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  #251  
Old 07-18-2019, 09:00 AM
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The Dems need to let this whole flap DIE. Thump is loving it-- pouring gasoline on a fire is his specialty. He relishes a fight. The more they fight back and defend, the better he likes it. He has said this and demonstrated it over and over. But they won't be able to resist the bait and they will likely continue to play right into his tiny hands.
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  #252  
Old 07-18-2019, 09:07 AM
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The U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) is a federal agency that administers and enforces civil rights laws against workplace discrimination.

From their website:
You forget: IOKIARDI.

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  #253  
Old 07-18-2019, 09:10 AM
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The Dems need to let this whole flap DIE. Thump is loving it-- pouring gasoline on a fire is his specialty. He relishes a fight. The more they fight back and defend, the better he likes it. He has said this and demonstrated it over and over. But they won't be able to resist the bait and they will likely continue to play right into his tiny hands.
This is what I have been saying. Just disengage.
  #254  
Old 07-18-2019, 09:36 AM
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Remember when Clinton called his supporters deplorable? Seems like she undersold it.
Actually, she said half of his supporters were deplorable. It seems that the reality is that the deplorable ones are an embarrassment to the other 1%.
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  #255  
Old 07-18-2019, 09:56 AM
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Originally Posted by ThelmaLou View Post
The Dems need to let this whole flap DIE. Thump is loving it-- pouring gasoline on a fire is his specialty. He relishes a fight. The more they fight back and defend, the better he likes it. He has said this and demonstrated it over and over. But they won't be able to resist the bait and they will likely continue to play right into his tiny hands.
I'm afraid it's probably already too late ("Send her back!"). But even if it never happened you can be sure that Trump & Friends would find another way - lotsa ways - to paint the face of the Democratic Party as anti-American, un-American, and wanting to 'take away everything you and your forebearers fought for'. A face that like that of Willie Horton.

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  #256  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:10 AM
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The Dems need to let this whole flap DIE. Thump is loving it-- pouring gasoline on a fire is his specialty. He relishes a fight. The more they fight back and defend, the better he likes it. He has said this and demonstrated it over and over. But they won't be able to resist the bait and they will likely continue to play right into his tiny hands.
Who are you, John McEnroe? Because you cannot be serious!

But, er, seriously? Are you also against impeachment? The words were so vile, and the chants so horrific, that to disengage and let this die would be the single most effective thing the Democrats could do right now to demonstrate their utter and complete lack of backbone, their utter cowardice, and their total refusal to do what's right. I was happy to see the House resolution, and that is a step in the right direction. They must do more.

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  #257  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:12 AM
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The Dems need to go back to issues like wealth inequality, corruption, medicare, the looming loss of insurance coverage for millions thanks to a right wing activism. Not saying abandon social justice - keep fighting that fight. Just don't forget about the issues that will be crucial to building a coalition, and by coalition, I mean getting somewhere north of 50 percent of the electorate. Ideally 55% but given recent electoral history, 50% or better would be an achievement.
  #258  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:27 AM
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Who are you, John McEnroe? Because you cannot be serious!

But, er, seriously? Are you also against impeachment? The words were so vile, and the chants so horrific, that to disengage and let this die would be the single most effective thing the Democrats could do right now to demonstrate their utter and complete lack of backbone, their utter cowardice, and their total refusal to do what's right. I was happy to see the House resolution, and that is a step in the right direction. They must do more.
"Do more"? Right. Yeah, the House resolution that was tabled? By continuing to engage with him on this topic, they are keeping it in the headlines. As vile as the insults were/are, they are not substantive. Cowardice and lack of backbone don't have anything to do with it. The Democrats need to be EFFECTIVE when they strike back.

This is how to be effective:
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The Dems need to go back to issues like wealth inequality, corruption, medicare, the looming loss of insurance coverage for millions thanks to a right wing activism. Not saying abandon social justice - keep fighting that fight. Just don't forget about the issues that will be crucial to building a coalition, and by coalition, I mean getting somewhere north of 50 percent of the electorate. Ideally 55% but given recent electoral history, 50% or better would be an achievement.
Don't be baited by thump's hateful tactics. Don't be pulled off topic. Stick with issues.
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  #259  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:32 AM
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And stop letting Trump get away with statements like "We're going to making an announcement about that soon. In the next few weeks. You'll see very important things we're working on, things that are in line with what we're doing all over government. Because I know this is a big issue; it's very important and we're going to solve it; there'll be an announcement soon. Very big things coming, very soon."

