Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #151  
Old 07-29-2019, 07:01 AM
What Exit?'s Avatar
What Exit? is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Central NJ (near Bree)
Posts: 29,199
So I'm still trying to understand Mets acquiring Marcus Stroman. The only weakness they don't have is starting staff. Defense, Offense and Bullpen are areas that could use addressing.
  #152  
Old 07-29-2019, 07:32 AM
ElvisL1ves is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: The land of the mouse
Posts: 50,126
And they're still talking about dealing Thor and Wheeler. Are you in or out, guys?
  #153  
Old 07-29-2019, 09:25 AM
storyteller0910 is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: New Jersey (it's not as bad as they tell you)
Posts: 4,416
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves View Post
And they're still talking about dealing Thor and Wheeler. Are you in or out, guys?
I'm pretty sure at this point that Brodie van Wagenen is just a the AI that baseball video games use to determine what trades and signings CPU-controlled franchises will make, ported into a robot shaped like an 80's movie villain.
  #154  
Old 07-29-2019, 12:21 PM
RealityChuck's Avatar
RealityChuck is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Schenectady, NY, USA
Posts: 42,668
The Mets are looking with an eye to next year: Wheeler is likely going, trade or not, so he needs to be replaced. Vargas, though playing well of late, is iffy (his BABIP is ridiculously low). Syndergaard might be gone for prospects. You may get more for any of them in a trade if Stroman is off the market.

The Mets have traded away four of their top prospects, but they added three in their place in the recent draft, and there are several names in the lower minors that look very promising. So picking up some other team's top prospects will refill the system and they'll get more for Syndergaard than anyone else.
__________________
"If a person saying he was something was all there was to it, this country'd be full of rich men and good-looking women. Too bad it isn't that easy.... In short, when someone else says you're a writer, that's when you're a writer... not before."
Purveyor of fine science fiction since 1982.
  #155  
Old 07-29-2019, 02:19 PM
dalej42 is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 14,298
Max Scherzer back to the IL as the Nationals have a brutal schedule in front of them
__________________
Twitter:@Stardales IG:@Dalej42
  #156  
Old 07-29-2019, 10:38 PM
Ulf the Unwashed is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,455
Not actually about MLB but thought I'd share: I saw a no-hitter last night in person.

Hardly anybody cared, however.

It was the very low minors (short-season A), where most fans don't care much about the score. Plus which, the home team was the one no-hit. And the attendance was only about 3,000. Maybe most important, there were four pitchers involved: the first guy went six (and walked five), three others followed with an inning each. Turns out that when the no-hitter is a team effort it's hard to get quite as excited about it.

Certainly a contrast to the only other no-hitter I have seen to date, which was a) in the major leagues, b) an individual effort, c) thrown by the home team's pitcher, d) in front of a standing room only crowd, and e) in the heat of the pennant race. The fans, as they say, went wild. Not like last night.

Oh well. It was cool anyhow, and the visiting team did get excited, mobbing the final pitcher after the last guy was called out on strikes. And now I can say I've seen two no-hitters.

Last edited by Ulf the Unwashed; 07-29-2019 at 10:39 PM.
  #157  
Old 07-30-2019, 02:07 AM
Superdude is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Fortress of Solidude
Posts: 10,475
That's really cool. And good on you for giving the low minors some love.

The biggest milestone I've seen in person was Sammy Sosa's 350th career homer. It was in a losing effort, though. And it happened at Wrigley Field.

Come to think of it, I've never seen the Cubs win at Wrigley. Only win I ever saw was in Cincinnati, with Steve "Human Rain Delay" Trachsel on the mound.
__________________
I can't help being a gorgeous fiend. It's just the card I drew.
  #158  
Old 07-30-2019, 06:01 AM
Zakalwe's Avatar
Zakalwe is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Posts: 4,956
Quote:
Originally Posted by Superdude View Post
Come to think of it, I've never seen the Cubs win at Wrigley.
Do me a favor and stay away from Wrigley for the next...ohhh...3 months or so, would ya?
  #159  
Old 07-30-2019, 07:01 AM
divemaster's Avatar
divemaster is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Gainesville, VA
Posts: 3,561
I've been to Wrigley twice. Once back in the 90s. Grad school road trip to Chicago. No one else was interested, but as a huge Cubs fan I could not pass up the opportunity. It was April and I walked up and bought a bleacher seat ticket for $6. Cubs were playing the Braves.

