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  #201  
Old 09-07-2019, 11:13 AM
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Why is some caution in order? It's not as if we can't see it happening before our eyes. It's not as if he hasn't been acting like a four year old all along.
Exactly! We've all seen and heard it for ourselves. We see it every single day, several times a day.

This is why I object to people who say you can't diagnose thump's mental/psychological condition from afar. He doesn't hide anything about himself. It's all right there in the open, on Twitter, in his public statements. All of us know more about what goes on in thump's head than we likely do about the friends/family we see all the time. Why? Because most normal people occasionally hold back from time to time. They don't say everything they're thinking without, well, thinking about it first. They don't express every emotion, hurt feeling, dumbass unfounded opinion just as soon as it pops into their heads. Thump is a living, breathing example of free association. He just urps it ALL out for the world to see, hear, and comment on-- and he does it all day, every day.

When normal people visit their therapist, psychologist, or doctor, sometimes it takes the client a while to open up. They try to be the "good patient/client" and conceal their deepest and darkest thoughts until they come to trust the practitioner. THAT'S the basis of "don't diagnose until you meet the person." Because you don't know all there is to know about the person.

But that rule doesn't apply to the president-- he just lets it all hang out. He hasn't hidden his real self-- EVER! He has always been like this, except that recently his mental function is clearly deteriorating. Those of us who have watched a parent sink into dementia over a period of years can see it. As can any and every mental health professional. This isn't rocket surgery, peeps! The man is mentally, emotionally, psychologically unbalanced. (And yes, I do have an MA in psychology-- not that anyone needs one to see what he is.)
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  #202  
Old 09-07-2019, 11:32 AM
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I agree ThelmaLou. I've dealt with family members sinking into Alzheimer's as they hit their 70s, and that's exactly what Trump's been reminding me of, ever since the Washington Post published the transcript of their meeting with candidate Trump back in 2015. The unconnected word salad was strikingly similar to some conversations I've had with relatives with Alzheimer's.
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  #203  
Old 09-07-2019, 12:15 PM
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Why is some caution in order? It's not as if we can't see it happening before our eyes. It's not as if he hasn't been acting like a four year old all along.
I just meant caution about the reporting on internal WH discussions. Clearly Trump is dangerously unstable. The story was only notable to me for its insider quotes. Other newspapers have published similar stories, so it's likely pretty accurate. But hell, I dunno.
  #204  
Old 09-07-2019, 12:21 PM
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I just meant caution about the reporting on internal WH discussions. Clearly Trump is dangerously unstable. The story was only notable to me for its insider quotes. Other newspapers have published similar stories, so it's likely pretty accurate. But hell, I dunno.
Even so... why caution? What do you see as the potential danger/problem here? (Serious question.)
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  #205  
Old 09-07-2019, 12:34 PM
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Yes, it's not like ther's reason to believe Pence and McConnell are secretly working to undermine Trump by a whispering campaign.

Their basic quality as the President's lapdog (Pence) and apologist (McConnell) seem well-established.
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  #206  
Old 09-07-2019, 01:25 PM
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Clearly Trump is dangerously unstable.
For the record, I have heard he is actually "very stable", in addition to being a "genius."

How does that grab ya?
  #207  
Old 09-07-2019, 01:28 PM
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Yes, it's not like ther's reason to believe Pence and McConnell are secretly working to undermine Trump by a whispering campaign.

Their basic quality as the President's lapdog (Pence) and apologist (McConnell) seem well-established.
Pence is certainly a lap dog. No question.

But McConnell an apologist? He's not defending Trumps fuck ups from what I can see. All of the republicans in the Senate are his lap dogs however. Not quite sure in what way McConnell is broken as a human being, power trip I guess, and perhaps a few more million in the bank.
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  #208  
Old 09-07-2019, 01:53 PM
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Well, he says he won't bring a matter to a vote in the Senate unless he's sure Trump will support it.
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  #209  
Old 09-07-2019, 03:08 PM
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Trump's psychotic episode is going to involve the entire government, potentially. He's got NOAA to throw the Birmingham National Weather Service under the bus, in an attempt to "prove" that Trump's 100%-wrong Sunday remarks were actually correct (they weren't) :
...
"Former National Hurricane Center Director Bill Read blasted NOAA leadership Friday night on his Facebook page calling the situation "so disappointing" and saying he would comment because NOAA employees were ordered to be quiet.




