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  #51  
Old 12-05-2018, 05:36 PM
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I've been saying elsewhere that I was sure the Apple store thing was just cover for what they wanted to do anyways, and it seems I was right. If it was about the child porn bots, they could have just used anti-bot tactics.

And the stuff being blocked by the bots is worse than I imagined. People who talk about toys?

My question is whether the "SJW" side of Tumblr will be willing to back their statements with action, and back away from the platform. They keep saying that there's nothing else, so I worry they will reluctantly stay, even Tumblr continues to try and become "family friendly."

At least use adblockers, so that the one reason they want users won't work. Why the hell give them money?
  #52  
Old 12-05-2018, 08:25 PM
clairobscur clairobscur is offline
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Originally Posted by Budget Player Cadet View Post
Very interesting article. So, it's about ads (by the way I'm really wondering why a company wouldn't want its adds to be seen besides adult content. It doesn't really make sense), it was planed and they have grand expectations of massive increase of the number of users. And hope among other things that they'll find ways to monetize social activists.

Something else that bothers me is that I met my long distance gf on tumblr, and several years of our common online history will disappear (she doesn't mind, she doesn't tend to stick to the past, but it really annoys me).

I noticed references to the new blogging platform pillowfort. Does anybody know more about them?
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  #53  
Old 12-05-2018, 08:33 PM
clairobscur clairobscur is offline
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Originally Posted by BigT View Post
I've been saying elsewhere that I was sure the Apple store thing was just cover for what they wanted to do anyways, and it seems I was right. If it was about the child porn bots, they could have just used anti-bot tactics.

And the stuff being blocked by the bots is worse than I imagined. People who talk about toys?
I assume it's things like "my little pony" fans, nothing sinister. Wait...I realize you meant the opposite of what I thought. I'm absolutely not surprised that bots are blocking all sorts of completely innocuous stuff, they're quite famous for that.

And there's no reference to "child porn bots" (who would build a child porn bot and why? It's not like you can advertise for your child porn website), only porn bots (of which there were plenty, even though Tumblr seemed able to relatively quickly delete their accounts).
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  #54  
Old 12-05-2018, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Crotalus View Post
I read a story about this last week that said that they had temporarily disabled the searchability of adult-content blogs while they figured out a technical solution to a very specific and serious problem. The problem: they had too much underage stuff getting by whatever filters they had in place. Sounds like they gave up on finding a technical solution.
Tumblr is owned by Verizon. The technical problem the are having is Congress, which is getting some heat about big companies like AOL/Yahoo/Tumblr and Google/YouTube or Facebook snooping on you, owning you, and selling you.

The solution they have come up with to this technical problem is virtue signaling. These are good companies that care about morals and certainly don't need regulation of their core business.
  #55  
Old 12-06-2018, 12:58 AM
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I'd rather have the enormous archive of porn and less snooping, if we're looking for a "virtuous" company. This is, in effect, someone locking up part of a public library and confiscating part of it.

And yes, I have been on Tumblr for years, and yes, there is creepy stuff on there. But they're going way beyond "creepy stuff" in what they say they're refusing to publish.
  #56  
Old 12-06-2018, 02:05 AM
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Originally Posted by clairobscur View Post
And there's no reference to "child porn bots" (who would build a child porn bot and why? It's not like you can advertise for your child porn website), only porn bots (of which there were plenty, even though Tumblr seemed able to relatively quickly delete their accounts).
My understanding was that a lot of bot porn was underage. And I have definitely heard of sites in other countries that allow this sort of thing to go unchecked--usually Russia is the one that is mentioned, but also some small, poorer countries.

I don't think it would be hard to shut down a child porn ring. Just start at the reported child porn, and read all the metadata: who visits it, who has reblogged, liked, commented, etc. Allow it to spider if you find any child porn on these other accounts. The only way I can envision it being difficult is if they can easily put their content back up on another account.
  #57  
Old 12-06-2018, 04:08 PM
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Wasn't there some kind of blackmail emails going round a while ago with passwords and threats of revealing pron browsing?
Yes. First I got one that looked threatening, carefully worded, reference to a keystroke logger and quoting my throwaway password. But it did not state exactly which sites I had visited. I ignored it, nothing has happened. Since I have good AV software and a VPN, I figured I was reasonably safe.

