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Old 03-08-2020, 10:23 AM
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Direction of the GOP after a hypothetical Trump drumming.


No fighting the hypothetical: Trump loses and loses fairly solidly, the Senate goes into D majority.

Does the GOP go with Trumpism 2.0? (He could even run again!)

Simple continuation of being the party of no, with no agenda of their own other than kneecapping the Ds?

Or alter course, and in which way?

Related - if they do alter course and Trumpism is no longer there in all its extreme ugliness, do the wings of the D side elevate their intraparty bickering?
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Old 03-08-2020, 10:32 AM
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Given the OP scenario, my expectation is they clean house of the Trump acolytes and establish a more traditional conservative party that, unfortunately, continues to genuflect to the evangelical base.
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Old 03-08-2020, 10:37 AM
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"Trump. Trump? Nope, sorry, never heard of him."

Trump would become persona non grata the same way George W. Bush has. Trump's failure to get reelected would be seen in the same light as the economy tanking at the end of the Bush administration; some sort of aberration that couldn't have been foreseen and had nothing to do with the party.

After thoroughly casting off Trump, for the next election they will nominate someone who promises to cut taxes, appoint right-wing judges, increase immigration enforcement, etc.
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Old 03-08-2020, 10:38 AM
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It'll whither and die like the Whig party before them. Although not mandated by law, the way the Constitution was cast pretty well guaranteed that when political parties formed, we'd have in effect two of them.

Nothing says one has to be the Republican party.
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Old 03-08-2020, 10:39 AM
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I'd expect they'd double down on everything, just like in 2008. You'd see some conversations about being more friendly to, say, Hispanics or whatever which will go nowhere.
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Old 03-08-2020, 11:41 AM
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Given the OP scenario, my expectation is they clean house of the Trump acolytes and establish a more traditional conservative party that, unfortunately, continues to genuflect to the evangelical base.
I seriously doubt this is the path they take; they will only become more aggressive and anti-democratic. Trump is a symptom of the disease, not the disease. Trump was able to articulate and voice what many conservatives had been feeling but felt unable to come out and say. He stripped the party of whatever shame it had left. They'll pivot away from Trump and find a charismatic ideologue.
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Old 03-08-2020, 12:09 PM
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Over the past three years the Republicans threw all the never-Trump conventional establishment leaders out of the party. They're not going to be welcomed back just because Trump loses. The younger elected Republicans are extremist nutcases, who won their primaries by outshouting the mere far right.

Who can these people appeal to? Their base is graying and dying. Younger voters voted Democrat by a 35 point margin in 2018.* The Republicans have done everything they can to alienate people of color, who are the fasting growing demographic and who skew much younger than white voters. Other than racist and sexist policies, the party has no new ideas to offer and so can't pivot toward them.

In the short run, they'll cling to local power wherever the demographics are still favorable, hoping that the Dems will screw up in some big way that will alienate a sufficient percentage to give them a path into national power.


* Note that the writer of that article is a conservative and presumably a never-Trumper whose suggestions to win younger voters are more deregulation and market forces. Good luck.
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Old 03-08-2020, 01:16 PM
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I've never heard Trump's drumming, I can't imagine he's any good.

Maybe the GOP will recruit Max Weinberg; he's supposed to be a Republican no?

(I think the word you want is drubbing.)
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Old 03-08-2020, 01:29 PM
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I don't see them backing off. They didn't back off from the Tea Party nonsense or any other extremism in my lifetime. Why would they think that now they went too far?
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Old 03-08-2020, 01:47 PM
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I don't see them backing off. They didn't back off from the Tea Party nonsense or any other extremism in my lifetime. Why would they think that now they went too far?
What happens when Republicans lose elections that they would have won had they not been racist and misogynistic?

Well after losing in 2008, they came back as the Tea Party.

And after losing in 2012, they came back as the Trump party.

And after losing in 2018, they came back as a proto-fascist party.

People need to understand that old republicans who value compromise and flexibility have long since left the party. The republican party that exists today have a different value system. People have to understand that those who continue to identify as republican do so precisely because they feel like they should have more power than they do, and they are determined to keep it even if it means tearing the country to pieces. What matters is that, in the end, they want the power to impose their will on everyone else.

