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Old 10-11-2019, 07:05 AM
Paul in Qatar is offline
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What Sort of Mask do I Need for a Riot?


I just saw a pictorial guide for what the well-dressed Hong Kong protesters are wearing.

-=linky=-

I suppose the main thing is to not stand out and use helmets, masks and clothing as much as possible to disrupt efforts to identify particular people.


But my mind turns to the gas mask. What sort would one need? Ideally a full-face mask that covers the eyes. A "real" gas mask would be best. What about the sort used by painters? What about simple gauze?


I admit I have never given it much thought before.
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Old 10-11-2019, 09:15 AM
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You can get those replaceable cartridge filter masks by 3M for pretty cheap, but the real question depends on what tear gas (CS) actually is categorized as.

3M sells a LOT of various filters that are compatible, although according to the CDC, you want an organic vapor filter of some kind and a pretty high filtration particulate filter (N100)

https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npg/npgd0119.html
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Old 10-11-2019, 09:20 AM
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How about a Guy Fawkes paintball mask?
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Old 10-11-2019, 09:36 AM
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It's getting difficult to keep up with the political unrest. I already keep a yellow vest in the car in case I run across a protest. Now I'll have to get a gas mask. Be cool if they made those in the shape of a Darth Vader helmet.
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Old 10-11-2019, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul in Qatar View Post
But my mind turns to the gas mask. What sort would one need? Ideally a full-face mask that covers the eyes. A "real" gas mask would be best. What about the sort used by painters? What about simple gauze?
You're trying to block certain gases and fine particulates, so simple gauze will be inadequate to this task; you need a filter rated for for the job. "P100" is a pretty common type of filter that blocks 99.97% of airborne particles at the 0.3-micron size (and generally does better for larger and smaller particle sizes), and their performance isn't diminished by oily mists. You'll also need the ability to absorb organic vapors, which generally means a cartridge packed with activated charcoal (as opposed to a simple mechanical filter).

Tear gas, as the name suggests, affects the eyes along with the respiratory system. A simple half-mask respirator, by itself, wouldn't provide adequate protection. Goggles along with the half-mask would do it, but they can't be the typical chem-lab goggles, since these have anti-fogging vents that would admit tear gas to the eyes. You'd want some kind of swim goggles, since these would completely isolate the eyes from exposure. And since your half-mask respirator will already be covering your nose, that means you need eyes-only swim goggles, i.e. the type seen in competitive swimming (as opposed to snorkeling). These will likely compromise your peripheral vision, degrading your situational awareness, so a standard full-face respirator might be a better solution for survival in a venue that is rife with physical hazards.

I was surprised to see that full-face respirators are so affordable, as little as $40 on Amazon. That's about the total you'd pay for a decent half-mask respirator and swim goggles together.
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Old 10-11-2019, 10:06 AM
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Old 10-11-2019, 10:20 AM
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Thanks to Machine Elf. Thanks to you all.
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Last edited by Paul in Qatar; 10-11-2019 at 10:24 AM.
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Old 10-11-2019, 10:35 AM
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As an aside, people can also be identified by their gait (among other things).

So the au currant protester needs facial concealment, a respirator (full face best), an untraceable route home, and a practised limp.

ETA: A 'reversible' jacket would be a fine accoutrement.

Last edited by KarlGauss; 10-11-2019 at 10:38 AM.
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Old 10-11-2019, 10:50 AM
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Don't forget adequate gloves: you don't want to pick up those hot CS canisters with bare hands when you throw them back at the cops.

Not sure what to do about the dyes they add to the water cannon, but you wouldn't be wearing your best clothes to a riot anyway.
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Old 10-11-2019, 12:09 PM
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When I was in London in 1999 we found ourselves in the middle of Mayday riots. Quie something, the riot squad police galloping by on big horses with horse-armour type riot gear on. When we go on the subway (tube) there were three or four young fellows talking among each other about how they'd trashed the McDonalds (did they ever!) and they were busy changing their shirts, hats, shoes - apparently even back then the police would try to match people up from station entrance and exit cameras by the clothing they wore to get good face shots (Plus find which station was near their home).

(Same was done with security footage for the Vancouver Stanley Cup riots - match people by clothing)

Today's systems are even more sophisticated, apparently - given a large collection of videos, it can follow particular persons based on things like clothing from one camera to the next, establishing a timeline of who was where and did what. So gas masks are not enough. The reason some HK protesters wear simple cloth face masks is to hide their faces and foil face recognition cameras. But a good rioter also brings one or more changes of clothes or wears something bland and common.
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Old 10-11-2019, 12:17 PM
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I still have a Richard Nixon mask, which might however prompt both protestors and police to beat me up.*

*assuming they even remembered who Tricky Dick was.
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Old 10-11-2019, 12:24 PM
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a practised limp.
Strapping some weights to one leg, or wearing a boot on one foot and a shoe on the other, ought to nicely obscure one's natural gait.

Marty Feldman: "Walk this way. Here, like this." <offers cane to Gene Wilder>
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Old 10-11-2019, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KarlGauss View Post
As an aside, people can also be identified by their gait (among other things).

