voters? He's going to draw a lot of votes away from Trump. Voters so disgusted by Hillary that they voted this egomaniac into office.

That's assuming the ultra left doesn't force Biden to shift from the center. He's already backpedaling on the Anita Hill hearings 25 years ago.

The irony doesn't escape me that Biden is the only centrist still standing.

20 years ago I thought of him as too liberal. Not any more.

He looks like John McCain compared to the other bleeding heart candidates.

Last edited by aceplace57; 04-25-2019 at 01:04 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:12 PM
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Bad move, IMO, and it's his first real campaign statement. Nothing like starting stupid, I suppose.
Well, the statement is (a) correct, and (b) reflects what most decent Americans are thinking and the consequences they fear, having seen what the first three years of Trump has done. Furthermore, by not addressing Trump's deeply immoral character and malignant nature directly and forcefully, Biden would in effect be normalizing him as just a regular politician, which he absolutely is not.

I don't think a campaign should be predominantly negative, and I don't believe Biden's will be. Probably quite the opposite, actually. But an important statement of truth about the conditions in the nation since January 2017 and why he's running is hardly something I would characterize as "stupid".
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:15 PM
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He starts his campaign by making it about Trump's supporters and not about Trump; ask Mrs. Clinton how well that worked for her.

That's one of the reasons it was stupid: it sets this as us-vs-them instead of as us-vs-Trump. He's declared war on at least 40% of Americans. That's not what this country needs and IMO it isn't what will stop Trump from keeping the presidency.

Last edited by Snowboarder Bo; 04-25-2019 at 01:16 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:17 PM
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In terms of endorsements, the thing to watch is where they come from on the ideological spectrum. Jeb Bush got a lot of endorsements but they were coming from what was considered the centrist and moderate wings of his party. I'm not sure how much endorsements matter these days, but if we're going to use them as a sign of strength, then the endorsements need to be in alignment with the party's base to mean anything.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:17 PM
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I'm falling in love already. This is the straight taking attitude the country needs right now. It feels good hearing someone speak for me and my values.
Quote:
Biden, who claimed that the bike could use a new paint job, said that with Bernie Sanders pulling his same old “commie shit” and Elizabeth Warren “totally tanking” in the polls, there was an opening for a Democrat who could ride in on 900 pounds of all-American steel and speak to the middle class.

Last edited by aceplace57; 04-25-2019 at 01:20 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo View Post
He starts his campaign by making it about Trump's supporters and not about Trump; ask Mrs. Clinton how well that worked for her.

That's one of the reasons it was stupid: it sets this as us-vs-them instead of as us-vs-Trump. He's declared war on at least 40% of Americans. That's not what this country needs and IMO it isn't what will stop Trump from keeping the presidency.
That's not necessarily how everyone would read it. People who were somehow rubbed the wrong way by the portion you quoted are probably going to be turned off the color of Biden's ties for all we know. There's nothing wrong about what he said.

All of that being said, though, I wouldn't be surprised if Biden tanks early. He'll be like a 40-year-old guy at a college bar. Same club, but not the same staff or patrons. He's going to struggle to fit in.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:25 PM
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He starts his campaign by making it about Trump's supporters and not about Trump; ask Mrs. Clinton how well that worked for her.

That's one of the reasons it was stupid: it sets this as us-vs-them instead of as us-vs-Trump. He's declared war on at least 40% of Americans. That's not what this country needs and IMO it isn't what will stop Trump from keeping the presidency.
Who declared war on who? I don't recall the LGBT's declaring war on straight people; quite the reverse. I don't recall immigrants (legal and otherwise) declaring war on native-borns; again,the other way around. I don't recall women in favor of reproductive rights declaring war on those who decided women should be Brood Mares for the State. I don't recall American Muslims declaring war on evangelical Christians.

War's already been declared. Germans bombed Pearl Harbor. Trump's not the disease, he's a symptom.

If Biden's statement is too inflammatory for the Democratic Party to handle, the primaries will show that.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:30 PM
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He starts his campaign by making it about Trump's supporters and not about Trump; ask Mrs. Clinton how well that worked for her.

