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  #51  
Old 01-08-2020, 08:45 AM
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News is reporting that all 170 aboard that Boeing 737 are dead. Tragic as it may be, this may be a good opportunity to end the conflict and nip it in the bud. Trump can send his condolences to Iran, the Iranian government can focus on the crash and investigation, the media in Iran and West can focus on the crash instead, and a week or two later, the war doesn't have to pick up where it left off.
This and they had 50 + crushed to death at the Soleimani funeral.
  #52  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:16 AM
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Does trump want a war? Yes, if it will 1) derail this impeachment nonsense, and/or 2) get him reelected.



Or maybe he thinks that if he takes us to the very brink of war and then stops it, that will 1) derail this impeachment nonsense, and/or 2) get him reelected.
In any case, everything Trump does is purely about image. That will be his only consideration: what kind of act he can put on.
  #53  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:26 AM
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I am pretty sure the North American Aerospace Defense Command doesn't cover the Middle East.
Actually, NORAD is responsible for the detection of Ballistic missiles all over the planet and then assessing whether they are a threat to North America or US and Allied Units world wide. Using US Satellites.
They did it in the Gulf War.

A live example.
  #54  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:28 AM
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This and they had 50 + crushed to death at the Soleimani funeral.
And an earthquake at their nuclear power plant today.
  #55  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:35 AM
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I'm sure Iran doesn't want a war. Why? Because they're sane.

Does trump want a war? Yes, if it will 1) derail this impeachment nonsense, and/or 2) get him reelected.
If 2), your entire country is insane, not just Trump.
  #56  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:41 AM
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If 2), your entire country is insane, not just Trump.
~63 million as of the last count.
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  #57  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:54 AM
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Was nice to wake up and discover the world was not on fire. Thanks Trump. For not over reacting.
  #58  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:54 AM
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Why doesn't Trump just build a wall all around Iran?
  #59  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:07 AM
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Iran clearly doesn't want a full-scale war. My guess is Trump doesn't either but who can say for sure? There will be probably be a limited retaliation by the US on some Iranian military targets and after that my guess is both sides will de-escalate and stick to fighting each other behind the scenes like they have been doing for years.
This.

This Gulf War 3 thread is big bag of hyperbole.

Iran probably went over the line with the attack on the embassy. Trump probably went over the line with the killing of Qasem Soleimani. Iran retaliated by destroying a helo, a tent and damaging a runway. Cooler heads will prevail and we'll continue being advisories.

I know many wanted Trump to get us into a war (one side so they could have one, the other so they could have another reason to hate Trump) but it isn't going to happen.
  #60  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:10 AM
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Why doesn't Trump just build a wall all around Iran?
Pakistan hasn't agreed to pay for it.
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  #61  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:22 AM
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I have a suspicious mind. A Ukrainian Airlines flight crashes shortly after leaving Tehran.
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  #62  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:37 AM
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(one side so they could have one, the other so they could have another reason to hate Trump)
Which side is the one which expects war because Trump is like a five-year-old with very dangerous toys?
  #63  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:40 AM
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Which side is the one which expects war because Trump is like a five-year-old with very dangerous toys?
*raises hand*

Should we start a poll?

Last edited by BeepKillBeep; 01-08-2020 at 10:41 AM.
  #64  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:41 AM
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... the other so they could have another reason to hate Trump....
No, that's not it, but thanks for that short-sighted bit of snark. There are already plenty of reasons to hate him.
  #65  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:47 AM
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Cooler heads will prevail and we'll continue being advisories.
Is that before or after Trump's pre-planned attack on 52 Iranian locations?
  #66  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:48 AM
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Which side is the one which expects war because Trump is like a five-year-old with very dangerous toys?
And yet three years in he hasn't.

So I'd guess it's whatever side you're on.
  #67  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:48 AM
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I know many wanted Trump to get us into a war (one side so they could have one, the other so they could have another reason to hate Trump) but it isn't going to happen.
You say this with the assured confidence of a person enjoying the benefit of knowledge that Trump hasn't started one. Yet.
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  #68  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:53 AM
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This.

This Gulf War 3 thread is big bag of hyperbole.

Iran probably went over the line with the attack on the embassy. Trump probably went over the line with the killing of Qasem Soleimani. Iran retaliated by destroying a helo, a tent and damaging a runway. Cooler heads will prevail and we'll continue being advisories.

I know many wanted Trump to get us into a war (one side so they could have one, the other so they could have another reason to hate Trump) but it isn't going to happen.
Lol, no, I'm not wanting for people to die so I have another reason to hate Trump.