Just losing the white house, house, and senate in 2020 wouldn't be enough; something major has to happen that reshapes the value system of enough people to the point where we realize that having people who think like republicans in power is dangerous. We're not there yet, not even close.
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Old 03-08-2020, 02:38 PM
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The GOP's existential fear of an electorate where diversity,secularism and social and economic justice are the prevailing sentiments means that its willingness to cheat and manipulate our archaic system won't end with the demise of Donald Trump.
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Old 03-08-2020, 03:06 PM
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Interesting notion...I’m going to think on this.
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Old 03-08-2020, 03:09 PM
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Disenfranchisement and suppression won't end anytime soon. GOPs know their program is abhorrent to the majority of current and potential voters; their only recourse is to lie, cheat, and steal. Don't expect improvement.
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Old 03-08-2020, 03:45 PM
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Trump’s Democratic successor reveals what is a long string of Trump’s hitherto-unrevealed misdeeds (actual and attempted). Republicans having to claim repeatedly they never knew anything about them is transparently bogus, gets old fast and proves especially effective as a Democratic election weapon. At least three consequences can be envisioned as following from this premise:

Republicans nationally follow the example of Republicans in CA, and begin to recede into irrelevance (at least, temporarily);

Republicans urgently encourage a lot of fresh faces (i.e., those with no direct connections to Trump or his administration) to run for office;

Trump tweets that Democrats are savaging what was the greatest administration in history because they never forgave his 2016 victory; and Republicans are now losers because they ran away from him (and Trumpism, in general).


It is possible some wishful thinking may have influenced my analytical and speculative processes.
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Old 03-08-2020, 07:34 PM
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I'd expect they'd double down on everything, just like in 2008. You'd see some conversations about being more friendly to, say, Hispanics or whatever which will go nowhere.
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I seriously doubt this is the path they take; they will only become more aggressive and anti-democratic.
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I don't see them backing off. They didn't back off from the Tea Party nonsense or any other extremism in my lifetime. Why would they think that now they went too far?
Yeppers to all of the above.
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Old 03-09-2020, 07:42 AM
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The Republicans will double down on their current course unless they are forced to change. In the hypothetical scenario in the OP, the only force strong enough to make them change would be losses in both 2022 and 2024. If we wake up on November 8th, 2022 with the house still in Democratic hands, and then on November 5th, 2024 with a Democratic senate, house, and president, the Republicans will start to change. Until then, they will keep doubling down.

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Old 03-09-2020, 08:01 AM
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Mitt Romney. When he took a stand against Trump during the impeachment process, he basically declared himself the reform candidate of the Republican Party. If Trump loses decisively, the party is going to want to distance itself from Trump and all of his horrible attributes. I can't see a better candidate for them, at this time at least, than Romney.
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Old 03-09-2020, 08:09 AM
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"Trump. Trump? Nope, sorry, never heard of him."

Trump would become persona non grata the same way George W. Bush has. Trump's failure to get reelected would be seen in the same light as the economy tanking at the end of the Bush administration; some sort of aberration that couldn't have been foreseen and had nothing to do with the party.

After thoroughly casting off Trump, for the next election they will nominate someone who promises to cut taxes, appoint right-wing judges, increase immigration enforcement, etc.
Bush Jr. was content to retire to his ranch and fade away from the public spotlight. Trump is unlikely to take that path. The only way Trumpism goes away is via defeat at the ballot box.
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Old 03-09-2020, 10:43 AM
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Trump would become persona non grata the same way George W. Bush has. Trump's failure to get reelected would be seen in the same light as the economy tanking at the end of the Bush administration; some sort of aberration that couldn't have been foreseen and had nothing to do with the party.
But that kind of worked. The GOP steadily picked up a cumulatively large number of seats in Congress, state legislatures (that was said to be what, cumulatively 1000 seats or something), state houses, etc in the following years. In terms of realistic political horizons the 2008 market crash *was* an aberration in terms of 'permanently' turning lots of voters against the GOP.