"Either NOAA Leadership truly agrees with what they posted or they were ordered to do it. If it is the former, the statement shows a lack of understanding of how to use probabilistic forecasts in conjunction with other forecast information. Embarrassing. If it is the latter, the statement shows a lack of courage on their part by not supporting the people in the field who are actually doing the work. Heartbreaking," Read wrote.


"What the Birmingham NWS office sent out Sunday morning was correct and served the public well," Read continued. "It clearly let the public know that they were not at risk from the impacts of Hurricane Dorian."


Dan Sobien, president of the union representing weather service employees, tweeted Friday, "Let me assure you the hard working employees of the NWS had nothing to do with the utterly disgusting and disingenuous tweet sent out by NOAA management tonight."



https://www.chicagotribune.com/natio...nfy-story.html

The headline from Chicago's quite conservative Chicago Tribune:
Federal weather agency ó in unnamed Friday statement ó reverses course and backs Trumpís Alabama hurricane claim; union blasts it as Ďutterly disgusting and disingenuousí


  #210  
Old 09-07-2019, 05:00 PM
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Why is some caution in order? It's not as if we can't see it happening before our eyes. It's not as if he hasn't been acting like a four year old all along.
As I commented in one of the Pit threads, Trump is clearly deteriorating because he used to be described as an 8-year-old.
  #211  
Old 09-07-2019, 06:29 PM
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... Dan Sobien, president of the union representing weather service employees, tweeted Friday, "Let me assure you the hard working employees of the NWS had nothing to do with the utterly disgusting and disingenuous tweet sent out by NOAA management tonight."
There are Twitter reports that the author of the NOAA letter making excuses for Trump is their Director of Communications--which does seem plausible. The interesting part is that she, apparently, worked for the Trump Inauguration---you can see it in the LinkedIn page, not quite half-way down:

Quote:
Deputy Director International and Diplomatic Corps
58th Presidential Inaugural Committee (PIC)
Dec 2016 Ė Jan 20172 months
Washington D.C. Metro Area
She got the NOAA Director of Communications gig seven months later.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/julie-roberts-cem-212a917
  #212  
Old 09-07-2019, 08:05 PM
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How does that grab ya?
If I had a pussy, it would be very unhappy.
  #213  
Old 09-07-2019, 08:13 PM
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There are Twitter reports that the author of the NOAA letter making excuses for Trump is their Director of Communications--which does seem plausible. The interesting part is that she, apparently, worked for the Trump Inauguration---you can see it in the LinkedIn page, not quite half-way down:







She got the NOAA Director of Communications gig seven months later.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/julie-roberts-cem-212a917
She has OVER 15 YEARS of professional experience!
  #214  
Old 09-07-2019, 08:26 PM
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Even so... why caution? What do you see as the potential danger/problem here? (Serious question.)
The danger of accepting thinly sourced reports and later finding out they were not as reliable or as close to the events as it seemed, then looking like a boob.

Listen, I hate Trump. He's an idiot, a racist, and a threat to the world. He may also have dementia. But I always take anonymous reports from inside the White House with a bit of caution, no matter who the President is.
  #215  
Old 09-07-2019, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Defensive Indifference View Post
The danger of accepting thinly sourced reports and later finding out they were not as reliable or as close to the events as it seemed, then looking like a boob.

Listen, I hate Trump. He's an idiot, a racist, and a threat to the world. He may also have dementia. But I always take anonymous reports from inside the White House with a bit of caution, no matter who the President is.
Ok, I get your point. I think. In this case we can be skeptical that WH staffers are saying he's crazy, even though we know he IS crazy, 'cause we've seen it for ourselves. I dunno. Maybe.
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  #216  
Old 09-08-2019, 08:14 AM
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She has OVER 15 YEARS of professional experience!
Doing what? Oh, a Trump appointee. Never mind.
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  #217  
Old 09-08-2019, 02:17 PM
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There are books by respected psychiatrists who diagnose Trump, so I donít presume to add to these. These opinions are well known, and at a minimum reflect certain personality disorders.

But it isnít obvious to me that Trump has dementia. The man speaks so much, for hours at a time, that it isnít hard to find incongruities. He is a troll with some talent for seeing opportunities and weak spots others might not see or be too principled to take. I donít find Trump well informed, lacking in hypocrisy or singularly capable. His views and basic personality have been fairly consistent for decades. Passing a mini-mental exam is a very low bar, but I donít see Trump getting lost on a golf course or forgetting where he put the bucket of chicken.
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  #218  
Old 09-08-2019, 02:32 PM
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There are books by respected psychiatrists who diagnose Trump, so I donít presume to add to these. These opinions are well known, and at a minimum reflect certain personality disorders.