Then came a flood of identical blackmail emails, worded very generally. Those I just deleted on the spot. No more came after a week. Now it is back to "Grab 16,000 woodworking plans", 50 times over.
  #58  
Old 12-06-2018, 04:32 PM
kaylasdad99 kaylasdad99 is online now
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Am I the only one who sees that thread title and misreads it as Trump can eat a gigantic bag of popcorn-sized dicks?

Only me? Okay, just checking.
  #59  
Old 12-06-2018, 04:53 PM
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Speaking of things Tumblr sucks at: their backup app. It fucking sucks. It has been running for three days with no visible progress.
  #60  
Old 12-07-2018, 10:44 PM
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Ads seem to be where a lot of online entities fail.

NoScript, AdBlock, and such were a reaction, not to ads, but the intrusive ads that would pop under your browser window and use your speakers, pop over the content you were trying to view and make you click it away, play a video you could not stop, and hidden spots where a click would send you somewhere you didn't want to go. Advertisers tried too hard.

Trying to scoop up user data to see what they like isn't much of a help. I might like left handed blivets, but I don't like videos telling me about blivets I can buy when I'm trying to find out what is the Peanuts theme music. The content of the ads isn't the problem, it's the presentation.

Make it like a magazine ad- place it between paragraphs. If I'm interested I will read it, if not I skip past.

~

4chan was mentioned. Christpher Poole could never make money from the site, but he did diligently create a means to fight CP. His successor is trying to split 4chan into NSFW porn ad boards and business friendly 4channel. It sounds like a good idea, it may work.

My point is money and law is driving some foolish changes by those who don't understand what they are doing and what they have. These people don't understand, but they want to make money. Somehow.

Now I'm going to think up an online (or not) school to teach execs about internet stuff.
  #61  
Old 12-08-2018, 12:23 AM
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You know who did really nice online ads, that I have actually clicked on repeatedly?
Project Wonderful.
They shut down this last summer.
  #62  
Old Yesterday, 01:22 AM
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Verizon takes a huge writedown on its creepily named Oath brand, the one that runs yahoo, HuffPo, tumblr et al. Goes from $4.8 billion to $200 million. That's their estimate of the value of the future profit stream. Wholly crap.

https://twitter.com/joshtpm/status/1072592235408048128

tumblr alone supposed had 555 million monthly visitors in Jan 2016.
  #63  
Old Yesterday, 04:56 AM
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...Holy shit. That's a 96% markdown. That's insane.
  #64  
Old Yesterday, 08:22 AM
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Normally I wouldn't plug a porn actress...
I see what you did there.
  #65  
Old Yesterday, 09:00 AM
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I mean, Tumblr doesn't even use real names.
Neither does Facebook, despite claiming they do. People that I want to find my not-real-name in FB have zero problem finding it; neither did ever anybody to whom I gave my skype name or my ICQ number. OTOH, people trying to find my actual real name on Facebook can't: Facebook naming policies do not accept my real name as being a valid name.
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  #66  
Old Yesterday, 10:48 AM
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With an appreciation and understanding that 'virtual communities' are real communities and this loss is real, I have a few . . . less-than-sympathetic responses.


-If there is really a commercially viable sex industry that depends on some kind of online platform, why doesn't someone go build it? Tumblr doesn't want the revenue, but someone else does, surely.

-Any community that depends on a single, for-profit company (particularly one whose mission is not aligned with that of the community) should know that its days are numbered.

-The Tumblr corner of the sex-worker industry was made possible by certain features/policies at Tumblr. They've changed. Conditions, resources, and needs change in industries all the time. I'm not sure how this is any different. The advent of Tumblr was a change. So is the demise of Tumblr.

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"Another day, another reminder that people dont give a shit if sex workers live or die. And we’re not just going to magically stop existing when we run out of places to turn online. more and more of us are going to be pushed back onto the streets and more and more of us are going to die. "
. . . sorry, but I don't get this. Sex work is a choice, not a requirement. Industries change all the time. Continuing to run a business in an unsafe environment is a choice. If you believe that Tumblr's porn ban is literally going to kill you, then I suggest, frankly, that you have deeper personal issues to work out. If I thought my career was a literal death sentence, I'd change careers. People change careers all the time. It's not always fun, but we do it.

I feel like a lot of the discussion and feelings around sex work conflates career choices with unchangeable-identity in a way that makes it impossible for people to get proper perspective on the options open to them.

