Straight Dope Message Board

[ElvisL1ves]

Looks like Scumpup is going to be in the news someday, and fairly soon, doesn't it? If not for murder, then for child molestation or at least child pornography. The evidence in this thread alone is pretty strong.

Hasn't he hinted he actually works with children? Does his employer have a hint about what he admits to us he fantasizes about? 4951

[Gyrate]

Can we just change the thread title to "No, YOU'RE going to be a mass murderer!"? Because that's what it's devolved into. 4952

[ElvisL1ves]

Pssst ... bet on the guy who's armed. 4953

[Gyrate]

Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves

Pssst ... bet on the guy who's armed.

At this point I'm not betting on any of you.

Guns don't make people stupid. Guns don't make people angry. Guns don't make people crazy. What guns do do is make stupid/angry/crazy people much more dangerous.

So let's stop pretending that guns make people homicidal, but neither let us pretend that guns don't make it a lot easier for homicidal people to succeed in their goals to a much greater degree than swimming pools or propane tanks or chainsaws. Because right now y'all are all just spouting bullshit. 4954

[ElvisL1ves]

Originally Posted by Gyrate

Guns don't make people stupid. Guns don't make people angry. Guns don't make people crazy. What guns do do is make stupid/angry/crazy people much more dangerous.

Exactly.

So let's stop pretending that guns make people homicidal,

Who do you see doing that?

Because right now y'all are all just spouting bullshit.

You've gone into the bullshit of only one side. Since, after all, you are positioning yourself as above it all, uniquely objective and nonpartisan and all that, you might help by pointing out some of the bullshit on the other side as well. Or, you know, be dismissed as a bullshitter yourself, yanno? 4955

[Scumpup]

Originally Posted by Jack Batty

Yeah. Who was it that brought up raping toddlers (apropos of absolutely nothing except possibly your browser history) in this thread again?

Say hi to your therapist for me at your next appointment.

Where was all your indignation all the many, many times your fellow asshole slandered gun owners? Oh, wait, there was none. You thought that was okey-dokey. As I already told you, but I'll tell you again due to your senility, I have deliberately chosen the most offensive things I can think of and asked ElvisL1ves if he wants to do them. I fully expected him to say no, because any normal human being would deny wanting to do those things. Except, of course, he won't deny wanting to do those things. Normal people, whether they own guns or not, don't wish to harm others. Abnormal people who do wish to harm people will do so whether they have guns or not. Can I make it any clearer to you? I won't explain it to you again, regardless. If you hurry, you can still catch The Price is Right. 4956

[ElvisL1ves]

Says the guy who fantasizes about raping children ... 4957

[Scumpup]

Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves

Says the guy who fantasizes about raping children ...

You're about done, I'd say. You bullshitted yourself into a corner. You aren't smart enough to bullshit your way back out. You aren't strong enough to admit you were bullshitting and move on. You're here with "I'm rubber and you're glue."
I'm done calling you on this bullshit, for now. You've made it clear that you are too fundamentally dishonest to do anything but keep repeating your bullshit. Nobody, not even your own side, takes your talking points seriously. You are nothing but a persistent and unimaginative troll.

You have a good day now. For all our sakes. 4958

[ElvisL1ves]

Let's all just pray your pedophilia is still latent, that you haven't yet chosen to destroy a child's life, as well as praying your anger never boils over to the extent you draw a firearm.

It would be better yet, for the sake of your future, or perhaps present, victims for you to turn in your weapons and remove yourself from contact with children, but it would take a little courage and a little self-understanding first, things you have clearly not yet achieved. 4959

[Jack Batty]

Scumpup, I tell you this in all sincerity, and I do believe this is for your own sanity and well-being:

Maybe you should clear your cookies or something so that ugly temptation doesn't keep rearing it's ugly head. 4960

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by Scumpup

I ws being wrong to call you a toolbag. Neither your low IQ nor your senile dementia are your fault. I've already explained the conversation to you once, but I'll try once more. Your side, mostly ElvisL1ves, is quite happy and comfortable calling gun owners all sorts of foul things. I am behaving toward you as you do toward us. That's all. I don't fantasize about these things any more than you do. Maybe you should sit this one out. Constantly being out of step and confused will just agitate you, and wh knows where that could end?

He knows exactly what you mean. He is just hoping that he can use your use of child molestation to imply that you have secret fantasies about child molestation just like people who accuse others of being Nazis have secret fantasies of committing genocide. 4961

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves

Your superior proposal to address the death-rate problem, by comparison, would be, well what exactly? Got one? Something reality-connected, hopefully?