And people who defend Trump tend to have their asses handed to them... by Trump. Things may appear to be 'calmer' this morning, but that doesn't change the fact a childish narcissist assassinated a government figure with the entire globe aware that he did so, nor does it change the fact that the perception of American power as a benign force may very well be gone even among our allies (and has never been seen as benign by a significant fraction of the globe).

Naw, there's no hyperbole here. Even if this doesn't blow up and this thread, God forbid (), should end after 7 pages because Trump's strategy worked to a degree, the events of this year have not made America or Americans safer.

On the other hand, the odds are good this isn't over - right now, it's WAY too soon to say 'it's over', not with Trump at the helm.

Last edited by JohnT; 01-08-2020 at 10:57 AM.
  #69  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:59 AM
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Was nice to wake up and discover the world was not on fire. Thanks Trump. For not over reacting.
YET ......... For not overreacting YET.

The right wing propaganda machine is already in full swing. The Iranian attack was couched in the terms of being a totally unprovoked act of aggression on their part when, in reality, it was in response to a totally unprovoked act of aggression on OUR part.
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  #70  
Old 01-08-2020, 11:08 AM
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YET ......... For not overreacting YET.

The right wing propaganda machine is already in full swing. The Iranian attack was couched in the terms of being a totally unprovoked act of aggression on their part when, in reality, it was in response to a totally unprovoked act of aggression on OUR part.
The top Fox news story is "Commander in chief will address nation after Iran attacks US military for hit on terror general"
  #71  
Old 01-08-2020, 11:35 AM
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I have to wonder where Russia is in all this. They're Iran's ally, aren't they?
  #72  
Old 01-08-2020, 11:37 AM
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So, not too sure what's going on with Trump's breathing, but if I sounded like that I would hope someone would ask after my health.
  #73  
Old 01-08-2020, 11:42 AM
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I know many wanted Trump to get us into a war (one side so they could have one, the other so they could have another reason to hate Trump) but it isn't going to happen.
15 years ago, during the worst of Iraq's post war chaos and violence, I can imagine a younger spifflog blaming anti-Iraq war protesters of hoping for this result as the false promises and bedlam aids in their TRUE goal of hating Bush.

It seems to be part of "the playbook." 1. Engage in mindless violence. 2. Repercussions predictably arise. 3. Blame detractors for acknowledging repercussions.

Last edited by orcenio; 01-08-2020 at 11:44 AM.
  #74  
Old 01-08-2020, 11:44 AM
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...
I know many wanted Trump to get us into a war (one side so they could have one, the other so they could have another reason to hate Trump) but it isn't going to happen.
This is like, "A lot of good people on both sides."

I do not know and do not assert that conservatives/Repubs "want" a war.

But this EXTREMELY liberal Dem can't imagine any folk thinking similarly to me who "want" a war for another reason to hate Trump. Hell - we have enough reasons, and we detest him as much as we can detest just about any human. Not sure I COULD hate him any more.

Far too many liberals/Dems supported the Iraqi invasion - which I considered inexcusable, both on behalf of the admin and the supporters. But I haven't heard ANYONE anywhere on the liberal end of the continuum who does anything other than abhor the prospect of wasting lives and $ on an unnecessary Iran war. Hell, my understanding was that most libs (and many conservs) wished we stayed in the nuke pact.
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  #75  
Old 01-08-2020, 11:51 AM
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This is like, "A lot of good people on both sides."

I do not know and do not assert that conservatives/Repubs "want" a war.

But this EXTREMELY liberal Dem can't imagine any folk thinking similarly to me who "want" a war for another reason to hate Trump. Hell - we have enough reasons, and we detest him as much as we can detest just about any human. Not sure I COULD hate him any more.

Far too many liberals/Dems supported the Iraqi invasion - which I considered inexcusable, both on behalf of the admin and the supporters. But I haven't heard ANYONE anywhere on the liberal end of the continuum who does anything other than abhor the prospect of wasting lives and $ on an unnecessary Iran war. Hell, my understanding was that most libs (and many conservs) wished we stayed in the nuke pact.

Well, a big war with Iran will likely give Trump's eventual Democratic challenger - whoever he or she may be - a big boost come November time.
  #76  
Old 01-08-2020, 11:52 AM
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So, not too sure what's going on with Trump's breathing, but if I sounded like that I would hope someone would ask after my health.
Trump in in perfect health.
  #77  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:02 PM
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It sounds like Trump is staying on his queue cards this morning and not escalating things. I'm very happy to hear that somehow somebody got through to this moron. At least for the moment.
  #78  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:03 PM
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Did anyone notice that Donald
1) Was out of breath
2) An aide took away the folder at 11 am and came back with a different one 15 minutes later.

