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Old 11-16-2017, 09:42 AM
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Now, Al Franken


Accused of sexual harassment, with apparent photographic evidence.

Senator Al Franken Kissed and Groped Me Without My Consent, And There’s Nothing Funny About It

ETA: from looking at the picture it's looks more like he's not actually groping her but just pretending to for comic effect. Not sure how that translates.

Last edited by Fotheringay-Phipps; 11-16-2017 at 09:45 AM.
  #2  
Old 11-16-2017, 09:48 AM
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Well, shit. I've always admired him.

What the hell, guys?!
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Old 11-16-2017, 09:53 AM
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That's it. The only men who never molested anyone are my father, my husband and my son. Probably not my brother, although, he works in Hollywood, so who knows anymore?
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Old 11-16-2017, 09:52 AM
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I can't tell from that photo whether or not Franken is actually touching her (and she was asleep at the time, so she wouldn't know).

The story of the forced kiss, however (if true, and I have no reason to believe otherwise) is disturbing enough.
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Old 11-16-2017, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Fotheringay-Phipps View Post
Accused of sexual harassment, with apparent photographic evidence.

Senator Al Franken Kissed and Groped Me Without My Consent, And Thereís Nothing Funny About It

ETA: from looking at the picture it's looks more like he's not actually groping her but just pretending to for comic effect. Not sure how that translates.
To me, it looks like his left hand is still coming in for a landing, but the right appears to have made contact.
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Old 11-16-2017, 09:55 AM
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Yeah, I saw that and was about to start a thread myself.

Fuck and damn.
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:02 AM
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Should probably resign. The governor is a D and would appoint a replacement through next year.
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:11 AM
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Should probably resign. The governor is a D and would appoint a replacement through next year.
I'm curious: Would your recommendation change if the governor were an R?
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:14 AM
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I'm curious: Would your recommendation change if the governor were an R?
I'm not basing my recommendation on the party of the governor. That was just information on what would happen afterwards.
  #10  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:03 AM
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Well, good bye Al. Time for a special election!
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:10 AM
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Is that a reputable source? It looks like an ABC radio station out of LA, but I know nothing of its reputation.
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:21 AM
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Is that a reputable source? It looks like an ABC radio station out of LA, but I know nothing of its reputation.
#BelieveWomen?
  #13  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:29 AM
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Is that a reputable source? It looks like an ABC radio station out of LA, but I know nothing of its reputation.
Are you saying the pic isn't real?
  #14  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:47 AM
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I can't tell from that photo whether or not Franken is actually touching her (and she was asleep at the time, so she wouldn't know).
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Originally Posted by Folacin View Post
To me, it looks like his left hand is still coming in for a landing, but the right appears to have made contact.
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Originally Posted by filmore View Post
For what it's worth, I don't think he actually groped her while she was sleeping. That's her flack vest she's wearing, and it doesn't seem like his fingers are actually touching it. It looks like he was pretending to grope her and have the photographer take a photo because he thought it would be funny. But that doesn't excuse it at all. Of course, it is also demeaning and sexually objectifying her.
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Are you saying the pic isn't real?
Perhaps whoever took the photo will speak up about the events.
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Old 11-16-2017, 11:06 AM
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Is that a reputable source? It looks like an ABC radio station out of LA, but I know nothing of its reputation.
The source is a statement by the accuser posted on the website of the radio station for which she is a news anchor.
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:15 AM
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Apparently she's a regular on Hannity. I'm sure he won't have any issues seeing the absolute worst on this issue.

It's hard to be the side that does the right thing when the other side couldn't give one fuck about what's right but that's what the Dems have to do. Show these fucks that ultimately even if it hurts you you have to do the right thing.

Al should be criticized and the cards should fall where they fall.
  #17  
Old 11-16-2017, 11:17 AM
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Apparently she's a regular on Hannity. I'm sure he won't have any issues seeing the absolute worst on this issue.

It's hard to be the side that does the right thing when the other side couldn't give one fuck about what's right but that's what the Dems have to do. Show these fucks that ultimately even if it hurts you you have to do the right thing.

