Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #101  
Old 07-15-2019, 01:20 PM
Fiveyearlurker is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 6,593
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillFarnaby View Post
Probably the fact that he’s never heard of Tommy Boy and the guy gets no media.
It's certainly not that. Tom Malinowski is not the color of someone that you tell to go back to his country, even though he, unlike the darker folks Trump attacked, is actually from another country.

You don't have to be a racist to support Trump, but you sure do have to either forgive, or pretend to not see, a lot of racism in order to do it.
  #102  
Old 07-15-2019, 01:33 PM
CAH66 is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 103
Trump's "strategy" seems to be just to keep the circus music playing long and loud whenever he can. I can't credit him for any grand ideas beyond self-aggrandizing posts on the one hand and shit-slinging at his opponents on the other. This is the guy who made fun of a disabled reporter in front of TV cameras and got fucking grins and applause from his supporters. He doesn't need genius with people like that on his side.
  #103  
Old 07-15-2019, 01:59 PM
Euphonious Polemic is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,684
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAH66 View Post
Trump's "strategy" seems to be just to keep the circus music playing long and loud whenever he can. I can't credit him for any grand ideas beyond self-aggrandizing posts on the one hand and shit-slinging at his opponents on the other. This is the guy who made fun of a disabled reporter in front of TV cameras and got fucking grins and applause from his supporters. He doesn't need genius with people like that on his side.
Absolutely. "how can Trump get so many votes when he's an obvious and unrepentant racist?"

Because many, many voters are unrepentant racists. (Sorry in advance for insulting any members of this board who feel that this targets them personally. It is not intended as such. And sorry if I am posting too many times for this thread. )
  #104  
Old 07-15-2019, 02:40 PM
Walken After Midnight is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,776
A Republican has spoken out against Trump's racist tweets!

Rep. Will Hurd, the only African American member of his political party serving in the U.S. House of Representatives, said this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will Hurd
"I think those tweets are racist and xenophobic. They're also inaccurate, right? The four women he's referring to are actually citizens of the United States. Three of the four were born here."
On the other hand, Steve Mnuchin says: "I don't find them racist."
  #105  
Old 07-15-2019, 02:44 PM
bobot's Avatar
bobot is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Chicago-ish
Posts: 8,565
Steve Mnuchin, reality doesn't depend on your idiotic opinion.

Last edited by bobot; 07-15-2019 at 02:44 PM.
  #106  
Old 07-15-2019, 03:22 PM
ThelmaLou's Avatar
ThelmaLou is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Neither here nor there
Posts: 16,228
These Are the 29 Members of Congress Born Outside the United States
Quote:
...There are 14 congressional members who were born outside of the United States, all of whom are Democrats, who became U.S. citizens. Thirteen of the 14 members of Congress born outside of the United States to non-American parents serve in the House of Representatives. Three of them are from Mexico -- Salud Carbajal and Raul Ruiz (California) and Jesus Garcia (Illinois), and two are from India -- Raja Krishnamoorthi (Illinois) and Pramila Jayapal (Washington). Other congressional members were born in the Dominican Republic, Cuba, Taiwan, Poland, Ecuador, Vietnam, and Guatemala.

The lone senator born outside of the United States to parents who are not American is Mazie Hirono of Hawaii, who was born in Japan. There are four other senators who were born in other countries to American parents.

Some members of the president’s cabinet were also born in foreign countries, including the Secretary of Transportation Elaine Chao, who was born in Taiwan, and the Secretary of Veterans Affairs Robert Wilkie, who was born in Germany. It is also worth noting that the president’s wife Melania was born in Slovenia and is the first first lady born outside of the United States since Louisa Catherine Adams, the wife of John Quincy Adams, the sixth president.....
Complete list at the linky.