Braves hit 3 HRs in the first inning, and the score was 7-0 before the Cubs even came up to bat. And it got worse from there. The final score was 19-7, if I recall. (I'm sure about the 19). Not much to do in the bleachers except drink and heckle Deion Sanders in the outfield. Somewhere, I saved next day's sports page and box score.

The second time was a playoff game during their 2016 World Series run. The NL Division series against the Giants. Home win of 1-0! Very exciting.
  #160  
Old 07-30-2019, 07:49 AM
Hawkeyeop is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Somerville, MA
Posts: 2,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by RealityChuck View Post
The Mets are looking with an eye to next year: Wheeler is likely going, trade or not, so he needs to be replaced. Vargas, though playing well of late, is iffy (his BABIP is ridiculously low). Syndergaard might be gone for prospects. You may get more for any of them in a trade if Stroman is off the market.

The Mets have traded away four of their top prospects, but they added three in their place in the recent draft, and there are several names in the lower minors that look very promising. So picking up some other team's top prospects will refill the system and they'll get more for Syndergaard than anyone else.
That is not a coherent plan, it a series of random events. Why pay deadline prices for Stroman when you aren't competing this year? Do they think they are competing? Well then why sell Vargas to a division rival. He isn't great, but we got nothing back, and it isn't like we are swimming in pitching depth. They think Stroman is a particularly great fit? The groundball pitcher on the team that can't field ground balls?

They want to get better next year? So they are shopping a younger better pitcher with more years control? Sure you might get a better prospect haul. That happens when you trade better players away then you receive back. Unlike to match the package we sent for Diaz/Cano though.

I'd understand if the Mets went all in on next year, as there team is built to win now and really just needs help around the edges. I understand blowing thing up if they went that route. The Mets however are just doing a little of everything and making their team worse in the short and long term.
  #161  
Old 07-30-2019, 08:38 AM
ElvisL1ves is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: The land of the mouse
Posts: 50,126
That move only makes sense if they're going to flip Stroman for better prospects than they gave the Jays, today or tomorrow, when buyers' desperation gets higher and the price goes up.
  #162  
Old 07-30-2019, 10:25 AM
Velocity is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 14,912
Baseball layman question (not worth its own thread):

Is it really necessary for the 3rd strike to be treated differently than the first 2 strikes, in terms of the ball glancing off of the bat? Why not just treat it the same, so that the 3rd time the ball glances off of the bat, it's still a strike? It would prevent some of those super-long-at-bat situations.
  #163  
Old 07-30-2019, 11:58 AM
P-man is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Washington, DC area
Posts: 1,725
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalej42 View Post
Max Scherzer back to the IL as the Nationals have a brutal schedule in front of them
August schedule isn't too brutal, and hopefully Scherzer won't miss more than 2-3 games. You never know with "minor" injuries, though.
  #164  
Old 07-30-2019, 03:05 PM
Atamasama's Avatar
Atamasama is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,765
Quote:
Originally Posted by Velocity View Post
Baseball layman question (not worth its own thread):

Is it really necessary for the 3rd strike to be treated differently than the first 2 strikes, in terms of the ball glancing off of the bat? Why not just treat it the same, so that the 3rd time the ball glances off of the bat, it's still a strike? It would prevent some of those super-long-at-bat situations.
Strikeouts are already abnormally high this season. Iím not sure theyíre seeing a need to increase them.