But I do agree with that this is how the Democrats are perceived, and it's because of their own inactions:
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the Democrats could do right now to demonstrate their utter and complete lack of backbone, their utter cowardice, and their total refusal to do what's right. I was happy to see the House resolution, and that is a step in the right direction. They must do more.
Democrats are weak, WEAK, weak. Not one Democratic politician had the nerve to say what Stephen Colbert said, for instance.
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Colbert’s bare-knuckled rebuke on the president’s comments followed a video clip of Trump attempting to justify his race-baiting screed.

“Oh shut up,” Colbert said at the end of that clip, conceding his mother wouldn’t approve of that brusque directive.

Riding a wave of thunderous applause, Colbert continued tearing into Trump before throwing his knockout punch.

"If someone is leaving this country it should be you,” Colbert said. "And if you’re looking for a new home, might I suggest you go to hell?”

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  #260  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:36 AM
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"Do more"? Right. Yeah, the House resolution that was tabled? By continuing to engage with him on this topic, they are keeping it in the headlines. As vile as the insults were/are, they are not substantive. Cowardice and lack of backbone don't have anything to do with it. The Democrats need to be EFFECTIVE when they strike back.

This is how to be effectiveon't be baited by thump's hateful tactics. Don't be pulled off topic. Stick with issues.
What's with the ?

Yes, more. Hence my use of the phrase "step in the right direction". Impeachment procedures, for starters. I don't understand this tendency of some on the left to choose not to fight back. And you don't really believe that presidential elections are won based on who can discuss the issues in depth the most, do you? Presidential elections are won based on emotions, not policy details.
  #261  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:43 AM
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McConnell thinks his leader is "on to something".

Wonder if he ever thinks of his future place in history?
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Old 07-18-2019, 10:44 AM
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As an example, assuming that every vote is going to be important (and they will be) what do you think the most effective way to get young voters/college students, to come out to the polls is? A detailed discussion on the best way to get to a public option, or a piss 'em off and get 'em protesting approach to rile up their young minds, get them angry, and thus encourage them to vote? And such tactics would hopefully influence more than just young voters to do the same.
  #263  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:47 AM
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As an example, assuming that every vote is going to be important (and they will be) what do you think the most effective way to get young voters/college students, to come out to the polls is? A detailed discussion on the best way to get to a public option, or a piss 'em off and get 'em protesting approach to rile up their young minds, get them angry, and thus encourage them to vote? And such tactics would hopefully influence more than just young voters to do the same.
Fight fire with fire, eh? <shrug> Yeah, that will work. No more grownups in the room at all. Good.

Carry on.
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  #264  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:48 AM
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When someone is standing in front you ready to punch you in the face, what do you do, ThelmaLou? They are swinging; the fists are moving towards your face. What do you do?

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  #265  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:51 AM
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The Dems need to let this whole flap DIE. Thump is loving it-- pouring gasoline on a fire is his specialty. He relishes a fight. The more they fight back and defend, the better he likes it. He has said this and demonstrated it over and over. But they won't be able to resist the bait and they will likely continue to play right into his tiny hands.
I have a fundamental disagreement with two of the things you've said here. To take the less upsetting: there is no evidence that this fight plays right into his hands. Contrary to the belief of some, Trump's poll numbers suffer when he goes down this path. They dipped after "shithole countries" and the dipped after Charlottesville. They also dipped after the Access Hollywood tapes as well, although that controversy was a little different. And most importantly, when he targeted the "migrant caravans" in the runup to the 2018 elections his party got creamed. He does best when he is NOT the subject of controversy and criticism. He rebounded from the Access Hollywood tapes when he (at the debate) and the media (thanks to the Comey letter) turned attention away from his behavior and squarely onto Clinton's emails.

Second- regardless of the strategic implications, the idea that people should stop fighting for and defending oppressed minorities is repellent to me. Oppressed minorities have faced more difficult obstacles and more intense hatred than what they currently face. They needed allies in those fights, and they need them in this one, period.
  #266  
Old 07-18-2019, 10:54 AM
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The Democrats need to be EFFECTIVE when they strike back.
Which is exactly why Pelosi is holding off the impeachment proceedings. She wants to be able to throw the whole fucking book at him!
  #267  
Old 07-18-2019, 11:09 AM
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Which is exactly why Pelosi is holding off the impeachment proceedings. She wants to be able to throw the whole fucking book at him!
No-she realizes that throwing the entire Encyclopedia Britannica at him at this point would be useless when the Republicans won't even rebuke him for being openly racist. She chickened out waiting for a safe "sure thing", and now she has nothing.
  #268  
Old 07-18-2019, 11:10 AM
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But I do agree with that this is how the Democrats are perceived, and it's because of their own inactions: ...