The foreign-born Pubbies are from UK, West Germany, France, Canada (Ted Cruz). No shithole countries there, eh?
__________________
"If we're not supposed to dance, why all this music?" Gregory Orr
  #107  
Old 07-15-2019, 03:48 PM
foolsguinea is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Tornado Alley
Posts: 15,822
Quote:
Originally Posted by asahi View Post
See, now he's even demanding that his targets apologize, which any sane person can tell is a deliberate attempt to troll them. But more than that, he knows it exerts pressure on the Democratic party. If Joe Biden thought he was going to run a safe, moderate campaign, he can throw that plan in the garbage can. He'll have to up his 'wokeness' game by a lot. If Pelosi thought that she can just build coalitions with moderates and progressives working together in unison without having serious infighting over social justice, she can throw those plans in the garbage can as well. Trump is firing up the progressive radicals, and he knows it. And Biden and Pelosi are going to struggle to contain that energy. I've been talking about polarization for quite a long time now, long before this latest controversy started. Polarization is how Donald Trump re-takes the White House. It's the only way he can win.
You're projecting an awful lot.

I was looking at Twitter the last few days. Trump's desperate attempt to distract from the Epstein case actually got several white moderates in Congress, Republican Justin Amash, & Hillary Clinton to defend Congress in general and 'the Squad' in particular. Trump may still have his bots & his racists on his side. But he's unifying people against him, people who profoundly disagree with each other. He's not dividing the Democrats. He's making himself a target.

The Democrats are a messy, fractious coalition for internal reasons going back decades. There are Democrats who hate Bernie Sanders and Democrats who hate Hillary Clinton, and the party, left to its own internal divisions, could be expected to crack up. But Trump as president, more than he was as candidate, is so awful that he can unify them against him. He's a big giant gift to those who are capable of seeing that.
  #108  
Old 07-15-2019, 04:12 PM
Kent Clark's Avatar
Kent Clark is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Posts: 26,353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walken After Midnight View Post
On the other hand, Steve Mnuchin says: "I don't find them racist."
But again, he's focused on cryptocurrency.
  #109  
Old 07-15-2019, 04:34 PM
Kent Clark's Avatar
Kent Clark is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Posts: 26,353
Quote:
Originally Posted by foolsguinea View Post
The Democrats are a messy, fractious coalition for internal reasons going back decades. There are Democrats who hate Bernie Sanders and Democrats who hate Hillary Clinton, and the party, left to its own internal divisions, could be expected to crack up. But Trump as president, more than he was as candidate, is so awful that he can unify them against him. He's a big giant gift to those who are capable of seeing that.
The last President to be defeated for reelection was George H.W. Bush. Bush won in 1988 against Michael Dukakis, who might have been an even worse campaigner than Hillary Clinton. Bush received 48.9 million votes and won 40 states.

Flash forward to 1992. Bush received 39.1 million votes. Bill Clinton, the winner, and Ross Perot won all the rest.

Bush ran into a rough patch in the economy in 1992, but his bigger problem, IMHO, was that he had promised "No new taxes" during his 1988 campaign and then had to go and raise taxes. Conservative voters rewarded this rare moment of fiscal sanity by not voting for Bush.

To win in 2020 the Democrats need to a) run a candidate who's at least marginally better than Hillary Clinton or Michael Dukakis, b) not go into the campaign like they did in 1968 (when the moderates won and the progressives pouted) and 1972 (when the progressives won and the moderates pouted), and c) convince a few voters who are fed up with Trump to simply stay home on election day.

Having said all that, I'm still not 100% sure the Democratic Party can manage to pull off all three things in the same year.

Last edited by Kent Clark; 07-15-2019 at 04:35 PM.
  #110  
Old 07-15-2019, 05:12 PM
Walken After Midnight is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,776
The President of the United States:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donald Trump
IF YOU ARE NOT HAPPY HERE, YOU CAN LEAVE!
  #111  
Old 07-15-2019, 05:47 PM
Snowboarder Bo's Avatar
Snowboarder Bo is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 26,855
Fuck him.
  #112  
Old 07-15-2019, 05:49 PM
Kobal2's Avatar
Kobal2 is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Paris, France
Posts: 18,421
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walken After Midnight View Post

Well, you seem mighty unhappy right now, sooooo...
__________________
--- ---
Assume I'm right and you're wrong - we'll both save a lot of time.
  #113  
Old 07-15-2019, 05:50 PM
bobot's Avatar
bobot is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Chicago-ish
Posts: 8,565
What a dipshit motherfucker. If you're not happy here you can leave... or, you know, I guess it's possible that you could get elected to congress, too, and change the whole ballgame.
Fuck Donald Trump.
  #114  
Old 07-15-2019, 05:55 PM
Walken After Midnight is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,776
This is his 2020 campaign strategy.
  #115  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:00 PM
pjacks is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Chicago
Posts: 216
And it will work like a charm.
  #116  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:04 PM
KarlGauss's Avatar
KarlGauss is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Between pole and tropic
Posts: 8,236
While understandable, the actions of the four representatives may lose the Senate for the Democrats.

