Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #2751  
Old 05-21-2015, 06:22 PM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,501
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Fun Ball View Post
And then there was the case of the veteran / soldier with no criminal record that voluntarily showed up at an El Paso Jail to serve a 48 incarceration for a DWI. He never left.
...what the actual fuck? The guy didn't do anything. He might not of heard the guard because his freaking ears were bleeding. My god. America, hurry up and sort your shit out. This is just flat out madness.
  #2752  
Old 05-21-2015, 06:33 PM
Snowboarder Bo's Avatar
Snowboarder Bo is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 27,523
I believe the US established several years ago that hearing the police is your responsibility. Cite & cite.
  #2753  
Old 05-21-2015, 07:13 PM
Czarcasm's Avatar
Czarcasm is online now
Charter Member
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 62,558
Six officers indicted by grand jury in Freddie Grey Case. So much for the "It was a switchblade! This sucka's gonna get thrown out!" defense.
  #2754  
Old 05-21-2015, 07:54 PM
TonySinclair is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,762
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
To the extent that they are abused by criminals in order to avoid justice, yes.
Great, so just have constitutional protections for people that the cops and DAs think are innocent. What could go wrong there?

Last edited by TonySinclair; 05-21-2015 at 07:56 PM.
  #2755  
Old 05-21-2015, 08:11 PM
Ike Witt's Avatar
Ike Witt is offline
Charter Member
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Lost in the mists of time
Posts: 14,834
Quote:
Originally Posted by Czarcasm View Post
Hey, on the plus side now that they are criminals it will be okay for some cops to shoot them.
  #2756  
Old 05-22-2015, 12:47 AM
eschereal's Avatar
eschereal is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Frogstar World B
Posts: 16,499
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banquet Bear View Post
...what the actual fuck? The guy didn't do anything. He might not of heard the guard because his freaking ears were bleeding. My god. America, hurry up and sort your shit out. This is just flat out madness.
Well, a DWI is not exactly "nothing". If they felt that jail time was warranted, I suspect it probably was, though switching it from 2 to 7 days, I would like to see how they came up with that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Per your own cite, the deceased had sickle cell anemia, which he failed to disclose to the jail, and the symptoms he experienced before his death are consistent with a sickle cell crisis that they couldn't treat because he chose to not tell them about it.
If the guy is bleeding inexplicably and having trouble breathing, you know, maybe you might consider getting a doctor or medic in there, like post haste.
  #2757  
Old 05-22-2015, 03:51 AM
elucidator is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Further
Posts: 60,071
Just like those people, sneak themselves into jail so they can die and embarrass the police.
  #2758  
Old 05-22-2015, 04:35 AM
SciFiSam is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Beffnal Green innit
Posts: 8,482
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Per your own cite, the deceased had sickle cell anemia, which he failed to disclose to the jail, and the symptoms he experienced before his death are consistent with a sickle cell crisis that they couldn't treat because he chose to not tell them about it. The insinuation that the jail is responsible for his death appears to be a meritless conspiracy theory on the part of the family.
"Chose?" He didn't know he had sickle cell problems (it wasn't sickle cell anemia - you didn't read it properly).

If a prisoner looks as ill as Brown did at the end of that video then medical help should be called for. That's pretty basic. He wasn't even being aggressive or anything that might make some people (such as you) excuse the guards for being less than sympathetic.

Quote:
Law-abiding citizens don't carry $16,000 in cash on their person. I'd be very surprised if the money was acquired through legal channels.
He had a very good excuse for carrying the money and some evidence of where it came from; it was in a bank envelope, not a random bundle of used bills - not that this is definitive proof of anything but it is evidence against it being drug money or whatever.

Did you read the article or not? If you did, how can you have missed those points?

And why take ALL the money? Yes, the person can sue to get it back, but why leave them completely without funds at all? Doesn't that sound harsh? If the DEA want to seize money there should be a minimum sum they allow the person to keep - I mean, even you have to agree that carrying a few hundred when on your way to a new city would not be at all unusual.
  #2759  
Old 05-22-2015, 06:33 AM
kayaker's Avatar
kayaker is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Rural Western PA
Posts: 32,805
Smapti, dude. I prefer to carry cash on vacation. When we do St Martin for two weeks I typically carry 3 grand. I also carry credit cards, but I like being able to put cash on the table/bar and be done. How much cash can I carry before I'm "suspicious"?