Democrats are weak, WEAK, weak. Not one Democratic politician had the nerve to say what Stephen Colbert said, for instance.
Great Colbert moment. Also, later, about how Lindsey Graham was spayed sometime after 2016.

(FWIW, I’m with Bo and not Thelma on this one — but I appreciate Thelma’s position).

Last edited by Bone; 07-18-2019 at 11:54 AM. Reason: broke up quote to remove unintended smiley
  #269  
Old 07-18-2019, 11:18 AM
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The Dems need to let this whole flap DIE. Thump is loving it-- pouring gasoline on a fire is his specialty. He relishes a fight. The more they fight back and defend, the better he likes it. He has said this and demonstrated it over and over. But they won't be able to resist the bait and they will likely continue to play right into his tiny hands.
No one has ever defeated fascism by backing away from fights.
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Old 07-18-2019, 11:19 AM
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Which is exactly why Pelosi is holding off the impeachment proceedings. She wants to be able to throw the whole fucking book at him!
The wheel grinds ever so slowly...

Right now, the Trump administration is denying every House effort at oversight. They are providing no witnesses, releasing no documents. The various committees are challenging this obstruction in court, winning, and then having to survive appeals - and this pattern will undoubtedly continue up to the Supreme Court.

If the House had empowered an impeachment investigation six months, a year ago, this would still be the same pattern; Trump's lawyers are actually arguing that Congress has no Constitutional authority to oversee the Executive. But here, the Administration would be denying documents and witnesses to the impeachment investigation. This lurching from court-to-court to force the Administration to comply would drag out the investigation (as is happening now), except this would make the impeachment investigation look helpless and incompetent.

I can see a strategy where the relevant committees hash out all of this legal wrangling prior to the impeachment investigation. Get the courts to rule that yes, the relevant committees do have oversight authority and the subpoenas have to be obeyed, thus, when the impeachment investigation starts, there will no longer be any question that the subpoenas have to be complied with. People get bored and impatient waiting for the legalities to be settled. Getting the courts to rule that Congressional oversight requires Executive compliance would go a long way to help "grease the skids" of an impeachment inquiry.
  #271  
Old 07-18-2019, 11:30 AM
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McConnell thinks his leader is "on to something".

Wonder if he ever thinks of his future place in history?
From here:
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Originally Posted by Christopher Browning
If the US has someone whom historians will look back on as the gravedigger of American democracy, it is Mitch McConnell
  #272  
Old 07-18-2019, 11:43 AM
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When someone is standing in front you ready to punch you in the face, what do you do, ThelmaLou? They are swinging; the fists are moving towards your face. What do you do?
Shoot the hostage.

Oh, wait, wrong movie. Never mind.

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Old 07-18-2019, 11:55 AM
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Shoot the hostage.



Oh, wait, wrong movie. Never mind.


^^^^
  #274  
Old 07-18-2019, 12:09 PM
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And stop letting Trump get away with statements like "We're going to making an announcement about that soon. In the next few weeks. You'll see very important things we're working on, things that are in line with what we're doing all over government. Because I know this is a big issue; it's very important and we're going to solve it; there'll be an announcement soon. Very big things coming, very soon."

But I do agree with that this is how the Democrats are perceived, and it's because of their own inactionsemocrats are weak, WEAK, weak. Not one Democratic politician had the nerve to say what Stephen Colbert said, for instance.
Oh, that's fantastic! Good for Stephen Colbert!
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Old 07-18-2019, 12:13 PM
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“He can stay. He can go. He can be impeached, or voted out in 2020. But removing him will not remove the infrastructure of an entire party that supported him; the dark money that funded him; the online radicalization that drummed his army; nor the racism he amplified and reanimated.”

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
  #276  
Old 07-18-2019, 12:16 PM
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No-she realizes that throwing the entire Encyclopedia Britannica at him at this point would be useless when the Republicans won't even rebuke him for being openly racist. She chickened out waiting for a safe "sure thing", and now she has nothing.
All those investigations have been called off?
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Old 07-18-2019, 12:23 PM
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I dunno about not responding to his horribleness. To the contrary, I think Hillary went a little too far to avoid confrontation, trying to take a "higher road." I would've loved to have heard her turn around at the debate and say, "Get the fuck away from me, you creepy stalker!"

