View Poll Results: Do you think Jeffrey Epstein committed suicide?
Yes 191 59.50%
No 58 18.07%
Not sure 72 22.43%
Voters: 321. You may not vote on this poll

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  #51  
Old 08-13-2019, 11:33 AM
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I voted Not Sure only because I would not be surprised if his demise was, um, assisted...
  #52  
Old 08-13-2019, 11:50 AM
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Yes*

*but with enablement and encouragement from various others to do it as the easy way out and take his secrets to the grave.
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  #53  
Old 08-13-2019, 12:13 PM
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(snip)

I do think he killed himself. I also think it was intentionally made possible for him to do so.
This. I think he was given the opportunity to kill himself by A) leaving him alone, and B) taking him off suicide watch.

While the prison is blaming understaffing and tiredness. I think we do need to know who made the decision to take him off watch and what their reasoning was, including did they suddenly have a big bill they owed paid off or make a major purchase. What is that person's politics?

While I don't really believe the conspiracy theories, I agree that the circumstances are a bit suspicious and a small investigation would go a long way towards relieving people's concerns/imaginations.

I also think the investigation needs to continue as there were many others involved in this damaging game, Trump, Clinton, et al.
  #54  
Old 08-13-2019, 12:16 PM
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Hermann GŲring committed suicide. If he could do it, with the level of care being taken to preserve his life, anyone could do it. Hermann had help. Jeffrey may have had help.

I don't doubt that Jeffrey Epstein killed himself. He waited until it was clear that he was not going to be able to bond / bail out for the trial. He knew the strength of the case against him. He knew that he would never be free again.

What conceivable evidence could he possibly give to reduce his prison time? If he had a clear high-definition video of the T-rump having sex with someone who was screaming, "Stop! I am only 12 years old!!" would that have been enough to trade away for a significantly reduced sentence? No, it would not.

Epstein was just done. He knew it. He took matters into his own hands.

I'm not sure why this is even a question, honestly.
  #55  
Old 08-13-2019, 01:14 PM
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If he had a clear high-definition video of the T-rump having sex with someone who was screaming, "Stop! I am only 12 years old!!" would that have been enough to trade away for a significantly reduced sentence? No, it would not...
I am not sure if you are right or not.

Something like that wouldn't have likely gotten him off scott free with a spring in his step, a twinkle in his eye and a taxpayer-furnished Uber ride to the nearest all-girls high school, but I would guess something like that would have significant leveraging value in the right set of skilled legal hands.

There is no doubt in my mind that many Americans, doubtless more than a few right here on the Straight Dope, would gladly give ol' Uncle Jeffie a "Get Out Of Jail Free, No Hard Feelings Sir, Here's My 17 Year-Old Drug Addled Niece's Phone Number" card for anything that would bring down Trump.
  #56  
Old 08-13-2019, 01:51 PM
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I don't doubt that Jeffrey Epstein killed himself. He waited until it was clear that he was not going to be able to bond / bail out for the trial. He knew the strength of the case against him. He knew that he would never be free again.

What conceivable evidence could he possibly give to reduce his prison time? If he had a clear high-definition video of the T-rump having sex with someone who was screaming, "Stop! I am only 12 years old!!" would that have been enough to trade away for a significantly reduced sentence? No, it would not.

Epstein was just done. He knew it. He took matters into his own hands.

I'm not sure why this is even a question, honestly.
If I was forced to answer yes or no on suicide I'd say 'yes'. But choose 'don't know' in the poll because the negligence by the prison authorities seems so shocking. 'Never attribute to malice what's explained by stupidity' but this case tests that theorem IMO. So I'd rather wait and hear the detailed explanation.

But again I do lean more to yes for some of the reasons you gave. No way could Epstein trade info for a deal as a 'small fish', unless the authorities dealing with him were hell bent by political bias on nailing a particular person on the 'other side' (which could just as conceivably be Bill Clinton as Donald Trump) but there's no real suggestion either Epstein had info implicating anyone else to a degree it would be plausible to give him, Epstein, any real break and have it stand public scrutiny. See the 2007 plea deal with Epstein where there's no actual evidence prosecutors acted improperly but still a firestorm of retroactive criticism in today's environment (I'm not saying they made the right call, but there's no evidence AFAIK they acted corruptly).

