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Old 12-26-2018, 02:46 PM
Kamaski Kamaski is offline
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Why is the eastern front of WW2 not covered more?

I know this has been talked about many, but there simply arenít enough movies/video games/books in the west which cover the enormous human scale of the Eastern Front of WW2.

A bout a year or two ago a video game came out called ďCall of Duty:WW2Ē.

Instead of focusing on the titatanic battles of of the Eastern Front where 30 million lives were lost, the game focuses on the battles of Western Europe in 1944-1945 which pale in comparison.


Americas largest battle in WW2 was the battle of the bulge where 19,000 lives were lost. The ussrs biggest battle (Stalingrad) lost 800,000 lives lost. And many more wounded/maimed/impailed.


Why is this titanic conflict, the largest land conflict in all history, so underreported in the west.

All serious military historians, American, Russian, British agree that the Second World War was decided on the eastern front. Itís not even an argument. For example Col. David Glantz, who has written many excellent books in English about the eastern front with its titanic battles.


There is obviously still a large interest in WW2 in the west, as can be seen by the movies and video games being made about it.



Why not portray the conflict accurately??
  #2  
Old 12-26-2018, 02:49 PM
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Because it involved the Commies, who only survived because of all the Ford trucks and Spam we sent them.
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Old 12-26-2018, 02:51 PM
HurricaneDitka HurricaneDitka is offline
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You're wanting more historical accuracy from Hollywood movies and video games?

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... Why not portray the conflict accurately??
Because the producers believe they'll sell more movies and video games the way they're currently doing things.

Last edited by HurricaneDitka; 12-26-2018 at 02:52 PM.
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Old 12-26-2018, 02:52 PM
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Because the media your are exposed to is trying to sell to Americans, not Russians.
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:04 PM
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I’m just saying that the subject matter on the eastern front is much more extensive, but doesn’t get covered nearly as much, so people have a warped view of WW2. Very Western-oriented.

When was the last time you heard a major news anchor on CNN talk about the battle of Stalingrad, Leningrad, Moscow, Kursk or the fall of Berlin? Or a million other large battles that happened on the east front?
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:08 PM
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The West simply focuses more on itself than on the East. And the West has long dominated the world media.
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:14 PM
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It's a case of winners writing the history. In this case the winners of the cold war. Basically the story told in mass media since WW2 has been an American one and the focused on the parts of the war the Americans were involved in.

For the same reason i suspect we will see far more representations of China in WW2 going forward (an aspect massively missing from popular accounts of WW2 in western media, far more so than the eastern front)
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:16 PM
HurricaneDitka HurricaneDitka is offline
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I’m just saying that the subject matter on the eastern front is much more extensive, but doesn’t get covered nearly as much, so people have a warped view of WW2. Very Western-oriented. ...
But your touchstones for what's "covered" seems to be video games and Hollywood movies, with a dash of whatever the 24-hour cable news channels think while drive more viewership and more ad revenue, not history textbooks or documentaries.

Yes, many of our countrymen (I'm guessing you're American here; if not, no offense intended) are incredibly ignorant of all sorts of aspects of history, not just WW2 (and Americans aren't alone in that respect). But complaining that the Russian (or Chinese) roles in WW2 aren't covered adequately in pop culture seems a tad silly. (Almost) Nobody wants to watch history lessons for entertainment or read encyclopedia articles for news. If the customers don't want it, the companies that provide entertainment are either going to accommodate their customers or be replace by ones that do.

Last edited by HurricaneDitka; 12-26-2018 at 03:19 PM.
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Kamaski View Post
Iím just saying that the subject matter on the eastern front is much more extensive, but doesnít get covered nearly as much, so people have a warped view of WW2. Very Western-oriented.

When was the last time you heard a major news anchor on CNN talk about the battle of Stalingrad, Leningrad, Moscow, Kursk or the fall of Berlin? Or a million other large battles that happened on the east front?
I doubt anyone would disagree with you. As others have pointed out, media aimed at American audiences will tend to focus on American characters and American battles.

Is there anything else we need to debate?
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:19 PM
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It's a case of winners writing the history. In this case the winners of the cold war. Basically the story told in mass media since WW2 has been an American one and the focused on the parts of the war the Americans were involved in.

For the same reason i suspect we will see far more representations of China in WW2 going forward (an aspect massively missing from popular accounts of WW2 in western media, far more so than the eastern front)
I don't understand what winning the cold war has to do with anything.
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:20 PM
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I doubt anyone would disagree with you. As others have pointed out, media aimed at American audiences will tend to focus on American characters and American battles.