Are we talking about the future of an industry? Of a community?

Sex work should be safe work, but if there are those who feel they have no choice but to continue working in unsafe conditions, then we should explore the economic/sociological issues that keep those people trapped in a self-destructive line of work. (note, I'm not saying to focus on one and ignore the other. Let's make sex work safe, and make sure that people are not in the industry (or any other industry, frankly) because they have no other choice).

Last edited by Eonwe; Yesterday at 10:48 AM.
  #67  
Old Yesterday, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Eonwe View Post
With an appreciation and understanding that 'virtual communities' are real communities and this loss is real, I have a few . . . less-than-sympathetic responses.


-If there is really a commercially viable sex industry that depends on some kind of online platform, why doesn't someone go build it? Tumblr doesn't want the revenue, but someone else does, surely.
Various people are going and building it. Cumblr, BDSMlr, Sharesome, et cetera. The problem with each of those sites (other than their newness and the fact that they haven't quite gotten the kinks out yet - I still can't upload any of my audio or multi-picture posts to BDSMlr) is that they're explicitly porn-focused. Whereas Tumblr is not. And that's actually a really important distinction.

The culture surrounding porn and sex work on Tumblr emerged organically, in a field largely built by and for women. It humanized content creators in a way that's simply impossible on sites like Pornhub, because you got to know them as people. It's not just porn, it's their personal blog, to talk about whatever they want whenever they want, to intermingle with people who aren't just there for porn, and to treat porn as just part of life, rather than this distinct "other" thing that needs to be permanently separated from all things pure and normal. Hell, my blog is half sexy stuff, half rationalist/social justice ranting. Y'think anyone on Pornhub is interested in Sasha Grey's thoughts on dehumanization in pornography, or Asa Akira's hilarious tweets? They're just there to get their rocks off in an environment designed by and for cishet men who want to masturbate.

The closest thing to that currently is Reddit, but Reddit really isn't a blogging platform, so... eh.

Quote:
-Any community that depends on a single, for-profit company (particularly one whose mission is not aligned with that of the community) should know that its days are numbered.
That's "any community on any website". Like, y'know, us. Case in point. And I suppose if the dope were to suddenly die, we'd all up roots, and there'd be some discussion about where we would all go. But we're small enough and we have an actual leadership structure to the point where we don't have coordination problems figuring out where to go, and you could in theory just throw up a MyBB board on a shared web host and have that work. This does not extrapolate well. There is a lot of communities like that. The fact that, at any time, say, WotC could crumble and pull the rug out from under the competitive Magic: The Gathering community wouldn't make it any less of a piss-take if Hasbro suddenly decided to shutter them, and people would have every right to be pissed off.

Quote:
-The Tumblr corner of the sex-worker industry was made possible by certain features/policies at Tumblr. They've changed. Conditions, resources, and needs change in industries all the time. I'm not sure how this is any different. The advent of Tumblr was a change. So is the demise of Tumblr.
It's a change, sure. A really lousy change that's hard to adapt to and will take time, energy, coordination, and often money.

Quote:
. . . sorry, but I don't get this. Sex work is a choice, not a requirement. Industries change all the time. Continuing to run a business in an unsafe environment is a choice. If you believe that Tumblr's porn ban is literally going to kill you, then I suggest, frankly, that you have deeper personal issues to work out. If I thought my career was a literal death sentence, I'd change careers. People change careers all the time. It's not always fun, but we do it.

I feel like a lot of the discussion and feelings around sex work conflates career choices with unchangeable-identity in a way that makes it impossible for people to get proper perspective on the options open to them.

Are we talking about the future of an industry? Of a community?
This is a very fair critique, IMHO.
  #68  
Old Today, 12:28 AM
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Here is a compilation of posts tagged as pr)n by tumblr's algorithm. SFW
https://twitter.com/aidosaur/status/1070325925085089792

Here are a list of alleged alternatives to Tumblr. Found online: I'm not familiar with all of them.

DeviantArt (though I understand they have content restrictions. I.e. they are about artwork, not photography, AFAIK)
Minds
Pillowfort
Pornhub (discussed above)
sharesome

Over at 4chan, they are moving their SFW stuff to 4channel.org. That seems like a reasonable way of doing things.