Sure, many people in red states will (probably) be willing to vote out Trump. But will they risk turning the Senate over to those they see as not respecting America?
  #117  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:20 PM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,426
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlGauss View Post
While understandable, the actions of the four representatives may lose the Senate for the Democrats.

Sure, many people in red states will (probably) be willing to vote out Trump. But will they risk turning the Senate over to those they see as not respecting America?
...as the four representatives do respect America, and the only reason that people would think that they "don't respect America" is the fact that the President of the United States is lying about them. if the Democrats "lose the Senate" the blame does not lie with the "actions of the four representatives", but with the people who don't vote for the Democrats and the President of the United States of America.
  #118  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:28 PM
KarlGauss's Avatar
KarlGauss is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Between pole and tropic
Posts: 8,236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
. . . the only reason that people would think that they "don't respect America" is the fact that the President of the United States is lying about them.
I think they have serious doubts about 'these women and those like them' and their worries were there long before Trump spewed forth. He knows who he's talking to.
  #119  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:37 PM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,426
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlGauss View Post
I think they have serious doubts about 'these women and those like them' and their worries were there long before Trump spewed forth. He knows who he's talking to.
...so you agree with me that the four representatives you were talking about actually do respect America, and that their actions won't be responsible for losing the Senate for the Democrats?
  #120  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:40 PM
pjacks is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Chicago
Posts: 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
...so you agree with me that the four representatives you were talking about actually do respect America, and that their actions won't be responsible for losing the Senate for the Democrats?
Do you think AOC implying that the top-ranked Democrat in the country is a racist is something that helps win the Senate?
  #121  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:41 PM
Biffster's Avatar
Biffster is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 4,428
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlGauss View Post
While understandable, the actions of the four representatives may lose the Senate for the Democrats.



Sure, many people in red states will (probably) be willing to vote out Trump. But will they risk turning the Senate over to those they see as not respecting America?


How in the world are they not respecting America? If anything, they’re speaking up for Americans against tyrants like Trump.
  #122  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:45 PM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,426
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjacks View Post
Do you think AOC implying that the top-ranked Democrat in the country is a racist is something that helps win the Senate?
...well thats a fucking loaded question.

AOC didn't imply the top-ranked Democrat in the country was a racist. I'm glad to clear that up for you.
  #123  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:51 PM
Euphonious Polemic is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 11,684
Quote:
Originally Posted by Biffster View Post
How in the world are they not respecting America? If anything, they’re speaking up for Americans against tyrants like Trump.
Because for 40% of the country, America = Dear Leader Trump. The two are inseparable.
  #124  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:56 PM
KarlGauss's Avatar
KarlGauss is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Between pole and tropic
Posts: 8,236
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlGauss View Post
. . . will they risk turning the Senate over to those they see as not respecting America?
(emphasis added)

Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlGauss
I think they have serious doubts about 'these women and those like them' and their worries were there long before Trump spewed forth. He knows who he's talking to.
Note the 'scare quote'

Clear?

Last edited by KarlGauss; 07-15-2019 at 06:58 PM.
  #125  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:56 PM
pjacks is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Chicago
Posts: 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
...well thats a fucking loaded question.

AOC didn't imply the top-ranked Democrat in the country was a racist. I'm glad to clear that up for you.
“When these comments first started, I kind of thought that she was keeping the progressive flank at more of an arm’s distance in order to protect more moderate members, which I understood,” Ocasio-Cortez told The Washington Post. “But the persistent singling out . . . it got to a point where it was just outright disrespectful . . . the explicit singling out of newly elected women of color.”

I realize the news cycle moves so fast these days, so there is her quote about the Speaker of the House being disrespectful to women of color in particular. I'm glad to clear that up for you.
  #126  
Old 07-15-2019, 06:56 PM
Little Nemo is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Western New York
Posts: 81,431
Quote:
Originally Posted by you with the face View Post
Don’t they already do that, though? There is no conservative who hasn’t gotten this memo already.
But the Republicans won't win the election with just the committed conservative vote. If committed conservatives were a majority, Democrats would never win an election.