Is there anything else we need to debate?
Nope, nailed it. You can close this sucker up.
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:29 PM
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This brings up another interesting question for me, how many veterans of WW2 are there in Russia/the former Soviet countries?

It has been reported that there are 500,000 American veterans of WW2 still alive and they are dying at the rate of 500 per day.

Some efforts are being made in the US to video tape their experiences before they all die, so that future generations will be able to know about WW2.

I wonder what he numbers are in Russia. I suspect a lot less because the quality of healthcare in Russia is bad, and people live shorter lives/die earlier.

To have fought in WW2 you must be at least 90.

I wonder if Russia is making efforts to record the history of WW2 from the veterans, anyone know?
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:32 PM
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Taking into account that there is a bias towards ignoring the worst of the mistakes and abuses of the Soviet army, one recommended documentary/reenactment series from Russia should be seen by people that know little about the eastern front: Soviet Storm: World War II in the east

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JhXK...wV3ToGxzo3AK0h

Made for Russian television in 2011, and translated to English.
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:36 PM
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:42 PM
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And the lies that the Russians ran into German machine gun positions unarmed still persist in the west.

Last edited by Kamaski; 12-26-2018 at 03:42 PM.
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Old 12-26-2018, 03:52 PM
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I don't understand what winning the cold war has to do with anything.
If the soviet union has won the cold war, and the American capitalist economic system collapsed, while the soviet communist one dominated the world unopposed starting in the 1990s, then you could be sure it would be the Eastern Front would be remembered in mass media.

Last edited by griffin1977; 12-26-2018 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 12-26-2018, 04:01 PM
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And the lies that the Russians ran into German machine gun positions unarmed still persist in the west.
Never heard that before and it sounds more heroic than derogatory. Where are you from, friend?
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Old 12-26-2018, 04:11 PM
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A bout a year or two ago a video game came out called ďCall of Duty:WW2Ē.
According to Wikipedia, these Call of Duty games all feature the Battle Of Stalingrad:

Call of Duty (2003)
Call of Duty: Finest Hour (2004)
Call of Duty 2 (2005)
Call of Duty: World at War (2008)
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Old 12-26-2018, 04:12 PM
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And the lies that the Russians ran into German machine gun positions unarmed still persist in the west.
Are you referring to the Russian Documentary just mentioned? Just to clarify, that documentary was made by Russian TV, so if the documentary mentioned that then one has to conclude that in the Russian media in the East that also persists.

IIRC in one episode of that Russian documentary it was mentioned that Russian prisoners of the punishment battalions were forced into the front to do work or given guns for missions that amounted to suicide, but AFAIK no specific case in the documentary about Russians running into battle unarmed.

Last edited by GIGObuster; 12-26-2018 at 04:13 PM.
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Old 12-26-2018, 04:27 PM
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Never heard that before and it sounds more heroic than derogatory. Where are you from, friend?
Iím from Poland originally but live in NYC (Polish people hate communism btw, and Russia in general).

A couple years ago there was actually a large number of Russian veterans of WW2 that came to NYC and marched in the Veterans Day parade with American veterans. The Russian veterans were in bad shape health wise, but happy just to be alive and with people who cared. (By the way, they were bringing school children out of school in NYC onto the street and letting them shake hands with the veterans).

I think the greatest misunderstanding of the Red Army is that they actually were well-equipped and in many cases had BETTER weapons than the Germans, even at the beginning of the war in 1941.


American army engineers thought the t-34 was a superb tank, probably the best in the world, when it was was demonstrated the them in 1942.
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Old 12-26-2018, 04:29 PM
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Are you referring to the Russian Documentary just mentioned? Just to clarify, that documentary was made by Russian TV, so if the documentary mentioned that then one has to conclude that in the Russian media in the East that also persists.

IIRC in one episode of that Russian documentary it was mentioned that Russian prisoners of the punishment battalions were forced into the front to do work or given guns for missions that amounted to suicide, but AFAIK no specific case in the documentary about Russians running into battle unarmed.



No the documentary is very good, I like it a lot, i want to watch the whole thing. Just the myth in general that the Soviet army didnít have rifles/equipment is what I was referring to.
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Old 12-26-2018, 04:34 PM
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I remember plenty of references to it in an old WWII documentary series. General Burkhalter often discussed the desirability of Klink's transfering to the Russian front.
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Old 12-26-2018, 11:43 PM
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Why is it surprising that people are more interested in something which affected them more personally?