It sure would be nice to see something from you people.

And your answer is "do something, anything, it doesn't matter what" 4962

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by Jack Batty

Yeah. Who was it that brought up raping toddlers (apropos of absolutely nothing except possibly your browser history) in this thread again?

Say hi to your therapist for me at your next appointment.

The point you're trying to make is stupid. Scumpup brought up child molestation to point out how stupid Elvis's theory is (the oen where everyone is just one bad day away from going on a rampage). Do you really not get this or are you being intentionally obtuse? 4963

[ElvisL1ves]

Everyone gets angry from time to time. Not everyone is "just one bad day" from raping a child. Only a pedophile would even think of that one.

But congratulations on finding someone in this thread with even worse mental health issues than yourself. 4964

[ElvisL1ves]

Originally Posted by Damuri Ajashi

And your answer is "do something, anything, it doesn't matter what"

Anything is better than nothing, which is what you offer (and please don't repeat that lie about supporting a measure you actually opposed). Why is that? And why should you be taken seriously as long as that is the case? 4965

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by Scumpup

You're about done, I'd say. You bullshitted yourself into a corner. You aren't smart enough to bullshit your way back out. You aren't strong enough to admit you were bullshitting and move on. You're here with "I'm rubber and you're glue."
I'm done calling you on this bullshit, for now. You've made it clear that you are too fundamentally dishonest to do anything but keep repeating your bullshit. Nobody, not even your own side, takes your talking points seriously. You are nothing but a persistent and unimaginative troll.

You have a good day now. For all our sakes.

All they have left is intentional distortion at this point. They pretend that your criticism of Elvis's ridiculous theory that "we are all one bad day away from a multiple murder"

When we use of the statistics about the dangers to children of having a pool in the back yard compared to having a gun in the house to show that there are plenty of things that pose more of a threat to a child than a gun in the house that do not generate anywhere near the level of hysteria that guns do.

When we make this comparison to show that they are acting irrationally WRT to guns, they pretend that we are saying that pools can be used as weapons just like guns. They don't want debate, they want to vent because they are mad that they have lost the debate and are not likely to turn things around any time soon (i.e. this century). 4966

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves

Anything is better than nothing, which is what you offer (and please don't repeat that lie about supporting a measure you actually opposed). Why is that? And why should you be taken seriously as long as that is the case?

You're wrong. There are some "gun control" measures that are harmful to your cause.

A dogged insistence on banning guns based on cosmetic features has got more than a few liberal posters on this board reevaluating their position on guns. They will never be on the wavelength and Bone or even me but they are no longer uncritically accepting everything that the gun control crowd proposes. You really shot yourself in the foot with that.

I have supported licensing and registration at the federal level for years. Show me where I have opposed universal licensing and registration? I suspect you believe you can read my mind based on my reaction to Manchin Toomey (which I didn't oppose, I was happy to rub your nose in its failure because it showed how badly you had biffed it but I never opposed it). manchin Toomey was not licensing and registration. it was not even universal background checks. it was a fig leaf so that the gun control side of the debate wouldn't be too embarrassed and you blew it so bad that you couldn't even get something as watered down as Manchin Toomey. 4967

[Projammer]

Originally Posted by Damuri Ajashi

All they have left is intentional distortion at this point. They pretend that your criticism of Elvis's ridiculous theory that "we are all one bad day away from a multiple murder"

It has occurred to me that if gun owners were really as irresponsible and prone to violence as some anti-gunners claim, there wouldn't be any anti-gunners left to make the claim.

Thus, ElvisL1ves is defeated by his own arguments. 4968

[ElvisL1ves]

Originally Posted by Damuri Ajashi

All they have left is intentional distortion at this point.

Tell us more about "hoplophobia".

When we make this comparison to show that they are acting irrationally WRT to guns, they pretend that we are saying that pools can be used as weapons just like guns.

No, we observe that you are evading and obfuscating the problem rather than addressing it.

they have lost the debate and are not likely to turn things around any time soon (i.e. this century).

Do you realize how telling it is that those who want to save lives are "they" and not "we"?

I do note that you're not even trying to promote better mental health treatment, and removal of access to guns by the mentally ill, as a way to do that. That may indicate your realization that it would result in disarming you. 4969

[ElvisL1ves]

Originally Posted by Projammer

It has occurred to me that if gun owners were really as irresponsible and prone to violence as some anti-gunners claim, there wouldn't be any anti-gunners left to make the claim.