Then there's the usual obstacle to believing outrageous conspiracies if you're not into that stuff: 'career' people in the govt are not monolithic politically. Not enough anyway to make it likely they commit or allow serious crimes for political ends and nobody else blows the whistle. Who/what to prosecute and what sleeping dogs to leave lying, yes I think politics does affect those decisions. But having people murdered or allowing their suicide on purpose is a lot different than investigating/prosecuting some things more than others based on politics.

But again this is a such a screw up, 'wait and see' is my answer if that's a choice.

Last edited by Corry El; 08-13-2019 at 01:53 PM.
  #57  
Old 08-13-2019, 02:13 PM
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He might have done it as his final "fuck you" to all those who would use him for information and then lock him up for the rest of his life.
Another factor he may have considered as part of his "fuck you" was knowledge that by killing himself he would be unable to be tried and convicted. This would prevent his ultra expensive properties around the world from being seized in order to provide civil compensation to his victims.
  #58  
Old 08-13-2019, 02:48 PM
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Another factor he may have considered as part of his "fuck you" was knowledge that by killing himself he would be unable to be tried and convicted. This would prevent his ultra expensive properties around the world from being seized in order to provide civil compensation to his victims.
IANAL, but I would think that civil suits against his estate could go forward even though he's dead. If the preponderance of evidence is that he did these things, then couldn't victims get judgments against his estate?
  #59  
Old 08-13-2019, 05:52 PM
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Any competent forensic pathologist would be able to distinguish between self-hanging and an attempt by a killer to simulate suicide. I would probably be able to do it myself if an open book autopsy was allowed and I had access to a good toxicology lab.

I see however that "Epstein's camp" has called in Michael Baden to do an independent autopsy, and given Baden's history, an alternative explanation to suicide is not unlikely.
  #60  
Old 08-13-2019, 06:06 PM
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I don't think he was killed. I am 50/50 split between "they let him commit suicide" and "people are constantly dying on suicide watch because prisons are criminally incompetent".

No doubt the man was despondent. He was truly fucked, for the first time in his life, in solitary, knowing that his powerful friends would breathe easier with him dead.

Whatever comes of this, somebody needs to answer why the prison system didn't seem too interested in safeguarding a guy who was literally the highest-risk, highest profile guy in the entire prison. It's crazy that someone hasn't already been fired for this.
  #61  
Old 08-14-2019, 05:38 AM
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There is no doubt in my mind that many Americans, doubtless more than a few right here on the Straight Dope, would gladly give ol' Uncle Jeffie a "Get Out Of Jail Free, No Hard Feelings Sir, Here's My 17 Year-Old Drug Addled Niece's Phone Number" card for anything that would bring down Trump.
There is no doubt in my mind that you genuinely believe that.
  #62  
Old 08-14-2019, 05:43 AM
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This would prevent his ultra expensive properties around the world from being seized in order to provide civil compensation to his victims.
Wrong. The civil case proceeds. Epstein's victims are going to pick his estate clean like leopards on a zebra carcass.

In fact... though Epstein's criminal complained is now moot, his death strengthens the civil case against him, and the criminal case against others. As of Epstein's death, no living person has grounds for a 4th-amendment challenge to any search warrant against Epstein's estate.
  #63  
Old 08-14-2019, 06:30 AM
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I think a number of people in this thread are forgetting the lessons learned from the Sandra Bland case; "the jailers killed him/gave him the rope" is far less likely than "the jailers were overworked and underequipped".
  #64  
Old 08-14-2019, 06:50 AM
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I voted "Not Sure" - it's entirely plausible that he killed himself (on his own or with "prompting") given what he was facing, but if even some of the stories about him are true there were a lot of powerful people (not all American) who stood to have their dirty little secrets revealed. So suicide or murder are both plausible explanations.

