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  #7651  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Evil Economist View Post
The officer murdering that one black kid was just the spark that set the whole thing off.
The fact that you still call it a "murder" despite it having been conclusively proven that it was no such thing just proves the effectiveness of the big lie.
  #7652  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:32 PM
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The fact that you still call it a "murder" despite it having been conclusively proven that it was no such thing just proves the effectiveness of the big lie.
It's a big lie that's engulfed you too! The truth is right in front of your eyes--it was the long-term abuse of black people in Ferguson that created the BLM movement, right? It was the police who implemented and carried-out the long-term abuse, right? It was the police who murdered Brown that created the spark that set the whole thing off, right?Clearly the police are at the bottom of this whole thing!

Don't stop questioning now, Smapti, keep digging!
  #7653  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:32 PM
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It's almost as though you understand that police jumping the gun is a problem. You kinda get it when they're setting dogs on infants, but you don't quite get it when they're gunning down unarmed children or old ladies.
I'm still voting for replicant. A bot would be better programmed.
  #7654  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:35 PM
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The truth is right in front of your eyes--it was the long-term abuse of black people in Ferguson that created the BLM movement, right? It was the police who implemented and carried-out the long-term abuse, right? It was the police who murdered Brown that created the spark that set the whole thing off, right?Clearly the police are at the bottom of this whole thing!
If you want to play it that way, then it comes down to a dysfunctional system of city governments that rely excessively on police citations as a source of revenue, either because the voters refuse to set appropriate tax rates, or because the city is no longer fundamentally capable of paying its bills.
  #7655  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:38 PM
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If you want to play it that way, then it comes down to a dysfunctional system of city governments that rely excessively on police citations as a source of revenue, either because the voters refuse to set appropriate tax rates, or because the city is no longer fundamentally capable of paying its bills.
No, you idiot! If that were true then the BLM movement would be justified and not just a cover for the de-militarization of US police forces. Since the BLM people are just patsies, it must go deeper! Keep digging, Smapti!
  #7656  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:41 PM
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Clearly this is a long term plan, and clearly the police are at the bottom of it. Keep digging Smapti!
It's insidious. Connect the dot, sheeple!
  #7657  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:44 PM
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...and more than a decade later....SDMB members are still trying to get Smapti to admit that a badge does not instantly transform a human being into an infallible agent of good. I am betting if Smapti's on-line personality is their in person personality that they would be the first to volunteer to take a shower or ride on a train when the government asks.
  #7658  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:46 PM
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No, you idiot! If that were true then the BLM movement would be justified and not just a cover for the de-militarization of US police forces.
It's as if you don't understand that they're using the things you agree with in order to get you to support acting against your own best interest.

The Republican Party's been doing it for 50 years.
  #7659  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:49 PM
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...and more than a decade later....SDMB members are still trying to get Smapti to admit that a badge does not instantly transform a human being into an infallible agent of good.
What it does turn them into is an agent of the government who is entitled to respect and obedience.
  #7660  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:51 PM
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It's as if you don't understand that they're using the things you agree with in order to get you to support acting against your own best interest.
Trust me, I know as well as anyone that allowing the police to randomly murder black people is in my own best interest. So naturally I don't want them to stop.