Was initially a much harder line planned?
  #79  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:06 PM
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Well, a big war with Iran will likely give Trump's eventual Democratic challenger - whoever he or she may be - a big boost come November time.
Has an incumbent President ever lost an election in the midst of war? Not that I'm aware of. I think that's why Trump is doing this, because he thinks it will secure his reelection. It pains me to say this, but he may be right.
  #80  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:17 PM
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By the way, that should have been cue cards not queue cards. I'm doing a lecture on stacks and queues on next week so I guess it was on my mind.
  #81  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:20 PM
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Did anyone notice that Donald
1) Was out of breath
2) An aide took away the folder at 11 am and came back with a different one 15 minutes later.

Was initially a much harder line planned?
Font was too small.
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  #82  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:24 PM
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For those who didn't see it, no American deaths reported. Mr. President says he's backing down (or rather, that Iran backed down by launching such a weak attack).

ETA: Does anyone know if there were Iraqi or coalition casualties?

~Max

Last edited by Max S.; 01-08-2020 at 12:25 PM.
  #83  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:28 PM
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Despite Hussein Obama's financial support for Iran's terrorism and nuclear weapon program, McConnell has not scheduled a vote for his impeachment. Really, no one knows how these internet rumors get started.
  #84  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:34 PM
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Has an incumbent President ever lost an election in the midst of war? Not that I'm aware of.
Truman (Korea) and LBJ (Vietnam) thought so little of their chances they dropped out. GHW Bush lost while Desert Storm was barely cold.
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  #85  
Old 01-08-2020, 12:41 PM
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Did anyone notice that Donald
1) Was out of breath
2) An aide took away the folder at 11 am and came back with a different one 15 minutes later.
The original folder contained Eric's Yogi Bear poster. When KellyAnne realized Donald grabbed the wrong one, there was a zig-zagging relay race across the West Wing between staffers to get the correct folder to Donald in time. I believe, although it hasn't been confirmed, the William Tell Overture was playing in the background.

Last edited by Happy Lendervedder; 01-08-2020 at 12:44 PM.
  #86  
Old 01-08-2020, 01:02 PM
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1) Was out of breath
I wouldn't say "out of breath," but he was doing that weird sniffle thing that he does during many of his major performances, like State of the Union or the Clinton debates. I'm wondering if he does a line of coke or something before he goes on stage....

Something that the White House physician probably needs to look into: "He's got his coke habit TOTALLY UNDER CONTROL! He's going to be doing lines for ANOTHER 50 YEARS!"
  #87  
Old 01-08-2020, 01:13 PM
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Well, a big war with Iran will likely give Trump's eventual Democratic challenger - whoever he or she may be - a big boost come November time.
EVEN if this is true, I have NOT heard a hint of any Dems/liberals say as much. I suspect you should be able to dig up someone trolling as much somewhere on the net.

And, as Blaron says, starting a war seems to generally be one of the surest ways for a President to get a bump in the pools.
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  #88  
Old 01-08-2020, 01:35 PM
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His "All is well" tweet makes me think he had some knowledge that we're not privy to, perhaps even in advance of the actual "attack." He just doesn't know how to play his cards, and he telegraphs way sooner than he should. No person in their right mind would tweet out "All is well" less than three hours after missiles hit a base where American soldiers live, unless he knew, for a fucking fact, that it was a nothingburder. He's just too stupid to even play along to make the 'tit for tat' look legit.
I think you nailed it.
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Old 01-08-2020, 02:15 PM
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I think you nailed it.
It's just another act in Trump's dog-and-pony show. He's always done this kind of crap, in one form or another.

He shits on the carpet or chews up the sofa, and then after his butt-licking lackeys clean up after him, he says, "Look! I saved the day!", and his dumb-ass supporters believe it.

For three years we've been going through this endless cycle of pointless distractions, while nothing positive otherwise gets done--in fact, Trump's swap-dweller administration just exploits it to screw the nation while no one notices.
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Old 01-08-2020, 03:11 PM
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  #91  
Old 01-08-2020, 03:16 PM
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Iran probably went over the line with the attack on the embassy. Trump probably went over the line with the killing of Qasem Soleimani. Iran retaliated by destroying a helo, a tent and damaging a runway. Cooler heads will prevail and we'll continue being advisories.
Dammit, I liked that tent!
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Old 01-08-2020, 03:32 PM
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I'm wondering if he does a line of coke or something before he goes on stage....