Do look into excluded middles sometime. It's a fascinating subject.

Thus, ElvisL1ves is defeated by his own arguments.

In your own delusions. 4970

[ElvisL1ves]

Originally Posted by Damuri Ajashi

I have supported licensing and registration at the federal level for years. Show me where I have opposed universal licensing and registration? I suspect you believe you can read my mind based on my reaction to Manchin Toomey (which I didn't oppose, I was happy to rub your nose in its failure because it showed how badly you had biffed it but I never opposed it).

When are you going to drop that lie? You claim to have supported it, but you're fucking gleeful that the filibuster born of NRA bribes born of your own dues money defeated it. You're gleeful that a measure you lie about having supported could not overcome you.

So, when asked again for what you actually propose, what bills you support, you have nothing. You can't even use the word "we" to describe people who want to cut down on the killings. If only you were merely dishonest; that could be dealt with. You are sick and dangerous. 4971

[Jack Batty]

Originally Posted by Damuri Ajashi

Scumpup brought up child molestation ...

Repeatedly, ad nauseum, like he was, idunno, fixated or something. It was fucking creepy. Hence my derision. 4972

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves

When are you going to drop that lie? You claim to have supported it, but you're fucking gleeful that the filibuster born of NRA bribes born of your own dues money defeated it. You're gleeful that a measure you lie about having supported could not overcome you.

OK, so show me where I am gleeful that the measure was defeated? And where do I say I supported the Manchin Toomey bill? I am pretty sure I ridiculed it as being a fig leaf from the very beginning. It wasn't just a maginot line, it was like a damming a river with a chain link fence.

So, when asked again for what you actually propose, what bills you support, you have nothing. You can't even use the word "we" to describe people who want to cut down on the killings. If only you were merely dishonest; that could be dealt with. You are sick and dangerous.

So you can read my mind but scumpup cannot read yours? 4973

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by Jack Batty

Repeatedly, ad nauseum, like he was, idunno, fixated or something. It was fucking creepy. Hence my derision.

He was basically flinging the accusation at Elvis. It is about as creepy as accusing Elvis of being one bad day away from being a Nazi but no one uses Nazi anymore so he used pedophile. I don't really see WTF you don't understand about how he was using the term.

Elvis is just frothing at the mouth because he is so pissed that he is not omnipotent and this country is a democracy that requires he actually convince people over to his side with reason rather than get people to do what he wants by accusing them of being evil. You know, "one bad day away from being a mass murderer" 4974

[Scumpup]

Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves

Let's all just pray your pedophilia is still latent, that you haven't yet chosen to destroy a child's life, as well as praying your anger never boils over to the extent you draw a firearm.

It would be better yet, for the sake of your future, or perhaps present, victims for you to turn in your weapons and remove yourself from contact with children, but it would take a little courage and a little self-understanding first, things you have clearly not yet achieved.

Here, I'll say it: I have never wanted to rape or kill a toddler; such acts are evil and I would never do or want to do such things.

Now you say it. 4975

[Scumpup]

Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves

Everyone gets angry from time to time. Not everyone is "just one bad day" from raping a child. Only a pedophile would even think of that one.

But congratulations on finding someone in this thread with even worse mental health issues than yourself.

The only one here who refuses to say he has never wanted to rape a toddler is you, Chester. My stars, what a reprehensible piece of shit you are. Too bad your mother was apparently not allowed to have wire clothes hangers. 4976

[Scumpup]

Originally Posted by Jack Batty

Repeatedly, ad nauseum, like he was, idunno, fixated or something. It was fucking creepy. Hence my derision.

It's okay that you don't understand. You're just not equipped to keep up. 4977

[Fear Itself]

Originally Posted by Scumpup

Here, I'll say it: I have never wanted to rape or kill a toddler; such acts are evil and I would never do or want to do such things.

Then why do you think about it so much? 4978

[Bone]

Originally Posted by Fear Itself

Then why do you think about it so much?

Any response to this?

Originally Posted by Bone

CA's scheme? All other things being equal, no. What are you offering in return?

4979

[Scumpup]

Originally Posted by Fear Itself

Then why do you think about it so much?

Oh look! You're back! Do you and Elvis think about murder so much because you want to murder? Good Christ, I'm amazed that you function well enough in a text based medium even to misunderstand the conversation. I'd have bet heavily on you to just not be able to read at all. 4980

[Scumpup]

Originally Posted by Fear Itself

Then why do you think about it so much?

