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  #351  
Old 10-23-2019, 06:52 AM
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I can believe it. Tulsi has a ridiculous throng of Twitter bots.
I read that as "thong of Twitter bots." I'm so glad I read that wrong.

On topic, though, I have to wonder about Hillary stepping into the public eye again. She's still polarizing, and I can see her resurfacing being used as a bullet for the GOP for

"See what the Democrats are doing? Hillary is still trying to interfere in the election. 'Crooked' Hillary Clinton is trying to rig the election, folks! She can't accept that I won by a landslide, so she's trying to find a way to overturn the election. Sad! #neverhillary #trump2020
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  #352  
Old 10-23-2019, 08:37 AM
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I didn't mention this before, but I think it's important:

Hillary made a major mistake by criticizing Gabbard in this way. Not because she is wrong that Russia is promoting Gabbard for their own ends -- clearly that is a fact. Hillary made an unforced error because she raised Gabbard's profile at a time when people were starting to forget about her. Streisand effect and all.

Hillary should stay out of the 2020 race. Lose twice, one inexcusably so, and you are dunzo.
  #353  
Old 10-23-2019, 10:16 AM
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Has Hillary Clinton lost her fucking mind? All this Russian asset stuff seems like a wild conspiracy theory to me....
There is rather a lot of evidence it's true.

The notion of being an "asset" does not mean Tulsi Gabbard is knowingly working for the Russians. She's not. It could mean simply that Russian money and social media assets are pumping her campaign up in an effort to cause division - hell, they may be doing it openly to have it deliberately come out that they're doing it to cause the very arguments we're seeing play out. I'd say it's very, very likely they're doing this.

It could also mean Gabbard is an active useful idiot - that the Russians are influencing her, and/or persons in her inner circle, to do things beneficial to them and harmful to the USA. That is possible but very unlikely, simply because I can't think of why they'd bother. Given the hordes of Democrats who ran for President, it was certain one would already be a doofus and friendly towards a dictator or two.

Of course Gabbard is not meeting with Sergei the Spy in a smoky cafe somewhere.
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  #354  
Old 10-23-2019, 10:38 AM
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I didn't mention this before, but I think it's important:

Hillary made a major mistake by criticizing Gabbard in this way. Not because she is wrong that Russia is promoting Gabbard for their own ends -- clearly that is a fact. Hillary made an unforced error because she raised Gabbard's profile at a time when people were starting to forget about her. Streisand effect and all.

Hillary should stay out of the 2020 race. Lose twice, one inexcusably so, and you are dunzo.
Shit, it's October. By December, Gabbard will see that bump from >1% to 1.5% settle back down to >1%.
  #355  
Old 10-23-2019, 10:46 AM
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Shit, damned "<>" signs. Like the spelling of parallel or the pronunciation of aluminum, that's one of those things my brain always trips on.
  #356  
Old 10-23-2019, 11:57 AM
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There is rather a lot of evidence it's true.

The notion of being an "asset" does not mean Tulsi Gabbard is knowingly working for the Russians. She's not. It could mean simply that Russian money and social media assets are pumping her campaign up in an effort to cause division - hell, they may be doing it openly to have it deliberately come out that they're doing it to cause the very arguments we're seeing play out. I'd say it's very, very likely they're doing this.

It could also mean Gabbard is an active useful idiot - that the Russians are influencing her, and/or persons in her inner circle, to do things beneficial to them and harmful to the USA. That is possible but very unlikely, simply because I can't think of why they'd bother. Given the hordes of Democrats who ran for President, it was certain one would already be a doofus and friendly towards a dictator or two.

Of course Gabbard is not meeting with Sergei the Spy in a smoky cafe somewhere.
This is why sound bites are dangerous. Basically all I heard was the headline, and it just sounded nuts. With your explanation, it makes more sense. Thanks.
  #357  
Old 10-23-2019, 06:42 PM
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There is rather a lot of evidence it's true.

The notion of being an "asset" does not mean Tulsi Gabbard is knowingly working for the Russians. She's not. It could mean simply that Russian money and social media assets are pumping her campaign up in an effort to cause division - hell, they may be doing it openly to have it deliberately come out that they're doing it to cause the very arguments we're seeing play out. I'd say it's very, very likely they're doing this.