Though in principle Iím not opposed to the idea.
  #165  
Old 07-30-2019, 03:14 PM
Barkis is Willin' is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 6,443
Quote:
Originally Posted by Velocity View Post
Baseball layman question (not worth its own thread):

Is it really necessary for the 3rd strike to be treated differently than the first 2 strikes, in terms of the ball glancing off of the bat? Why not just treat it the same, so that the 3rd time the ball glances off of the bat, it's still a strike? It would prevent some of those super-long-at-bat situations.
Oh my, this would be a drastic change with severe consequences. A lot of good hitters, hitters that don't strike out much (relative in today's MLB) are skilled at fouling off good pitches with two strikes. Spoiling pitch after pitch is called having a good at bat, and the drama of those two-strike foul balls is actually appealing to many fans, myself included. A foul ball strike three would speed up the game, yes, but it would also make it so much more boring.
  #166  
Old 07-30-2019, 03:24 PM
Superdude is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Fortress of Solidude
Posts: 10,475
Cubs acquire David Phelps from Toronto in exchange for minor league pitcher Thomas Hatch.

Joc Pederson was pulled from last night's game for not running out a ground ball in the 8th inning of a 9-1 loss.
__________________
I can't help being a gorgeous fiend. It's just the card I drew.
  #167  
Old 07-31-2019, 12:27 AM
Superdude is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Fortress of Solidude
Posts: 10,475
Puig goes to the Indians, Reds get Bauer in 3 team deal:

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/...-reds-get-puig
__________________
I can't help being a gorgeous fiend. It's just the card I drew.
  #168  
Old 07-31-2019, 07:12 AM
Tom Scud is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 9,249
So the only two teams to trade prospects for veteran starting pitchers so far are both below .500. This does not make a ton of sense.
  #169  
Old 07-31-2019, 07:31 AM
What Exit?'s Avatar
What Exit? is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Central NJ (near Bree)
Posts: 29,199
It is a twisted year thus far. What will happen by 4pm EST today though?
  #170  
Old 07-31-2019, 09:01 AM
Blank Slate's Avatar
Blank Slate is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,366
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Scud View Post
So the only two teams to trade prospects for veteran starting pitchers so far are both below .500. This does not make a ton of sense.
It makes sense that Toronto didn't want to trade Stroman within the division and Cleveland didn't want to strengthen a rival, though. They might have been dealing exclusively with NL treams. Next year, Cincinnati will have Castillo, Bauer, Gray and DeSclafani heading their rotation. That will be paired with an offense that is currently third in runs scored in the NL. Not too shabby.
  #171  
Old 07-31-2019, 09:15 AM
Rysto is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blank Slate View Post
It makes sense that Toronto didn't want to trade Stroman within the division
No, it doesn't. The only reason to avoid trading within the division is that your GM is afraid of looking bad if the player that he traded plays well against your team. That's a terrible reason to sabotage your own team by taking an inferior return. Any GM who refuses to trade within their division should be summarily fired and replaced with somebody who doesn't blatantly put their own interests above the team's.
  #172  
Old 07-31-2019, 10:19 AM
Cheesesteak's Avatar
Cheesesteak is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Lovely Montclair, NJ
Posts: 13,537
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rysto View Post
No, it doesn't. The only reason to avoid trading within the division is that your GM is afraid of looking bad if the player that he traded plays well against your team.
No, it isn't. You play 19 games a year against a division rival, 6-7 games against an interdivision team, and may not play at all against a team in the other league for multiple years.

If the Jays can get a comparable deal from the Mets as from the Yankees, it makes FAR more sense to avoid strengthening the Yankees. A strong Yankees team makes EVERYTHING harder on the Jays, you have to play them more, and they make it harder to win your division.

The Mets refusing to deal with the Yankees, while talking to the Braves, now that is stupid.

Last edited by Cheesesteak; 07-31-2019 at 10:20 AM. Reason: typo
  #173  
Old 07-31-2019, 10:22 AM
What Exit?'s Avatar
What Exit? is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Central NJ (near Bree)
Posts: 29,199
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheesesteak View Post
No, it isn't. You play 19 games a year against a division rival, 6-7 games against an interdivision team, and may not play at all against a team in the other league for multiple years.

If the Jays can get a comparable deal from the Mets as from the Yankees, it makes FAR more sense to avoid strengthening the Yankees. A strong Yankees team makes EVERYTHING harder on the Jays, you have to play them more, and they make it harder to win your division.