So it probably depends a good deal actually if the 'drumming' (that could be a phrase for a big loss, just never heard it before) is due to say the fallout from coronavirus* as opposed to Trump losing badly when that mainly blows over soon. IOW losing big because an electorate came out to vote highly unhappy with Trump over the whole 4 yrs. despite economy etc going OK. That would surely make some difference in the party's subsequent reaction.

And just as importantly what the Democrats do (are able to do) in office. As much as many here probably like Obama (maybe not progressive enough, but heart in the right place?) his achievements early on were major fuel for the big GOP gains in elections on many levels from 2010 onward, though with major exception of failing to defeat Obama in 2012. If the Democrats sweep in and enact an agenda like the one spoken about in the primaries, every by Biden, the GOP isn't going anywhere and doesn't need to change. It's a polarized country: major progressive legislation will at least at first give the GOP a lot of scope to generate an electoral backlash, as in 2010-2016 elections. Whereas 'long term', 'demographics are destiny' etc remind me of people predicting the price of oil in the long term: it's impossible. Lots of people on the internet think they can predict such things, but they can't. In terms of just a few election cycles a big Democratic 'mandate' significantly fueled by a one off event like in 2008 will offer the GOP lots of comeback opportunity as in 2010 etc. A 'drumming' when things seem to be going OK with GOP in power would be much more likely to generate a significant change in the party.

Sure, the place of primacy in the party Trump personally achieved during his term (which he didn't really have in Jan 2017, ironically) would be severely challenged if he loses by a significant margin, for any reason. However whether it causes the GOP to fundamentally change I think does depend on the reason he loses.

*there are no exact parallels and voters might more specifically, and rationally, view that as due to Trump admin mishandling. The world financial crisis of '08 had lots of roots worldwide and the ones in US didn't particularly date to Bush's admin. But let's assume it's mainly fear/unhappiness about corona, not so much specifically that objective Trump mishandling is the main factor, 'don't fight my hypothetical'.

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Old 03-09-2020, 11:00 AM
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Trump tweets that Democrats are savaging what was the greatest administration in history because they never forgave his 2016 victory; and Republicans are now losers because they ran away from him (and Trumpism, in general).
That'll only be an issue for a limited period, unless the New York Department of Corrections liberalizes its policy on cell phone possession.
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Old 03-09-2020, 11:06 AM
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Bush Jr. was content to retire to his ranch and fade away from the public spotlight. Trump is unlikely to take that path. The only way Trumpism goes away is via defeat at the ballot box.
Trump will still be the same blowhard he's always been, but if he is ever seen to lose an election the GOP will pretend they never heard of him, just as with both Bushes before him.

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But that kind of worked. The GOP steadily picked up a cumulatively large number of seats in Congress, state legislatures (that was said to be what, cumulatively 1000 seats or something), state houses, etc in the following years. In terms of realistic political horizons the 2008 market crash *was* an aberration in terms of 'permanently' turning lots of voters against the GOP.

So it probably depends a good deal actually if the 'drumming' (that could be a phrase for a big loss, just never heard it before) is due to say the fallout from coronavirus* as opposed to Trump losing badly when that mainly blows over soon. IOW losing big because an electorate came out to vote highly unhappy with Trump over the whole 4 yrs. despite economy etc going OK. That would surely make some difference in the party's subsequent reaction.
My comment was really more about how the Republican Party fails to question its own orthodoxy. They had George W. Bush in office for 8 years, doing everything that they'd always believed would make the economy grow without end. When, at the end of those 8 years, the economy tanked, it couldn't possibly have been the fault of Republican policies. Bush got cast aside as if it was all some personal failing on his part. And then the search was on for someone else to cut taxes, increase spending, and make the economy grow forever.