I wouldn’t accept an even-odds bet if the majority of Japanese were aware that WWII included areas outside of Asia and the Pacific.
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Old 12-27-2018, 12:20 AM
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Cracked did a great podcast on this very subject. TV tropes article "America won WW2" is excellent too (sorry no links; im using my phone and it's PITA to do that. But I heartily recommend both.)

It's basically because noone wants to be seen to "big up" a communist regime, plus it's a nicer story to american ears that the US did all the most important stuff.

Similarly you don't get much mention of how many people prominent americans sympathized with Nazi philosophy or opposed getting involved in Europe... It would cloud the story.

To the OP though, note that the original Call of Duty included a very good Stalingrad stage.

Last edited by Mijin; 12-27-2018 at 12:21 AM.
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Old 12-27-2018, 12:30 AM
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When Col. David Glantz gave a lecture at the US Army War College, this is how he addressed the topic.

The US Army lost 5,000 men killed/wounded in the Iraq war since its start (at that time, maybe 2007)


A single Soviet division entering Stalingrad in the latter half of 1942 could except to take that many casualties in dead alone in just a single week.
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Old 12-27-2018, 01:18 AM
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Cracked did a great podcast on this very subject. TV tropes article "America won WW2" is excellent too (sorry no links; im using my phone and it's PITA to do that. But I heartily recommend both.)

It's basically because noone wants to be seen to "big up" a communist regime, plus it's a nicer story to american ears that the US did all the most important stuff.

Similarly you don't get much mention of how many people prominent americans sympathized with Nazi philosophy or opposed getting involved in Europe... It would cloud the story.

To the OP though, note that the original Call of Duty included a very good Stalingrad stage.
Or no one in the west wants to admit that our Soviet allies were as bloodthirsty as the Nazis. That the war in the East didn't really end until 1989 and the liberation of Eastern Europe. Or admit that the ethnic cleansing that took place in the East after the war cost hundreds of thousands of lives. There was little heroic in a USSR that enabled Hitler to rearm and went to war as his ally.
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Old 12-27-2018, 02:14 AM
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Those are reasons to *add more* to the story, not omit details.

The eastern front was the more important in the European conflict, and Soviet Russia was integral to crushing the Nazi war machine. These things are really beyond dispute.
But I don't think anyone is in danger of thinking that means Stalin was a swell guy.
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Old 12-27-2018, 05:54 AM
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and?

No one talks about the Free French armies being mostly made of the Maghrebines and the West Africans - essentially mostly the muslims - the Free French get 100 percent whitened-europeanized in almost all the movies that touch on them, the French empire brownies disappear in the films...
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Old 12-27-2018, 07:20 AM
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If the soviet union has won the cold war, and the American capitalist economic system collapsed, while the soviet communist one dominated the world unopposed starting in the 1990s, then you could be sure it would be the Eastern Front would be remembered in mass media.
This is absurd. The reason people make movies centered on their own culture has everything to do with the market. Winning the Cold War has nothing to do with it. The Russians can - and do - make movies about their own history and nobody is stopping them.

The “capitalist economic system” as a concept - and therefore Hollywood - was never in danger of collapse or conquest.

Last edited by JB99; 12-27-2018 at 07:22 AM.
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Old 12-27-2018, 07:44 AM
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And the lies that the Russians ran into German machine gun positions unarmed still persist in the west.
Iím getting a little fed up with Kamaskiís insistence on characterizing things as ďlies,Ē as though there is a willful conspiracy to attack and demonize the Soviets. Thereís a saying that goes: ďNever attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity.Ē And the fact of the matter is that Americans are very, very stupid.

The average American couldnít find Normandy if you gave them a map of France. They barely know their own history, much less that of other countries. Unless someone actually takes the time to study history on their own, there is little reason to expect them to retain it.
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Old 12-27-2018, 08:01 AM
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This also brings up an interesting question for me, when will we stop thinking of world war 1 and world war 2 as two seperate wars, but actually THE SAME WAR.

Instead of being two different gigantic conflicts fought for different reasons, they were actuallyfought for the same reason (German aggression)


Except in World war 2 the Germans came back in a much more sinister and evil way.


The German Kaiser in 1914 was no nice guy, he was an autocrat, a dictator, a mean and a jealous individual with no problem using his military for aggressive war. Really he was not unlike the Middle East dictators if today.