I'm not sold on the whole "He's not really dead; this is all a coverup and he's been spirited away" story, however. Far easier and less risky for Epstein to be really dead.
Yeah, this.
  #65  
Old 08-14-2019, 07:45 AM
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I think a number of people in this thread are forgetting the lessons learned from the Sandra Bland case; "the jailers killed him/gave him the rope" is far less likely than "the jailers were overworked and underequipped".
That is very possible, but it seems frankly bizarre that Jeffrey Epstein, possibly the highest-risk and highest-profile inmate in custody, would have been treated with the same neglect as Sandra Bland.
  #66  
Old 08-14-2019, 09:00 AM
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I don't see why it's hard to believe that a old rich guy whose life is about to go from yacht parties and sexual thrills to steel bars and constant threats and who has just been shoved into solitary confinement in a prison that's constantly getting sued for inhumane conditions would try to kill himself, and that since said prison is so badly understaffed that he wouldn't be getting regular checks that he'd succeed. I'm sure quite a few people wanted him dead and pushed for him to end up where he did in hopes of that happening, but I don't see that there has to be an actual hit on him involved.
  #67  
Old 08-14-2019, 09:10 AM
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I do think he killed himself. I also think it was intentionally made possible for him to do so.
This, but we may not agree on the reason. It seems unlikely to have been arranged by an uncharged (yet) accomplice who needed his own protection, since he could have been dealt with much more quietly and much earlier. Most probably, the guards and warden quietly agreed that it was appropriate for this child-raping scum to clean up the matter himself.
  #68  
Old 08-14-2019, 09:33 AM
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I absolutely believe he committed suicide. I also absolutely believe nobody in charge gave enough of a shit to prevent it.
  #69  
Old 08-14-2019, 09:46 AM
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I totally believe that the guards were inept, understaffed, and overworked.
I've had a lot of friends and relatives who worked in corrections over the years and it's a crappy job that nobody wants to do, they'll hire just about anybody, and because of that you can get as much overtime as you want.
Because the prisons are funded by taxes and run by the gov't they are often run down, face regular budget cuts, and get over crowded. Suicide proof rooms and sheets with 24/7 hi-tech surveillance by highly trained staff is just a thing out of the movies.
  #70  
Old 08-14-2019, 10:00 AM
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There are reports now that the two guards who were assigned to watch Epstein fell asleep for more than three hours, then falsified their reports. They have been placed on administrative leave and face possible criminal charges and the warden has been reassigned. I do hope the guards are prosecuted to the fullest extent.
  #71  
Old 08-14-2019, 10:07 AM
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If you mean did he decide for internal reasons to end his own life? No.

It's pretty easy for me to believe he was murdered either directly by another person, or that he was coerced (Turn out the lights or your family is going out horribly). I'd call both of those murder.
  #72  
Old 08-14-2019, 10:16 AM
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I was just on the phone with my aunt, and she asked "Do you believe in the official story?" and I replied, "They keep changing it".

It wouldn't surprise me one bit if someone killed him, or sent him off to israel, where he can get plastic surgery.

People have been lied to about much bigger things (every war in the last few generations), so I give them no credibility.
  #73  
Old 08-14-2019, 10:37 AM
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I think that the simplest explanation is that he killed himself. But that would not have been possible, but for multiple irregularities in the system. And I think that the simplest explanation for those irregularities is that someone in a position of power ordered those irregularities.

Sure, the prison he was in was overworked and understaffed. But let's not forget that the people in authority specifically chose to move him to that prison.
  #74  
Old 08-14-2019, 11:12 AM
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I can believe in sleepy guards much more easily than I can believe in any of the three preceding theories. Most organizations are like your state's Motor Vehicles office. In other words, a massive clusterfuck. No one really is in power.