To win a second term for Trump, the Republicans need to figure out a message they can sell to uncommitted voters.
  #127  
Old 07-15-2019, 07:01 PM
Little Nemo is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Western New York
Posts: 81,431
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlGauss View Post
While understandable, the actions of the four representatives may lose the Senate for the Democrats.

Sure, many people in red states will (probably) be willing to vote out Trump. But will they risk turning the Senate over to those they see as not respecting America?
It's not a given. If politicians attacking their opponents was a deal breaker in American politics, Trump himself never would have been elected. None of those representatives have said anything worse about Trump than what Trump has said about them. The only standard about who was right or wrong is which side you support.
  #128  
Old 07-15-2019, 07:03 PM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,426
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjacks View Post
“When these comments first started, I kind of thought that she was keeping the progressive flank at more of an arm’s distance in order to protect more moderate members, which I understood,” Ocasio-Cortez told The Washington Post. “But the persistent singling out . . . it got to a point where it was just outright disrespectful . . . the explicit singling out of newly elected women of color.”

I realize the news cycle moves so fast these days, so there is her quote about the Speaker of the House being disrespectful to women of color in particular. I'm glad to clear that up for you.
...as I said: there is nothing in that quote that is either inaccurate, or implies that Pelosi is racist. I'm glad this is all cleared up now.
  #129  
Old 07-15-2019, 07:09 PM
pjacks is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Chicago
Posts: 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
...as I said: there is nothing in that quote that is either inaccurate, or implies that Pelosi is racist. I'm glad this is all cleared up now.
Wow, well you have a very unique interpretation of that quote considering the breathless news coverage it got immediately before Trump capitalized on it with his ridiculous tweetstorm.
  #130  
Old 07-15-2019, 07:10 PM
Sherrerd's Avatar
Sherrerd is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 6,994
Quote:
Originally Posted by Walken After Midnight View Post
This is his 2020 campaign strategy.
This (overt racism)---in combination with massive vote-suppression.

Because Trump can't win with only his base (the white racists). He must also keep other whites, and all people of color, from voting---at least as much as possible. Polling places will be sparse in some areas; voting rolls will be purged of the 'wrong' people; ID will be required--and declared incorrect or fraudulent for 'wrong' voters, etc. etc.

And before election day, Russian and other trolls will be working hard to tell non-racist whites and people of color that there's no point in their going out to vote because:
  • their vote doesn't matter
  • all candidates are the same anyway
  • Candidate _____ was robbed, sidelined by a corrupt DNC
  • voting is uncool
  • voting is for suckers
  • the Dem candidate hates ______ people
  • the Dem candidate is a tool of the corporations, so why bother

.....etc. etc. etc. The internet will be absolutely flooded with these and similar messages in the months leading up to November 2020.

All of this---the suppression, the discouragement from voting---is Trump's only path forward. Because he can't win with the votes of white racists alone.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Euphonious Polemic View Post
Then they are not "Bernie fans". They are going to have to come to terms with the fact that for the next election - if they stay home - they are Trump supporters. Plain and simple.

Any progressive that does not vote next election because the nominee is not "pure enough" to suit them, or has some imperfection that they do not like..... Is a Trump Supporter. They might as well put on a MAGA hat and scream for minorities to be deported.

Any Dem who bitches about flaws in the chosen Dem candidate should ask themselves why they are supporting a Republican mentally deficient fascist wanna-be who is about as suitable for the job as a drunken toddler with a loaded gun.