(I'm white)
  #2760  
Old 05-22-2015, 06:55 AM
Banquet Bear's Avatar
Banquet Bear is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Posts: 5,501
Quote:
Originally Posted by eschereal View Post
Well, a DWI is not exactly "nothing". If they felt that jail time was warranted, I suspect it probably was, though switching it from 2 to 7 days, I would like to see how they came up with that.
...I wasn't referring to the crime that landed him in jail, I was referring to the events that take place in the video: there wasn't anything that he did (from the footage that was shown) that justified six or seven guards in full riot gear to enter the room and beat him down.
  #2761  
Old 05-22-2015, 08:53 AM
Muffin is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Great White North
Posts: 20,648
Of course it is stupid to carry large amounts of cash, for you never know when a criminal might rob you. When the criminal is a police officer, it can add injury to the insult.
  #2762  
Old 05-22-2015, 08:59 AM
Sinaptics is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 996
Quote:
Originally Posted by eschereal View Post
Well, a DWI is not exactly "nothing". If they felt that jail time was warranted, I suspect it probably was, though switching it from 2 to 7 days, I would like to see how they came up with that.
Apparently Texas has a 72 hour minimum sentence for dui.

Quote:
Confinement in the County Jail for a term of not less the 72 hours nor more that six (6) months. Open Container If there was an open container of alcohol in your car when arrested, the minimum term of confinement is six (6) days in the county jail.
  #2763  
Old 05-22-2015, 09:50 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by kayaker View Post
Smapti, dude. I prefer to carry cash on vacation. When we do St Martin for two weeks I typically carry 3 grand. I also carry credit cards, but I like being able to put cash on the table/bar and be done. How much cash can I carry before I'm "suspicious"?
I never carry cash unless I'm expecting to go somewhere where I know they don't take cards. If I'm on vacation I may carry a few hundred on me, but I keep the rest in the bank and if I need more foldin' money I use an ATM or go to the store. That's just common sense - It's a lot easier for a thief to spend your pilfered cash than it is for them to drain your bank account.
  #2764  
Old 05-22-2015, 09:52 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by SciFiSam View Post
And why take ALL the money? Yes, the person can sue to get it back, but why leave them completely without funds at all? Doesn't that sound harsh?
If the money was acquired illegally, why should they be allowed to keep any of it?
  #2765  
Old 05-22-2015, 09:53 AM
Terr is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Houston
Posts: 12,453
Quote:
Originally Posted by kayaker View Post
Smapti, dude. I prefer to carry cash on vacation. When we do St Martin for two weeks I typically carry 3 grand. I also carry credit cards, but I like being able to put cash on the table/bar and be done. How much cash can I carry before I'm "suspicious"?

(I'm white)
$3K for vacation is reasonable. $16K, whether on vacation or not, is not. Do you need an exact cutoff point?

That said, just having the money on you should not be good enough for "probable cause" of a crime being committed.

Last edited by Terr; 05-22-2015 at 09:54 AM.
  #2766  
Old 05-22-2015, 09:57 AM
mhendo is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 25,428
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
If the money was acquired illegally, why should they be allowed to keep any of it?
You beg the very question at the heart of civil asset forfeiture: the police take the money without ever proving that it was acquired illegally.

The fact that you would be "very surprised" if the money was acquired legally is not—or, in a reasonable world, should not be—the standard by which we determine whether or not that is, in fact, the case. And nor should the say-so of a police officer who has a clear interest in taking the money because he knows that it will go into his own department's coffers.

Last edited by mhendo; 05-22-2015 at 09:59 AM.
  #2767  
Old 05-22-2015, 10:09 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Oh, and to answer the "Nobody riots in Olympia, you paranoid fascist" comment from upthread, here's the scene about half a mile from my house last night.

