Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-05-2019, 05:57 PM
Folacin is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: North of the River
Posts: 3,835

Shazam - spoilers after first


Has anyone else seen this? I thought it was decent.
  #2  
Old 04-05-2019, 06:06 PM
Folacin is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: North of the River
Posts: 3,835
Not as silly as I expected. Learning the super powers was fun, Billy had a nice growth arc as a hero (if a somewhat sudden acceptance of family at the climax).

Nice semi-cameo in the final cafeteria scene, tying the Captain into the DC universe (although they had already done that). I guess this means he at least makes it into a Darkseid movie (assuming there is one).

I knew I didn't know squat about DC much beyond the big four, but I guess the inch-worm in the mid-credits scene is a known villain?

And I knew there was a Mary Marvel (although I expected her to just be a setup for a potential sequel) and possibly a Captain Marvel Junior, but are the other four existing characters? And does everyone have the same power set?

And finally - I counted six Marvels, but aren't there seven chairs? Is someone missing?

Last edited by Folacin; 04-05-2019 at 06:08 PM.
  #3  
Old 04-05-2019, 06:38 PM
Miller's Avatar
Miller is offline
Sith Mod
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Bear Flag Republic
Posts: 44,948
Saw it last night, and really enjoyed it! I think they've finally figured out how to properly do "DC dark" in the movies - make the setting as grimdark as you want, but keep the darkness off the heroes. Sivana was a first-rate villain, and the bit where he meets his dad in the boardroom was surprisingly graphic. But Billy himself doesn't do any of that bullshit, "Is it right to save people's lives?" soul-searching that Superman was doing in Justice League.

The worm in the mid-credit scene is Mister Mind, who is specifically a Captain Marvel villain. Here's his original look. Here's how he's been shown in DC comics lately.

The "Marvel Family" has been a staple of the property for ages. Freddy and Mary date back to the '40s. Billy's other three foster siblings were more recent additions, from about ten years ago. They all have the same basic powerset as Billy, but each has a specialty - Darla is faster than the others, Pedro is stronger, and so forth.

Last edited by Miller; 04-05-2019 at 06:39 PM.
  #4  
Old 04-06-2019, 09:49 PM
Dewey Finn is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 30,172
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller View Post
Saw it last night, and really enjoyed it! I think they've finally figured out how to properly do "DC dark" in the movies - make the setting as grimdark as you want, but keep the darkness off the heroes. Sivana was a first-rate villain, and the bit where he meets his dad in the boardroom was surprisingly graphic.
I just saw it today, and yes the boardroom scene was pretty graphic, particularly when one of the monsters/sins bit the head off one of the suits. I think I saw a family leave right after that.

I liked it, and in an earlier thread mentioned that some elements reminded me of the Tom Hanks movie Big. So it was amusing when there was a brief reference to that movie (in the scene in the mall, Billy-as-Shazam crashed through a wall and landed on a floor keyboard like in the FAO Schwartz scene in Big).
  #5  
Old 04-06-2019, 09:51 PM
Dewey Finn is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 30,172
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller View Post
Saw it last night, and really enjoyed it! I think they've finally figured out how to properly do "DC dark" in the movies - make the setting as grimdark as you want, but keep the darkness off the heroes. Sivana was a first-rate villain, and the bit where he meets his dad in the boardroom was surprisingly graphic.
I just saw it today, and yes the boardroom scene was pretty graphic, particularly when one of the monsters/sins bit the head off one of the suits. I think I saw a family leave right after that.

I liked it, and in an earlier thread mentioned that some elements reminded me of the Tom Hanks movie Big. So it was amusing when there was a brief reference to that movie (in the scene in the mall, Billy-as-Shazam crashed through a wall and landed on a floor keyboard like in the FAO Schwartz scene in Big).

BTW, did he ever settle on a superhero name? It seemed that he didn't.
  #6  
Old 04-10-2019, 05:58 AM
epbrown01 is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 3,878
Quote:
Originally Posted by Folacin View Post
And finally - I counted six Marvels, but aren't there seven chairs? Is someone missing?
As Shazam (the ancient wizard) explained, his previous avatar went rogue and is still at large. He's known as Black Adam and will apparently be played by Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson in the sequel. Originally the two post-credit scenes were going to have Cavill as Superman and Johnson as Black Adam recruiting Sivana.