Because this coming election is about getting as many D's into office as humanly possible. Full stop.
All of this. 100%.
  #131  
Old 07-15-2019, 07:13 PM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,426
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjacks View Post
Wow, well you have a very unique interpretation of that quote considering the breathless news coverage it got immediately before Trump capitalized on it with his ridiculous tweetstorm.
...the "breathless news coverage" is part of the problem. And there is absolutely nothing unique about my interpretation. Have I answered your question to your satisfaction?
  #132  
Old 07-15-2019, 07:30 PM
pjacks is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Chicago
Posts: 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
...the "breathless news coverage" is part of the problem. And there is absolutely nothing unique about my interpretation. Have I answered your question to your satisfaction?
*yawn*
Yes, you've proven that you live and breathe identity politics, to the point that a problematic quote about the Speaker of the House disrespecting women of color doesn't phase you at all. Thanks.
  #133  
Old 07-15-2019, 07:38 PM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,426
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjacks View Post
*yawn*
Yes, you've proven that you live and breathe identity politics, to the point that a problematic quote about the Speaker of the House disrespecting women of color doesn't phase you at all. Thanks.
...LOL. You just played the "identity politics" card. Nothing better than a baseless ad hominem as a resolution to your loaded question.
  #134  
Old 07-15-2019, 07:41 PM
Walken After Midnight is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,776
Excerpts from Washington Post article by conservative lawyer George Conway, husband of Kellyanne, entitled "Trump is a racist president":
Quote:
Originally Posted by George Conway
"Naivete, resentment and outright racism, roiled in a toxic mix, have given us a racist president ... Telling four non-white members of Congress — American citizens all, three natural-born — to 'go back' to the 'countries' they 'originally came from'? That’s racist to the core.
...
"By virtue of his office, he speaks for the country. What's at stake now is more important than judges or tax cuts or regulations or any policy issue of the day. What's at stake are the nation's ideals, its very soul."
  #135  
Old 07-15-2019, 07:45 PM
madmonk28 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 12,301
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiveyearlurker View Post
...You don't have to be a racist to support Trump...
I absolutely disagree, racism is the core of their belief system.
  #136  
Old 07-15-2019, 08:36 PM
D'Anconia is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 4,510
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobot View Post
If you're not happy here you can leave... or, you know, I guess it's possible that you could get elected to congress, too, and change the whole ballgame.
What exactly have those four accomplished since being elected?
  #137  
Old 07-15-2019, 09:17 PM
pjacks is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Chicago
Posts: 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
...LOL. You just played the "identity politics" card. Nothing better than a baseless ad hominem as a resolution to your loaded question.
Much like how AOC and her awful chief of staff play the race card against fellow democrats, I guess.
  #138  
Old 07-15-2019, 09:43 PM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,426
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjacks View Post
Much like how AOC and her awful chief of staff play the race card against fellow democrats, I guess.
...they haven't "played the race card." This entire discussion is about race. The President of the United States is a big old racist. Why would AOC and her chief of staff not talk about race?

However the House Democrats did try and play "the woke card." Perhaps you should be telling them to stop playing "identity politics."
  #139  
Old 07-15-2019, 09:52 PM
pjacks is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Chicago
Posts: 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
...they haven't "played the race card." This entire discussion is about race. The President of the United States is a big old racist. Why would AOC and her chief of staff not talk about race?

However the House Democrats did try and play "the woke card." Perhaps you should be telling them to stop playing "identity politics."
I would gladly tell them that. What a pathetic response to a pathetic tweet. Twitter has completely destroyed our public discourse, clearly.
  #140  
Old 07-15-2019, 10:06 PM
running coach's Avatar
running coach is offline
Arms of Steel, Leg of Jello
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Riding my handcycle
Posts: 37,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjacks View Post
I would gladly tell them that. What a pathetic response to a pathetic tweet. Twitter has completely destroyed our public discourse, clearly.
Trump has completely destroyed our public discourse, clearly.
  #141  
Old 07-15-2019, 10:09 PM
pjacks is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Chicago
Posts: 216
Quote:
Originally Posted by running coach View Post
Trump has completely destroyed our public discourse, clearly.
It was long dead before that. It's what got him elected. Trump is a symptom of the disease, not the disease itself. Tribalism amplified by millions of voices and bots on social media caused this nightmare.
  #142  
Old 07-15-2019, 10:20 PM
Kent Clark's Avatar
Kent Clark is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Posts: 26,353
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlGauss View Post
While understandable, the actions of the four representatives may lose the Senate for the Democrats.