You know, I went back and looked at your posts to this thread. Even for The Pit, your offerings are content-free. You have actually managed to make Elvis the second most stupid person in the thread. Congratulations, I guess. 4981

[Fear Itself]

Originally Posted by Bone

CA's scheme? All other things being equal, no. What are you offering in return?

From what you describe, I would like Califonia regs nationwide. 4982

[Bone]

Originally Posted by Fear Itself

From what you describe, I would like Califonia regs nationwide.

That's an answer to your question, not to mine. What would you be willing to offer to attain CA's regs nationwide? Anything? Nothing? Haven't given it sufficient thought? 4983

[Fear Itself]

Originally Posted by Bone

That's an answer to your question, not to mine. What would you be willing to offer to attain CA's regs nationwide? Anything? Nothing? Haven't given it sufficient thought?

Why would I want to give up anything? That's a pretty unrealistic expectation. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but sooner or later the steady increase in horrific gun violence will turn public opinion against easy, unfettered access to guns on demand. The longer you postpone dealing with it, the more Draconian the solutions they demand will be. You can't just kick the can down the road without consequences. 4984

[Scumpup]

Originally Posted by Fear Itself

Why would I want to give up anything? That's a pretty unrealistic expectation. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but sooner or later the steady increase in horrific gun violence will turn public opinion against easy, unfettered access to guns on demand. The longer you postpone dealing with it, the more Draconian the solutions they demand will be. You can't just kick the can down the road without consequences.

I can just picture Jimmy Stewart saying that in a Frank Capra movie. Who did you have in mind? 4985

[Bone]

Originally Posted by Fear Itself

Why would I want to give up anything? That's a pretty unrealistic expectation. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but sooner or later the steady increase in horrific gun violence will turn public opinion against easy, unfettered access to guns on demand. The longer you postpone dealing with it, the more Draconian the solutions they demand will be. You can't just kick the can down the road without consequences.

I won't begrudge your opinion here, as long as you aren't asking for nor complaining about the lack of compromise. I would say that recent history does not align to your view - gun violence has not been steadily increasing, and public opinion has not been turning.

I expect technology will play a part in the future landscape of gun laws. I'm hopeful 3D printing makes the idea that guns can be banned an anachronism. Look at the recent SCOTUS ruling about gay marriage. A marriage in one state must be recognized in another state. Imagine if the same logic applied to concealed carry permits? Places like CA would be up in arms that non-residents enjoy greater civil rights than residents and the laws would tumble.

You may be optimistic about what the future holds - so am I. 4986

[Projammer]

Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves

Your superior proposal to address the death-rate problem, by comparison, would be, well what exactly? Got one? Something reality-connected, hopefully?

I directly refute a statement that you make and rather than counter and defend you choose to ignore, deflect, and redirect. While no one actually expects reasoned discourse from you, you could at least make the occasional effort. Who knows? Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while.

But to address your deflection..

• Allow citizens to defend themselves and others.
• Do nothing. The status quo will eventually lead to the previous solution.
• ---This ends reasonable legislation---
• Pass weapon bans that do nothing but give anti-gunners warm fuzzies.
• Ban all weapons. Disarming citizens and ignored by criminals.
• Pass laws creating criminals from citizens with a single signature.

The cities with the highest crime rates have the strictest gun laws. Unarmed citizens -v- armed criminals. Criminals ignore gun laws. Who knew? 4987

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by Fear Itself

Why would I want to give up anything? That's a pretty unrealistic expectation. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but sooner or later the steady increase in horrific gun violence will turn public opinion against easy, unfettered access to guns on demand. The longer you postpone dealing with it, the more Draconian the solutions they demand will be. You can't just kick the can down the road without consequences.

First of all, the tide is not going in the direction you think it is. Gun laws are being relaxed across the country. SCOTUS is likely to enforce the constitutional right to bear arms (the right to carry).

Second, we do not have "unfettered access to guns on demand" Guns are about the most regulated product on the market. Some people want access to guns to be limited to cops and that's fine, just repeal the second amendment. All you have to do is get 2/3rds of each house of congress and 3/4ths of the states to agree with you and you're set. But seeing as we can't even get 40 members of the senate to support an assault weapons ban, we are a long way from the "draconian solutions" you mention.

I suspect we will have light sabers and plasma rifles before we get anywhere close to those draconian consequences.