I mean, can you imagine what would happen if they allowed them to vote? Unthinkable!
  #7661  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:53 PM
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What it does turn them into is an agent of the government who is entitled to respect and obedience.
...and to murder people and get away with it.
  #7662  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:55 PM
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Forget about shooting the dog. If he'd broke away them to instinctively protect his kid in the car, they probably would have seen that as proof of guilt and shot him.
Smapti would have. You don't disobey cops, even to protect your own child. If you do this is proof that you are a criminal as you disobeyed a lawful order by a police officer and you deserve to be shot. Right Smapti?
  #7663  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:57 PM
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It's as if you don't understand that they're using the things you agree with in order to get you to support acting against your own best interest.
I forgot to ask, who is 'they' in this sentence? Have you gotten to the bottom of the conspiracy yet, Smapti? Don't be shy, tell us!
  #7664  
Old 12-31-2015, 03:58 PM
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I forgot to ask, who is 'they' in this sentence?
We've been over this already - the anarchists who want the police defenseless and incapable of stopping them from doing whatever the hell they want. Stop playing dumb.
  #7665  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:01 PM
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You don't disobey cops, even to protect your own child. If you do this is proof that you are a criminal as you disobeyed a lawful order by a police officer and you deserve to be shot.
Considering that any act of "protecting your own child" in this case would require assaulting a police officer, it's certainly not a good idea.
  #7666  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:01 PM
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We've been over this already - the anarchists who want the police defenseless and incapable of stopping them from doing whatever the hell they want. Stop playing dumb.
So these anarchists are the ones who forced the police in Ferguson to abuse black people and murder Brown, to spark the BLM movement, to force the police to stop randomly murdering people, so that they could commit their petty street crimes unmolested?

A clever plot.

So, remind me, who are these anarchists? Let's have names so that we can root them out!
  #7667  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:04 PM
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I gotta question...

If the guy had been carrying and he had shot that dog in the midst of it attacking his baby, would the other officers been within their rights to shoot him?
As I understand it, the dog is regarded as an officer. Assaulting a police dog counts as equivalent to assaulting a homo sapiens officer. You are not allowed to harm or kill a police dog in self-defense.
  #7668  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Smapti View Post
Considering that any act of "protecting your own child" in this case would require assaulting a police officer, it's certainly not a good idea.
So . . . if you were in that situation you'd let your toddler be used as a dog's chew toy?
  #7669  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:09 PM
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We've been over this already - the anarchists who want the police defenseless and incapable of stopping them from doing whatever the hell they want. Stop playing dumb.
Those 17 month old anarachists sure are a menace to police.
  #7670  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:10 PM
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So . . . if you were in that situation you'd let your toddler be used as a dog's chew toy?
Considering that the inevitable result of trying to intervene is "I am shot dead for assaulting an officer and my child grows up without a father", then yes.

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So these anarchists are the ones who forced the police in Ferguson to abuse black people and murder Brown, to spark the BLM movement, to force the police to stop randomly murdering people, so that they could commit their petty street crimes unmolested?
No, the anarchists took advantage of a justified shooting of no consequence to start the BLM movement, to drive up mob support for disarming the police.
  #7671  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:11 PM
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Considering that any act of "protecting your own child" in this case would require assaulting a police officer, it's certainly not a good idea.
Some folks believe that protecting a child is a good thing.

Smapti, however, would rather feed a child to a dog.
  #7672  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:12 PM
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Some folks believe that protecting a child is a good thing.

Smapti, however, would rather feed a child to a dog.
In your opinion, if the man in this case had thrown himself at the police dog, would things have turned out better for him, for his child, or for the police department?
  #7673  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:12 PM
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Some folks believe that protecting a child is a good thing.

Smapti, however, would rather feed a child to a dog.
Only if the dog has a badge....which you know, justifies it.
  #7674  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:15 PM
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Only if the dog has a badge....which you know, justifies it.
The dog, in this case, does have a badge. Which makes it a police officer. Which makes any use of force on it "assaulting an officer", with all the risk to one's person that that entails.

You're basically proposing that a man could fight off the police department with his bare hands and that the end result of his attempt would be better than if he'd stood back and allowed the professionals to rein in the animal.

Last edited by Smapti; 12-31-2015 at 04:15 PM.
  #7675  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:15 PM
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No, the anarchists took advantage of a justified shooting of no consequence to start the BLM movement, to drive up mob support for disarming the police.
But the movement only got support because the police were abusing people to begin with, right? So clearly the police were involved in creating an environment that allowed these anarchists to get support....so clearly the police are the anarchists! It's the only explanation that makes sense!