It could also mean Gabbard is an active useful idiot - that the Russians are influencing her, and/or persons in her inner circle, to do things beneficial to them and harmful to the USA. That is possible but very unlikely, simply because I can't think of why they'd bother. Given the hordes of Democrats who ran for President, it was certain one would already be a doofus and friendly towards a dictator or two.

Of course Gabbard is not meeting with Sergei the Spy in a smoky cafe somewhere.
Hillary is a 'useful idiot' for Russia. They start some online activity that on the surface appears to be an attempt to help Gabbard, but the real purpose was to provoke a response by Hillary Clinton, fracturing the Democrats some and weakening the party vis-a-vis Trump. Now I'm seeing posts seriously wondering if Hillary will try for the nomination again.
  #358  
Old 10-23-2019, 08:25 PM
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Yeah, that was it. They support Gabbard to goade Clinton into making a side comment in a friend's podcast. My God, they're good!
  #359  
Old 10-23-2019, 08:50 PM
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... Not because she is wrong that Russia is promoting Gabbard for their own ends -- clearly that is a fact. Hillary made an unforced error because she raised Gabbard's profile at a time when people were starting to forget about her. Streisand effect and all.

Hillary should stay out of the 2020 race. Lose twice, one inexcusably so, and you are dunzo.
I really think that it was said exactly right earlier: Clinton has no fucks to give. She’s like the older relative who just says what she thinks now. The impact it has? I don’t think she gives a shit.

She’s right, and she’s right to think that attention to Russian machinations should be paid. Her saying it, and saying it how she said it, very much the wrong thing to do. But IMHO she don’t care.

She’d have been a good president but she’s an awful losing candidate and a worse party elder. Smart yes, wise no.
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  #360  
Old 10-23-2019, 09:00 PM
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She’d have been a good president but she’s an awful losing candidate and a worse party elder. Smart yes, wise no.
That's giving her far too much benefit of the doubt. Her displays as a bad losing candidate and party elder raise a lot of doubt how good a President she would have been. It wouldn't have been all sunny days in office.

I guess must add "still better than Trump" to at least cut down on the people who will rush to point that out to me.
  #361  
Old 10-24-2019, 01:06 AM
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...Of course Gabbard is not meeting with Sergei the Spy in a smoky cafe somewhere.
Have you heard about the Gabbard "Kill Moose and Squirrel!" Bill?
  #362  
Old 10-25-2019, 09:47 AM
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Gabbard to Hannity:
"Appearing on “Hannity” Thursday, the presidential candidate said she originally supported the inquiry, but she stressed the need for transparency.


“I don't know what's going on in those closed doors,” Gabbard said. “We as members of Congress do not have access to the information that's being shared. I think the American people deserve to know exactly what the facts are, what the evidence is being presented as this inquiry goes on.”
(Warning: Link goes to Faux)
https://www.foxnews.com/media/dem-tu...e-closed-doors
  #363  
Old 10-25-2019, 09:51 AM
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Very possible that Tulsi is angling for a show on Fox news. She denounces David Duke's endorsement, but has no compunction about aiding and abetting another white supremacist (if a tad more subtle than Duke) Tucker Carlson on his show, as well as Trump bestie (and fellow aider/abetter of white supremacists) Sean Hannity. Still no traction with the Democratic primary electorate, thankfully, but she has a real future in right-wing infotainment.

Last edited by iiandyiiii; 10-25-2019 at 09:51 AM.
  #364  
Old 10-25-2019, 07:00 PM
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Very possible that Tulsi is angling for a show on Fox news. She denounces David Duke's endorsement, but has no compunction about aiding and abetting another white supremacist (if a tad more subtle than Duke) Tucker Carlson on his show, as well as Trump bestie (and fellow aider/abetter of white supremacists) Sean Hannity. Still no traction with the Democratic primary electorate, thankfully, but she has a real future in right-wing infotainment.
Yes, you may be on to something, there.

Certainly she has to know the Democratic Party is never going to embrace her. A job with conservative media after her (inevitable?) 3rd-party candidacy spoils the election enough to keep Trump in office, may be her game-plan.
  #365  
Old 10-25-2019, 09:52 PM
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As a "nuts and bolts" question, don't a lot of states have so-called "sore loser" laws that would prevent a person defeated in the primary from running as a 3rd party candidate?
  #366  
Old 10-26-2019, 01:01 PM
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Every new item of news about her further goes to show that you just can't trust her. She is obviously hiding something behind that disingenuous façade. What we do know she's hiding is her substantial ties with the Science of Identity homophobic, Islamophobic authoritarian hate cult. Makes you wonder what else she's hiding. Even though her cult involvement has been thoroughly exposéed by investigative journalism, most of the official public mention of her still seems reluctant to say the emperor has no clothes on.