Last edited by cochrane; 08-14-2019 at 11:15 AM.
  #75  
Old 08-14-2019, 11:26 AM
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Sure, the prison he was in was overworked and understaffed. But let's not forget that the people in authority specifically chose to move him to that prison.
What prison (technically, jail, since he hadn't been convicted) could they have put him in that ISN'T overworked and understaffed and operated with all of the efficiency of a mid-80s DMV?
  #76  
Old 08-14-2019, 11:33 AM
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I don't see why it's hard to believe that a old rich guy whose life is about to go from yacht parties and sexual thrills to steel bars and constant threats and who has just been shoved into solitary confinement in a prison that's constantly getting sued for inhumane conditions would try to kill himself, and that since said prison is so badly understaffed that he wouldn't be getting regular checks that he'd succeed. I'm sure quite a few people wanted him dead and pushed for him to end up where he did in hopes of that happening, but I don't see that there has to be an actual hit on him involved.
It is not hard to believe that, no.

It is also not hard to believe that somebody offed the son of a bitch.
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  #77  
Old 08-14-2019, 11:49 AM
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It is not hard to believe that, no.

It is also not hard to believe that somebody offed the son of a bitch.
It's hard for me to believe that.
  #78  
Old 08-14-2019, 01:45 PM
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I can believe in sleepy guards much more easily than I can believe in any of the three preceding theories. Most organizations are like your state's Motor Vehicles office. In other words, a massive clusterfuck. No one really is in power.
And this is the most easily believed and most probable cause of it all. Having stood late night watches in the military after a hard day's work, I know that sleep just overcomes you at some point. I'm sure it wasn't the first time these guys slept while on duty, and not the first time they fudged the records. This time it will cost them their jobs.
  #79  
Old 08-14-2019, 01:55 PM
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And this is the most easily believed and most probable cause of it all. Having stood late night watches in the military after a hard day's work, I know that sleep just overcomes you at some point. I'm sure it wasn't the first time these guys slept while on duty, and not the first time they fudged the records. This time it will cost them their jobs.
And most likely, their freedom. I believe the federal government can press charges for falsifying their logs.
  #80  
Old 08-14-2019, 02:21 PM
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It is not hard to believe that, no.

It is also not hard to believe that somebody offed the son of a bitch.
It is, if you look at it reasonably. What evidence is there, exactly, of someone taking positive steps to "off the son of a bitch" in some active way? What motive would they have for taking the high risk option of an assassination rather than the low-risk option of putting him into a place where he's very likely to commit suicide and where the overworked guards will take the fall if he does? Even if someone did want to off him, wouldn't it make sense to wait a week or two to see if he'd succumb to inhumane conditions and absent guards before pulling the trigger?
  #81  
Old 08-14-2019, 03:23 PM
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I have very little doubt that he committed suicide. He tried it before, and it's a common response when a person in a powerful position is brought down with no hope of escaping the consequences.

I recognize that it's possible that someone was convinced either to look the other way or create a scenario where his suicide was easier to facilitate. But the more likely explanation is incompetence.
  #82  
Old 08-14-2019, 11:54 PM
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There are reports now that the two guards who were assigned to watch Epstein fell asleep for more than three hours, then falsified their reports. They have been placed on administrative leave and face possible criminal charges and the warden has been reassigned. I do hope the guards are prosecuted to the fullest extent.
I'd be watching these guard's bank accounts for a while.
  #83  
Old 08-15-2019, 01:10 AM
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Either he was murdered, or he was given the means and opportunity to kill himself by powerful people who wanted him dead. Itís all the same to me, and I absolutely 100% believe one of those two things happened.
  #84  
Old 08-15-2019, 02:22 AM
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Either he was murdered, or he was given the means and opportunity to kill himself by powerful people who wanted him dead. Itís all the same to me, and I absolutely 100% believe one of those two things happened.
Why?