So the au currant protester needs facial concealment, a respirator (full face best), an untraceable route home, and a practised limp.

ETA: A 'reversible' jacket would be a fine accoutrement.
Keep a pebble in your pocket, adding a pebble to your shoe to make you limp is an old cold war spy trick.
Quote:
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Don't forget adequate gloves: you don't want to pick up those hot CS canisters with bare hands when you throw them back at the cops.

Not sure what to do about the dyes they add to the water cannon, but you wouldn't be wearing your best clothes to a riot anyway.
Yes on the gloves, but you might want to go ahead and get a tyvec hooded suit with boot covers, go full on techdrone - has the advantage of not leaving behind any DNA evidence [skin flakes, oils or hairs] and you can strip it all off and stuff it into a reusable shopping bag ... along with the respirator.
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Old 10-11-2019, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Machine Elf View Post
Strapping some weights to one leg, or wearing a boot on one foot and a shoe on the other, ought to nicely obscure one's natural gait.

Marty Feldman: "Walk this way. Here, like this." <offers cane to Gene Wilder>
Add a hump and then switch from one shoulder to the other so they can't keep track of you.
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Old 10-11-2019, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by aruvqan View Post
Keep a pebble in your pocket, adding a pebble to your shoe to make you limp is an old cold war spy trick.


Yes on the gloves, but you might want to go ahead and get a tyvec hooded suit with boot covers, go full on techdrone - has the advantage of not leaving behind any DNA evidence [skin flakes, oils or hairs] and you can strip it all off and stuff it into a reusable shopping bag ... along with the respirator.
It's difficult to run or do anything athletic like climb fences while wearing Tyvek.
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Old 10-11-2019, 02:55 PM
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Fashionable, but functional
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Old 10-11-2019, 03:39 PM
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What about one of those old time-y creepy bird gas masks:
https://www.amazon.com/Raxwalker-Cos...apparel&sr=1-9
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Old 10-11-2019, 04:14 PM
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Don't be selfish. This is a Peoples protest after all. Also what better way to blend in than if everyone looks alike. Box of six Tyvek suits $30.99 on Amazon.
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Old 10-11-2019, 08:48 PM
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The HazMat suit would make you noticeable. "Everybody keep an eye on the guy in the white suit."

As for the gait recognition, I would think that would be a very small threat, given the number of people involved. At this point you could arrest ten people at the office water cooler and nab eight protesters.
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Old 10-12-2019, 12:16 AM
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How good can a protective suit really be if you can get six of them for $30?
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Old 10-12-2019, 01:23 AM
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Tyvek is an excellent protective suit...until it rips out at the crotch because ya got the one that was too small, and yeah, they rip pretty easily, said the guy who used to wear them pretty regularly for work.

Pro tip, you may want the yellow water proof suits instead, yeah, you stand out more, but they are slightly less prone to tearing.
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Old 10-12-2019, 02:35 AM
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Tyvek is an excellent protective suit...until it rips out at the crotch because ya got the one that was too small, and yeah, they rip pretty easily, said the guy who used to wear them pretty regularly for work.
My crotch is also extremely large, it's difficult to find protection that covers it adequately.
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Old 10-12-2019, 06:46 AM
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Strapping some weights to one leg, or wearing a boot on one foot and a shoe on the other, ought to nicely obscure one's natural gait.

Marty Feldman: "Walk this way. Here, like this." <offers cane to Gene Wilder>
From Royal Canadian Air Farce:

Armand (Head Waiter, House of Commons Cafeteria): "Ah, Mister Mulroney, walk this way please..."

Prime Minister Mulroney: "If I could walk that way, I wouldn't be Conservative."
  #24  
Old 10-12-2019, 08:50 AM
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Strapping some weights to one leg, or wearing a boot on one foot and a shoe on the other, ought to nicely obscure one's natural gait.

Marty Feldman: "Walk this way. Here, like this." <offers cane to Gene Wilder>
I was thinking something more... Duneish.
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Old 10-13-2019, 03:04 PM
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Blue lasers (405nm) seem to disrupt digital cameras far worse than green. They overload more pixels. Keep one in hand, or on top of hat/helmet. Although the later might make you too unique.
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Old 10-14-2019, 01:47 PM
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What about one of those old time-y creepy bird gas masks:
https://www.amazon.com/Raxwalker-Cos...apparel&sr=1-9
#1 and most important, NOT a gas mask!

#2 Steam Punk is not old time-y, it is wannabe "old time-y"
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Old 10-14-2019, 02:02 PM
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#1 and most important, NOT a gas mask!

#2 Steam Punk is not old time-y, it is wannabe "old time-y"
That isn't a "Steam Punk" mask. While it may have been adopted by some admirers of Steam Punk fashion, it's more commonly associated with it's original purpose. It's the mask worn by plague doctors in the mid 1600s. That's definitely "old time-y". I certainly don't look at that mask and think, "steam punk". I think, "plague".
  #28  
Old 10-15-2019, 11:09 AM
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Tyvek doesn't breathe. if you're exerting yourself (running, climbing fences, etc.) you will steam yourself.
OTOH, it is thin, there's no reason that it can't be a base layer under jeans or grey sweats other than how hot it'll be.
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