Last edited by Kamaski; 12-27-2018 at 08:03 AM.
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Old 12-27-2018, 09:48 AM
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I know this has been talked about many, but there simply arenít enough movies/video games/books in the west which cover the enormous human scale of the Eastern Front of WW2.

A bout a year or two ago a video game came out called ďCall of Duty:WW2Ē.

Instead of focusing on the titatanic battles of of the Eastern Front where 30 million lives were lost, the game focuses on the battles of Western Europe in 1944-1945 which pale in comparison.


Americas largest battle in WW2 was the battle of the bulge where 19,000 lives were lost. The ussrs biggest battle (Stalingrad) lost 800,000 lives lost. And many more wounded/maimed/impailed.


Why is this titanic conflict, the largest land conflict in all history, so underreported in the west.

All serious military historians, American, Russian, British agree that the Second World War was decided on the eastern front. Itís not even an argument. For example Col. David Glantz, who has written many excellent books in English about the eastern front with its titanic battles.


There is obviously still a large interest in WW2 in the west, as can be seen by the movies and video games being made about it.



Why not portray the conflict accurately??
A couple of things here. First off, there have been video games set on the eastern front in the past. The fact that Call of Duty which is a 1st/3rd person shooter from what I understand (I don't play it) probably has several factors which the game designers used to determine where the setting would be. The first is that almost certainly the main market for the game will be in western countries, not Russia. IOW, the game designers (or more liked the corporate suits who green lighted the development) felt that the majority of those who would buy the game would be in the US, Canada, Australia and Europe (maybe Japan and South Korea as well). Perhaps they already have the uniforms modeled for allied soldiers and their weapons though that was probably a minor matter compared to the first. Perhaps they felt the game play on the western front would be more interesting that the brutal slog match on the eastern front. But in the end it's who would be playing to game and what they would want to play that factored in the most. You can't look at a year of gaming and then make broad statements about what was or wasn't covered in general.

Not sure what your point about the Soviets taking more casualties in one day or one battle verse what the US took is supposed to demonstrate wrt what you are asking. In Russia, especially in the Soviet era the focus of their history was, unsurprisingly, completely on their own part. In the UK, again unsurprisingly, their main focus (though not all) was on their part. And in the US, our focus was on our part. Other countries focused on other aspects too. That said, I didn't go to a particularly good school, and we spent a large part of our time when we were studying WWII on the eastern front. Certainly in college that was the focus. It was covered quite a lot. Again, because it wasn't in some game doesn't equate to, well, anything really, except the corporate suit types thinking they had a crystal ball on what would sell wrt their game.
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Old 12-27-2018, 10:01 AM
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Old 12-27-2018, 10:47 AM
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This is absurd. The reason people make movies centered on their own culture has everything to do with the market. Winning the Cold War has nothing to do with it.
Of course, America makes films about Americans and Russia make films about Russians but the reason most people have heard of Saving Private (inside and outside the US) but hardly anyone outside the former Soviet has heard of Come and See, is America won the cold war. American mass media is the default mass media.

Last edited by griffin1977; 12-27-2018 at 10:49 AM.
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Old 12-27-2018, 10:57 AM
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Of course, America makes films about Americans and Russia make films about Russians but the reason most people have heard of Saving Private (inside and outside the US) but hardly anyone outside the former Soviet has heard of Come and See, is America won the cold war. American mass media is the default mass media.
I sort of agree with this. Basically, America is the sole world hyper-power and our culture and films dominate on the world stage. Hollywood, until fairly recently, was almost entirely driven by what the American movie going public would want to go see (or, wrt the OP, what the American gaming community wanted to play), so our films reflected that (just as other countries home grown film industries reflect what they think their movie going public wants to see). However, since the US has such a huge global impact that means that a Hollywood film is going to reach a much wider audience than most if not all other countries home grown films.

Notice that recently this has been changing, though. Which is why I only sort of agree with you. Recently, the Hollywood film industry has been trying to court China (which didn't win the cold war...though they didn't lose either I suppose). A lot of recent Hollywood films have either re-written their scripts or put in parts to make them appeal to the China market as well (and, of course, get through the CCPs very restrictive foreign film rules that only allow a handful of official films a year...the rest basically being pirated, which means no profits for Hollywood).