Cavill still isn't confirmed to continue the role so didn't do the cameo. Johnson has the same agent as Cavill so he didn't do a scene either, helping pressure the studio to keep Cavill.
__________________
"Motorcycles - the cigarettes of transportation." Seth Meyers
  #7  
Old 04-10-2019, 12:52 PM
Miller's Avatar
Miller is offline
Sith Mod
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Bear Flag Republic
Posts: 44,948
Quote:
Originally Posted by epbrown01 View Post
As Shazam (the ancient wizard) explained, his previous avatar went rogue and is still at large. He's known as Black Adam and will apparently be played by Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson in the sequel. Originally the two post-credit scenes were going to have Cavill as Superman and Johnson as Black Adam recruiting Sivana.

Cavill still isn't confirmed to continue the role so didn't do the cameo. Johnson has the same agent as Cavill so he didn't do a scene either, helping pressure the studio to keep Cavill.
I don't think the number of thrones was meant to correlate to the number of people in the Marvel Family. Shazam was only ever looking to make one champion. Sharing the power out among his foster family was Billy's idea. Shazam also said he was the last of a council of wizards, but I'm pretty sure he said there were originally thirteen of them.

Maybe the other six wizards had to bring their own chairs.
  #8  
Old 04-10-2019, 11:38 PM
Drunky Smurf's Avatar
Drunky Smurf is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Smurf Village.
Posts: 11,203
If I remember right, Wizard Shazam told Billy, that Billy remembered right before he Shazamed the family, was that Billy needed to use his greatest power, his heart, and fill the thrones.

Or something like that.
  #9  
Old 04-14-2019, 07:20 PM
Sir T-Cups is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 8,866
Sooooooooo


What was Sivana a doctor of?
__________________
Want to see more of my adventures in Orlando? Follow Mrs. Cups and me @theorlandoduo on Instagram. And check out our blog too: TheOrlandoDuo.com
  #10  
Old 04-05-2019, 08:08 PM
DigitalC is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Obamatopia
Posts: 11,311
I liked the movie for the most part, but "bodybuilder" type muscles really do not work for super heroes. They all looked fairly ridiculous.
  #11  
Old 04-05-2019, 11:50 PM
Equipoise's Avatar
Equipoise is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Chicago
Posts: 10,128
The Foster mom is named Rosa Vasquez
The Foster dad is named Victor Vasquez

The Kids are:
Mary Bromfield
Darla Dudley
Eugene Choi
Pedro Pena
Freddy Freeman
Billy Batson


Come on, stop with this "Captain Marvel"/"Marvel Family" shit. Go start a dedicated thread about the old-timey comics and refer to them that way if you're an old person and can't stop living in the past. For THIS movie, in 2019, and all the Shazam! sequels to come, not one of the characters names has or ever will have the word "Marvel" in it.

I loved the movie btw. I've seen it twice already.
  #12  
Old 04-06-2019, 08:36 AM
Ukulele Ike is offline
Charter Member
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 18,467
Quote:
Originally Posted by Equipoise View Post
Come on, stop with this "Captain Marvel"/"Marvel Family" shit. Go start a dedicated thread about the old-timey comics and refer to them that way if you're an old person and can't stop living in the past.
Is it okay if I call him “the Big Red Cheese?”
__________________
Uke
  #13  
Old 04-06-2019, 07:00 AM
AK84 is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 16,867
I loved it.
Better then Captain Marvel by a country mile.
I would have made one change. The rest of the foster kids knew Billy for, like a day and suddenly, they are like blood siblings.
It felt forced.
A better change would have been him already with the Vasquezs from the beginning. They literally did not need to domjuc bu5 change a bit of dialogue. Would have sold the sibling team vibe, which the young actors hit perfectly, better.
  #14  
Old 04-06-2019, 08:51 AM
DigitalC is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Obamatopia
Posts: 11,311
Quote:
Originally Posted by AK84 View Post
I loved it.
Better then Captain Marvel by a country mile.
I would have made one change. The rest of the foster kids knew Billy for, like a day and suddenly, they are like blood siblings.
It felt forced.
A better change would have been him already with the Vasquezs from the beginning. They literally did not need to domjuc bu5 change a bit of dialogue. Would have sold the sibling team vibe, which the young actors hit perfectly, better.
That showed me it was a good home and the kids were being raised right.
  #15  
Old 04-06-2019, 06:41 PM
D_Odds is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Queens
Posts: 13,091
Mister Mind, the little worm (which also appeared in the first Rock of Eternity scene) is probably Captain Marvel's second most known villain. I know I'm an old dude, but I prefer the pre-Geoff Johns Captain Marvel. I did like that a tiger was focused upon; assuming a sequel I hope they go there.