And this isn't even some "white cop kills unarmed black guy because RACISM" incident - this is over a non-fatal shooting in which a cop wounded two men, in self-defense, when they attacked him with a skateboard while fleeing the scene of an attempted grocery store robbery.
  #2768  
Old 05-22-2015, 10:19 AM
Fear Itself is offline
Cecil's Inner Circle
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Flavortown
Posts: 35,983
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
If the money was acquired illegally, why should they be allowed to keep any of it?
I don't think police should have that power to decide, do you?
  #2769  
Old 05-22-2015, 10:21 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fear Itself View Post
I don't think police should have that power to decide, do you?
No, that's the court's decision. But just as we don't wait until after someone is convicted of murder to arrest them, we don't wait until after the civil process has been conducted to seize the dirty money.
  #2770  
Old 05-22-2015, 10:35 AM
Fear Itself is offline
Cecil's Inner Circle
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Flavortown
Posts: 35,983
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
No, that's the court's decision. But just as we don't wait until after someone is convicted of murder to arrest them, we don't wait until after the civil process has been conducted to seize the dirty money.
So assets are the same as a suspect? Can I bail out my money?
  #2771  
Old 05-22-2015, 10:36 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fear Itself View Post
Can I bail out my money?
If it was acquired illegally, it was never "your money" to begin with.
  #2772  
Old 05-22-2015, 10:42 AM
Fear Itself is offline
Cecil's Inner Circle
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Flavortown
Posts: 35,983
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
If it was acquired illegally, it was never "your money" to begin with.
Since we are extending your ridiculous analogy, the legality of my money is determined by a judge. In the mean time, it is presumed innocent, entitled to due process, and eligible for bail pending prosecution.
  #2773  
Old 05-22-2015, 10:49 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fear Itself View Post
Since we are extending your ridiculous analogy, the legality of my money is determined by a judge. In the mean time, it is presumed innocent, entitled to due process, and eligible for bail pending prosecution.
Well, no, because objects, unlike persons, do not enjoy a Constitutional presumption of innocence.

Last edited by Smapti; 05-22-2015 at 10:49 AM.
  #2774  
Old 05-22-2015, 10:51 AM
elucidator is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Further
Posts: 60,071
No. According to the Constitution, property cannot be seized without due process. Since it was seized all fair and square and legal-like, you have to go to court to get it back. Which causes me to wonder, has anyone, ever, gotten their stuff back?

Last edited by elucidator; 05-22-2015 at 10:51 AM.
  #2775  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:01 AM
Fear Itself is offline
Cecil's Inner Circle
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Flavortown
Posts: 35,983
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Well, no, because objects, unlike persons, do not enjoy a Constitutional presumption of innocence.
So this was just nonsense you threw out to hand-wave the injustice of taking someone's money because it might be tainted:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
But just as we don't wait until after someone is convicted of murder to arrest them, we don't wait until after the civil process has been conducted to seize the dirty money.
  #2776  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:02 AM
Happy Fun Ball is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: The down hill slope
Posts: 3,179
Wait a minute, I thought money was speech. Doesn't the seizure violate the 1st amendment?
  #2777  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:12 AM
Kobal2's Avatar
Kobal2 is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Paris, France
Posts: 18,530
Quote:
Originally Posted by elucidator View Post
No. According to the Constitution, property cannot be seized without due process. Since it was seized all fair and square and legal-like, you have to go to court to get it back. Which causes me to wonder, has anyone, ever, gotten their stuff back?
No, but then their stuff was no angel.
  #2778  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:16 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fear Itself View Post
So this was just nonsense you threw out to hand-wave the injustice of taking someone's money because it might be tainted:
What "injustice"?
  #2779  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:17 AM
Sinaptics is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 996
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Well, no, because objects, unlike persons, do not enjoy a Constitutional presumption of innocence.
So...following this train of reasoning, I could make an anonymous phone call to the police station stating that you've been selling drugs for years and they could, in turn, seize your house, car, and bank accounts because Suspicion!

You'd be okay with that, right? Perfectly constitutional?
  #2780  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:20 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinaptics View Post
So...following this train of reasoning, I could make an anonymous phone call to the police station stating that you've been selling drugs for years and they could, in turn, seize your house, car, and bank accounts because Suspicion!

You'd be okay with that, right? Perfectly constitutional?
Assuming you actually intended to do such a thing, your documented public declaration of your intent to make false statements to the police would be pretty solid evidence I could use to fight the seizure in court, as well as landing you in some pretty hot water to boot.

Last edited by Smapti; 05-22-2015 at 11:20 AM.
  #2781  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:22 AM
Sinaptics is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 996
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Assuming you actually intended to do such a thing, your documented public declaration of your intent to make false statements to the police would be pretty solid evidence I could use to fight the seizure in court, as well as landing you in some pretty hot water to boot.
Way to ignore my hypothetical, and no, I absolutely plan on doing no such thing.