But it isnít obvious to me that Trump has dementia. The man speaks so much, for hours at a time, that it isnít hard to find incongruities. He is a troll with some talent for seeing opportunities and weak spots others might not see or be too principled to take. I donít find Trump well informed, lacking in hypocrisy or singularly capable. His views and basic personality have been fairly consistent for decades. Passing a mini-mental exam is a very low bar, but I donít see Trump getting lost on a golf course or forgetting where he put the bucket of chicken.
I'd like to see him try to put together a puzzle made for 10 year olds. But then, I'm kinda a busy guy, I don't have all day.
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  #219  
Old 09-08-2019, 03:19 PM
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That might depend on the puzzle picture. It is easier to put together a hamburger than a space force.

But to pass the mini-mental dementia test, you need advanced skills: knowing the date, season, your location and what a watch looks like. You also need to be able to remember three items for five minutes, follow simple commands, make a drawing of a weather probability cone and count and spell backwards, which is easier for some people than others.
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  #220  
Old 09-08-2019, 03:22 PM
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Iím not the biggest fan of Internet memes, but there is an article on boredpanda.com about 30 memes inspired by Trumpís sharpie drawing which is extremely amusing.
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  #221  
Old 09-09-2019, 05:57 AM
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Iím not the biggest fan of Internet memes, but there is an article on boredpanda.com about 30 memes inspired by Trumpís sharpie drawing which is extremely amusing.
If this crazy social experiment we call the Internet catches on and more people become aware of it, maybe someday we'll come up with a means for directly connecting, or "linking" if you will, to information we want to share with others.
  #222  
Old 09-09-2019, 06:36 AM
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I looked through the site and found it. They are amusing:
https://www.boredpanda.com/trump-sha...ane-map-memes/
  #223  
Old 09-09-2019, 07:08 AM
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Thanks!
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Old 09-09-2019, 07:34 AM
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Well, our president appeared with a weather map that was obviously and crudely altered with a line drawn by a Sharpie in order to "prove" his assertion that Alabama was in serious danger from Dorian. He seemed to genuinely believe his own delusion, which is what concerns me the most.

Not long after he was elected, and in a discussion on this board pertaining to his constant and obvious lies, I pointed out that there is, in fact, a condition where a person lies and actually believes the lies even if they are obviously lies to any observer. Our school councilors have cases like that. "Johnny" slaps "Billy" in the face right in front of an adult, but will adamantly deny doing so and many times ending up in tears because of the "unjust accusation" of the adult. As Trump has aged and his mental abilities have diminished, he has shown signs of slipping farther and farther into his delusions and lies. This could at some point become very dangerous because of the power he can bring swiftly to bear without the approval of Congress.
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  #225  
Old 09-09-2019, 07:45 AM
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This bit with the summit meeting with the Taliban shows some sort of disorder, I'm not sure what to call it. Messiah complex? He seems to think that with zero preparation, he can come into a meeting and singlehandedly solve complex disputes by the sheer power of his superior intellect and personality. Maybe it's delusions of grandeur. Whatever it is, hostile nations have it figured out and know how to play him like a fiddle. Or maybe in his case, a double bass.
  #226  
Old 09-09-2019, 07:52 AM
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I'm not sure what to call it. Messiah complex? He seems to think that with zero preparation, he can come into a meeting and singlehandedly solve complex disputes by the sheer power of his superior intellect and personality.
Well, he looked up at the heavens and somberly announced, "I am the chosen one." So, yeah, "Messiah Complex" might be a good description.
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  #227  
Old 09-09-2019, 08:07 AM
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This bit with the summit meeting with the Taliban shows some sort of disorder, I'm not sure what to call it. Messiah complex? He seems to think that with zero preparation, he can come into a meeting and singlehandedly solve complex disputes by the sheer power of his superior intellect and personality. Maybe it's delusions of grandeur. Whatever it is, hostile nations have it figured out and know how to play him like a fiddle. Or maybe in his case, a double bass.
Agreed. That's always been his thing. ISTR in the election cycle, he talked about how he didn't like to have scheduled meetings or even carry a briefcase. He just liked to "see what develops during the day" (paraphrasing from memory). So, yeah, he just figures he can wing it because he's so damned smart.