I would have liked a little more focus on the gods and heroes that make up Shazam, such as Shazam invoking the courage of Achilles to finally learn to stand up to Sivana. But they seemed to not want to emphasize that. Still worked overall.
  #16  
Old 04-06-2019, 09:25 PM
tonyfop is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Southern Maryland
Posts: 814
He really didn't show very much of the "Wisdom of Solomon", although he started to make pretty good decisions near the end. They seemed to concentrate more on Hercules, Atlas, Zeus and Mercury. Not much courage of Achilles until the end.
__________________
TonyFop

Curmudgeon-in-Training
Get off my lawn
  #17  
Old 04-06-2019, 11:35 PM
Siam Sam is offline
Elephant Whisperer
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
Posts: 41,469
We saw it this afternoon. Very good. Makes up for that godawful Aquaman dreck. Looks like a sequel is planned.
__________________
The two most interesting things in the world: Other people's sex lives and your own money.
  #18  
Old 04-07-2019, 09:04 AM
vislor is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Iowa
Posts: 566
Saw it yesterday and enjoyed it a lot!

Yes to what everyone says about the setting being grim-dark but not the heroes. Zachary Levi nailed it!

I liked that the rest of the Shazam family was there. Loved the cartoon drawings at the end, before mid credit scene, to also tie them into the DC world.

LOVED the guest at lunch! Perfectly handled, imo.

If I have a complaint about the movie, it's that I saw just enough previews that a good number of fun scenes were known. Not all but enough that for me, when I recognized what was coming, I was a bit taken out of the moment. It's a small nit for me and it's why I avoid trailers as much as I can now beyond the first one.

If I have a complaint about myself, it's that I read the comic with Zachary Levi on the front, and that told about two thirds of the story here. I will say that what they changed worked much better than the comic and I'm glad that they did make the changes. (It's not a comic adaption of the movie, it's actually a compilation of comics from about ten years ago that brought Shazam back into DC, I think New 52.)

Great discussion! Thanks!
  #19  
Old 04-07-2019, 09:27 AM
Dewey Finn is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 30,172
A couple of questions.

How does it work if the superhero's name is Shazam but that's also the magic word that transforms him into Billy Batson and vice versa? If the superhero is talking to a news reporter and says, "My name is Shazam", is the reporter now talking to Billy Batson? And doesn't that make it difficult to hide his real identity?

The full cast listing in IMDB includes one actress playing "Sivana's Twin Sisters - 12 Yrs Old" and another playing "Mrs. Sivana". I only remember seeing Thad Sivana's father (played by John Glover) and brother in the car at the beginning and later in the board room. So was there a deleted scene? If so, that's probably something for the home video release.

Finally, when the foster siblings were transformed into superheroes, did each only have one power (super-strength, speed, lightning, etc)? And did "Shazam" retain all of them at the same time?
  #20  
Old 04-07-2019, 11:27 AM
DigitalC is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Obamatopia
Posts: 11,311
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewey Finn View Post
A couple of questions.

How does it work if the superhero's name is Shazam but that's also the magic word that transforms him into Billy Batson and vice versa? If the superhero is talking to a news reporter and says, "My name is Shazam", is the reporter now talking to Billy Batson? And doesn't that make it difficult to hide his real identity?
That's why he does not actually go by Shazam.
  #21  
Old 04-08-2019, 02:12 PM
Quimby is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: NJ
Posts: 8,588
This was a fun movie. I enjoyed it. A nice cross between Superman and Big.

One thing that wasn't clear to me is if his siblings are permanently heroes too or was that just a one time thing?
  #22  
Old 04-08-2019, 02:19 PM
Miller's Avatar
Miller is offline
Sith Mod
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Bear Flag Republic
Posts: 44,948
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quimby View Post
This was a fun movie. I enjoyed it. A nice cross between Superman and Big.

One thing that wasn't clear to me is if his siblings are permanently heroes too or was that just a one time thing?
Permanent, I'm pretty sure. Certainly, that's how it is in the comics.
  #23  
Old 04-08-2019, 02:24 PM
simster is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 11,528
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller View Post
Permanent, I'm pretty sure. Certainly, that's how it is in the comics.
Rigth - its "All in the Shazamily".

We enjoyed it - easily the most fun DC movie to date.