I think the same thing will happen to Trump if he loses. It won't matter whether he loses because of incompetent governance on his part. Maybe the CDC completely mishandles the corona virus outbreak, and it's an epidemic here while other countries have it more closely controlled and monitored. Trump will lose, the GOP will forget about him, and in 2024 they'll nominate someone who promises to cut government waste like the CDC.
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Old 03-09-2020, 11:55 AM
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Mitt Romney. When he took a stand against Trump during the impeachment process, he basically declared himself the reform candidate of the Republican Party. If Trump loses decisively, the party is going to want to distance itself from Trump and all of his horrible attributes. I can't see a better candidate for them, at this time at least, than Romney.
No. Republicans don't like losers. They also don't like perceived disloyalty to whoever the current president is. They're happy to rag on past presidents, but don't you dare do it while they're in office. Romney Dixie Chicked himself, Republicans are not going to forget that. They hold grudges. In fact, I doubt he gets re-elected in the Senate after this.
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Old 03-09-2020, 01:30 PM
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I've never heard Trump's drumming, I can't imagine he's any good.

Maybe the GOP will recruit Max Weinberg; he's supposed to be a Republican no?

(I think the word you want is drubbing.)
I thought that, too but then there is the practice of ceremonially “drumming out” a disgraced member of the military. So that sort of works too.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drumming_out

Which is how I would love to see Trump leave. Please Please Please
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Old 03-09-2020, 07:56 PM
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I thought that, too but then there is the practice of ceremonially “drumming out” a disgraced member of the military. So that sort of works too.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drumming_out

Which is how I would love to see Trump leave. Please Please Please
That was the thought but also inspired by Biden’s oft repeated he’ll beat him like a drum.
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Old 03-09-2020, 08:25 PM
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In fact, I doubt he gets re-elected in the Senate after this.
Nah, Utah's Senate seat is Romney's for as long as he wants it. Utah may be solid red (Goldwater is the only Republican presidential candidate to lose Utah in the last 70 years), but it's not Trump country at all. Trump came in dead last in the 2016 caucus (13% in a 3-way race), and failed to get a majority in the general (he got 45% while 3rd party conservative McMullin got over 21%). Sure, Trump will carry Utah this year because of the (R) after his name, but Romney did not put himself in any danger by turning on Trump.
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Old 03-09-2020, 09:41 PM
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.

My comment was really more about how the Republican Party fails to question its own orthodoxy. They had George W. Bush in office for 8 years, doing everything that they'd always believed would make the economy grow without end. When, at the end of those 8 years, the economy tanked, it couldn't possibly have been the fault of Republican policies. Bush got cast aside as if it was all some personal failing on his part. And then the search was on for someone else to cut taxes, increase spending, and make the economy grow forever.
OK, but that doesn't really change my comment. The 2008 pretty clearly didn't turn the voting public permanently against a relatively unchanged GOP. The GOP's position in the US House, state houses and state legislatures by late in the Obama years was the strongest it had been since the 1920's. In the Trump era they've lost back some, not all, of that. Nor is the underlying opinion you seem to hold that (relative*) free market policies caused the 2008 crash an obvious fact either.

However I also don't think it's strictly true that the GOP base thought of the crash itself as particularly Bush's personal fault or even focused on whose fault. What they faulted was mainly the policy of bail outs which followed, populists on both left and right did not like that. Whereas the establishment on both sides agreed on it: Obama carried on pretty much with Bush's policies in terms of bailouts (which I personally think was the only real choice for either of them, but anyway there was basic bipartisan continuity on that policy).

Along with other actually substantive issues on which the GOP base or parts of rejected Bush and embraced Trump, Bush's nuanced position on illegal immigration, and the more protectionist instincts shared by Trump and the base (and again left populists also, Sanders is perhaps more of a protectionist than Trump, but he seems destined not to take over the Democrats, for now). So it's not even really true the GOP hasn't changed. Some things have definitely changed if you compare Bush to Trump, even besides very different personal styles.

*compared to the Democrats: the GOP has hardly been a 'libertarian free market' party, ever, and the mainstream of the Democrats has hardly been a 'socialist' party. It hasn't necessarily been that big a difference once you take out electioneering rhetoric and consider what the two parties' elected officials do, not what their mouthpieces in media and now internet say.
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Old 03-09-2020, 10:06 PM
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No. Republicans don't like losers. They also don't like perceived disloyalty to whoever the current president is. They're happy to rag on past presidents, but don't you dare do it while they're in office. Romney Dixie Chicked himself, Republicans are not going to forget that. They hold grudges. In fact, I doubt he gets re-elected in the Senate after this.
Unless Trump constantly brings it up, the next twenty or thirty Trump-ups will put it out of their minds.
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Old 03-09-2020, 11:25 PM
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Brain Dead Democracks!
Why hello there! I see this is your first post at the Straight Dope!