That's one of the reasons it was stupid: it sets this as us-vs-them instead of as us-vs-Trump. He's declared war on at least 40% of Americans. That's not what this country needs and IMO it isn't what will stop Trump from keeping the presidency.
I don't see an attack on Trump supporters in that statement. Hillary put a label on them, "basket of deplorables". Biden is attacking Trump. Any other interpretation is a ridiculously fanciful stretch. The "we" in "that's not who we are" seems to me to mean all Americans.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:30 PM
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I can't for the life of me find anything wrong with what Biden said. He is telling the absolute truth, and we already know that Trump owns the 35% of the absolute fucking racist xenophobic misogynistic assholes who would get huffy about hearing just what scum they are.

Good for him for speaking the truth. Biden is famously friendly with mainstream Republicans, so I don't see him alienating the more traditional conservatives who have a few working braincells and no longer want to be associated with this corrupt, ignorant, narcissistic pathological liar who's ripped the heart out of what used to be their party..

Quote:
Originally Posted by aceplace57 View Post

Quote:
Biden, who claimed that the bike could use a new paint job, said that with Bernie Sanders pulling his same old “commie shit” and Elizabeth Warren “totally tanking” in the polls, there was an opening for a Democrat who could ride in on 900 pounds of all-American steel and speak to the middle class.
I'm falling in love already. This is the straight taking attitude the country needs right now. It feels good hearing someone speak for me and my values.
WTF... Cite please? Is this from the Onion, or one of your usual oh-so-trusty resources, aka the Daily Mail or NY Post quotes? Because if Biden really said that, he's gone bonkers and has become Trump Lite, and fuck him.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:33 PM
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I can't for the life of me find anything wrong with what Biden said. He is telling the absolute truth, and we already know that Trump owns the 35% of the absolute fucking racist xenophobic misogynistic assholes who would get huffy about hearing just what scum they are.

Good for him for speaking the truth. Biden is famously friendly with mainstream Republicans, so I don't see him alienating the more traditional conservatives who have a few working braincells and no longer want to be associated with this corrupt, ignorant, narcissistic pathological liar who's ripped the heart out of what used to be their party..



WTF... Cite please? Is this from the Onion, or one of your usual oh-so-trusty resources, aka the Daily Mail or NY Post quotes? Because if Biden really said that, he's gone bonkers and has become Trump Lite, and fuck him.
Click the link in my OP.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:34 PM
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It's from the OP's link.

Biden is reaching out to the traditional middle class core of the Democratic party. The people that rebelled against Hillary.

I hope Biden can pull together the Democratic party base that I long admired.
Quote:
The 76-year-old is in a strong position in national polls and early voting states. He will run as a centrist Obama-Biden Democrat anchored by strong union support.

He will lambaste Trump as a phony populist and a friend of Wall Street CEOs who hit the jackpot with the tax overhaul law.

Biden's hopes may depend on the idea that working class, union Democrats and moderates in the suburbs remain the backbone of the party. Though he will also have to appeal to radical young progressives electrified by Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez of New York.

Last edited by aceplace57; 04-25-2019 at 01:38 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:39 PM
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:41 PM
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Click the link in my OP.
Yeah ,I just did a search for the quote and of course it's the Onion but also some other source that's either parody or they took it as legitimate.

TBH I wish you hadn't linked to satire in the opening post, Happy. I mean, the article's funny, but people like aceplace57 might think this was a legit quote. (It's kinda hard to tell if he was fooled or not.)

Look, we're gonna be barraged with lies and Russian bots and alt-right nasty bullshit that tries to pit Dems against each other. So I just hope we focus on truth before veering off into fun stuff like the Onion.

The quote you posted, aceplace57, slurring Sanders, was fake. You do realize that, right? It's super hard to tell with you because you seem to treat the Mail and New York Post as legitimate news sources.

Last edited by choie; 04-25-2019 at 01:42 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:45 PM
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I hoped it was true. I didn't see the Onion in the link until after I posted. I'm very familiar with The Onion and regret not seeing that in the link.

We need a straight talking candidate. Maybe not that blunt, but someone that talks to the middle class.