We've solved it Smapti!
  #7676  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:16 PM
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But the movement only got support because the police were abusing people to begin with, right? So clearly the police were involved in creating an environment that allowed these anarchists to get support....so clearly the police are the anarchists! It's the only explanation that makes sense!
The police are only tools of the government that employs them. If your argument is that governments like the one in Ferguson ought to be disbanded and reorganized into units that will better serve the interests of their constituents, you'll get no disagreement from me.
  #7677  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:17 PM
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The dog, in this case, does have a badge. Which makes it a police officer. Which makes any use of force on it "assaulting an officer", with all the risk to one's person that that entails.

You're basically proposing that a man could fight off the police department with his bare hands and that the end result of his attempt would be better than if he'd stood back and allowed the professionals to rein in the animal.
It is only the crime of "assaulting an officer" if the officer is acting lawfully.

But I have given up ever hoping that you ever will concede that a police officer is capable of committing a crime or violating rights.
  #7678  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:18 PM
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It is only the crime of "assaulting an officer" if the officer is acting lawfully.

But I have given up ever hoping that you ever will concede that a police officer is capable of committing a crime or violating rights.
Do you propose to prosecute a dog for civil rights violations, then?
  #7679  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:19 PM
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The police are only tools of the government that employs them. If your argument is that governments like the one in Ferguson ought to be disbanded and reorganized into units that will better serve the interests of their constituents, you'll get no disagreement from me.
Good point. The police were 'only following orders', so they're not guilty at all, right?

Also, just to be clear, are you now saying that the anarchists are the local governments?
  #7680  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:19 PM
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Do you propose to prosecute a dog for civil rights violations, then?
Nope, Most dogs do not even live to the age of majority let alone meet the legal requirements for being charged but it's handler is very much open to prosecution.
  #7681  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:20 PM
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Nope, Most dogs do not even live to the age of majority let alone meet the legal requirements for being charged but it's handler is very much open to prosecution.
Then the dog's handler should be charged for his negligence here.
  #7682  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:20 PM
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In your opinion, if the man in this case had thrown himself at the police dog, would things have turned out better for him, for his child, or for the police department?
Seriously? Have the dog shot, the dog's cop locked away for a few years for assault with a deadly weapon, and the rest of the cops fired for failing to do their duty when they did not stop the cop with the dog.

As far as the father throwing himself at the dog goes, he was too far away to do so, so your silly little question is irrelevant.
  #7683  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:22 PM
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Good point. The police were 'only following orders', so they're not guilty at all, right?
The police are not responsible for the policies they're ordered to enforce. If I'm overweight, it's not my hand's fault for shoving more food into my mouth, and it isn't my mouth's fault for refusing to close.

Quote:
Also, just to be clear, are you now saying that the anarchists are the local governments?
The anarchists are the petty criminals who want a weakened police department. Stop playing dumb.
  #7684  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:23 PM
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Then the dog's handler should be charged for his negligence here.
The dog's handler was police, you anarchist!
  #7685  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:24 PM
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As far as the father throwing himself at the dog goes, he was too far away to do so, so your silly little question is irrelevant.
Then we're in agreement that the scenario you proposed was silly;

Quote:
Some folks believe that protecting a child is a good thing.

Smapti, however, would rather feed a child to a dog.
  #7686  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:25 PM
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The dog's handler was police, you anarchist!
Are you saying that a police officer can't commit a crime?
  #7687  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:26 PM
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The police are only tools
I always figured that police are people. Most are good. Some are bad. All have the responsibility and ability to act ethically.

Sicking a dog on a toddler goes under the heading "bad" in my books, and the bad cop being a cop -- or as you put it, being a tool -- is no excuse what so ever for what he did.
  #7688  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:28 PM
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The police are not responsible for the policies they're ordered to enforce.
Right, the 'just following orders' defense, like I said.