Al should be criticized and the cards should fall where they fall.
Bolding mine
No pass for usually doing the right thing
  #18  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:46 AM
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[off topic] When I (in Thailand) click the kabc link, or even attempt to go to kabc home page, I see
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www.kabc.com - Access Denied
Error code 16
This request was blocked by the security rules
...
Your IP: ...
Seems odd.
  #19  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:08 AM
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For what it's worth, I don't think he actually groped her while she was sleeping. That's her flack vest she's wearing, and it doesn't seem like his fingers are actually touching it. It looks like he was pretending to grope her and have the photographer take a photo because he thought it would be funny. But that doesn't excuse it at all. Of course, it is also demeaning and sexually objectifying her.
  #20  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:11 AM
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For what it's worth, I don't think he actually groped her while she was sleeping. That's her flack vest she's wearing, and it doesn't seem like his fingers are actually touching it. It looks like he was pretending to grope her and have the photographer take a photo because he thought it would be funny. But that doesn't excuse it at all. Of course, it is also demeaning and sexually objectifying her.
And one article I read said he forcibly kissed her during a rehearsal for a skit. She objected, and she said he then started acting like a dick to her.
  #21  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:19 AM
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And one article I read said he forcibly kissed her during a rehearsal for a skit. She objected, and she said he then started acting like a dick to her.
That's in the article linked to in the OP.
  #22  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:25 AM
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That's in the article linked to in the OP.
Ah. I couldn't get to that site from my work machine, so I saw it on another news site.
  #23  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:14 AM
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Imagine what he did back in the early days of SNL while fueled on Cocaine?

The bigger question is how many Senators have sexual harassment in the past? I'm guessing it is a disgusting number. Have you seen the protections they put in place for themselves from Federal workers complaining? It is a complicated procedure that takes 90 days minimum and must be completed within 180 days. I would like to find a link to this procedure; I would laugh about how silly it sounds if it wasn't so deadly serious. I heard about it just last night on the Opposition with Jordan Klepper.
  #24  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:16 AM
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WTF, Al!

I thought you were one of the good ones...
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  #25  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:39 AM
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Statement from Franken to Business Insider
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In a statement sent to Business Insider, Franken apologized to Tweeden.

"I certainly don't remember the rehearsal for the skit in the same way, but I send my sincerest apologies to Leeann. As to the photo, it was clearly intended to be funny but wasn't. I shouldn't have done it," he said.
  #26  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:47 AM
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What the hell, man? I'm starting to worry that when this is all over, the Capitol will be empty except for one guy with a floor polisher, and the only person left in Hollywood will be like, Kirk Cameron or some shit.
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:49 AM
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What the hell, man? I'm starting to worry that when this is all over, the Capitol will be empty except for one guy with a floor polisher, and the only person left in Hollywood will be like, Kirk Cameron or some shit.
From where I'm at, that sounds like a delightful vision for the future.
  #28  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:50 AM
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What the hell, man? I'm starting to worry that when this is all over, the Capitol will be empty except for one guy with a floor polisher, ...
You say the first part like that would be a bad outcome. I would not be upset if we had a complete reset on Congress & the Senate (and President for that matter). Beside, the odds are fairly good most of the few Women Congressman & Senators would be there with the one guy with a floor polisher.
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Old 11-16-2017, 11:07 AM
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What the hell, man? I'm starting to worry that when this is all over, the Capitol will be empty except for one guy with a floor polisher, and the only person left in Hollywood will be like, Kirk Cameron or some shit.
I really don't understand the use of the word 'worry' here. Not that it's going to happen, but clearing out Washington would be such a beautiful thing to witness.
  #30  
Old 11-16-2017, 11:17 AM
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... and the only person left in Hollywood will be like, Kirk Cameron or some shit.
No way that dude gets out of this clean!
  #31  
Old 11-17-2017, 08:12 AM
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What the hell, man? I'm starting to worry that when this is all over, the Capitol will be empty except for one guy with a floor polisher, and the only person left in Hollywood will be like, Kirk Cameron or some shit.
And the world will be a better place.

But seriously, we've got to find something to take down Kirk Cameron too.

Maybe something with a floor polisher?

Last edited by Two Many Cats; 11-17-2017 at 08:13 AM.
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Old 11-17-2017, 08:28 AM
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But seriously, we've got to find something to take down Kirk Cameron too.
He's got a real thing for bananas, soó I'm sure the photos are out there, somewhere.
  #33  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:45 AM
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Well, this is awkward, isn't it Al?

