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  #101  
Old 05-23-2018, 10:50 AM
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puddleglum puddleglum is offline
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Originally Posted by k9bfriender View Post

You are looking at that backwards. The numbers would not be skewed by an underreporting of white victims, it would be skewed by an underreporting of black victims.

And, given the general perceived relationship between black people and the police, seems perfectly reasonable.


This forum is not long enough to list them all.

Do you want examples of personal life, professional life, financial life, business life, or just walking down the street?
It would only be skewed by an under reporting of black victims if black people only reported crimes to the police and to survey takers that were committed by white people, yet are perfectly willing to report crimes done by other black people. Do you think it is reasonable that white people are committing huge numbers of crimes against black people that are going unreported both to police and to survey takers?

Opportunities to walk down the street would be interesting.
  #102  
Old 05-23-2018, 12:59 PM
k9bfriender k9bfriender is offline
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I am afraid I don't this is very authoritative - how do you determine the crimes rates in the other neighborhoods, the ones you don't live in?
I visit them.

I know people in many neighborhoods. And I know many people in many neighborhoods who commit some level of crime, mostly drug related. And they are never busted. My friend's neighbor has domestic abuse issues that have the police showing up once a week or more, but never does anyone get detained over it.
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What do you say to someone who claims that black people are less likely to be above average at something?

Why is their observation subject to confirmation bias, and yours isn't?
My observation is of a specific place and time, and I do not try to use it to justify treating people outside of that place and time differently. That must be where we differ.
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Black people in America, overall, are disproportionately likely to be involved in violent crime. This is backed up by statistics. Why is it wrong to think that, whereas thinking black people make better bank tellers is just something you have observed and should be taken seriously?
That you think that that is what I said is a problem only with your own presumptions. I said nothing about either black people or about bank tellers.

As far as anecdotal observation goes, yeah, I do see a difference. When I was a consumer banking customer, most of the people that I dealt with were okay at best. Maybe they were just newbs, maybe they didn't have what it took to advance. In any case, my home mortgage was almost completely messed up not once, not twice, but three times due to the mistakes that were made, all by white guys. Now that I deal with the business side of things, I deal with much more competent individuals who have advanced further. I have not dealt with a single white guy since, I am often the only white guy in our financial meetings. Not out of my choice, but out of the fact that all the people on that side are women and/or minorities.

You are not just looking at statistics, and making the dispassionate observation that there are disparities in the way different people of different ethnicities interact with the justice system. You are not looking at these disparities, and looking at ways to fix them, you are looking at these disparities as an excuse to continue to judge people based on the color of their skin.

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Originally Posted by puddleglum View Post
It would only be skewed by an under reporting of black victims if black people only reported crimes to the police and to survey takers that were committed by white people, yet are perfectly willing to report crimes done by other black people. Do you think it is reasonable that white people are committing huge numbers of crimes against black people that are going unreported both to police and to survey takers?
I think that black people as crime victims is underreported, regardless of the race of the offender.
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Opportunities to walk down the street would be interesting.
Okay, that is something that I can do without having to worry about being side eyed by white people or trailed by cops. When I was younger and more into drugs, I always had something on me. If I was ever stopped and searched by anyone, I would have gotten popped for possession at best. I never did. Most of the other white drug aficionados that I was acquainted with never got searched either, you pretty much had to beg the cop to take extra interest in you. Every black person I know that has ever done drugs has gotten caught at least once, if not multiple times. Every white drug dealer that I knew is still in business, or has retired on their own terms. Every black drug dealer that I ever dealt with didn't last long before they were put out of business by law enforcement.
  #103  
Old 05-23-2018, 01:25 PM
DrDeth DrDeth is offline
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Originally Posted by Shodan View Post
In 1965 I could point to Jim Crow laws to demonstrate institutional racism. So if you got something like that, it would be a start.
Well, Jim Crow laws are back, so.....

To answer the Op- to me, it really depends on "that systemic/institutional bias/bigotry/racism is still a significant force with significant impact on various statistical disparities in America -- " the definition of "significant". Obviously racism is there, but not much is "systemic or institutional" anymore, it's more individual. Does it still have a "significant" effect? Well, we managed to elect a black President, so maybe no longer that significant.

Denying that racism exists is ridiculous, it is obviously here and widespread in the South. And of course other races can be racist also. It's not all white on black racism.
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  #104  
Old 05-23-2018, 01:27 PM
DrDeth DrDeth is offline
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Originally Posted by manson1972 View Post
Not really. Black people are often stuck in poor neighborhoods and poor people commit more crimes. That, I think, is more cultural that racist.
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  #105  
Old 05-23-2018, 01:31 PM
DrDeth DrDeth is offline
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Originally Posted by DrDeth View Post
Well, Jim Crow laws are back, so.....

Obviously racism is there, but not much is "systemic or institutional"* anymore, it's more individual.
Missed the edit window:
'
*In certain states, passing new "voter ID" laws, there is institutional racism.
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