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The anarchists are the petty criminals who want a weakened police department. Stop playing dumb.
See, you're not following the conspiracy properly. BLM was formed as a cover to weaken the police. But BLM only got traction because the police were actually abusing people. But the police were 'just following orders', so it was the local governments who forced the police to abuse people who are at the heart of this conspiracy, so they are the anarchists, right? Your they is the government, right?
  #7689  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:29 PM
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Sicking a dog on a toddler goes under the heading "bad" in my books, and the bad cop being a cop -- or as you put it, being a tool -- is no excuse what so ever for what he did.
We don't disagree on that. The difference is there are people out there for whom "the cop screwed up" isn't a good enough explanation and want to spin elaborate tales about "the cop knew there was a baby in there and unleashed the dog on purpose because cops like hurting people for no reason".
  #7690  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:29 PM
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Are you saying that a police officer can't commit a crime?
You sicken me, you anarchist.
  #7691  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:30 PM
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The police are only tools...
Calling a police officer a tool? you anarchist!!!
  #7692  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:31 PM
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BLM was formed as a cover to weaken the police. But BLM only got traction because the police were actually abusing people. But the police were 'just following orders', so it was the local governments who forced the police to abuse people who are at the heart of this conspiracy, so they are the anarchists, right? Your they is the government, right?
"The government are anarchists" is, of course, an oxymoron, and you will note that the BLM people didn't start out chanting about excessive issuance of speeding tickets or moving violations - it was lies about "Hands up, don't shoot".
  #7693  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:33 PM
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Calling a police officer a tool? you anarchist!!!
"Tool" isn't an insult. It's a statement of fact. The police don't decide policy. They enforce the policies they're ordered to.
  #7694  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:36 PM
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"The government are anarchists" is, of course, an oxymoron
That's what they want you to think.
Quote:
and you will note that the BLM people didn't start out chanting about excessive issuance of speeding tickets or moving violations - it was lies about "Hands up, don't shoot".
Yeah, the BLM movement didn't get traction until the police started killing people. But the police would have known that if they started killing people then people would start protesting, right? So clearly the police were complicit. But the police 'just follow orders', so it was someone above them who came up with this plan, right?


KEEP DIGGING, SMAPTI!
  #7695  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:37 PM
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lies about "Hands up, don't shoot".
Hands up, don't bite the baby!
  #7696  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:51 PM
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"Tool" isn't an insult. It's a statement of fact. The police don't decide policy. They enforce the policies they're ordered to.
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=tool
  #7697  
Old 12-31-2015, 04:58 PM
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"Tool" isn't an insult. It's a statement of fact. The police don't decide policy. They enforce the policies they're ordered to.
OK, non-humorous response.

The police do not create laws but they do create policy in both what laws they enforce and how they enforce them.

There are no laws that require police to aggressively approach a suspect yelling commands in a way that escalates the situation and invokes a fight or flight response from a civilian. This is purely a choice of the police department and their self defined policy.

If your claim was true there would be no reason for DOJ consent decrees and poor and or brown citizen would not be harassed and or arrested in a way that white middle class citizens avoid. There would be no reason for the black lives matter movement to exist if your claim was true as the police would be forced to not violate citizens rights.

Last edited by rat avatar; 12-31-2015 at 04:59 PM.
  #7698  
Old 12-31-2015, 05:02 PM
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The police are not responsible for the policies they're ordered to enforce. <snip>
Bullshit. This defense did not work in the Nuremburg tribunals, it does not work in the military (See US v. Keenan among others), and it will not work with the police either. If the policy that the police are ordered to follow is illegal, the police are liable even thought they are just following orders.
  #7699  
Old 12-31-2015, 05:06 PM
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Bullshit. This defense did not work in the Nuremburg tribunals, it does not work in the military (See US v. Keenan among others), and it will not work with the police either. If the policy that the police are ordered to follow is illegal, the police are liable even thought they are just following orders.
Warning Smapti!!!

Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball!!
  #7700  
Old 12-31-2015, 05:32 PM
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Are you saying that a police officer can't commit a crime?
We're kinda saying that they commit crimes all. the. fucking. time.
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