As for the ad-dollar issue, I wish Flashblock was up and running. I don't mind static ads without obnoxious ad copy.
  #69  
Old Today, 02:22 AM
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. . . sorry, but I don't get this. Sex work is a choice, not a requirement. Industries change all the time. Continuing to run a business in an unsafe environment is a choice. If you believe that Tumblr's porn ban is literally going to kill you, then I suggest, frankly, that you have deeper personal issues to work out. If I thought my career was a literal death sentence, I'd change careers. People change careers all the time. It's not always fun, but we do it.
You seem to be making some rather incorrect assumptions.

The people who we talk about losing their lives are people who can't do other kinds of work, or at least can't make enough money to get by on other types of work. They found a safe place to do business online that allows them to have a life without the need of having a pimp or being out on the street.

We're talking people who are disabled, who have mental disorders, who have physical disorders, and other such that makes the stereotypical workday impossible. We're not talking about the people who have skills to do other jobs but prefer sex work.

Additionally, even if we aren't talking about those people, the idea that it's hard but possible to simply up and change careers is just out of touch. If that were the case, we wouldn't have the working class problem that we have. Why would coal workers want to keep on working at failing coal plants if they could afford to get trained in another job? That's the argument you are making: that people can just up and choose.

In fact, most of your post sounds like right wing logic. You assume that capitalism just works. That, when there is a hole in the market, the guiding hand will come in and fill it in. But reality is far more messy than that. It doesn't always happen, and, when it does, it's at a higher systemic level, not at the individual or group level.

You neglect the facts on the ground. For example, why do you think Verizon would think that they need to have Tumblr be work-safe? Because all the online companies that allow you to make money are trending in that direction. Advertisers are becoming more squeamish about NSFW content, because they want to avoid controversy. Patreon has been not allowing NSFW content. Paypal has been pulling funding from places. YouTube is demonetizing NSFW and controversial content.

There is no inherent reason that any of them will decide "I want to take a gamble and be the one who still supports NSFW stuff." There's no guarantee that any company will come in and fill the gap, due to the huge startup costs causing so much inertia. Even if it eventually does happen, a lot of people will hurt in the mean time.

You also neglect the big push of traditional media companies to undermine online companies because they can't seem to shift into online content and do as well. It's a classic problem with capitalism: the old guards struggle to hold on as long as they can, taking out others with them. Sure, eventually it tends to work out, but again, a lot of people hurt in the mean time.

And then there's just how you analyze everything as having to do with money. Apparently having an LGBT, sex positive community only has value if it makes companies money. Why in the world should that be? Sometimes capitalism screws society over, hurting what it actually needs because it is only interested in profit. There are tons of very helpful things that should exist, but capitalism keeps away--including your issue with people who don't want to do sex work being able to not do sex work: capitalism doesn't necessarily give them an option.

That said, the destruction of a community can actually harm business. Even if other sites pick up the slack, you've lost a built-in audience. The community--the network of people-- are now split up. Tumblr kept them all connected together. Sure, new connections will eventually form, but, again, that doesn't help people in the meantime, or those who don't ever recover.

I think all that's left is about why we treat sex workers as a class. That's easy: because they are discriminated against. Even you presume that being a sex worker when it is not your ideal job is worse than all other jobs. The majority of people have jobs that they would rather not have--why is sex work different?

Sex workers face a societal taboo that is unwarranted, created by the prudery of society that was historically fueled by misogyny. Based on your post, you'll probably hate this word, but it's entirely applicable: sexual taboos exist because of the patriarchy, of keeping women in their place. The reason we shame women who have sex outside of marriage is to keep them under control.

There are enough similarities that the fact that some sex workers choose to be in the industry is overwhelmed by the problems these groups share with other discriminated groups. If you want to get technical, it's actually a form of classism.

I know my post is long and not really planned out. But I hope you will read it and understand why there is such a reason for sympathy in this case, and why this seems like such a huge wrong that will only harm the companies involved for making it. None of your reasons to withhold sympathy really hold up to scrutiny.

And don't forget that non-porn related Tumblr is being attacked too, since the whole thing is automated. That's what has the possibility of taking Tumblr down completely. But then there's a huge amount of inertia for any new company to take it's place. The whole thing is a catch 22 with social networks: no one wants to join unless there are people already there. That's what happens when the social aspect is the product.
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