Of course, you want to be careful about extending the criticism to his mouthbreathing supporters. As accurate as it might be to characterize them as "deplorables" "clinging to their guns and bibles", such words do not play well in today's media.

Call Trump what he is - an ignorant, lazy, classless, sleezebag coward. An embarrassment to have as the leader of ANY country - not to mention the US. And then pivot to your platform. The office of the president might be owed SOME respect and deference, but not this douchebag.
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  #278  
Old 07-18-2019, 12:37 PM
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All those investigations have been called off?
All those investigations won't amount to squat. The Republicans have already showed us what they will tolerate from him to stay in power, and he has shown them that outright lying and racism is a viable path to success. I am trying to imagine what any investigation that is not buried in bullshit could possibly reveal that would cause the Republicans to put Country before Party.

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  #279  
Old 07-18-2019, 01:10 PM
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Fight fire with fire, eh? <shrug> Yeah, that will work. No more grownups in the room at all. Good.

Carry on.
I have no problem at all with the idea that this is not a "grown-up" way to conduct an election, or a system of governance for that matter. I'm simply saying that if you want to win this election, this is what you should do.
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Old 07-18-2019, 01:14 PM
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An utterly devastating attack from The Atlantic, on the Democrats and what their failure to stand up to Trump could mean for the future of the country. My quotes below are from the conclusion. I do a disservice to the author to quote them here, as the rest of the article demands to be read first. I would encourage those who believe that the Democrats should stand down from Trump's attack on the "Squad" to read this, and see if it will change their minds, or at least encourage them to rethink their position.

Quote:
But Democrats now hold the House, and they are not holding Trump back...

If the Democrats convince themselves that anything they do to attack the president risks alienating white voters who believe the country belongs only to them, then they will be partially responsible for the path the country is taking, and the standard it is upholding. The Democrats’ weakness has not appeased the president. Instead, it has only invited bolder challenges to democracy and the rule of law. This will not change. If congressional Democrats cannot or will not defend the principle that America belongs to all of its citizens, regardless of race, creed, color, or religion, their oaths to defend the Constitution are meaningless...

Omar must be defended, but not because of her views on Israel, gay rights, or progressive taxation... She must be defended, because the nature of the president’s attack on her is a threat to all Americans—black or white, Jew or Gentile—whose citizenship, whose belonging, might similarly be questioned. This is not about Omar anymore, or the other women of color who have been told by this president to “go back” to their supposed countries of origin. It is about defending the idea that America should be a country for all its people. If multiracial democracy cannot be defended in America, it will not be defended elsewhere. What Americans do now, in the face of this, will define us forever.
  #281  
Old 07-18-2019, 01:27 PM
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SingleMalt, thanks for that info (about ten posts up). It does make sense to hash out all the foot-dragging legalities possible before starting impeachment proceedings.
  #282  
Old 07-18-2019, 01:36 PM
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An utterly devastating attack from The Atlantic, on the Democrats and what their failure to stand up to Trump could mean for the future of the country. My quotes below are from the conclusion. I do a disservice to the author to quote them here, as the rest of the article demands to be read first. I would encourage those who believe that the Democrats should stand down from Trump's attack on the "Squad" to read this, and see if it will change their minds, or at least encourage them to rethink their position.
So I read it, I guess he doesn't like the pace that Democrats are moving at on hearings, but like, what does he want them to do differently? They can pass bills (or impeachments) that will die in the Senate, and they can hold hearings where administration officials will show up (or not) to lie and stonewall, and then what? That's a mighty fine basis for lawsuits and that's about it.

Without the Senate, Democrats can continue to issue sternly worded rebukes and wait for 2020. Right? Or am I missing some obvious sword that they're wielding that they've been choosing not to use?

Last edited by steronz; 07-18-2019 at 01:37 PM.
  #283  
Old 07-18-2019, 01:52 PM
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Which is exactly why Pelosi is holding off the impeachment proceedings. She wants to be able to throw the whole fucking book at him!
Problem is, that's like waiting for Steven King to write his last novel.
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Old 07-18-2019, 02:16 PM
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It's more like she's waiting for public opinion to become solidly in support of impeachment, including the Republicans to conclude they have to cut him loose, or it will backfire.
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Old 07-18-2019, 02:36 PM
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Problem is, that's like waiting for Steven King to write his last novel.