So, the reality is that if Russia was perceived as a similarly large market you WOULD see more movies (and more games no doubt) based on the eastern front of WWII, as well as more movies focused on the Russian market. But they aren't...they are just a very niche market for US companies. It's not because of the cold war, per se, it's because there isn't any money in it.
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Old 12-27-2018, 11:05 AM
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in combination with his other thread in this forum, a reflection on the engagement can be made.
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Old 12-27-2018, 11:18 AM
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.

Notice that recently this has been changing, though. Which is why I only sort of agree with you. Recently, the Hollywood film industry has been trying to court China (which didn't win the cold war...though they didn't lose either I suppose). A lot of recent Hollywood films have either re-written their scripts or put in parts to make them appeal to the China market as well (and, of course, get through the CCPs very restrictive foreign film rules that only allow a handful of official films a year...the rest basically being pirated, which means no profits for Hollywood).
.
As I said in my original post I think the Chinese point of view in WW2 will become much more common in mass media outside China. For all the same reasons.
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Old 12-27-2018, 11:20 AM
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Because the media your are exposed to is trying to sell to Americans, not Russians.
That's why we had Americans running around the North African desert in The Rat Patrol and went through the tunnels of The Great Escape.* You can bet there were plenty of stories about the Great Patriotic War in the Soviet Union.

*Americans were in the camp and participated in the digging, but were transferred out of the camp two months before the attempt was made.
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Old 12-27-2018, 11:27 AM
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As I said in my original post I think the Chinese point of view in WW2 will become much more common in mass media outside China. For all the same reasons.
I seriously doubt it, but we shall see. Certainly movies that conform to what the CCP wants or a Chinese audience wants to see will become more common...it's already happening. I don't have a major issue with movies that appeal to the Chinese movie going audience, but I think it's a serious mistake to conform to CCP censorship or demands.
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Old 12-27-2018, 11:46 AM
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I don’t think anyone in the former Soviet Union/Russia thinks that the sacrifice of nearly half a million lives defeating Nazi germany should not be celebrated in that war. The Americans were extremely heroic. But I think the scale of the fighting in the east needs to be remembered more, there is so much subject matter there, enough to fill several encyclopedias.

Russian generals loved to drive in American Willys jeeps, they thought they wer great vehicles.

Russia is still digging up the remains of soldiers in Stalingrad, I don’t know how many have been identified or properly buried, but the number who couldn’t be identified/buried properly is much larger. Nearly a million soviet soldiers died there.
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Old 12-27-2018, 11:46 AM
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When was the last time you heard a major news anchor on CNN talk about the battle of Stalingrad, Leningrad, Moscow, Kursk or the fall of Berlin?
I don't watch CNN. But all of those battles* are featured regularly on WWII retrospectives such as the ones shown on the History Channel and Military Channel. There was a show specifically dedicated to tank battles which featured Kursk.

The fighting for Berlin gets lots of coverage in particular.

In a related matter, complaints about how the Soviets bore the brunt of fighting against the Nazis should be tempered by the knowledge that Soviet complicity with Germany (their 1939 pact, followed by the carving up of Poland) was a major factor in enabling Nazi aggression.

*I think there was only one major battle for Stalingrad/Leningrad.
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Old 12-27-2018, 11:55 AM
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I donít think anyone in the former Soviet Union/Russia thinks that the sacrifice of nearly half a million lives defeating Nazi germany should not be celebrated in that war. The Americans were extremely heroic. But I think the scale of the fighting in the east needs to be remembered more, there is so much subject matter there, enough to fill several encyclopedias.

Russian generals loved to drive in American Willys jeeps, they thought they wer great vehicles.

Russia is still digging up the remains of soldiers in Stalingrad, I donít know how many have been identified or properly buried, but the number who couldnít be identified/buried properly is much larger. Nearly a million soviet soldiers died there.
It IS remembered. It's just not something that the average Hollywood film studio (or the average Huston game company) thinks there is enough of a market for to make a major movie or hallmark game for. We didn't really see a lot of Hollywood movies about the British, and that's a much more sympathetic and less conflicted subject that the Soviet Russian story in WWII.

WWII is complex wrt the varying contribution of each power. Yes, the Soviets were a major factor in the war and certainly did the bulk of the dying. However, relative contribution to actually winning the war isn't just about who had the majority of their soldiers killed. If you want to discuss this in more detail then we can, but wrt YOUR OP the answer is simply that the major companies don't think that they can make the most money by making films or movies from a Russian perspective. It's as simple as that.
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Old 12-27-2018, 12:41 PM
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As I said in my original post I think the Chinese point of view in WW2 will become much more common in mass media outside China. For all the same reasons.
There isn't a single Chinese viewpoint of WWII and the reality of it will never be acknowledged by Communist China. There was a war against Japanese aggression and another civil war between various Chinese groups. Today's China whitewashes its history. Where are the films about Tianenmen Square?
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Old 12-27-2018, 12:47 PM
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This also brings up an interesting question for me, when will we stop thinking of world war 1 and world war 2 as two seperate wars, but actually THE SAME WAR.