The Mets refusing to deal with the Yankees, while talking to the Braves, now that is stupid.
Perfect summary.
  #174  
Old 07-31-2019, 10:25 AM
ElvisL1ves is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: The land of the mouse
Posts: 50,126
The Mets thinking they can get Andrew Benintendi for Edwin Diaz, now that also is stupid.
  #175  
Old 07-31-2019, 10:39 AM
Barkis is Willin' is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 6,443
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves View Post
The Mets thinking they can get Andrew Benintendi for Edwin Diaz, now that also is stupid.
The "experts" like Buster Olney seem to think he, or JBJ or Chavis have to be a part of a deal. I agree it is stupid and while the Sox are in desperate need of bullpen help, I expect a hell of a lot better return if Benny is part of a trade.

What the Mets just gave up for Stroman kind of set the going rate, right? They didn't part with any MLB level talent.
  #176  
Old 07-31-2019, 11:25 AM
Jackmannii is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: the extreme center
Posts: 31,879
Quote:
Originally Posted by storyteller0910 View Post
I'm pretty sure at this point that Brodie van Wagenen is just a the AI that baseball video games use to determine what trades and signings CPU-controlled franchises will make, ported into a robot shaped like an 80's movie villain.
Or maybe Brodie is the reincarnation of Frank Lane*.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheesesteak
The Mets refusing to deal with the Yankees, while talking to the Braves, now that is stupid.
Too bad the Yankees don't have a cozy setup with the Kansas City A's anymore (K.C. was notorious for shipping its best players to the Yankees circa 1955-60 in return for next to nothing).

*still a pariah in Cleveland for trading Rocky Colavito for Harvey Kuenn.
  #177  
Old 07-31-2019, 01:09 PM
Superdude is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Fortress of Solidude
Posts: 10,475
Cubs flip the recently-acquired Martin Maldonado to the Astros for Tony Kemp.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/...edium=facebook
__________________
I can't help being a gorgeous fiend. It's just the card I drew.
  #178  
Old 07-31-2019, 03:26 PM
FoieGrasIsEvil's Avatar
FoieGrasIsEvil is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Land of Cheese Coneys
Posts: 18,003
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blank Slate View Post
It makes sense that Toronto didn't want to trade Stroman within the division and Cleveland didn't want to strengthen a rival, though. They might have been dealing exclusively with NL treams. Next year, Cincinnati will have Castillo, Bauer, Gray and DeSclafani heading their rotation. That will be paired with an offense that is currently third in runs scored in the NL. Not too shabby.
Hell yeah it's not shabby at all for next year, and while losing a fiery, streaky guy like Puig sucks for this season, the Reds are still not out of the division hunt at 7 games back. All the divisional games are huge now. August will tell the tale.

ETA: and those guys are 4th in ERA (Castillo), 21st (Gray), 31st (Bauer) and 49th (Disclefani) in all of baseball.
__________________
Posting From Above The Browns

Last edited by FoieGrasIsEvil; 07-31-2019 at 03:30 PM.
  #179  
Old 07-31-2019, 03:31 PM
What Exit?'s Avatar
What Exit? is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Central NJ (near Bree)
Posts: 29,199
SI is saying:
Quote:
Astros Pull Last-Second Stunner by Acquiring Zack Greinke and Aaron Sanchez
  #180  
Old 07-31-2019, 04:08 PM
Gray Ghost is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,085
Tee hee.

And got Greinke without parting with either Whitley or Tucker. While getting Arizona to pay a third of Greinke's salary. Though losing Beer, Bukaskas, Martin, and Rojas may later sting.

Top 3 WHIPs for SP now play for Houston, per Jayson Stark.

Also picked up Aaron Sanchez and Joe Biagini from Toronto for Derek Fisher. Good outfielder, just blocked in Houston. RickJay, how are the two pitchers from your team that Houston just picked up? Did the Astros get fleeced? Are they guys just needing a change of scenery?
  #181  
Old 07-31-2019, 04:14 PM
Rysto is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7,157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheesesteak View Post
If the Jays can get a comparable deal from the Mets as from the Yankees
First of all, this assumption is incredibly dubious. Artificially restricting the field of potential trade partners will absolutely lower your return. That's just basic supply and demand.

Second of all, if the Blue Jays cared about winning in the last year and a half of Stroman's contract, they wouldn't have traded him in the first place.