There's on ongoing battle royal behind the scenes at Wikipedia, because Gabbard partisan editors are exploiting Wikipedia's rule that you're not allowed to say the emperor has no clothes on unless the emperor publicly says in a reliable source, "I'm totally not wearing any clothes, yo." They're fighting tooth and nail to exclude any mention of Butler and his cult from any article concerning Gabbard.

Papa Mike Gabbard is an even bigger emperor with no clothes, since his active involvement in the Butler hate cult is exhaustively documented, but many commentators still credit his cover story about being "Roman Catholic."
  #367  
Old 10-26-2019, 02:27 PM
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Tulsi announcing she won't run for reelection to her Congressional seat sure sounds like she's going to make a third party run.
And when she doesn't win that, she can go to work for RT.
  #368  
Old 10-26-2019, 02:48 PM
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As a "nuts and bolts" question, don't a lot of states have so-called "sore loser" laws that would prevent a person defeated in the primary from running as a 3rd party candidate?
Usually doesn't apply to presidential candidates. Don't know if these have been tested for constitutionality, specifically for senate and house elections. Not sure if it should matter in state elections.
  #369  
Old 10-26-2019, 03:28 PM
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And not too sure she has actually lost anything, yet, to be honest
  #370  
Old 10-26-2019, 03:32 PM
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You got me there. Bote isn't even an asset for the Cubs.
Bote is quite a good player stuck on a team that doesn't have a full time role for him.

I don't know why the Blue Jays haven't traded for him yet, but I would assume it's because they're stupid.

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Tulsi announcing she won't run for reelection to her Congressional seat sure sounds like she's going to make a third party run.
And when she doesn't win that, she can go to work for RT.
Gabbard is apparently facing a rough primary challenge and she cannot actually be stupid enough to think she has a shot as being President, so it's not so much that she's going to go work for Fox News/RT if things don't work out politically. She is doing what she's doing to go work for Fox News/RT, straight up. That's why she's on Fox all the time.
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Last edited by RickJay; 10-26-2019 at 03:33 PM.
  #371  
Old 10-27-2019, 12:14 AM
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I'd still vote for her over a Republican. Now that she's not running for reelection, that makes the Dem choice more palatable here in Hawaii.
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  #372  
Old 10-27-2019, 05:13 PM
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It's likely that the ongoing stream of exposés of her very questionable background has convinced her that her cover story is ultimately not going to work, that her campaign cannot much longer survive all the investigative work by journalists like Christine Gralow. In retrospect, it seems terribly naïve that Gabbard thought her façade would hold up through the electoral year when it's already crumbling now.

She may have been holding this exit strategy in reserve. Time to deploy plan B.
  #373  
Old 12-02-2019, 09:07 PM
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Gabbard is nothing but a headache for the whole Democratic party.

Democratic establishment reaches boiling point with Tulsi Gabbard

Key pull quote: “She sort of seems to be filling a pretty strange lane. Is there a part of the party that hates the party?” said Sen. Chris Murphy (D-Conn.). “It’s a little hard to figure out what itch she’s trying to scratch in the Democratic Party right now.” (Emphasis mine.)

She doesn't have anything at all to contribute besides attacks on other Democrats and making Republicans happy.
  #374  
Old 12-02-2019, 09:15 PM
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I blame Bernie and the Bros. They're the ones who started the conspiracy theories against the Democratic party and led credence to the idea that there's some party machine that conspires to make sure that candidates who barely pull 1 fucking percentage point in a poll of polls are somehow squeezed out of sight.

Christ, Gabby, you barely got above 1 percent - what the fuck does the world owe you?
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Old 12-02-2019, 09:47 PM
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I blame Bernie and the Bros. They're the ones who started the conspiracy theories against the Democratic party and led credence to the idea that there's some party machine that conspires to make sure that candidates who barely pull 1 fucking percentage point in a poll of polls are somehow squeezed out of sight.

Christ, Gabby, you barely got above 1 percent - what the fuck does the world owe you?
I do as well. The ridiculous conspiracy theories about the DNC were insane, they’re the equivalent of a Bond villain or a medieval king.