Instead of being two different gigantic conflicts fought for different reasons, they were actually fought for the same reason (German aggression).
I've never thought much of that concept. I mean you could arguably draw rather more parallels between between the Franco-Prussian War, Seven Weeks War and WW I, than with any of those and WW 2. WW I and II are linked, but the regime, ideology and goals were substantially different.

Might as well argue with that logic that the War of Devolution and the Franco-Dutch War of the late 17th century were 'the same war'. I don't much hold with lumping. And yes the Hundred Years War is a misnomer and was at least three separate wars( ETA: and nonetheless thematically far more coherent than WW I and WW II ).

Last edited by Tamerlane; 12-27-2018 at 12:51 PM.
  #45  
Old 12-27-2018, 12:59 PM
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I think it was Churchill who said that WW1 and WW2 were so linked together that they might as well be part of the same war, with WW2 being a continuation of WW1. Churchill was involved in all aspects of WW1 for the British government, and as first lord of the admirtalty.

I think Churchill thought of WW1 as as his main legacy to British history, how suprised he must have been that he would play an even great part in WW2 only twenty year later.

But Churchill always thought there would be a sequel to WW1.
  #46  
Old 12-27-2018, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by madsircool View Post
There isn't a single Chinese viewpoint of WWII and the reality of it will never be acknowledged by Communist China. There was a war against Japanese aggression and another civil war between various Chinese groups. Today's China whitewashes its history. Where are the films about Tianenmen Square?
Exactly. A Chinese viewpoint of the war would entail basically the Republic of China fighting (and losing) against the Japanese, with the CCP fighting in the background, as much against the Republic and other faction groups as the Japanese. But the heroic party of Mao really mainly sat on the sidelines allowing the Republic to do most of the fighting and dying, and waiting until the Republic was so drained as to make another go at civil war viable. Mao himself said the Japanese had helped the CCP immensely to gain a final victor over the Republic and finally defeat them completely (well, except for Taiwan).

There is no way the CCP would allow that story to be told, so it would be a lot of propaganda horseshit about the valiant CCP fighting the Japanese (which is what a lot of their current war movies are like) and doing a lot of really silly things like knocking down Japanese fighters with grenades or really over the top 80's action movie gun fights with equally over the top evil Japanese villains (as if the real evil Japanese weren't bad enough).
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  #47  
Old 12-27-2018, 01:10 PM
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There isn't a single Chinese viewpoint of WWII
Equally there is no single American or Soviet story. But it is still correct to say "the" Chinese story of WW2 has been told far far less in mass media than "the" American or Soviet story.
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Old 12-27-2018, 01:19 PM
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Others have touched on the difference between the subjects covered by history and the subjects covered by pop culture. There are plenty of history books, published in America, that cover the Eastern Front of WWII. I can remember as far back as the seventies seeing authors "apologize" for writing another book on such an overdone topic or "complaining" about trying to find something new to say.

Now if you want a neglected WWII topic, you've got the land war in Asia.
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Old 12-27-2018, 01:37 PM
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Equally there is no single American or Soviet story. But it is still correct to say "the" Chinese story of WW2 has been told far far less in mass media than "the" American or Soviet story.
Its hard to tell the story of China 1932-45 when China won't allow the story to be told.
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Old 12-27-2018, 02:28 PM
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Equally there is no single American or Soviet story. But it is still correct to say "the" Chinese story of WW2 has been told far far less in mass media than "the" American or Soviet story.
Um, no. There isn't a single Chinese story because it happened at a time when there was also a Chinese civil war going on...and the weaker side that did the least against the Japanese ended up losing. A real Chinese WWII story would be about the Republic of China and the US alliance with them (though mainly that they pretty much fought alone at the same time they were beleaguered by other factions as well as the Japanese) as well as the perspective of factions like the CCP that fought the Japanese AND the government, but that story won't be told because the CCP doesn't want it to be. There is zero that is similar between the US and Soviet 'story' about WWII and the fragmentary Chinese perspective on the war. Your analogy was just bad and you've made it worse by this post.
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