Last edited by Rysto; 07-31-2019 at 04:14 PM.
  #182  
Old 07-31-2019, 05:20 PM
Oredigger77 is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Back at 5,280
Posts: 4,934
As a Dodgers fan I'm annoyed by the Greinke trade. Sure it makes sense for both teams but damn did it make the Dodgers life harder. I guess the 'stros still have to make it through the Yankees but that is a terrifing group of pitches they've got now.

I haven't seen anything about bullpen help for the Dodgers or at least no headlines hopefully we got some help.
  #183  
Old 07-31-2019, 05:47 PM
Caldris bal Comar is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 44
If I was a fan of a competitive AL team, I would be upset about the Greinke trade. Luckily, I'm a fan of the Orioles.

That said, if the Tigers couldn't win with the Verlander/Scherzer/Price/Fister/Sanchez rotation, I wouldn't count my chickens right now if I were an Astros fan.

Last edited by Caldris bal Comar; 07-31-2019 at 05:47 PM.
  #184  
Old 07-31-2019, 05:58 PM
Blank Slate's Avatar
Blank Slate is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,366
No doubt Aaron Sanchez will see an increase in velocity and spin rate while posting a 1.75 ERA in August/September.
  #185  
Old 07-31-2019, 06:10 PM
Gray Ghost is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,085
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caldris bal Comar View Post
If I was a fan of a competitive AL team, I would be upset about the Greinke trade. Luckily, I'm a fan of the Orioles.

That said, if the Tigers couldn't win with the Verlander/Scherzer/Price/Fister/Sanchez rotation, I wouldn't count my chickens right now if I were an Astros fan.
The lineup is probably a bit better than the Tigers's was. Even as well as former Astro J.D. Martinez ended up doing there.

Player: OPS+
Alvarez 188
Springer 153
Bregman 141
Brantley 139
Altuve 132
Correa 127
Guriel 124

even the catcher has an OPS+ of 115.

It's a pretty damned good team. And they only had to historically tank for three years to help make it.

Still, what did the Mariners win in 2001, 116 games? And lost the ALCS to the Yankees. How many rings did all of those great Braves teams win, with Glavine to Maddox to Smoltz?

It's not a sure thing, but I definitely like Greinke on the team more than him not being on the team.
even Chirinos at 115 isn't bad.
  #186  
Old 07-31-2019, 08:33 PM
Truman Burbank is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: California
Posts: 2,618
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oredigger77 View Post
As a Dodgers fan I'm annoyed by the Greinke trade. Sure it makes sense for both teams but damn did it make the Dodgers life harder. I guess the 'stros still have to make it through the Yankees but that is a terrifing group of pitches they've got now.

I haven't seen anything about bullpen help for the Dodgers or at least no headlines hopefully we got some help.
We got this guy, that's about it: https://www.mlb.com/player/adam-kolarek-592473 I don't get it, hell, we got better guys in AAA. We needed a STUD. On the other hand, we're set up to go deep into the offseason for the next hundred years, we've got to win that last series sometime before I croak.

Last edited by Truman Burbank; 07-31-2019 at 08:36 PM.
  #187  
Old 07-31-2019, 08:43 PM
Suburban Plankton's Avatar
Suburban Plankton is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 8,094
So, the Giants traded away four relief pitchers and about $25 million in salary, have already picked up half a game on Washington, and are leading the Phillies 5-1 in the 8th.

So far, it's been a good trade deadline day.

If they can continue to play anywhere close to where they've been for the last two months, it's going to make for a very interesting October.
  #188  
Old 07-31-2019, 09:12 PM
Tom Scud is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 9,249
Wowow Greinke. I have my doubts about whether the Astros pitching staff can turn Sanchez around, but I guess he has done it once and he does supposedly have a very high spin rate on his curveball or something. Anyway, even if they are the best team in the league right now, that still only translates into one chance in four or so of winning the World Series. But still wow.
  #189  
Old 08-01-2019, 02:15 PM
silenus's Avatar
silenus is offline
Isaiah 1:15/Screw the NRA
Charter Member
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: SoCal
Posts: 51,384
August thread here.
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:34 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@straightdope.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Copyright © 2018 STM Reader, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017