The DNC bent over backwards to accommodate all candidates and didn’t hold kiddie table debates. There’s no way Tulsi, Steyer, or Yang should have been in the last debate. The voting starts for real and it’ll be fast and furious once it does. Get rid of the marginal clowns now.
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  #376  
Old 12-02-2019, 10:01 PM
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I blame Bernie and the Bros. They're the ones who started the conspiracy theories against the Democratic party and led credence to the idea that there's some party machine that conspires to make sure that candidates who barely pull 1 fucking percentage point in a poll of polls are somehow squeezed out of sight.

Christ, Gabby, you barely got above 1 percent - what the fuck does the world owe you?
Because we dragged the overton window to the left you now have candidates running on progressive policies which are popular enough to keep ratings high so ofc mainstream media is going to have them on the stage.

You can blame "conspiracy theories against the democratic party" but it's the actual things that happened, such as Hillary receiving debate questions, or the DNC doing their damnest to figure out a way to keep Bernie from getting the nomination, that led to the backlash. IF the democratic party wasn't so weak, corrupt, and pathetic maybe they wouldn't have lost a thousand seats under my favorite non-republican republican, centrist obama. Nor would they have lost to Trump of all people.

Keep playing the blame game and see how far it gets you. Just a hint, it wont get you too far with Americans now. Do not call yourself a "liberal" if you aren't willing to accept new things such as the sudden surge of progressive voters.
  #377  
Old 12-02-2019, 10:02 PM
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oh and can someone please let Harris know Tulsi is within margin of error matched with her atm.
  #378  
Old 12-02-2019, 10:49 PM
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Kamala Harris is the Rick Perry of 2020. What a hyped candidate and what a massive fall. But I'm glad for that vetting process. Her complete inability to put together a campaign with clear lines of authority clues us in as to how unready she'd be to manage the executive branch.

As for Tulsi, I like her as a person, disagree with her on most things.
  #379  
Old 12-03-2019, 12:32 AM
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Hillary receiving debate questions, or the DNC doing their damnest to figure out a way to keep Bernie from getting the nomination, that led to the backlash. IF the democratic party wasn't so weak, corrupt, and pathetic

Keep playing the blame game and see how far it gets you.
The irony, it burns!

Is Bernie Sanders a Democrat or an Independent?

If he's an Independent, why should Democrats entertain the idea of him getting their nomination?

If he's a Democrat, why does he insist on campaigning for Senate as an Independent?
  #380  
Old 12-03-2019, 12:33 AM
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The irony, it burns!

Is Bernie Sanders a Democrat or an Independent?

If he's an Independent, why should Democrats entertain the idea of him getting their nomination?

If he's a Democrat, why does he insist on campaigning for Senate as an Independent?
This is what centrists keep saying. "Well it's the democratic party, and he's an independent" yeah and what is your point? You're literally condoning the shit they pulled in 2016. Just, no.
  #381  
Old 12-04-2019, 07:53 AM
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Useless to keep replaying 2016 now. Water under the bridge, get over it.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:00 AM
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This is what centrists keep saying. "Well it's the democratic party, and he's an independent" yeah and what is your point? You're literally condoning the shit they pulled in 2016. Just, no.
Insisting that candidates actually be a member of the party whose candidate they are is not an unreasonable criterion. That's the point.
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Old 12-04-2019, 02:14 PM
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The irony, it burns!

Is Bernie Sanders a Democrat or an Independent?

If he's an Independent, why should Democrats entertain the idea of him getting their nomination?

If he's a Democrat, why does he insist on campaigning for Senate as an Independent?
It’s the least they could do after co-opting his best policies.
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:02 PM
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This is what centrists keep saying. "Well it's the democratic party, and he's an independent" yeah and what is your point? You're literally condoning the shit they pulled in 2016. Just, no.
If he's an Independent, why should Democrats entertain the idea of him getting their nomination?
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Old 12-04-2019, 06:12 PM
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If he's an Independent, why should Democrats entertain the idea of him getting their nomination?
Becuse it's meaningless to be a Democrat. There's no barrier to entry, no requirements to fulfill and no way to be kicked out. So what's the difference?
  #386  
Old 12-18-2019, 10:36 PM
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Defying party, Gabbard votes ‘present’ on Trump impeachment
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Already comfortable as an outlier in her party, Democratic presidential candidate Tulsi Gabbard did not support the impeachment of President Donald Trump, voting “present” Wednesday on two articles that cleared the House.
Quote:
Gabbard was one of just a handful of Democrats who did not back impeachment. Two Democrats voted against the first article: Rep. Jeff Van Drew of New Jersey, who is considering switching parties to become a Republican, and Rep. Collin Peterson of Minnesota, whose district went overwhelmingly for Trump in 2016. Those two and freshman Democratic Rep. Jared Golden of Maine also voted against the second article.