CNN's analysis does give me hope that Biden will be a centrist. That's who can beat Trump.

Last edited by aceplace57; 04-25-2019 at 01:48 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:46 PM
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I still don't understand the appeal of Biden and how he jumps to 1# in mere hours. He is an old white man and a throwback to the 1980s-1990s instead of the 2020s. What is generating the fireworks exactly?
Why should his age, race, or gender/sex/?, be a factor at all?
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:50 PM
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I hoped it was true. I didn't see the Onion in the link until after I posted. I'm very familiar with The Onion and regret not seeing that in the link.

We need a straight talking candidate. Maybe not that blunt, but someone that talks to the middle class.

CNN's analysis does give me hope that Biden will be a centrist. That's who can beat Trump.
C’mon now, the ‘clam magnet’ line should have been a giveaway regardless of the link.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:54 PM
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Agreed with octopus (oh God, three words I wouldn't have thought I'd utter). Plus if Biden is a throwback to anything, it'll be the Obama presidency, and there's a real push of nostalgia for that. Plus, the younger folks actually remember that era, which is not true of the '88-92 era.

All I care about with Biden is: Does he have the energy/stamina? Does he sound articulate (he usually does, gaffes not withstanding)? Does he tell the truth? Does his sincerity and compassion shine through? Does he have thoughts on progressive issues as well as centrist ones? Can he tie both wings of the party together?

Of course Trump's already calling him "Sleepy Joe," which makes no fucking sense, especially coming from a guy who spends 8 or 9 hours on the toilet watching TV rather than doing any, like, presidenting. Also golfing and spending so much time at Mar-a-Lago.

Last edited by choie; 04-25-2019 at 01:55 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 01:54 PM
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C’mon now, the ‘clam magnet’ line should have been a giveaway regardless of the link.
I wasn't looking for it. I never expected a Election thread announcing a major candidacy to link The Onion in the OP. Who does that?

Last edited by aceplace57; 04-25-2019 at 01:57 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:02 PM
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Biden needs to run as his own man. Quit apologizing for hugging people.

Run on his excellent record and stick to it. Don't apologize or show any weakness. Show some backbone and Resiliency.

That's so important. Trump never apologizes or kisses anyone's ass.

Biden has to have that same take it or leave it attitude.
Have you heard him lately? Clearly he cares whether he offends people. That might not be so bad if he were always precise with what comes out of his mouth. Prepare your hopes for disappointment. He may have a chance but it will be ugly.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:06 PM
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Have you heard him lately? Clearly he cares whether he offends people. That might not be so bad if he were always precise with what comes out of his mouth. Prepare your hopes for disappointment. He may have a chance but it will be ugly.
There is virtually no way for me to be more disappointed than I have been since Nov. 2016. And there is almost nothing that can be uglier than what's currently occupying the White House.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:06 PM
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It's probably me, but I don't really understand Biden's appeal. He seems very bland. I wouldn't be surprised to see him drop out by the 3rd or 4th primary/caucus.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:13 PM
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I think after the last 3 years bland might actually be pretty appealing.

A lot of people are tired as hell of the reality TV presidency.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:16 PM
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Dispatch from the ultra-far-left:

A candidate who opposed school integration is not the right candidate for 2019.

Last edited by Richard Parker; 04-25-2019 at 02:18 PM.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:23 PM
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I wasn't looking for it. I never expected a Election thread announcing a major candidacy to link The Onion in the OP. Who does that?
FFS, man, it's 2019. If you read that article, even just skimmed it, and thought it was a legit article, I don't even know where to begin. I honestly thought we were a sophisticated enough bunch of humans here to recognize The Onion, but now I know better.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:25 PM
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Run on his excellent record and stick to it.
His record sucks.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:28 PM
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Dispatch from the ultra-far-left:

A candidate who opposed school integration is not the right candidate for 2019.
Do you think Politico is an ultra-far-left news source?

And you do realize that article is from 2015 right?
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:29 PM
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Do you think Politico is an ultra-far-left news source?