Last edited by HurricaneDitka; 11-16-2017 at 10:45 AM.
  #34  
Old 11-16-2017, 10:49 AM
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While I've been thinking Franken would be a solid choice for 2020, I'm not surprised he's not a boy scout. I'm sure this isn't the only time he's done something lewd over the past 40-odd years. Or done coke. Or done any number of questionable things. Better it comes out now instead of after he wins the nomination. Although, even that wasn't a campaign-ender for Trump. But this may end up rightfully costing him his political career.

Not saying what he did was right, groping and shoving one's tongue into another person's mouth is wrong no matter who does it, but interesting this is coming from a Hannity regular at this exact moment. Also interesting how our board's known conservatives have suddenly taken such a strong interest in sexual harassment, but only in this thread. Strange, that.

Last edited by Happy Lendervedder; 11-16-2017 at 10:50 AM.
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Old 11-16-2017, 11:05 AM
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I'm sure this isn't the only time he's done something lewd over the past 40-odd years.
Don't downplay it. He didn't just do 'something lewd' like tell a dirty joke or engage in naught consensual activities, he forced his tongue into an unwilling person's mouth, harassed her for resisting him, and then used her body to take a sexual picture while she was sleeping with clear malicious intent.

Quote:
Not saying what he did was right, groping and shoving one's tongue into another person's mouth is wrong no matter who does it, but interesting this is coming from a Hannity regular at this exact moment.
This is exactly like saying "I'm not racist, but...". And when you shove the 'not saying' butt or the 'not racist' butt into your statement, it nullifies the 'not'. And it's REALLY not that "interesting" that sexual assault victims are coming forward in the wake of the recent revelations and the current environment of actually caring about sexual assaults.

Quote:
Also interesting how our board's known conservatives have suddenly taken such a strong interest in sexual harassment, but only in this thread. Strange, that.
If you're going that route, it's also interesting how this board's known liberals have suddenly taken such a strong interest in victim blaming and dismissing allegations, but only in this thread.
  #36  
Old 11-16-2017, 11:08 AM
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Don't downplay it. He didn't just do 'something lewd' like tell a dirty joke or engage in naught consensual activities, he forced his tongue into an unwilling person's mouth, harassed her for resisting him, and then used her body to take a sexual picture while she was sleeping with clear malicious intent.
What was the malicious intent?
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If you're going that route, it's also interesting how this board's known liberals have suddenly taken such a strong interest in victim blaming and dismissing allegations, but only in this thread.
Who has done that in this thread?

Last edited by Snowboarder Bo; 11-16-2017 at 11:08 AM.
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Old 11-16-2017, 11:16 AM
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What was the malicious intent?
At a minimum, ridicule and humiliation. And that's if there was no actual touching.
  #38  
Old 11-16-2017, 11:20 AM
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At a minimum, ridicule and humiliation. And that's if there was no actual touching.
Are we to be similarly outraged by millions of photos taken by college students, like these?

ETA: Is this an "always wrong" thing? It's never funny? It's always unacceptable?

Last edited by Snowboarder Bo; 11-16-2017 at 11:22 AM.
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Old 11-16-2017, 01:00 PM
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What was the malicious intent?
Well, if you read the article, it's obvious:
Quote:
Other than our dialogue on stage, I never had a voluntary conversation with Al Franken again. I avoided him as much as possible and made sure I was never alone with him again for the rest of the tour.

Franken repaid me with petty insults, including drawing devil horns on at least one of the headshots I was autographing for the troops.

But he didn’t stop there.

I couldn’t believe it. He groped me, without my consent, while I was asleep.

I felt violated all over again. Embarrassed. Belittled. Humiliated.