Trump, at a rally Wednesday night in Michigan, celebrated that “three Democrats went over to our side.”
She will never be a Democratic Party candidate for POTUS now.
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Old 12-18-2019, 10:47 PM
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Late Wednesday night, Tulsi Gabbard announced she was introducing a resolution to censure Donald Trump for abusing the powers of the presidency for his own personal gain.

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After doing my due diligence in reviewing the 658-page impeachment report, I came to the conclusion that I could not in good conscience vote either yes or no
So you can't decide whether Trump is guilty of the conduct he was accused of, but that he ought to be censured for it anyway.

Blow your resolution out your ass, Tulsi.
  #388  
Old 12-18-2019, 10:51 PM
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Gabbard: present.
Gabbard's spine: absent.
  #389  
Old 12-21-2019, 01:59 PM
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Gabbard: present.
Gabbard's spine: absent.
Now, now, now, it takes a lot of courage to stand up for your Russian overlords when you're in theory a member of the Democratic Party. I'm sure she'll appear in the next Russian-language edition of "Profiles in Courage."
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Old 12-21-2019, 02:42 PM
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Gabbard is nothing but a headache for the whole Democratic party.

Democratic establishment reaches boiling point with Tulsi Gabbard

Key pull quote: “She sort of seems to be filling a pretty strange lane. Is there a part of the party that hates the party?” said Sen. Chris Murphy (D-Conn.). “It’s a little hard to figure out what itch she’s trying to scratch in the Democratic Party right now.” (Emphasis mine.)

She doesn't have anything at all to contribute besides attacks on other Democrats and making Republicans happy.
If there's a part of the country that hates the country, then maybe she is inching towards them too.
  #391  
Old 12-21-2019, 04:07 PM
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Becuse it's meaningless to be a Democrat. There's no barrier to entry, no requirements to fulfill and no way to be kicked out. So what's the difference?
In attempting to knock down the argument you actually reinforce it. If it's so darn easy to become a Democrat, the fact that Sanders continues to seek the nomination as an independent speaks volumes.
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Old 12-21-2019, 04:36 PM
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... She will never be a Democratic Party candidate for POTUS now.
You thought maybe she had a chance last week?
  #393  
Old 12-21-2019, 05:35 PM
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In attempting to knock down the argument you actually reinforce it. If it's so darn easy to become a Democrat, the fact that Sanders continues to seek the nomination as an independent speaks volumes.
He had to officially declare himself a Dem to be in the race. So for the next few months he's a Dem. You are flat out wrong that I proved anything contrary to my point. The fact that he runs as an independent for his Senate seat speaks only to how he gets elected in Vermont.
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Old 12-21-2019, 06:05 PM
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Let me ask you a question, E-DUB, since we're in the Gabbard thread: who do you think has a better Dem voting record: Sanders or Gabbard?
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Old 12-21-2019, 06:30 PM
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Without trying an off-the-cuff analysis of their respective voting records or reffering to their ratings by the various groups that do such things, my intuitive response would probably be Sanders.
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Old 12-21-2019, 06:33 PM
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He had to officially declare himself a Dem to be in the race. So for the next few months he's a Dem. You are flat out wrong that I proved anything contrary to my point. The fact that he runs as an independent for his Senate seat speaks only to how he gets elected in Vermont.
Actually, he runs as a Democrat in Vermont. Only after he wins the Democratic nomination does he declare himself to be an Independent and renounce the Democratic Party.

Is there anything stopping him from doing the same if he should win the nomination for President?

Last edited by bmoak; 12-21-2019 at 06:34 PM.
  #397  
Old 12-21-2019, 06:44 PM
bmoak is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,323
And I forgot the question. Until Tulsi decided to quit the DNC and support Bernie, she had one of the least progressive rankings in the Dem caucus despite being from a +17 district. Progressive Punch currently has her at 148th out of 232 Democrats.
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