Remember when Republicans complained that Obama was "arrogant". I'm beginning to think that might have been a code for something else.
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Old 09-09-2019, 09:02 AM
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In The Atlantic online today.

Trump Is Not Well
Accepting the reality about the presidentís disordered personality is importantóeven essential.
Quote:
...ďHeís deteriorating in plain sight,Ē one Republican strategist who is in frequent contact with the White House told Business Insider on Friday. Asked why the president was obsessed with Alabama instead of the states that would actually be affected by the storm, the strategist said, ďYou should ask a psychiatrist about that; Iím not sure Iím qualified to comment.Ē

We have repeatedly heard versions of that sentiment over the course of Trumpís presidency. Itís said that speculating on Trumpís mental health is inappropriate and unwise, especially for those who are not formally trained in the field of psychiatry or psychology.

Thatís true, up to a point. Yes, it is best to leave it to experts to determine whether Trump satisfies the criteria for a clinical diagnosis of antisocial personality disorder, narcissistic personality disorder, some combination of both, or nothing at all.

But if a clinical diagnosis is beyond my own expertise, Trumpís psychological impairments are obvious to all who are not willfully blind. On a daily basis we see the presidentís chaotic, unstable mind on display. Are we supposed to ignore that?

An analogy may be helpful here. If smoke is coming out from under the hood of your car, if you notice puddles of oil under it, if the engine is overheating and you smell burning oil, you donít have to be a car mechanic to know that something is wrong with your car.

...

Even now, almost a thousand days into his presidency, the latest Trump outrage elicits shock and disbelief in people. The reaction is, ďCan you believe he said that and did this?Ē

To which my response is, ďWhy are you surprised?Ē Itís a shock only if the assumption is that weíre dealing with a psychologically normal human being. Weíre not. Trump is profoundly compromised, acting just as you would imagine a person with a disordered personality would. Many Americans havenít yet come to terms with the fact that we elected as president a man who is deeply damaged, an emotional misfit. But it would be helpful if they did.

... Seeing him for what he isóa terribly damaged soul, a broken man, a person with a disordered mindóshould not lessen our revulsion at how Trump mistreats others, at his cruelty and dehumanizing actions. Nor should it weaken our resolve to stand up to it. It does complicate the picture just a bit, though, eliciting some pity and sorrow for Trump.

But above all, accepting the truth about Trumpís mental state will cause us to take more seriously than we have our democratic duty, which is to prevent a psychologically and morally unfit person from becoming president.

The office is too powerful, and the consequences are too dangerous, to allow a person to become president who views morality only through the prism of whether an action advances his own narrow interests, his own distorted desires, his own twisted impulses.
....
This is from a very long article. Here's the punch line:
Quote:
...Whether or not his disorders are diagnosable, the presidentís psychological flaws are all too apparent. They were alarming when he took the oath of office; they are worse now. Every day Donald Trump is president is a day of disgrace. And a day of danger.
My bold.

We don't need a name (Latin or otherwise) for his condition and a paper signed by a doctor to see with our own millions and millions of eyes that he is not fit to hold the office (or to hold a Sharpie, for that matter).
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  #229  
Old 09-09-2019, 10:23 AM
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Agreed. That's always been his thing. ISTR in the election cycle, he talked about how he didn't like to have scheduled meetings or even carry a briefcase. He just liked to "see what develops during the day" (paraphrasing from memory). So, yeah, he just figures he can wing it because he's so damned smart.

Remember when Republicans complained that Obama was "arrogant". I'm beginning to think that might have been a code for something else.
"Uppity" is so 19th-century.
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Old 09-10-2019, 12:48 PM
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Last weekend I was on a tour boat, and one of the other passengers was shitfaced. She was rambling and semi-coherent, and every time one of the crew tried to mitigate her behavior she lashed out, accusing them of persecuting her and threatening legal action.

Here's the punchline: her exasperated husband was wearing a Trump t-shirt. Suppose it occurred to him that the President he supports acts like his drunk wife 24/7?
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Old 09-28-2019, 10:31 AM
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The President is in the news of late. Since I avoid video I rarely see him. My goodness he looks unhealthy. I would not be surprised if he is unable to run in 2020.
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Old 09-28-2019, 10:37 AM
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The President is in the news of late. Since I avoid video I rarely see him. My goodness he looks unhealthy. I would not be surprised if he is unable to run in 2020.
He will run if some one has to hold him up.
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