Sure, many people in red states will (probably) be willing to vote out Trump. But will they risk turning the Senate over to those they see as not respecting America?
Oh for fuck's sake! Anyone willing to vote out Trump will be willing to look at the actual candidates for Senate in their states and make a determination based on that. Josh Hawley and Roy Blunt were not sent to the Senate by the people of Missouri to provide some sort of counterbalance to Bernie Sanders and Diane Feinstein, nor was its last Democratic Senator elected to counterbalance Chuck Grassley.
  #143  
Old 07-15-2019, 10:53 PM
Chisquirrel is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 2,565
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kent Clark View Post
Oh for fuck's sake! Anyone willing to vote out Trump will be willing to look at the actual candidates for Senate in their states and make a determination based on that. Josh Hawley and Roy Blunt were not sent to the Senate by the people of Missouri to provide some sort of counterbalance to Bernie Sanders and Diane Feinstein, nor was its last Democratic Senator elected to counterbalance Chuck Grassley.
Nitpick

Grassley represents Iowa, not Missouri.

/Nitpick

He also decries socialism while collecting socialist farmer bailouts paid for by the American people. The irony burns in Iowa.
  #144  
Old 07-16-2019, 12:06 AM
asahi's Avatar
asahi is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: On your computer screen
Posts: 10,600
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
...they haven't "played the race card." This entire discussion is about race. The President of the United States is a big old racist. Why would AOC and her chief of staff not talk about race?

However the House Democrats did try and play "the woke card." Perhaps you should be telling them to stop playing "identity politics."
I don't know if Chakrabarti has necessarily played "the race card," but he's a certifiable ass. I think he believes himself to be the Steve Bannon of the Democratic Party. He can try that, and he can get half of twitter to follow him. But I doubt he can get half of twitter to vote for his causes. He doesn't understand what he's about to get himself (and others) into.
  #145  
Old 07-16-2019, 12:41 AM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,426
Quote:
Originally Posted by asahi View Post
I don't know if Chakrabarti has necessarily played "the race card," but he's a certifiable ass. I think he believes himself to be the Steve Bannon of the Democratic Party. He can try that, and he can get half of twitter to follow him. But I doubt he can get half of twitter to vote for his causes. He doesn't understand what he's about to get himself (and others) into.
...conflating Chakrabarti with Bannon is an appalling abuse of hyperbole and exactly the sort of destructive "bothsiderist" rhetoric that people in this thread are railing against. Nobody had heard of Chakrabarti until the House Democrats decided to boost his tweet. He isn't trying to be "the Steve Bannon of the Democratic Party." Don't make this bigger than it is. He posted an opinion on twitter: thats all.
  #146  
Old 07-16-2019, 01:04 AM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,426
Quote:
Originally Posted by AG Barr
"My concern today is that under the banner of identity politics, some political factions are seeking to obtain power by dividing Americans, and they undermine the values that draw us together such as a shared commitment to our country's success."
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1150832784644218880

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindsay Graham
"We all know that AOC and this crowd are a bunch of communists ... they're anti-Semitic. They're anti-America."
https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1150748086488240128

...in case you hadn't noticed: they are gunning for the Progressive Four. They smell blood in the water. The rhetoric from Trump & Co is dangerous. You can express the opinion that Chakrabarti said something stupid. Thats okay. I'm sure he would welcome the debate. But there is a difference between criticising his statement and buying into the same dangerous rhetoric that Barr and Graham are spewing.
  #147  
Old 07-16-2019, 05:48 AM
asahi's Avatar
asahi is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: On your computer screen
Posts: 10,600
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
...conflating Chakrabarti with Bannon is an appalling abuse of hyperbole and exactly the sort of destructive "bothsiderist" rhetoric that people in this thread are railing against. Nobody had heard of Chakrabarti until the House Democrats decided to boost his tweet. He isn't trying to be "the Steve Bannon of the Democratic Party." Don't make this bigger than it is. He posted an opinion on twitter: thats all.
It is absolutely not an abuse of hyperbole. Look, I get that you appreciate Chakrabarti's no-holds-barred activism and political pugnacity, particularly since you see it from afar and don't have a sense for how his tactics could potentially splinter fragile coalitions along ideological and even ethnic lines. I consider myself a sympathizer and even basically a fan of AOC, Omar, and the Squad, but I'm not always a fan of their rhetoric, and I think a lot of it is being driven by ex-Bernie Bros. I see the same kind of "fuck you" energy and self-immolating tactics, and it's one major, major reason why we are living in the age of President Trump instead of President Hillary Clinton.