Since you're new here you may not know the ways of the board. While it's possible you've misspelled Democrats, it's also possible that you may be misspelling it intentionally to add an insult in there. Posters at this board will sometimes do this but it is generally regarded as juvenile. So just a heads up if anyone calls you out on that. But if you do feel like hurling some invective don't worry, the board's got you covered! There's an entire forum called The BBQ Pit where you can flame to your heart's content. Well, there are some rules there. I'd check first.

Now as for the "brain dead" part, I'm hoping you can clarify. Are you saying that the Democrats have been brain dead up to this point and that they can turn around by embracing intellectualism? That's a hard sell in a world where people are stocking up on toilet paper to deal with a respiratory illness but if you've got some thoughts on the subject, I'm willing to listen.

Or perhaps you are suggesting a different approach? The perceived elitism of Democrats leaves many feeling left out in the cold. Perhaps the Democrats need to go a little more "brain dead" in order to widen their appeal to an audience that composes about half of the United States. Put down the arugula, pick up a Budweiser. Stop talking down to people, stop referring to the heart of America as "flyover country". Something like that perhaps?

In any case, I hope you enjoy some productive and enlightening discussions here at the Straight Dope Message Board!
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Old 03-10-2020, 07:34 AM
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I think one of the important things is to call it what it is. It isn't Trumpism, it is American fascism. And it isn't going away, and I think will only get stronger over the next couple of decades until a true crisis point hits. Trump's loss will be seen only as another sign of the danger of liberalism to the USA that will require more extreme countermeasures. The non-fascist GOP voters are never going to stand up to the fascists in their party because of guns, abortions, or low taxes. Expect the GOP to continue heading further and further right. In particular, if Biden (a moderate) wins, then expect Republicans to *sprint* further right. The more centrist the Democrat position, the further right the GOP has to become. They have to appeal to the idea that the Democrats are wholly wrong, and quite probably evil, and hence they must maximize the distance from any Democrat position (see Obamacare as a very recent example).

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Old 03-10-2020, 07:50 AM
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I think one of the important things is to call it what it is. It isn't Trumpism, it is American fascism. And it isn't going away, and I think will only get stronger over the next couple of decades until a true crisis point hits. Trump's loss will be seen only as another sign of the danger of liberalism to the USA that will require more extreme countermeasures. The non-fascist GOP voters are never going to stand up to the fascists in their party because of guns, abortions, or low taxes. Expect the GOP to continue heading further and further right. In particular, if Biden (a moderate) wins, then expect Republicans to *sprint* further right. The more centrist the Democrat position, the further right the GOP has to become. They have to appeal to the idea that the Democrats are wholly wrong, and quite probably evil, and hence they must maximize the distance from any Democrat position (see Obamacare as a very recent example).
Presumably there is a limit to how far to the right that the voters who decide elections are willing to move. That's why I think defeating the movement is going to take them losing consecutive elections including a midterm or two. I think three consecutive elections should be enough, but four should definitely do it.

Let's start with this year's election as an example. Let's say Biden wins and the senate turns blue. The Republicans will double down on the crazy. If things go well for the Democrats and they somehow avoid a red wave in 2022, the Republicans will likely double down on the crazy again. But by 2024, and for sure by 2026, continued losses (assuming that they occur) would likely be enough to finally convince enough Republicans to abandon the crazy and return to normalcy.
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Old 03-10-2020, 08:20 AM
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Presumably there is a limit to how far to the right that the voters who decide elections are willing to move. That's why I think defeating the movement is going to take them losing consecutive elections including a midterm or two. I think three consecutive elections should be enough, but four should definitely do it.