Billy's use (or misuse, as it were) of the powers after he got them are exactly what I would expect a 15 year old boy to do.

"That was the _first_ place you could think of?"

Last edited by simster; 04-08-2019 at 02:25 PM.
  #24  
Old 04-10-2019, 10:50 AM
Ashtura is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,805
I thought it was decent. Of the new DC movies I'd rate it 3rd after Wonder Woman and Aquaman.

I thought it took too long to get to the Shazam part (as it should for anyone that saw the damn trailer), and a lot of the humor fell flat for me. However, there were some gems in there too, like the bus scene. Him pulling out the disgusting mattress and the guy going "no, no" was hysterical.
  #25  
Old 04-10-2019, 12:20 PM
D_Odds is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Queens
Posts: 13,091
The bus scene...

I don't know why this happens to me in superhero movies, but it always does. In a movie where a guy can fly, bullets bounce off his chest, he can shoot lightning from his hands (or heat from his eyes), etcetera and so forth, the physics of falling objects (and normal people) always break my suspension of disbelief. I can't help but grimace when that happens. It bothered me when Superman did it 41 years ago and bothers me still. Both Lois and Thaddeus should have been dead from their falls. Superman should have been holding a piece of the helicopters landing strut; there would be little difference between the bus striking Captain Marvel or the pavement. I can lose myself into every other aspect of these shows, but that's what gets me.
  #26  
Old 04-10-2019, 12:46 PM
Miller's Avatar
Miller is offline
Sith Mod
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Bear Flag Republic
Posts: 44,948
Quote:
Originally Posted by D_Odds View Post
The bus scene...

I don't know why this happens to me in superhero movies, but it always does. In a movie where a guy can fly, bullets bounce off his chest, he can shoot lightning from his hands (or heat from his eyes), etcetera and so forth, the physics of falling objects (and normal people) always break my suspension of disbelief. I can't help but grimace when that happens. It bothered me when Superman did it 41 years ago and bothers me still. Both Lois and Thaddeus should have been dead from their falls. Superman should have been holding a piece of the helicopters landing strut; there would be little difference between the bus striking Captain Marvel or the pavement. I can lose myself into every other aspect of these shows, but that's what gets me.
I can mostly ignore the "Catching a falling person six feet before they hit the pavement means no injuries" thing. And I can mostly ignore the "Lifting a multi-ton vehicle with your bare hands doesn't just tear the vehicle to bits," thing. But that scene of Captain Marvel standing there, holding an entire bus over his head by its windshield was too much for me. Especially when thirty seconds earlier, they'd made a point of showing that the window was cracking and about to fail.
  #27  
Old 04-15-2019, 12:27 PM
Acsenray is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 37,156
I quite enjoyed this movie. My only regret is that I accidentally ended up in the 3-D show and the glasses made everything too dark.

I wanted to get a close look at each of the seven deadlies, but I couldn't really make them out. I was interested in how they visually portrayed each particular sin. Is there any place that has good images of each one?
__________________
*I'm experimenting with E, em, and es and emself as pronouns that do not indicate any specific gender nor exclude any specific gender.

Last edited by Acsenray; 04-15-2019 at 12:30 PM.
  #28  
Old 04-15-2019, 12:58 PM
Intergalactic Gladiator's Avatar
Intergalactic Gladiator is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Chicago
Posts: 12,606
That's one of the things my son and I were talking about after watching it yesterday. The Seven Deadly Sins are distinctive looking but I had a hard time determining each during the movie. Gluttony was pretty obvious - he was the fat one with the mouth that opened up along his torso but was Sloth all that Slothful? I can't remember seeing. Wrath seemed obvious but what was Lust? They were all the same colors and made the same smoke, so it was a bit confusing.