In the real world, the person wouldn't tell you, and you would just have police at your door taking your stuff. Perfectly constitutional of them, right?
  #2782  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:25 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinaptics View Post
In the real world, the person wouldn't tell you, and you would just have police at your door taking your stuff. Perfectly constitutional of them, right?
Yes, but it'd be a waste of their time, because they'd have no evidence to back up that seizure and they would lose in court.
  #2783  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:34 AM
Fear Itself is offline
Cecil's Inner Circle
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Flavortown
Posts: 35,983
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
What "injustice"?
It's in the Constitution:
Quote:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects,[a] against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
No where does it say police can just seize cash on the off chance it might be ill-gotten.
  #2784  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:39 AM
Snowboarder Bo's Avatar
Snowboarder Bo is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 27,523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terr View Post
$3K for vacation is reasonable. $16K, whether on vacation or not, is not. Do you need an exact cutoff point?

That said, just having the money on you should not be good enough for "probable cause" of a crime being committed.
Would $4k in cash be reasonable? How about $5k? I get that $16k is too much, but what about $15k? Is there a guide online somewhere that you use, Terr? Can you link to it so I can know if the amount of cash I want to carry is or is not "reasonable"? Thanks in advance.
  #2785  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:39 AM
Sinaptics is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 996
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Yes, but it'd be a waste of their time, because they'd have no evidence to back up that seizure and they would lose in court.
Ah, I get it! No problem because you'd probably only have to spend a few thousand and wait a year or two to get your house, car, and money back. Are you still not seeing a problem with this?

I'd feel remiss pointing out that the authorities do this because a lot of the time, people don't have the time or money to fight over a few thousand dollars so the cops win by default.
  #2786  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:41 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinaptics View Post
Ah, I get it! No problem because you'd probably only have to spend a few thousand and wait a year or two to get your house, car, and money back. Are you still not seeing a problem with this?
And I'd be better off in the long run with the punitive damages the court would award to me after the cops did something as laughably stupid as seize a house and car based on an anonymous phone call with absolutely no physical or documentary evidence to back it up.
  #2787  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:43 AM
Snowboarder Bo's Avatar
Snowboarder Bo is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 27,523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Yes, but it'd be a waste of their time, because they'd have no evidence to back up that seizure and they would lose in court.
Haha like the cops need evidence to keep stuff they seize. OMG you're stupid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
And I'd be better off in the long run with the punitive damages the court would award to me after the cops did something as laughably stupid as seize a house and car based on an anonymous phone call with absolutely no physical or documentary evidence to back it up.
Let's go to the quarry and throw stuff down there! Ddamn, you should see about bottling and selling that denial of yours.

Last edited by Snowboarder Bo; 05-22-2015 at 11:44 AM.
  #2788  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:43 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fear Itself View Post
It's in the Constitution:No where does it say police can just seize cash on the off chance it might be ill-gotten.
Quote:
The right of the people
People, not objects.

Quote:
to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects
Their effects, not other people's effects that they stole or otherwise acquired unlawfully.

Quote:
against unreasonable searches and seizures
There's nothing unreasonable about seizing the profits of an illegal venture.
  #2789  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:45 AM
Sinaptics is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 996
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
And I'd be better off in the long run with the punitive damages the court would award to me after the cops did something as laughably stupid as seize a house and car based on an anonymous phone call with absolutely no physical or documentary evidence to back it up.
Umm, you won't get punitive damages. Do you think any of the people who have gotten their seized stuff returned have gotten damages? A single link would be sufficient.

In fact, most of them settle for half or so of the value of what's been taken so they don't have to fight over it for a year.
  #2790  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:46 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo View Post
Haha like the cops need evidence to keep stuff they seize. OMG you're stupid.
I have bank statements and pay stubs to prove that every dollar I've earned over the past 15 years was acquired lawfully from my employers and from the IRS, there are no drugs prohibited by state or federal law present in my residence or my car, and there is absolutely no one on this Earth who will testify in a court of law that I have ever sold them drugs.