Why is it so difficult to believe that a man who

Has lost all his power and influence,
Whose rich friends have deserted him,
Who was denied bail and was facing the rest of his life doing hard time, where he would be reviled by staff and convicts alike,
and was staying in a notoriously understaffed and incompetently run jail,

Why is it so hard to believe he killed himself?
  #85  
Old 08-15-2019, 02:29 AM
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Either he was murdered, or he was given the means and opportunity to kill himself by powerful people who wanted him dead. Itís all the same to me, and I absolutely 100% believe one of those two things happened.
100% is a pretty high confidence level. What is the evidence that leads to you believe this?
  #86  
Old 08-15-2019, 03:06 AM
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I'd be watching these guard's bank accounts for a while.
Why?

Prison guard isn't a career many people aspire to; it's a job people fall into because their other plans didn't work out. Typical features include low pay, lousy working conditions, boredom, lots of paperwork, dealing with unpleasant people, and lack of accomplishment: at the end of the shift, you usually can't say you made people's lives better or achieved some goal, but merely got through to the end of another tedious shift. Those kinds of job features tend to drive away people who are or want to be enthusiastic or motivated about their work. Who's left?

Think of DMV clerks with even less motivation to care what their "customers" think, for whom fudging the records to cover up sleeping on the job is easier to get away with.
  #87  
Old 08-15-2019, 04:30 AM
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Either he was murdered, or he was given the means and opportunity to kill himself by powerful people who wanted him dead.
For what reason? If anything, the fact that Epstein is dead makes it easier to prosecute anyone he had dirt on, since the dead have no expectation of privacy under the Fourth Amendment and there's nothing to stop the feds from sifting through everything he owned in search of evidence.

Furthermore, was his first suicide attempt also a conspiratorial plot that they somehow screwed up? Or did he try to kill himself for real the first time, and then have a change of heart before he was murdered? If his first hanging attempt was staged, why would they try to stage it the exact same way a second time? If it were a plot, why would the authorities - who presumably are in on it - be openly providing the evidence that's lead you to believe it was staged? Why make it a hanging when there are far less detectible ways of staging a death?

Last edited by Smapti; 08-15-2019 at 04:35 AM.
  #88  
Old 08-15-2019, 04:51 AM
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Suicide proof rooms and sheets with 24/7 hi-tech surveillance by highly trained staff is just a thing out of the movies.
On Amazon I see many security cameras for well under $100. Even if it costs several hundred, plus hundreds for storage, that is a trivial cost when the investigation and trial were going to cost millions. Video surveillance wouldn't necessarily stop him from committing suicide, but it would stop someone from murdering him and staging it as a suicide, and if he did kill himself it would stop us from wondering if it was a murder.

Everyone I saw discussing this case predicted something like this would happen. It's grossly negligent that that no steps were taken to stop it. It means the management of the prison was either completely incompetent, or complicit in his death and preventing us from ever knowing for sure how he died.

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And this is the most easily believed and most probable cause of it all. Having stood late night watches in the military after a hard day's work, I know that sleep just overcomes you at some point. I'm sure it wasn't the first time these guys slept while on duty, and not the first time they fudged the records. This time it will cost them their jobs.
They aren't supposed to stand night watch after a hard day's work. They're supposed to be paid a full time salary for doing it and then sleep during the day. Again, paying a few guards is trivial compared to the overall cost of this case.
  #89  
Old 08-15-2019, 05:33 AM
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On Amazon I see many security cameras for well under $100. Even if it costs several hundred, plus hundreds for storage, that is a trivial cost when the investigation and trial were going to cost millions.
I can see you've never had to deal with government bureaucracy.
  #90  
Old 08-15-2019, 05:37 AM
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Why?

Why is it so difficult to believe that a man who

Has lost all his power and influence,
Whose rich friends have deserted him,
Who was denied bail and was facing the rest of his life doing hard time, where he would be reviled by staff and convicts alike,
and was staying in a notoriously understaffed and incompetently run jail,

Why is it so hard to believe he killed himself?
My first question would be, why was he put in a notoriously understaffed and incompetently run jail? He wasnít just some run of the mill pervert. He was a pervert who may very well have had very serious, life destroying information about some of the most powerful people in the world. He was, by a mile, Americaís most high profile prisoner. So why put him in a notorious shit hole prison run by idiots?