Or wating for Godot to show up.
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Old 07-18-2019, 02:40 PM
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Real leaders don't follow public opinion, they shape it.
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Old 07-18-2019, 03:02 PM
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An utterly devastating attack from The Atlantic, on the Democrats and what their failure to stand up to Trump could mean for the future of the country.
I appreciate the link to the article, but I guess I don't see how Democrats have failed to stand up to Trump when they've tried to hold him accountable when they don't hold all the cards. House Democrats are just that: House Democrats. They're not the entire House. They're not the Senate. They're not judges. They're not representative of America as a whole.

Quotes from the linked article:

Quote:
If the Democrats convince themselves that anything they do to attack the president risks alienating white voters who believe the country belongs only to them, then they will be partially responsible for the path the country is taking, and the standard it is upholding.
Why does the author assume that Democrats aren't impeaching the president or aren't censuring the president simply out of fear of alienating whites? Maybe the author doesn't really understand how this started, and why Trump thrust himself into the debate.

It started over disagreement about whether to pass a Senate version of a border funding bill, or wait until the congress comes back from its July 4 recess. Without the funding, the suffering of the migrants would likely be even worse, and it's something Republicans have no shame in exploiting. It sucks that Democrats in the House are in that position, but that's a reminder of the importance of winning elections, not just in 2018, not just in 2020, but every damn won from here on out. Winning back the House was a good start, but they don't have the kind of power they want right now, which means they need more of it, which means they really shouldn't be picking fights with centrists and pragmatists who want House democrats to be viewed as a party that can actually govern.

I would agree with you that centrists and moderates shouldn't be lily-livered cowards, either. But I'm just not seeing that - not when they have already overwhelmingly voted as a party to condemn the comments against Omar and others.

Quote:
The Democrats’ weakness has not appeased the president. Instead, it has only invited bolder challenges to democracy and the rule of law. This will not change. If congressional Democrats cannot or will not defend the principle that America belongs to all of its citizens, regardless of race, creed, color, or religion, their oaths to defend the Constitution are meaningless...
Where in God's name does the author think the Democrats are trying to "appease" Trump. This is just a bunch of fake progressive propaganda that's been colored as news.

Quote:
Omar must be defended, but not because of her views on Israel, gay rights, or progressive taxation... She must be defended, because the nature of the president’s attack on her is a threat to all Americans—black or white, Jew or Gentile—whose citizenship, whose belonging, might similarly be questioned.
No disagreement there, but again, they've been defending her. They just wish that progressives like AOC wouldn't tweet out that Pelosi is deliberately trying to silence women of color when that vicious statement had absolutely no basis in fact.

In fact, it was that comment that undoubtedly caught Donald Trump's attention. It was at that moment that Trump realized that Cortez had signaled that there was, from her point of view -- not Pelosi's, but the Squad's -- that there was a growing rift between the two elements of the party that he could exploit. I won't say that Pelosi is entirely blameless, either. She didn't have to do that interview with the Times, and I'm guessing she regrets that now. But I still put more of the blame on the progressives who go full-on chair-throwing Bernie Bro mad when they don't get their way.

Quote:
This is not about Omar anymore, or the other women of color who have been told by this president to “go back” to their supposed countries of origin. It is about defending the idea that America should be a country for all its people. If multiracial democracy cannot be defended in America, it will not be defended elsewhere. What Americans do now, in the face of this, will define us forever.
I don't disagree, but that doesn't relieve all members of the democratic party of the awesome responsibility they have to be part of a team, and a coalition. They can't just think about their constituencies only. I would agree that it goes both ways. Center-line Dems need to recognize the moments when they need to be statesmen and step up, but I think they did that yesterday and I have no doubt they'll do it again. It's the progressives who need to think more strategically.

Last edited by asahi; 07-18-2019 at 03:03 PM.
  #288  
Old 07-18-2019, 03:44 PM
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I am sure that if Pelosi thought she could get the votes in the Senate to remove, she'd push thru Impeachment. She can't, and even The Atlantic knows that.

Pelosi has also very likely had studies done that show that Impeachment in the House, without Conviction in the Senate will do nothing but increase public support for trump, making his re-election a certainty.

I feel that calls for a worthless Impeachment are done by people who either support trump or dont understand the process.
  #289  
Old 07-18-2019, 04:14 PM
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I feel that calls for a worthless Impeachment are done by people who either support trump or dont understand the process.
Oh, so you understand the process better than Jerry Nadler, Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, Kamala Harris, Cory Booker, Kirsten Gillibrand, Julián Castro, Ted Lieu, and many others? Or are they Trump supporters?
  #290  
Old 07-18-2019, 04:20 PM
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Oh, so you understand the process better than Jerry Nadler, Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, Kamala Harris, Cory Booker, Kirsten Gillibrand, Julián Castro, Ted Lieu, and many others? Or are they Trump supporters?
No, but I think Pelosi knows the process better than all of them combined. However, several of them know full well impeachment is a bad idea, they just want the publicity for screaming for it.

