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Old 10-10-2019, 04:56 PM
HurricaneDitka is offline
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the rule on "Threatening harm"


I had a question about this bit of moderation:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bone View Post
Do not post threats or state or imply that any individual or group is deserving of harm. ...
That seems like a bit broader restriction than the rules post's guidance:

Quote:
Threatening harm - Posters may not threaten to harm or to wish for harm to befall other posters for any reason whatsoever.
I guess my real question is whether posting things along the lines of these examples would run afoul of the moderation staff:
  • I hope the Kurds make the Turks pay a heavy price in blood for every mile of territory they invade
  • I wish the US military would make the IRGC cease to exist

I get that hoping for one's political opponents to swing from lightposts en masse, or calling for the wholesale nuking of cities would not be kosher, but what about legitimate military operations against "bad guys"? Is it against the rules to "wish for harm to befall" people like Osama bin Laden / ISIS? The IRGC? Turkish / Russian / Syrian military forces? Erdogan? Maduro?

Last edited by HurricaneDitka; 10-10-2019 at 04:57 PM.
  #2  
Old 10-10-2019, 05:01 PM
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From the registration agreement:

Quote:
Do not post threats or state or imply that any individual or group is deserving of harm. We recognize that this rule cannot be strictly applied in discussions of war, capital punishment and the like but urge users to express themselves in moderate terms nonetheless. If we tell you to refrain from behavior that we regard as uncivil, or that in our view detracts from productive discussion, do so or face revocation of your posting privileges.
See bolded part.
  #3  
Old 10-10-2019, 05:03 PM
HurricaneDitka is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bone View Post
From the registration agreement:


See bolded part.
Thanks, that's the answer I was looking for.
  #4  
Old 10-10-2019, 05:58 PM
Joey P is offline
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Even without what Bone posted, unless the IRGC or Turks are posters on the board, you wouldn't run afoul of the rule stating you can't threaten harm to other posters. Granted, there could be members of that group that post here, but in general the rule seems to get applied when you're threatening a specific poster.
The only time I can think where it's been applied to groups is when we know posters are part of that group, for example, republicans or Cubs fans or Canadians.

IOW, is there even a small chance that someone could take it as a call to action and actually attempt to carry out the threat on another member.

I know emotions can run high, but ISTM in almost every case of wanting to say something like that there's usually a way to, well, not say it.

ETA, since we sometimes get nitpicky about the exact wording of a post (I'm looking at you 'attack the post, not the poster'), is "I wish..." or "I hope..." actually a threat. A distinction could be made between a statement like "I hope you get killed" or "I wish someone would kill you" vs "I'm going to kill you" or "Someone needs to kill you".

Last edited by Joey P; 10-10-2019 at 06:01 PM.
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Old 10-11-2019, 05:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey P View Post
Even without what Bone posted, unless the IRGC or Turks are posters on the board, you wouldn't run afoul of the rule stating you can't threaten harm to other posters.
Doesn't matter, the registration agreement is more general (and, I'd argue, has more weight)
  #6  
Old 10-11-2019, 07:27 AM
Joey P is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrDibble View Post
Doesn't matter, the registration agreement is more general (and, I'd argue, has more weight)
I think that's one of the problems that shows up when we have so many rules*. Both of those rules are written by Bone, but you'd think the rules for an individual forum wouldn't be less restrictive than rules for the entire board since that can't work. Technically, based on that, you could be warned for insulting someone in the pit. But it's a gray area. Like a state allowing something that's not legal at the federal level.



*I've done this before, but here it is a again. The approximate number of pages (based on how many times I hit Page Down to get to the bottom) of rules for the board as a whole and each forum.
Registration Agreement/ATMB 9
FAQ - Rules for posting 11
FAQ - Guidelines and Etiquette 6
FAQ - Technical issues for Posting 10
Glossary 3
Forum Rules 3
GQ 2
GD/Elections 2
CS 10
Game Room 1
MPSIMS 3
Marketplace 1
Pit 1

60 pages of rules is a lot of rules.

Last edited by Joey P; 10-11-2019 at 07:29 AM.
  #7  
Old 10-11-2019, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey P View Post
I think that's one of the problems that shows up when we have so many rules*. Both of those rules are written by Bone, but you'd think the rules for an individual forum wouldn't be less restrictive than rules for the entire board since that can't work. Technically, based on that, you could be warned for insulting someone in the pit. But it's a gray area. Like a state allowing something that's not legal at the federal level.



*I've done this before, but here it is a again. The approximate number of pages (based on how many times I hit Page Down to get to the bottom) of rules for the board as a whole and each forum.
Registration Agreement/ATMB 9
FAQ - Rules for posting 11
FAQ - Guidelines and Etiquette 6
FAQ - Technical issues for Posting 10
Glossary 3
Forum Rules 3
GQ 2
GD/Elections 2
CS 10
Game Room 1
MPSIMS 3
Marketplace 1
Pit 1

60 pages of rules is a lot of rules.
It totally is. Though I think we've cleaned up and streamlined quite a bit. Yes each forum can have their own individual rules stickied, but in ATMB there is now only one thread stickied that contains the registration agreement, rules, and FAQ. There were links to previous threads that had guidelines, etiquette, glossary, etc. but those have largely fallen off the main page. We're always open to clean up and streamlining so if you see something that could use attention please let us know.
  #8  
Old 10-11-2019, 11:08 AM
Joey P is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bone View Post
It totally is. Though I think we've cleaned up and streamlined quite a bit. Yes each forum can have their own individual rules stickied, but in ATMB there is now only one thread stickied that contains the registration agreement, rules, and FAQ. There were links to previous threads that had guidelines, etiquette, glossary, etc. but those have largely fallen off the main page. We're always open to clean up and streamlining so if you see something that could use attention please let us know.
When I was going through them, my thought was to have one set of rules for the entire board, as easy to read and short as possible (and I know that's not easy since we're a nitpicky, rules-lawyering group). Each forum would then have it's own sticky post with a link to that along with with it's own amendments.
This may serve to cut out how many forums have rules that are identical to the board rules and/or rules in other forums.


But, as I mentioned earlier, it doesn't make a whole lot of difference to me. Beyond looking for something specific, I'm not sure I've ever really read them.
  #9  
Old 10-11-2019, 01:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey P View Post
When I was going through them, my thought was to have one set of rules for the entire board, as easy to read and short as possible (and I know that's not easy since we're a nitpicky, rules-lawyering group).
As I'm sure you'll recall it used to be the only real rule was "don't be a jerk." Sadly it proved unworkable, as for some folks it seems everyone is a jerk but them.

Last edited by Tamerlane; 10-11-2019 at 01:17 PM.
  #10  
Old 10-11-2019, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey P View Post
When I was going through them, my thought was to have one set of rules for the entire board, as easy to read and short as possible (and I know that's not easy since we're a nitpicky, rules-lawyering group). Each forum would then have it's own sticky post with a link to that along with with it's own amendments.
This may serve to cut out how many forums have rules that are identical to the board rules and/or rules in other forums.
What I'm saying is, what you describe is what we currently have for the most part. The other things that you reference, like etiquette and glossary, those are not stickied anywhere anymore.
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