My second question would be, why keep him there after his unsuccessful suicide attempt? I could, perhaps, maybe understand putting Americaís most notorious criminal in a shit jail run by a skeleton crew of morons before he showed suicidal tendencies. Itís not what I wouldíve done, but mistakes happen. I canít understand keeping him there after he tried to off himself.

This brings me to my third question. Apparently, Epstein was taken off suicide watch and placed on something called an ĎElevated Riskí watch, which is like halfway between regular watch and suicide watch. This is utterly inexcusable. Again, this wasnít just any prisoner. It was Jeffrey Epstein! If a reviled criminal who everyone wants to see punished, and who may have dirt on actual world leaders tries to kill himself then you keep him on suicide watch! He shouldnít have been able to blow his nose without a guard noticing, let alone hang himself with a bedsheet.

Fourthly, it recently came to light that one of the guards on duty the night Epstein died wasnít a qualified prison guard. Are you kidding me? You remember in The Godfather when Solozzo wants to assassinate Don Corleone? He pays the Donís regular bodyguard to ďcall in sickĒ because he knows that Fredo will have to guard him instead. Again, this wasnít just any old prisoner! If youíre in charge of watching Jeffrey Epstein, you make sure your top men are watching him around the clock. You donít take him off suicide watch and then give custody to some temp. This is so staggeringly obvious that I simply canít hand wave it away as mere incompetence. Like everything else about this case, it just doesnít pass the smell test.
  #91  
Old 08-15-2019, 05:40 AM
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Like everything else about this case, it just doesn’t pass the smell test.
Your imagination of what and how the prison system "should" do is not reflected by the reality of prisons in America.

He was put in a notoriously understaffed and underfunded jail because all the jails are notoriously understaffed and underfunded. He was kept there after the first suicide attempt because there wasn't any better place to put him. He was taken off suicide watch because his legal team requested it. And the guard wasn't qualified because there aren't enough qualified guards.

High-profile prisoners only get VIP treatment in movies.

Last edited by Smapti; 08-15-2019 at 05:42 AM.
  #92  
Old 08-15-2019, 05:48 AM
Unreconstructed Man is online now
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Your imagination of what and how the prison system "should" do is not reflected by the reality of prisons in America.

He was put in a notoriously understaffed and underfunded jail because all the jails are notoriously understaffed and underfunded. He was kept there after the first suicide attempt because there wasn't any better place to put him. He was taken off suicide watch because his legal team requested it. And the guard wasn't qualified because there aren't enough qualified guards.

High-profile prisoners only get VIP treatment in movies.
Iím sorry, but I simply donít believe this can possibly be true. Do you have a cite for this?
  #93  
Old 08-15-2019, 05:54 AM
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Iím sorry, but I simply donít believe this can possibly be true. Do you have a cite for this?
Would you consider Chelsea Manning to be a high-profile prisoner? She was able to make two suicide attempts despite being on a stricter watch regimen than Epstein was, and was kept in solitary in the same facility afterward.

If the military can't keep a convicted spy under military arrest from trying to kill themselves without outside assistance, then it seems unlikely that a civilian-staffed jail could do a better job with a mid-level white collar crook.
  #94  
Old 08-15-2019, 06:02 AM
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Why?

Prison guard isn't a career many people aspire to; it's a job people fall into because their other plans didn't work out. Typical features include low pay, lousy working conditions, boredom, lots of paperwork, dealing with unpleasant people, and lack of accomplishment: at the end of the shift, you usually can't say you made people's lives better or achieved some goal, but merely got through to the end of another tedious shift. Those kinds of job features tend to drive away people who are or want to be enthusiastic or motivated about their work. Who's left?