The common refrain, of course, is that moderate democrats will just have to stop being moderate and join the resistance.

Ain't gonna happen.

It just ain't.

Last edited by asahi; 07-16-2019 at 05:48 AM.
  #148  
Old 07-16-2019, 05:52 AM
asahi's Avatar
asahi is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: On your computer screen
Posts: 10,600
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1150832784644218880



https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1150748086488240128

...in case you hadn't noticed: they are gunning for the Progressive Four. They smell blood in the water. The rhetoric from Trump & Co is dangerous. You can express the opinion that Chakrabarti said something stupid. Thats okay. I'm sure he would welcome the debate. But there is a difference between criticising his statement and buying into the same dangerous rhetoric that Barr and Graham are spewing.
I'm not buying into their rhetoric; just the opposite. I'm pointing out that if Chakrabarti isn't careful and can't keep insinuating that his own fucking allies are essentially closet racists, the Democratic party is going to start alienating white allies.

Tell me, how does the Squad and how do progressives win back the Senate, let alone the presidency, with fewer allies?
  #149  
Old 07-16-2019, 06:47 AM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,426
Quote:
Originally Posted by asahi View Post
It is absolutely not an abuse of hyperbole. Look, I get that you appreciate Chakrabarti's no-holds-barred activism and political pugnacity,
...strawman. You don't have a fucking clue what my opinion is about Chakrabarti. I had never heard of him before the day before yesterday. I can't hold an opinion about somebody I know nothing about.

Quote:
particularly since you see it from afar and don't have a sense for how his tactics could potentially splinter fragile coalitions along ideological and even ethnic lines.
Tactics? It was a fucking tweet. An honest answer to a question that was posed to him. It wasn't a strategic move. It was 140 characters or less that probably took him less than a minute to type. I might be "afar" but I'm not so far away I can't see the obvious.

Quote:
I consider myself a sympathizer and even basically a fan of AOC, Omar, and the Squad, but I'm not always a fan of their rhetoric, and I think a lot of it is being driven by ex-Bernie Bros. I see the same kind of "fuck you" energy and self-immolating tactics, and it's one major, major reason why we are living in the age of President Trump instead of President Hillary Clinton.
We are living in the age of Trump because of rampant voter supression, because of propaganda, because of a weak-ass-so-called-mainstream-media, because there are a fuck-load more racists in America than anyone is comfortable saying out loud. And if Trump & Co get voted in again it won't be because of AOC and the squad.

Quote:
The common refrain, of course, is that moderate democrats will just have to stop being moderate and join the resistance.
Nope. That isn't the refrain. The squad voted for and supported Pelosi. Here are the moderate Democrats who opposed Pelosi for speaker. The squad aren't on that list. This isn't what they demand.

Quote:
Ain't gonna happen.

It just ain't.
Four. More. Years.

Quote:
I'm not buying into their rhetoric; just the opposite. I'm pointing out that if Chakrabarti isn't careful and can't keep insinuating that his own fucking allies are essentially closet racists, the Democratic party is going to start alienating white allies.
Chakrabarti is a nobody, no-one knows who he is, and what he said doesn't matter. For fucks sakes: you compared him to Steve Bannon. That was completely ridiculous. You absolutely are buying into their rhetoric, their narrative, and by doing that and by others doing that you are doing more damage than anything Chakrabarti would ever say.

Quote:
Tell me, how does the Squad and how do progressives win back the Senate, let alone the presidency, with fewer allies?
Since when was this debate about members of the House winning back the Senate? How about some of the people running for President dropping out of the race and going back to their state and running for Senate instead? There are only four members of the "Squad." They won't make any fucking difference in the race for the Senate.
  #150  
Old 07-16-2019, 07:57 AM
Unreconstructed Man is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
...as I said: there is nothing in that quote that is either inaccurate, or implies that Pelosi is racist. I'm glad this is all cleared up now.
...AOC accused Pelosi of “explicitly singling out women of colour”. The so-clear-you-could-bet-your-life-on-it implication is that Pelosi is racist.
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:23 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@straightdope.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Copyright © 2018 STM Reader, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017