How dare anyone grab my breasts like this and think it’s funny?
Quote:
You forcibly kissed me without my consent, grabbed my breasts while I was sleeping and had someone take a photo of you doing it, knowing I would see it later, and be ashamed.
But maybe she's overreacting, or hyping this up for the benefit of conservatives? Well, let me set a ground rule: I don't think that's it's a stretch to say that a person doing something that "isn't funny" is "completely inappropriate", that is "obvious" that the victim and "millions of other women would feel violated by it" is pretty obviously acting with malicious intent. With that in mind, what does Al Franken say about the picture?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Franken
For instance, that picture. I don't know what was in my head when I took that picture, and it doesn't matter. There's no excuse. I look at it now and I feel disgusted with myself. It isn't funny. It's completely inappropriate. It's obvious how Leeann would feel violated by that picture. And, what's more, I can see how millions of other women would feel violated by it—women who have had similar experiences in their own lives, women who fear having those experiences, women who look up to me, women who have counted on me.
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Who has done that in this thread?
For one, the person denying the obvious malicious intent involved when a man who had been harassing a woman after being rebuffed by her took "completely inappropriate" pictures of her that it's obvious to him that she would feel violated by.

Last edited by Pantastic; 11-16-2017 at 01:01 PM.
  #40  
Old 11-16-2017, 05:27 PM
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Well, if you read the article, it's obvious:
I keep missing the part where Mr. Franken states his intentions. Could you highlight that part?
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But maybe she's overreacting, or hyping this up for the benefit of conservatives? Well, let me set a ground rule: I don't think that's it's a stretch to say that a person doing something that "isn't funny" is "completely inappropriate", that is "obvious" that the victim and "millions of other women would feel violated by it" is pretty obviously acting with malicious intent. With that in mind, what does Al Franken say about the picture?
Thanks; I hadn't seen that before.
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For one, the person denying the obvious malicious intent involved when a man who had been harassing a woman after being rebuffed by her took "completely inappropriate" pictures of her that it's obvious to him that she would feel violated by.
Who is that?
  #41  
Old 11-16-2017, 11:15 AM
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Don't downplay it. He didn't just do 'something lewd' like tell a dirty joke or engage in naught consensual activities, he forced his tongue into an unwilling person's mouth, harassed her for resisting him, and then used her body to take a sexual picture while she was sleeping with clear malicious intent.



This is exactly like saying "I'm not racist, but...". And when you shove the 'not saying' butt or the 'not racist' butt into your statement, it nullifies the 'not'. And it's REALLY not that "interesting" that sexual assault victims are coming forward in the wake of the recent revelations and the current environment of actually caring about sexual assaults.



If you're going that route, it's also interesting how this board's known liberals have suddenly taken such a strong interest in victim blaming and dismissing allegations, but only in this thread.
Seriously, who's victim blaming in this thread? Who's dismissing allegations? I'm not victim blaming nor dismissing, but nice try; I'm saying this could end his career and rightfully so. I'm not downplaying it, I'm saying there's a good chance he is guilty as charged, and probably done other shit and possibly worse. And I say this as someone who really, really wanted Al Franken to run for president. Not anymore.

But there's almost a glee from conservatives in pointing out a Democratic Senator's harassing behavior which doesn't exist in other threads on Roy Moore. Or Bill O'Reilly. Or that old guy who ran Fox News.

Last edited by Happy Lendervedder; 11-16-2017 at 11:18 AM.
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Old 11-16-2017, 11:22 AM
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But there's almost a glee from conservatives in pointing out a Democratic Senator's harassing behavior which doesn't exist in other threads on Roy Moore.
I disagree with this.

But beyond that, the situation is very different. As someone noted above, the Franken seat will be Democratic in any event. So it's just a matter of one guy paying a personal price for his own actions. In the case of Moore - in a close race in a close Senate - it's about the national balance of power potentially changing due to the actions of one bozo 35-40 years ago.
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At a minimum, ridicule and humiliation.
I don't see that. He probably just thought it was funny.

Not to say she's wrong to be offended. But I don't see any reason to assume that was his intention. More like "look at me, Bad Boy that I am ..."
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Old 11-16-2017, 11:38 AM
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I don't see that. He probably just thought it was funny.

Not to say she's wrong to be offended. But I don't see any reason to assume that was his intention. More like "look at me, Bad Boy that I am ..."
You didn't read your own link, then?
Quote:
Other than our dialogue on stage, I never had a voluntary conversation with Al Franken again. I avoided him as much as possible and made sure I was never alone with him again for the rest of the tour.