But we enjoyed the movie in any case. I noticed Mr. Mind right off the bat while at the Rock of Eternity and the setup for Black Adam seemed obvious. There was a bit of a tonal shift that was jarring, mostly when Savanna gets to the boardroom, throws his brother out the window and then lets the Sins chomp down on everyone else. The working around his name was a little goofy but made for a great moment at the end when he says "Say my name" and the other kids all respond with "Billy!"
  #29  
Old 04-15-2019, 01:14 PM
Miller's Avatar
Miller is offline
Sith Mod
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Bear Flag Republic
Posts: 44,948
Quote:
Originally Posted by Intergalactic Gladiator View Post
That's one of the things my son and I were talking about after watching it yesterday. The Seven Deadly Sins are distinctive looking but I had a hard time determining each during the movie. Gluttony was pretty obvious - he was the fat one with the mouth that opened up along his torso but was Sloth all that Slothful? I can't remember seeing. Wrath seemed obvious but what was Lust? They were all the same colors and made the same smoke, so it was a bit confusing.
Greed had an extra pair of arms coming out his back, presumably for grabbing stuff it was greedy for.
  #30  
Old 04-15-2019, 01:40 PM
Acsenray is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 37,156
I really like how many elements of the classic stories they got in Dr. Sivana, Mr. Mind, a hint of Black Adam, the Seven Deadlies, the Wizard Shazam, Freddie's disability, Captain Marvel Jr.'s blue costume, Mary Marvel and the Lieutenants Marvel.

And all the characters were really engaging and warm. All-in-all a very cozy setup. I knew I liked it when I found myself grinning broadly at Captain Marvel gleefully flossing.
__________________
*I'm experimenting with E, em, and es and emself as pronouns that do not indicate any specific gender nor exclude any specific gender.
  #31  
Old 04-15-2019, 01:46 PM
Acsenray is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 37,156
And being as I just learned the term myself, this is "flossing" -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCqeRQuOgUA
__________________
*I'm experimenting with E, em, and es and emself as pronouns that do not indicate any specific gender nor exclude any specific gender.
  #32  
Old 01-27-2020, 11:12 AM
SlackerInc's Avatar
SlackerInc is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Northern Minnesota
Posts: 13,235
I wasn’t surprised that I enjoyed this, as it was very well-received when it came out last year. But I *was* surprised by two things. While there was a good chunk of the movie that consisted of cheeky, irreverent superhero hijinks as I had expected, the opening reel of the film was surprisingly dark and ominous. And then there’s an early-middle section, before any actual superpowers come into play, that is just a straight up solid depiction of a very appealing and diverse foster family. I actually literally forgot for a few minutes that I wasn’t just watching a realistic drama. I would watch a show on HBO or Netflix or whatever that focused on that family with nothing supernatural involved.

As is typical for the superhero genre, the movie does suffer from an overstuffed and overlong final battle sequence. If I could edit 10 or 15 minutes out of the final reel, it could easily make my top ten of 2019 instead of just missing it. Although it obviously would have been even better to just avoid unnecessarily spending so much money on battle sequence special effects to begin with! Do they really have audience research that shows it is necessary to make these so long? Or are they just engaged in an arms race and everyone is afraid to pull back? Because I really feel like even if you cut out 10 or 15 minutes like I said, it would still be plenty long enough.

Postscript: After writing the above, I figured I would check the actual movie to see how that would all shake out. There’s a five minute battle with the villain, then a nine minute break, followed by a continuous 28 minute final battle before the coda. That’s just way too long! 15 minutes would be plenty. And that would bring the movie in under two hours. Although in the director’s commentary on deleted scenes, he pointed out that some of the scenes with the foster family were favorites of his but had to be cut for time. Put those back in instead!

That’s a lot of complaining, I realize; but I did really like this movie. It’s just a shame to see a potentially better movie get brought down a peg by this kind of de rigueur Hollywood studio trope. Pretty much every film critic complains about this every time a superhero movie comes out. Now, sometimes the hoi polloi can genuinely be into stuff that critics find hokey or tiresome, and they are the ones who pay the bills. I just wonder if that’s actually true in this case. If no one ever dares to go shorter, how would we know?
  #33  
Old 01-27-2020, 12:20 PM
vislor is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Iowa
Posts: 566
@SlackerInc - I agree about fights. With few exceptions, or if it's the point of the movie, fights are too long. Endgame might have been okay as it had a lot of little fights in it but I think individual fights didn't take long? I hope that's correct as I can't check it right now.
  #34  
Old 02-12-2020, 04:44 AM
SlackerInc's Avatar
SlackerInc is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Northern Minnesota
Posts: 13,235
Quote:
Originally Posted by vislor View Post
@SlackerInc - I agree about fights. With few exceptions, or if it's the point of the movie, fights are too long. Endgame might have been okay as it had a lot of little fights in it but I think individual fights didn't take long? I hope that's correct as I can't check it right now.

There was a big one on the asteroid or whatever it was. But yeah, they managed to avoid the really generic structure of most of these.
__________________
SlackerInc on Twitter: http://twitter.com/slackerinc
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:02 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@straightdope.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Copyright © 2019 STM Reader, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017