And you do realize that article is from 2015 right?
Pretty sure Richard Parker is being ironic there.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:31 PM
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Pretty sure Richard Parker is being ironic there.
Yes. Just to be clear, I think Joe Biden is a bad candidate because he is very old and has taken very conservative positions on a number of important issues, not least of all racial equity (which is of course a big part of why he was selected as Obama's VP).
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:32 PM
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Nate Silver thinks that Biden is in an interesting position in that he's sort of the frontrunner, but not really. He's leading in the polls and endorsements, but not by the massive margins that Gore or Hillary had at this point in their campaigns. He's quite popular with older voters and moderates, but much less so with younger voters and progressives. He's averaging 25-30% currently, so to win without a brokered convention, he'd need to almost double that.

So does he run like the frontrunner, not aggressively attacking other candidates, taking the high road and focusing on attacking Trump? That strategy worked for Hillary, even though she constantly lost support to Sanders throughout the primary season. But her lead at the start of the campaign was so large that she could afford to do that; Biden's current lead is nowhere near that large.

Or should he be the guy aceplace wants him to be and rally his army of grumpy old white guys to do battle against the evil forces of identity politics and socialism? Would that increase his support much, or are most of the voters who would respond to that already on his side?

Silver also makes a point that I have been making for a while, that a large part of Biden's support is based on the perception that he is the most "electable" candidate (the linked article links to recent surveys confirming that Dems do view Biden that way). But this may be largely a function of name recognition; Hillary had massive leads in perceived electability early in both her campaigns, but those largely evaporated as voters became more familiar with the other guys. IOW, Biden's position at the top of the polls could be self-reinforcing; many of his supporters might be quick to bail if his numbers start to slip, or if he underperforms in early primaries.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:37 PM
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Also, I wonder to what extent Biden (and Sanders) might be vulnerable to opponents who make their age a major issue. Sanders didn't really have to deal with that last time, because Hillary was keeping the gloves on and was no spring chicken herself. I could see that line of attack potentially knocking both of them down a few notches if it were aggressively pursued.

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Old 04-25-2019, 02:39 PM
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I have no problem with Biden or most of the other candidates, but he'll need to shift from "Trump evil" to "country good" very quickly. Trump thrives on hate, so the Dem candidates need to take their sails out of his wind.
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Old 04-25-2019, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by aceplace57 View Post
I'm falling in love already. This is the straight taking attitude the country needs right now. It feels good hearing someone speak for me and my values.
Maybe he'll be able to give Elvira that government post.

But I don't think Worm will be able to fill in for him, like when he was VP.
  #47  
Old 04-25-2019, 02:55 PM
Thing Fish is offline
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Originally Posted by Chefguy View Post
I have no problem with Biden or most of the other candidates, but he'll need to shift from "Trump evil" to "country good" very quickly. Trump thrives on hate, so the Dem candidates need to take their sails out of his wind.
But he's not currently running against Trump. In the context of a Democratic primary, lambasting Trump is an uplifting, unifying, noncontroversial message.
  #48  
Old 04-25-2019, 03:01 PM
CaptMurdock's Avatar
CaptMurdock is offline
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Originally Posted by Richard Parker View Post

A candidate who opposed school integration.
[snip]
...forty years ago (as it says in the first words of the cite).

Nothing personal, RP, but wake me when they have something from this century.

Disclaimer: not in the tank for Joe.
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  #49  
Old 04-25-2019, 03:12 PM
RTFirefly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HurricaneDitka View Post
I think the far-left wing of the party has taken over more than Joe realizes, and he's positioned himself as too much of a moderate to win the nomination.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aceplace57 View Post
Awesome, fantastic news.

We FINALLY! have a centrist candidate that has a chance of winning.

Hot damn, finally a Democrat that isn't uktra left wing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by aceplace57 View Post
That's assuming the ultra left doesn't force Biden to shift from the center. He's already backpedaling on the Anita Hill hearings 25 years ago.
I'm curious as to what makes the "far left" or "ultra left" so awful, but I don't want to hijack this thread. So I've started another.
  #50  
Old 04-25-2019, 03:17 PM
RTFirefly is offline
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Originally Posted by CaptMurdock View Post
Nothing personal, RP, but wake me when they have something from this century.
2005 Bankruptcy Law
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