Bernie Sanders has never understood politics, he is a demagogue. Kamala has never had to run opposed in a election, really. The closest thing was running against another dem for the dem nom for Senate.
  #291  
Old 07-18-2019, 04:24 PM
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However, several of them know full well impeachment is a bad idea, they just want the publicity for screaming for it.
Cite? I disagree with your reading of their minds.
  #292  
Old 07-18-2019, 04:37 PM
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Cite? I disagree with your reading of their minds.
FWIW I agree with his reading of their minds.
  #293  
Old 07-18-2019, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Walken After Midnight View Post
Oh, so you understand the process better than Jerry Nadler, Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, Kamala Harris, Cory Booker, Kirsten Gillibrand, Julián Castro, Ted Lieu, and many others? Or are they Trump supporters?
Those people are campaigning for president, they don't have to actually put their money where their mouths are on this.

Pelosi is probably one of the most shrewd and skilled politicians in the country, who has a better understanding of the Congress than possibly any of those people you listed. And she's actually got responsibilities beyond making headlines and getting attention on cable news.
  #294  
Old 07-18-2019, 04:54 PM
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Those people are campaigning for president, they don't have to actually put their money where their mouths are on this.
Here's a list of House members who support opening an impeachment inquiry (last updated June 26, 2019):

Rep. Alma Adams (D-NC)
Rep. Nanette Barragán (D-CA)
Rep. Joyce Beatty (D-OH)
Rep. Don Beyer (D-VA)
Rep. Earl Blumenauer (D-OR)
Rep. Suzanne Bonamici (D-OR)
Rep. Brendan Boyle (D-PA)
Rep. G.K. Butterfield (D-NC)
Rep. Tony Cardenas (D-CA)
Rep. Sean Casten (D-IL)
Rep. Joaquín Castro (D-TX)
Rep. David Cicilline (D-RI) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Yvette Clarke (D-NY)
Rep. Lacy Clay (D-MO)
Rep. Steve Cohen (D-TN), (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Danny Davis (D-IL)
Rep. Madeleine Dean (D-PA) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Diana DeGette (D-CO)
Rep. Val Demings (D-FL) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Mark DeSaulnier (D-CA)
Rep. Lloyd Doggett (D-TX)
Rep. Mike Doyle (D-PA)
Rep. Veronica Escobar (D-TX) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Adriano Espaillat (D-NY)
Rep. Dwight Evans (D-PA)
Rep. Marcia Fudge (D-OH)
Rep. Ruben Gallego (D-AZ)
Rep. Jesús García (D-IL)
Rep. Mary Gay Scanlon (D-PA) (vice chair, House Judiciary Committee)
Rep. Jimmy Gomez (D-CA)
Rep. Al Green (D-TX)
Rep. Raul Grijalva (D-AZ) (chair, Natural Resources Committee)
Rep. Brian Higgins (D-NY)
Rep. Jim Himes (D-CT)
Rep. Jared Huffman (D-CA)
Rep. Pramila Jayapal (D-WA) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Robin Kelly (D-IL)
Rep. Joe Kennedy (D-MA)
Rep. Dan Kildee (D-MI) (chief deputy whip of House Democratic Caucus)
Rep. Ann Kirkpatrick (D-AZ)
Rep. Brenda Lawrence (D-MI)
Rep. Barbara Lee (D-CA)
Rep. Andy Levin (D-MI)
Rep. Ted Lieu (D-CA) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Alan Lowenthal (D-CA)
Rep. Tom Malinowski (D-NJ)
Rep. Carolyn Maloney (D-NY)
Rep. Betty McCollum (D-MN)
Rep. Jim McGovern (D-MA) (chair, House Rules Committee)
Rep. Gwen Moore (D-WI)
Rep. Seth Moulton (D-MA)
Rep. Debbie Mucarsel-Powell (D-FL) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Grace Napolitano (D-CA)
Rep. Joe Neguse (D-CO) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Donald Norcross (D-NJ)
Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-NY)
Rep. Ilhan Omar (D-MN)
Rep. Bill Pascrell (D-NJ)
Rep. Scott Peters (D-CA)
Rep. Chellie Pingree (D-ME)
Rep. Mark Pocan (D-WI)
Rep. Katie Porter (D-CA)
Rep. Ayanna Pressley (D-MA)
Rep. Mike Quigley (D-IL)
Rep. Jamie Raskin (D-MD) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Kathleen Rice (D-NY)
Rep. Cedric Richmond (D-LA) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Harley Rouda (D-CA)
Rep. Bobby Rush (D-IL)
Rep. Tim Ryan (D-OH)
Rep. Jan Schakowsky (D-IL)
Rep. Brad Sherman (D-CA)
Rep. Adam Smith (D-WA)
Rep. Jackie Speier (D-CA)
Rep. Eric Swalwell (D-CA)
Rep. Greg Stanton (D-AZ) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Bennie Thompson (D-MS) (chair, House Homeland Security Committee)
Rep. Rashida Tlaib (D-MI)
Rep. Paul Tonko (D-NY)
Rep. Norma Torres (D-CA)
Rep. Juan Vargas (D-CA)
Rep. Filemon Vela (D-TX)
Rep. Nydia Velazquez (D-NY) (chair, House Committee on Small Business)
Rep. Maxine Waters (D-CA) (chair, House Financial Services Committee)
Rep. Bonnie Watson Coleman (D-NJ)
Rep. Peter Welch (D-VT)
Rep. John Yarmuth (D-KY) (chair, House Budget Committee)
Rep. Justin Amash (I-MI)
  #295  
Old 07-18-2019, 05:05 PM
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Were you aware that McConnell won't let the Senate vote on any of this and that's why they are telling you that the congress hasn't passed anything?
Were you aware that laws are passed by the House, Senate, and the President?