Franken repaid me with petty insults, including drawing devil horns on at least one of the headshots I was autographing for the troops.
And the pic followed that.

Sure, he was being a funny bad boy, but he was doing so in an abusive, punching-down sort of way, aimed at this one woman. Assuming her overall story is true, there's every reason to believe this photo was part of that.
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:52 AM
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He wasn't a senator when it happened, just saying. Can the Senate kick him to the curb? This crap has got to stop. Will men ever learn? It is possibly gonna take years to clean this mess up. I hope they are running scared on capital hill.
I would like to call out all women who have been sexually assaulted by these creeps to stand up and scream it out! I have NO more tolerance for this left in me.
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:53 AM
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Going after Bill again, too.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...cid=spartanntp

Why is this thread in Elections?
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:58 AM
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The women on capital hill should start filing harassment lawsuits.
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Old 11-16-2017, 11:00 AM
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Until 15 minutes ago, pretty much my favorite Senator.

What a pathetic apology. Fuck him. Sure, there's a non-zero chance this is all manufactured, but there's also a non-zero chance Franken is a lizard person. Fuck all harassers and assaulters; every last one of them. If he's a tenth of the person I thought he was 15 minutes ago, he'll give a much better apology and then resign.

Fuck 'em all. Let the hammer fall where it may. Hopefully liberal and progressive office-holders won't let me down, and will refrain from defending Franken or justifying his behavior or attacking his accuser.
  #48  
Old 11-16-2017, 12:44 PM
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Until 15 minutes ago, pretty much my favorite Senator.

What a pathetic apology. Fuck him. Sure, there's a non-zero chance this is all manufactured, but there's also a non-zero chance Franken is a lizard person. Fuck all harassers and assaulters; every last one of them. If he's a tenth of the person I thought he was 15 minutes ago, he'll give a much better apology and then resign.

Fuck 'em all. Let the hammer fall where it may. Hopefully liberal and progressive office-holders won't let me down, and will refrain from defending Franken or justifying his behavior or attacking his accuser.
I agree, let the hammer fall where it may. Regardless of political or societal position. Because these sort of harassment and abuses are not about sex, they are about power. Men in power abusing their position over women. Al is clearly objectifying and exerting his opportunity over a sleeping woman. Making it a "joke' is no excuse. Does anyone really find the picture funny?

A line needs to firmly be drawn where this sort of thing is clearly unacceptable. If it destroys some otherwise good men so what. Let them fall.

There are lies, rumors, allegations, all that can be flavored through our own personal prism. And then there are pictures. The picture cannot be hand waved away. And to dismiss the woman as acting for political purposes demeans all the women who report these incidents or fail to because they will not be believed.

Al Franken's political future will not, and should not survive this. He has about 10 days, maybe less.
  #49  
Old 11-16-2017, 06:34 PM
Brown Eyed Girl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iiandyiiii View Post
Until 15 minutes ago, pretty much my favorite Senator.

What a pathetic apology. Fuck him. Sure, there's a non-zero chance this is all manufactured, but there's also a non-zero chance Franken is a lizard person. Fuck all harassers and assaulters; every last one of them. If he's a tenth of the person I thought he was 15 minutes ago, he'll give a much better apology and then resign.
Hypothetically, since you've already alluded to a non-zero chance that this is all manufactured, what you expect to hear from a man you think highly of when he is wrongfully accused of this kind of behavior? If he's a tenth of the person you thought AND he's innocent of the accusation, what should he do?

This is not saying he is innocent or that she is lying (although I don't think the picture is evidence of groping), but I'm curious as to what a reasonable response from an innocent man looks like to those decrying the 'non-apologies.'

Seems despite an absence of evidence of wrong-doing or even an investigation or trial to determine guilt, we are all expected to assume the worst for the sole reason that if it's true, it is truly objectionable. And anyone accused should lose their jobs. Period.

This is hard stuff. I feel for anyone who is molested, assaulted or made to feel uncomfortable by a person in a position of power, but it seems the power has now shifted and that is also worrisome to me, too.

Last edited by Brown Eyed Girl; 11-16-2017 at 06:34 PM.
  #50  
Old 11-16-2017, 11:04 AM
AK84 is offline
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I take it the Alabama Senate hopeful is probably dancing for joy right about now?
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