Let's start with this year's election as an example. Let's say Biden wins and the senate turns blue. The Republicans will double down on the crazy. If things go well for the Democrats and they somehow avoid a red wave in 2022, the Republicans will likely double down on the crazy again. But by 2024, and for sure by 2026, continued losses (assuming that they occur) would likely be enough to finally convince enough Republicans to abandon the crazy and return to normalcy.
Unfortunately, I don't think it is that simple. You cannot embrace the crazy for 10+ years, and tell your supporters that this is the right way to go, and then suddenly do a 180. Look at the Tea Party. The Republicans embraced them instead of rejecting them, and now it is an entrenched and powerful part of the GOP. They could not get rid of the Tea Party now. What is more likely to happen is any Republican trying to return to normalcy would be primaried (not 100% of the time of course, but with high frequency). That's the danger of the political messaging coming mainly from the right-wing media right now. It is a very dangerous type of message that they're sending, which prevents the idea of turning back. And it was, at one point, mainly coming from the fringe of the right-wing media. Now, it is coming from POTUS. I legitimately fear for the future of the USA. I would very much like to be wrong but from history, I think the USA is on a dark path.

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Old 03-10-2020, 10:02 AM
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They will once again be in favor of fiscal conservatism.
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Old 03-10-2020, 11:18 AM
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They'll double down on voter suppression, gerrymandering and undermining democracy.

They will also pick someone who hates democracy as much as trump does but who isn't as clownish and obvious like trump is.
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Old 03-10-2020, 02:16 PM
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They'll double down on voter suppression, gerrymandering and undermining democracy.

They will also pick someone who hates democracy as much as trump does but who isn't as clownish and obvious like trump is.
Pretty much my thoughts. If Trump loses and the Senate goes blue, the GOP could easily blame it on Trump's general loathsomeness and not their overall approach to governance. ("That idiot just couldn't stop pissing people off long enough for our policies to take control.") They'll revert back to being the party of no for four years and nominate someone in 2024 who checks all their boxes without being a supreme jackass.

If and only if that approach fails, we might see a humbling that leads to the GOP once again being a responsible, respectable party.
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Old 03-10-2020, 08:21 PM
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No fighting the hypothetical: Trump loses and loses fairly solidly, the Senate goes into D majority.

Does the GOP go with Trumpism 2.0? (He could even run again!)

Simple continuation of being the party of no, with no agenda of their own other than kneecapping the Ds?

Or alter course, and in which way?

Related - if they do alter course and Trumpism is no longer there in all its extreme ugliness, do the wings of the D side elevate their intraparty bickering?
It depends on how badly they lose. You specified a big loss for Team R.

I imagine they would vote for a very strong conservative (doubling down) such as Ted Cruz. They would probably complain that Trump was insufficiently conservative and religious to win. Their support might not even fade much... for some reason so many people are liberal in everything or conservative in everything. (Christians supporting Mammon, god of wealth.)

If the Republicans act sensibly (something that hasn't really happened since the days when Newt Gingrich was relevant) then I expect the Democrats to viciously fight with each other. With the Republicans "neutralized" the extremists can now vote for their beloved candidates... and destroy anyone who doesn't believe in their extremism while they're at it.

