View Poll Results: Do you think James Mattis (Defense Secretary) is the source of NY Times Co-Op?
Yes 3 7.50%
No 31 77.50%
Other 6 15.00%
Voters: 40. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old 09-16-2018, 01:33 PM
Mr Quatro Mr Quatro is offline
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Could it be that Defense Secretary James Mattis is the NY Times Co-Op source?

Let's make it simple this time ... just 'yes', 'no' or 'other'

Trump fears James Mattis is secretly a Democrat as he mulls his fate

https://nypost.com/2018/09/15/trump-...ulls-his-fate/
  #2  
Old 09-16-2018, 01:39 PM
Mr Quatro Mr Quatro is offline
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Whoops! I meant op-ed of course, "Mattis denied Woodward’s reporting, and also said he isn’t behind a recent anonymous op-ed in the New York Times by a senior administration official criticizing the president"
  #3  
Old 09-16-2018, 02:47 PM
PastTense PastTense is offline
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While it's possible I think the general consensus is that this is someone in the White House rather than an official in a Cabinet department.
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Old 09-16-2018, 05:14 PM
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For a Marine of Matis' training and experience to pull a stunt like that...it's inconceivable to me.

If he actually felt as strongly as the NYT OpEd writer, he'd simply resign.
  #5  
Old 09-16-2018, 05:43 PM
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IDK. As a Marine he may think he can fix this problem, by himself. You know them Marines; always ready to police the area and take out the enemy. Gung-ho to go!!
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Old 09-16-2018, 08:52 PM
Mr Quatro Mr Quatro is offline
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Originally Posted by PastTense View Post
While it's possible I think the general consensus is that this is someone in the White House rather than an official in a Cabinet department.
How big are the insiders in the WH then? Looks like it could be easy to narrow down ... I like General Kelly too much to think it is him. I thought he might run for POTUS, but he has said he is staying till 2020.

Last edited by Mr Quatro; 09-16-2018 at 08:53 PM.
  #7  
Old 09-17-2018, 08:09 AM
mcgato mcgato is offline
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I think that it will end like Deep Throat, the famous Watergate source. After many theories, it will turn out to be somebody that nobody has heard of.
  #8  
Old 09-17-2018, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by ExTank View Post
For a Marine of Matis' training and experience to pull a stunt like that...it's inconceivable to me.
What, Marines don't believe in stealth, subterfuge and flanking maneuvers?
  #9  
Old 09-17-2018, 08:56 AM
Ravenman Ravenman is offline
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What, Marines don't believe in stealth, subterfuge and flanking maneuvers?
Why do any of that when they could charge right at the machine gun nest?
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Old 09-17-2018, 09:01 AM
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What, Marines don't believe in stealth, subterfuge and flanking maneuvers?
Yes, sort of, but those who manage to fight another day do not believe in yelling to the world that they're doing it.
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  #11  
Old 09-17-2018, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ExTank View Post
For a Marine of Matis' training and experience to pull a stunt like that...it's inconceivable to me.

If he actually felt as strongly as the NYT OpEd writer, he'd simply resign.
I agree. Military guys will follow the dumbest orders imaginable as long as they're. And they're proud of that fact. Their opinion of trump, on a personal level, might make Tillerson's seem like flattery. But they do what they're told.
  #12  
Old 09-17-2018, 01:43 PM
Fretful Porpentine Fretful Porpentine is offline
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I doubt it. He might, indeed, be quietly undermining Trump to prevent him from doing something irredeemably stupid, but if he is, I think he has too much common sense to write an op-ed saying that he is (and is probably facepalming at whoever did write it, since its existence makes the task of stopping Trump from doing stupid things harder, not easier).
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  #13  
Old 09-17-2018, 02:42 PM
Hari Seldon Hari Seldon is offline
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Originally Posted by mcgato View Post
I think that it will end like Deep Throat, the famous Watergate source. After many theories, it will turn out to be somebody that nobody has heard of.
That's not true. I have read that Felt was widely considered to be the possible source.

I did not vote here because while I think Mattis could be the author, he is just one of several. My money is on Kelly, but I think the odds on him, or anyone else, are well below 50%.
  #14  
Old 09-17-2018, 03:15 PM
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The problem for Trump is that there are dozens and dozens of people who could plausibly have written that letter. It's not like there's one guy who thinks Trump is an idiot and has to be undermined, it's lots and lots of them.

It probably isn't Mattis, because while we know he thinks the president is an idiot, and while we know he goes behind the president's back and undermines him, he probably isn't stupid enough to go to the New York Times and tell them that he thinks the president is an idiot.

I think it's pretty clear to most people working in the Trump White House that they're not going to leave their gigs and go on to future glory. Sure, you'll be able to get a lobbyist job or a right-wing media job. But you're not going to go on to elective office, because your reputation will be trashed. And that's whether you were part of the MAGA team or part of the Resistance. You're not going to salvage your reputation when you come out later and reveal that you were part of the Resistance, because who would support you if you betrayed your boss? Nevermind that your boss deserved to be betrayed. If you have to betray your boss you go ahead and betray your boss, but you're never going to be treated as a hero for doing it.

There is only one way to salvage your reputation here: publicly resign in protest. Working for Trump and undermining him while writing a letter to the NYT bragging about undermining him won't do that. If you wanna keep working for Trump while undermining him, then you take the hit to your reputation like a man, because you reckon the good of the country outweighs your reputation, and it's more honorable to do the right thing than it is to be seen to do the right thing.
  #15  
Old 09-17-2018, 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Ravenman View Post
Why do any of that when they could charge right at the machine gun nest?
Maybe the opinion piece is a form of suppressing fire, and that the actual attack will come from a different direction.

Last edited by Alessan; 09-17-2018 at 04:03 PM.
  #16  
Old 09-17-2018, 04:22 PM
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What, Marines don't believe in stealth, subterfuge and flanking maneuvers?
Marines tend to think that the easiest way through a brick wall is to beat your head against it over-and-over until something gives.

Us Army types just lob an M908 and let the grunts climb over the rubble.
  #17  
Old 09-17-2018, 04:46 PM
Lamoral Lamoral is offline
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I think the possibility is extraordinarily remote.

Mattis is a military man. His job is to issue orders to subordinates and follow orders from superiors. While he has been known for a few quotable quips over the years, his primary concern has always been to simply do his job.

Right now his priority is to perform the necessary duties as Secretary of Defense. He is not a shit-stirrer at all. He has by far been the most low-key member of this administration so far, because he sees no reason to be otherwise. I highly doubt that Mattis even concerns himself with the political goings-on of the Trump administration, no matter how much turmoil and controversy erupts. He is above all that shit. His job is to oversee the military. I believe that his mind is 100% in military mode, 100% of the time, based on everything I have read and heard about the man. I do not believe he would take it upon himself to issue a statement like this.
  #18  
Old 09-17-2018, 09:09 PM
Loach Loach is offline
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No way in hell. It’s not his style.

Out of 1800 people it could be I would put him as the 1800th most likely.

Last edited by Loach; 09-17-2018 at 09:10 PM.
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