The so-called squad has accomplished nothing.
  #296  
Old 07-18-2019, 05:10 PM
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Were you aware that laws are passed by the House, Senate, and the President?

The so-called squad has accomplished nothing.
The House and Senate don't pass laws, they pass a bill.
The President doesn't pass laws, he signs a bill that has passed the House and senate into law.
  #297  
Old 07-18-2019, 05:14 PM
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Here's a list of the House Democrats that voted to support impeachment yesterday, but aren't on the list I posted above:

Karen Bass (Calif.)
Anthony Brown (Md.)
André Carson (Ind.)
Katherine Clark (Mass.)
Debbie Dingell (Mich.)
Eliot Engel (N.Y.)
Sylvia Garcia (Texas)
Sheila Jackson Lee (Texas)
Hank Johnson (Ga.)
Mike Levin (Calif.)
Nita Lowey (N.Y.)
Doris Matsui (Calif.)
Jerry McNerney (Calif.)
Grace Meng (N.Y.)
Jerrold Nadler (N.Y.)
Frank Pallone Jr. (N.J.)
Donald Payne Jr. (N.J.)
Lucille Roybal-Allard (Calif.)
Mary Gay Scanlon (Pa.)
David Scott (Ga.)
Mike Thompson (Calif.)
Dina Titus (Nev.)
Lori Trahan (Mass.)
Frederica Wilson (Fla.)
  #298  
Old 07-18-2019, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Walken After Midnight View Post
Here's a list of House members who support opening an impeachment inquiry (last updated June 26, 2019):