In short, the gun rights side does not have to compromise right now and you do but you seem to think that the opposite is true. 4988

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by Bone

I won't begrudge your opinion here, as long as you aren't asking for nor complaining about the lack of compromise. I would say that recent history does not align to your view - gun violence has not been steadily increasing, and public opinion has not been turning.

They are not complaining about a lack of compromise, they are complaining about our failure to surrender and capitulate. 4989

[Bruce Wayne]

Originally Posted by Fear Itself

Why would I want to give up anything? That's a pretty unrealistic expectation. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but sooner or later the steady increase in horrific gun violence will turn public opinion against easy, unfettered access to guns on demand. The longer you postpone dealing with it, the more Draconian the solutions they demand will be. You can't just kick the can down the road without consequences.

There is no steady increase in horrific gun violence. Your side isn't winning and the idea that you will eventually is wishful thinking. 4990

[Fear Itself]

Originally Posted by Damuri Ajashi

In short, the gun rights side does not have to compromise right now and you do but you seem to think that the opposite is true.

"Right now" being the operative words in that sentence. The frequency and barbarity of mass shootings is accelerating, and there will be a point at which people will happily trade liberty for safety. Social change can come out of nowhere; witness the public opinion on gay marriage in the last ten years.

You are never going to know what hit you. 4991

[ElvisL1ves]

Originally Posted by Damuri Ajashi

they are complaining about our failure to surrender and capitulate.

No. We are complaining about your active hostility toward reducing the number of killings, and your having to resort to delusional scenarios and "No, you're the sickos!" assertions to do so.

All this time and you still can't be bothered to state a view other than your own accurately, or even with a relevant caricature. 4992

[ElvisL1ves]

Originally Posted by Projammer

I directly refute a statement that you make

"Nuh-uh!" is not a refutation.

• Allow citizens to defend themselves and others.
• Do nothing. The status quo will eventually lead to the previous solution.
• ---This ends reasonable legislation---
• Pass weapon bans that do nothing but give anti-gunners warm fuzzies.
• Ban all weapons. Disarming citizens and ignored by criminals.
• Pass laws creating criminals from citizens with a single signature.

How about something related to life here on Earth? 4993

[ElvisL1ves]

Originally Posted by Bone

TWhat would you be willing to offer to attain CA's regs nationwide? Anything? Nothing? Haven't given it sufficient thought?

Have you thought about answering a question you were already asked? If something is a good idea, why should it be balanced by a bad one? That's just weird. If it's a good idea, we should all be in favor of doing it, right?

Unless you're not really willing to discuss anything at all, even to save lives, which is what the evidence suggests, not to your favor. 4994

[Scumpup]

Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves

Have you thought about answering a question you were already asked?

You never do. Of course, you have the excuse of being a moral coward, dishonest, and just not very bright.

Still waiting to hear you say that you don't desire to murder children. Heck, I'll settle for you just affirming that you don't want to murder anyone. C'mon. You can do it. Don't be a worthless shitstain for once in your life. Give your mother one moment from your life that won't fill her with regret. 4995

[ElvisL1ves]

Says the pedophile. 4996

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by Fear Itself

"Right now" being the operative words in that sentence. The frequency and barbarity of mass shootings is accelerating, and there will be a point at which people will happily trade liberty for safety. Social change can come out of nowhere; witness the public opinion on gay marriage in the last ten years.

You are never going to know what hit you.

Mass shooting accounts for less than 1% of shooting deaths. I think enough people realize this that that we won't have draconian results. I don't see us repealing the second amendment based on a mass shooting. 4997

[ElvisL1ves]

It takes repeated shocks of that kind to break through the walls of denial propped up by the likes of yourself. The frequency is not reducing, either, for reasons you know well even if you can't face up to them squarely.

You've repeatedly stated that there is an "acceptable number" of gun killings as the price of, well, something or other that sounds like "freedom" to you. Are you willing to tell us what the number is that you find acceptable? And how you can claim that people who want fewer killings are the real sickos? 4998

[Damuri Ajashi]

Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves

Have you thought about answering a question you were already asked? If something is a good idea, why should it be balanced by a bad one? That's just weird. If it's a good idea, we should all be in favor of doing it, right?

Unless you're not really willing to discuss anything at all, even to save lives, which is what the evidence suggests, not to your favor.

I thought bone has been making it pretty clear that he thinks California's laws are horrible. 4999

[ElvisL1ves]

That wasn't the question. You can't even read honestly. 5000