On what basis would a judge rule that the preponderance of evidence is against me?
  #2791  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:48 AM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinaptics View Post
Umm, you won't get punitive damages. Do you think any of the people who have gotten their seized stuff returned have gotten damages? A single link would be sufficient.
A single link;

Quote:
Javier Gonzalez was carrying $10,000 cash in a briefcase and got pulled over in Texas; deputies handed Gonzalez a waiver, that if he signed over the money and did not claim it later, he would not be arrested, but if he refused to sign the waiver, Gonzalez would be arrested for money-laundering. Gonzalez signed the waiver wondering if the officers were real "officers of law" and wondering if he got robbed, but later sued the county, which lost, and returned his cash plus paid him $110,000 in damages (emphasis mine) plus attorney's fees.

Last edited by Smapti; 05-22-2015 at 11:48 AM.
  #2792  
Old 05-22-2015, 11:53 AM
Fear Itself is offline
Cecil's Inner Circle
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Flavortown
Posts: 35,983
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Their effects, not other people's effects that they stole or otherwise acquired unlawfully.
Did the police demonstrate probable cause to a judge, who issued a warrant?
  #2793  
Old 05-22-2015, 12:01 PM
Czarcasm's Avatar
Czarcasm is online now
Charter Member
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 62,558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
So basically, they tried to extort $10,000 from him, right? "Give us the money, or we'll arrest you!"
  #2794  
Old 05-22-2015, 12:03 PM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Czarcasm View Post
So basically, they tried to extort $10,000 from him, right? "Give us the money, or we'll arrest you!"
And they lost. The system works.
  #2795  
Old 05-22-2015, 12:26 PM
Czarcasm's Avatar
Czarcasm is online now
Charter Member
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 62,558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
And they lost. The system works.
And how long were they sentenced for extortion?
  #2796  
Old 05-22-2015, 12:40 PM
eschereal's Avatar
eschereal is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Frogstar World B
Posts: 16,499
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Yeah, not such a good link. Here, under the "Civil Forfeiture" column, it says Assets returned if owner proves innocence. That is straight up backwards WRT how the system is supposed to work.

Also, several examples given further on are very bad,
Mandrel Stuart and his girlfriend were on a date driving on Interstate 66 ... The traffic stop on that balmy afternoon in August 2012 was the beginning of a dizzying encounter that would leave Stuart shaken and wondering whether he had been singled out because he was black and had a police record. Over the next two hours, he would be detained without charges, handcuffed and taken to a nearby police station ... stripped of $17,550 in cash ... earned through ... a small barbecue restaurant ... he was going to use the money that night for supplies and equipment.
In that case, IIRC, he had to close his restaurant because of financial hardship.
In May 2010 a couple was driving from New York to Florida and they were stopped by police because of a cracked windshield. During questioning, the officer decided that $32,000 cash in the van was "probably involved in criminal or drug-related activity", seized it, shared it with federal authorities under equitable sharing. The victim hired a lawyer to get back the seized money who urged settling for half of the seized amount, and after the lawyer's fees, the victim only got back $7,000.
$25K for a cracked windshield?
Police seized a house on the pretext that it was being used for selling drugs, after a couple's son was arrested for selling $40 worth of illegal drugs. In another case, homeowners Carl and Mary Shelden sold their house to a man who was later convicted of fraud, but because of the real estate transaction, the Sheldens got caught up in a 10-year legal battle that left them "virtually bankrupt"; after years, they finally got back their house but it was in badly damaged condition; the Sheldens did nothing wrong.
Yeah, looks to me like the system is working
  #2797  
Old 05-22-2015, 12:44 PM
Larry Borgia's Avatar
Larry Borgia is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Washington DC
Posts: 10,633
Smaptis gonna smap.
  #2798  
Old 05-22-2015, 12:48 PM
Smapti is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 16,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by eschereal View Post
That is straight up backwards WRT how the system is supposed to work.
The Supreme Court disagrees.

Last edited by Smapti; 05-22-2015 at 12:48 PM.
  #2799  
Old 05-22-2015, 12:48 PM
eschereal's Avatar
eschereal is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Frogstar World B
Posts: 16,499
"going to"?
  #2800  
Old 05-22-2015, 12:50 PM
Sinaptics is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 996
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Got me there. I was unaware of anyone receiving punitive damages. You have to realize that this is an extreme outlier, though. Given the stories you've just been presented with, do you still think this is a fair and constitutional system?
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:00 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@straightdope.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Copyright 2019 STM Reader, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017