Rep. Alma Adams (D-NC)
Rep. Nanette Barragán (D-CA)
Rep. Joyce Beatty (D-OH)
Rep. Don Beyer (D-VA)
Rep. Earl Blumenauer (D-OR)
Rep. Suzanne Bonamici (D-OR)
Rep. Brendan Boyle (D-PA)
Rep. G.K. Butterfield (D-NC)
Rep. Tony Cardenas (D-CA)
Rep. Sean Casten (D-IL)
Rep. Joaquín Castro (D-TX)
Rep. David Cicilline (D-RI) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Yvette Clarke (D-NY)
Rep. Lacy Clay (D-MO)
Rep. Steve Cohen (D-TN), (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Danny Davis (D-IL)
Rep. Madeleine Dean (D-PA) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Diana DeGette (D-CO)
Rep. Val Demings (D-FL) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Mark DeSaulnier (D-CA)
Rep. Lloyd Doggett (D-TX)
Rep. Mike Doyle (D-PA)
Rep. Veronica Escobar (D-TX) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Adriano Espaillat (D-NY)
Rep. Dwight Evans (D-PA)
Rep. Marcia Fudge (D-OH)
Rep. Ruben Gallego (D-AZ)
Rep. Jesús García (D-IL)
Rep. Mary Gay Scanlon (D-PA) (vice chair, House Judiciary Committee)
Rep. Jimmy Gomez (D-CA)
Rep. Al Green (D-TX)
Rep. Raul Grijalva (D-AZ) (chair, Natural Resources Committee)
Rep. Brian Higgins (D-NY)
Rep. Jim Himes (D-CT)
Rep. Jared Huffman (D-CA)
Rep. Pramila Jayapal (D-WA) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Robin Kelly (D-IL)
Rep. Joe Kennedy (D-MA)
Rep. Dan Kildee (D-MI) (chief deputy whip of House Democratic Caucus)
Rep. Ann Kirkpatrick (D-AZ)
Rep. Brenda Lawrence (D-MI)
Rep. Barbara Lee (D-CA)
Rep. Andy Levin (D-MI)
Rep. Ted Lieu (D-CA) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Alan Lowenthal (D-CA)
Rep. Tom Malinowski (D-NJ)
Rep. Carolyn Maloney (D-NY)
Rep. Betty McCollum (D-MN)
Rep. Jim McGovern (D-MA) (chair, House Rules Committee)
Rep. Gwen Moore (D-WI)
Rep. Seth Moulton (D-MA)
Rep. Debbie Mucarsel-Powell (D-FL) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Grace Napolitano (D-CA)
Rep. Joe Neguse (D-CO) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Donald Norcross (D-NJ)
Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-NY)
Rep. Ilhan Omar (D-MN)
Rep. Bill Pascrell (D-NJ)
Rep. Scott Peters (D-CA)
Rep. Chellie Pingree (D-ME)
Rep. Mark Pocan (D-WI)
Rep. Katie Porter (D-CA)
Rep. Ayanna Pressley (D-MA)
Rep. Mike Quigley (D-IL)
Rep. Jamie Raskin (D-MD) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Kathleen Rice (D-NY)
Rep. Cedric Richmond (D-LA) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Harley Rouda (D-CA)
Rep. Bobby Rush (D-IL)
Rep. Tim Ryan (D-OH)
Rep. Jan Schakowsky (D-IL)
Rep. Brad Sherman (D-CA)
Rep. Adam Smith (D-WA)
Rep. Jackie Speier (D-CA)
Rep. Eric Swalwell (D-CA)
Rep. Greg Stanton (D-AZ) (House Judiciary Committee member)
Rep. Bennie Thompson (D-MS) (chair, House Homeland Security Committee)
Rep. Rashida Tlaib (D-MI)
Rep. Paul Tonko (D-NY)
Rep. Norma Torres (D-CA)
Rep. Juan Vargas (D-CA)
Rep. Filemon Vela (D-TX)
Rep. Nydia Velazquez (D-NY) (chair, House Committee on Small Business)
Rep. Maxine Waters (D-CA) (chair, House Financial Services Committee)
Rep. Bonnie Watson Coleman (D-NJ)
Rep. Peter Welch (D-VT)
Rep. John Yarmuth (D-KY) (chair, House Budget Committee)
Rep. Justin Amash (I-MI)

Uh, yeah? I was responding to your list of presidential candidates.

My greater point still stands. Those people don't have the same job as pelosi. Or the same political savvy.

I actually trust Pelosi's ability to effectively run the House more than yours, or anyone on that list.
  #299  
Old 07-18-2019, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by D'Anconia View Post
Were you aware that laws are passed by the House, Senate, and the President?

The so-called squad has accomplished nothing.
Presidents don't pass laws.
  #300  
Old 07-18-2019, 05:35 PM
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When someone is standing in front you ready to punch you in the face, what do you do, ThelmaLou? They are swinging; the fists are moving towards your face. What do you do?
The conclusion I’m drawing is that we’re supposed to sit there and pretend: everything is fine, everything is good, insane shit isn’t happening, the POTUS is just being his ole rascally self, nothing to see here nothing to see here.

But what happens when Trump ups the ante? And you know he will. Instead of likening racial minorities to foreigners in a tweet, let’s imagine Trump egging on violence against black and brown Dems? What if someone tries to kill The Squad because of Trump’s hateful rhetoric? What if they are successful? What then?

I can see it now.

“Oh no, this is Trump playing 16-D chess against the Dems again. Time to self-flagellate as we think of new and exciting ways to blame ourselves for this mess instead of Trump.”

“If we give him what he wants, everyone will think we’re Commie pinkos! We need to lay low if we want to win in 2020.”

Black people will be on the chopping block and no one white will have the fortitude to fight back. That’s the end game.

Last edited by you with the face; 07-18-2019 at 05:38 PM.
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