Something that the White House physician probably needs to look into: "He's got his coke habit TOTALLY UNDER CONTROL! He's going to be doing lines for ANOTHER 50 YEARS!"
FDR's physician gave him cocaine for a cold before his Pearl Harbor speech.
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Old 01-08-2020, 05:34 PM
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If 2), your entire country is insane, not just Trump.
We love war. We’ve been in perpetual war for 20 years now, it creates jobs and gives people on cable news something to talk about. Trump knows that we never consider a president great until he has fought a war. He’ll get his.

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Old 01-08-2020, 05:47 PM
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I wouldn't say "out of breath," but he was doing that weird sniffle thing that he does during many of his major performances, like State of the Union or the Clinton debates. I'm wondering if he does a line of coke or something before he goes on stage....

Something that the White House physician probably needs to look into: "He's got his coke habit TOTALLY UNDER CONTROL! He's going to be doing lines for ANOTHER 50 YEARS!"
It's just a bad habit and easy to get into when speaking publicly. One has to both breathe and speak forcefully. You speak forcefully and then take a deep breath because you were holding your breath as you spoke. Then you get out of breath, so you breathe harder at pauses, and it causes a cycle that makes it worse. Being overweight doesn't help.

Normally it doesn't happen because you give a 10 to 15 second statement and then listen while another responds. When you are on the spot and know you have to keep speaking, the anxiety makes you breathe harder.

You learn to to breathe while speaking, maybe pausing to catch your breath and pretend to look at notes if you need to do so. I'll admit that Trump doesn't take advice well, but this very common for public speakers. This nonsense of doing a line of coke is just a cheap shot.
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Old 01-08-2020, 05:53 PM
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Care to name other poor public speakers who have his same affliction?

ETA: And I don't think a cheap shot at Trump is possible. But you probably think calling him a liar is a cheap shot, regardless of the 13,000 fibs he's told.

Last edited by Ravenman; 01-08-2020 at 05:56 PM.
  #96  
Old 01-08-2020, 06:01 PM
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15,000. Your numbers are two months out of date.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...ims-over-days/
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Old 01-08-2020, 06:36 PM
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It's just a bad habit and easy to get into when speaking publicly. One has to both breathe and speak forcefully. You speak forcefully and then take a deep breath because you were holding your breath as you spoke. Then you get out of breath, so you breathe harder at pauses, and it causes a cycle that makes it worse. Being overweight doesn't help.

Normally it doesn't happen because you give a 10 to 15 second statement and then listen while another responds. When you are on the spot and know you have to keep speaking, the anxiety makes you breathe harder.

You learn to to breathe while speaking, maybe pausing to catch your breath and pretend to look at notes if you need to do so. I'll admit that Trump doesn't take advice well, but this very common for public speakers. This nonsense of doing a line of coke is just a cheap shot.
bullshit -

He only does this to this degree when he's clearly reading 'prepared' remarks that he has no idea what he is about to say and is completely unfamilar with the topic at hand.

He doesn't do it quite as bad during his un-scripted bullshit sessions.

Secondly - anyone that has been speaking in public for any period of time knows how NOT to do what you describe - new speakers - sure - experienced - no.
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Old 01-08-2020, 11:50 PM
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So, not too sure what's going on with Trump's breathing, but if I sounded like that I would hope someone would ask after my health.
Quote:
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I wouldn't say "out of breath," but he was doing that weird sniffle thing that he does during many of his major performances, like State of the Union or the Clinton debates. I'm wondering if he does a line of coke or something before he goes on stage....

Something that the White House physician probably needs to look into: "He's got his coke habit TOTALLY UNDER CONTROL! He's going to be doing lines for ANOTHER 50 YEARS!"
Snorting Adderall, actually. Or, so say rumors going back years.
  #99  
Old 01-09-2020, 12:25 AM
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Care to name other poor public speakers who have his same affliction?

ETA: And I don't think a cheap shot at Trump is possible. But you probably think calling him a liar is a cheap shot, regardless of the 13,000 fibs he's told.
Also, it relies on the idea that Trump is somehow new to public speaking, when in fact his previous career is reality TV show host (and failed real estate developer).
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Old 01-09-2020, 09:40 AM
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Pelosi announced Wednesday that the House will vote Thursday on a resolution to limit the presidentís ability to authorize military action in Iran without congressional consent. Trump tweets to House Republicans: vote against "another Democrat fraud"!
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