I believed the hype, thinking the Obama coalition was a "permanent" one, with the US becoming 0.5% more Democratic per year. Nope. I was wrong. (As pollster Larry Sabato said, after predicting a Clinton victory, "maximum mea culpa".) The coalition lost one component, and other components didn't turn out in the expected huge numbers. Democrats should have learned to work for their votes, instead of hoping to catch lightning. Democrats like to say they won six of the last seven elections in terms of the popular vote, but they may have won four of them with human lightning rods.
  #36  
Old 03-11-2020, 12:31 PM
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Let's start with this year's election as an example. Let's say Biden wins and the senate turns blue. The Republicans will double down on the crazy. If things go well for the Democrats and they somehow avoid a red wave in 2022, the Republicans will likely double down on the crazy again. But by 2024, and for sure by 2026, continued losses (assuming that they occur) would likely be enough to finally convince enough Republicans to abandon the crazy and return to normalcy.
Ah, it's a martingale system only politics instead of money.
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Old 03-11-2020, 12:37 PM
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The Never-Trumpers who will help elect Biden will act mortified when Biden rolls out his public option to expand on Obamacare, push through gun control legislation and replaces Ginsburg with a pro-choice, pro-affirmative action Supreme Court Justice, and will rally around to restructure the party around Nikki Haley for 2024.
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Old 03-11-2020, 01:13 PM
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The Never-Trumpers who will help elect Biden will act mortified when Biden rolls out his public option to expand on Obamacare, push through gun control legislation and replaces Ginsburg with a pro-choice, pro-affirmative action Supreme Court Justice, and will rally around to restructure the party around Nikki Haley for 2024.
That won't work. Now that il Doofus has fed them red meat, the deplorables will turn up their noses at the pink slime offered by the old-line-GOP Never-Trumper faction.
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  #39  
Old 03-11-2020, 01:21 PM
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Mitt Romney. When he took a stand against Trump during the impeachment process, he basically declared himself the reform candidate of the Republican Party. If Trump loses decisively, the party is going to want to distance itself from Trump and all of his horrible attributes. I can't see a better candidate for them, at this time at least, than Romney.
I don't see this as happening at all. Even if Trump falls from grace, Romney will still be seen as a traitor to the party. I think he will keep his senate seat but be viewed as an outsider RINO (similar to Collins and Murkowski) Conservative and crazy is what currently sells ads on right wing media, and until that changes, conservative and crazy is what is going to win Republican primaries.

Regarding the OP, and mirroring much of what was said above:

Trump will be identified as not a true conservative, practically a Democrat in fact. McConnell will continue his agenda of pure obstruction. Efforts to win back power will be based primarly on voter suppression and campaign malfeasance with the helpful support of a new batch of Trump appointed judges. Ambitious individuals within the Republican party will engage in circular firing squads as they attempt to out conservative each other in hopes of taking Trumps spot as the head of the party.

Meanwhile, without the threat of Trump hanging over them, The Democrats will feel more safe in trying out some of the more radical progressive ideas. Eventually they will reach a bit too far, the Republicans will win the next election, and the whole cycle will start again. But before that happens there will be one or two bits of progressive legislation will make it through and the country will just a little bit better. Three steps forward and two steps back is how progress is made.

Last edited by Buck Godot; 03-11-2020 at 01:24 PM.
  #40  
Old 03-17-2020, 02:44 PM
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Trumpism is sui generis. It only involves Trump. The GOP has went along with it because it is a damn sight better than a President Hillary, President Sanders, or President Biden. Once Trump is gone, whether that is after the 2020 election or the 2024 election, the GOP will go back to regular GOP stuff.
  #41  
Old 03-17-2020, 03:01 PM
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I've never heard Trump's drumming, I can't imagine he's any good.
https://media.tenor.com/images/3a93b...ed28/tenor.gif
  #42  
Old 03-18-2020, 02:47 AM
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Trumpism is sui generis. It only involves Trump. The GOP has went along with it because it is a damn sight better than a President Hillary, President Sanders, or President Biden. Once Trump is gone, whether that is after the 2020 election or the 2024 election, the GOP will go back to regular GOP stuff.
Is that the Tea-Party (baghead) GOP, the destroy-the-Dems GOP, the white-supremacist GOP, the dying-demographic GOP, the nuke-Russia GOP, or some version I didn't notice?
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Old 03-18-2020, 05:55 AM
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If the GOP base is old white geezers, it seems quite possible that a lot of them are going to die this year before they can vote. On unattended gurneys in hospital corridors. A percentage of the ones that live (probably a small one, but some) will actually blame the republican shrink the government/make sure it is incompetent policy for the plague that destroyed the economy and killed so many of their friends and neighbors.

In which case the idea that we are seeing right now the grand climax and fall of the GOP is not as far-fetched.
  #44  
Old 03-18-2020, 08:09 PM
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If the GOP base is old white geezers, it seems quite possible that a lot of them are going to die this year before they can vote. On unattended gurneys in hospital corridors.
If my BIL dies before me, I inherit his fabulous camera and photo gear collection. I keep encouraging him to socialize more at taverns and drink much vodka, but he's slowing down. His Hannity consumption hasn't decreased so he's not getting any smarter. Sad.
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