Think of DMV clerks with even less motivation to care what their "customers" think, for whom fudging the records to cover up sleeping on the job is easier to get away with.
You were responding to a comment about watching the guards' bank accounts, and it seems you proved the point that you are refuting. The implication was that someone paid some guards handsomely to look the other way. For the reasons you metion I've no doubt that they are vulnerable to bribes.
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  #95  
Old 08-15-2019, 06:06 AM
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You were responding to a comment about watching the guards' bank accounts, and it seems you proved the point that you are refuting. The implication was that someone paid some guards handsomely to look the other way. For the reasons you metion I've no doubt that they are vulnerable to bribes.
...So did they pay all the guards, from the gate all the way up to his cell? Or just those two? And what about the contractors - janitorial staff, cafeteria, etc?

And why'd they bother planting explosives in Tower 7 anyway?

Last edited by Smapti; 08-15-2019 at 06:07 AM.
  #96  
Old 08-15-2019, 08:17 AM
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The guards were supposed to check on him every thirty minutes and they didn't but even that would have given plenty of time to of the deed. I don't think there was any conspiracy-just a scumbag deciding he was too chicken to put up with a trial and certain incarceration.
  #97  
Old 08-15-2019, 08:45 AM
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...So did they pay all the guards, from the gate all the way up to his cell? Or just those two? And what about the contractors - janitorial staff, cafeteria, etc?
Epstein's lawyers requested that he be taken off suicide watch, so I guess they were in on it too.

Regards,
Shodan
  #98  
Old 08-15-2019, 08:52 AM
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Suicide.


This is upsetting. We Dopers are smarted than the average bear. Why are a third of us entertaining conspiracy theories? This bodes ill for when the Russians start their already-planned preelection viral fake news.
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  #99  
Old 08-15-2019, 09:12 AM
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Why?

Prison guard isn't a career many people aspire to; it's a job people fall into because their other plans didn't work out. Typical features include low pay, lousy working conditions, boredom, lots of paperwork, dealing with unpleasant people, and lack of accomplishment: at the end of the shift, you usually can't say you made people's lives better or achieved some goal, but merely got through to the end of another tedious shift. Those kinds of job features tend to drive away people who are or want to be enthusiastic or motivated about their work. Who's left?
My 25 year old son is a corrections officer in a large southern prison and he loves his job. He has access to a gym, and is in the best shape he's ever been in. During downtime he lifts, and he gets paid to work out with his colleagues; "wrestling" (fighting dirty), learning judo, etc. He has gotten pay increases with each new skill he learns; he is certified to do cell extractions, shoot a variety of weapons, etc.

Sure, he deals with some of the scum of the earth, but he finds this hilarious. Some days he sits in a tower, working on his farmer tan, some days he works in the segregation unit, some days he transports dangerous guys.

When we talk about his job it skeeves me the fuck out, but he is very happy.
  #100  
Old 08-15-2019, 09:22 AM
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Iím sorry, but I simply donít believe this can possibly be true. Do you have a cite for this?
Which part of this do you want a cite for?

Here's a cite for the federal staffing crisis: the federal Bureau of Prisons has lost twelve percent of its workforce since January 2017, with teachers and chaplains being asked to substitute for guards who aren't available.

Elsewhere around the nation:

Kansas: the state declared a "staffing emergency" at El Dorado Correctional Facility earlier this year: 25 percent of the uniformed positions were vacant and much of the staff was on mandatory 12-hour shifts. (El Dorado houses the state's death row, the special management unit for persistent troublemakers, and a psychiatric unit, among others.)

Arizona: a thirteen-year freeze on officer pay has led to vacancy rates that can approach fifty percent in some facilities.

California: sweeping prison reform and downsizing at the state level just pushed problems into county jails.

Alabama: "Federal investigators who spent more than two years scrutinizing the prisons in a state that incarcerates more people per capita than almost any other found illegal drugs and weapons were rampant, cellblocks were overcrowded and dilapidated and the few poorly trained officers on duty appeared powerless to establish any semblance of control. "--https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2019/04/03/violence-murder-rape-alabama-prisons-unconstitutional-justice-department-investigation/3351480002/

In fact, it's hard to find a state that has an efficient working correctional system; I certainly don't know of any.
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