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  #101  
Old 03-28-2019, 10:32 AM
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And now president scumbag is getting in on the action:

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"FBI & DOJ to review the outrageous Jussie Smollett case in Chicago," Trump tweeted Thursday morning. "It is an embarrassment to our nation!"
There his is, expressing more outrage than he did over Charlottesville, Stoneman Douglas or Las Vegas. Utterly fucking pathetic.
  #102  
Old 03-28-2019, 10:42 AM
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According to abc7chicargo:
"On Wednesday, Cook County State's Attorney Kim Foxx defended her office's decision to drop all charges against Smollett, who was accused of staging a racist and homophobic attack on himself.

"I believe this is a just outcome based on the circumstances," Foxx said.

Foxx said that the practice of dropping charges in exchange for community service and restitution is not uncommon for the Class 4 felonies that Smollett was charged with. "


This quite clearly shows that he did do it and paid the "fine" in the same way one pays a fine for a traffic violation to avoid going to court.
OK, i did not know that one could null out 14 *felony* charges with a fine, but that's another matter...
I've never heard of any kind of plea bargain where the defendant didn't accept responsibility for his actions. That's not the case here--he's maintaining his innocence, looking for the 'real perpetrators', and considering suing the city of Chicago & the police department.
  #103  
Old 03-28-2019, 10:53 AM
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And now president scumbag is getting in on the action:



There his is, expressing more outrage than he did over Charlottesville, Stoneman Douglas or Las Vegas. Utterly fucking pathetic.
I take it that this is a big story on Faux and Friends, then.
  #104  
Old 03-28-2019, 11:04 AM
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Even his "community service" seems sketchy. Rainbow thought he was volunteering. Stuffed envelopes,worked in the bookstore. Critiquing its Saturday broadcast LOL, poor guy must of been absolutely exhausted.

Jussie got an easy 18 hours of community service. Imho Usually they pick up trash or remove graffiti. I remember photos of Boy George in a yellow vest on trash detail.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.tmz...arges-dropped/

Quote:
A Rainbow PUSH rep says it was their decision, not Jussie's, to keep his work with them under wraps. The rep added that they viewed his efforts as volunteering, not community service. Point being ... Jussie never mentioned his deal with prosecutors. Remember, the prosecutor's office says it was in discussions with Smollett's camp for weeks about dropping the charges. 

Last edited by aceplace57; 03-28-2019 at 11:06 AM.
  #105  
Old 03-28-2019, 11:11 AM
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More typical community service.
https://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-bo...-32839259.html
  #106  
Old 03-28-2019, 11:13 AM
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Community service is something ordered by a judge, not volunteer work serving a special interest you like.
  #107  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:12 PM
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And now president scumbag is getting in on the action:

There his is, expressing more outrage than he did over Charlottesville, Stoneman Douglas or Las Vegas. Utterly fucking pathetic.
Yep.

Smollett is an asshole, and they should not have dropped the charges. But if there's one thing that would get me to rally behind him, it's President Bone Spurs taking up the case.
  #108  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:15 PM
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I’m most confused by how he managed to insure it got sealed? What’s in there that it can’t be made public? Surely the public has an interest in the outcome here, as it could mean prosecutors or police over reacted! In a case such as this, if he’s innocent especially why would he want it sealed?
I'll be interested if anyone challenges the seal. I follow the Volokh Conspiracy legal blog, and they've had some recent discussions of cases involving sealed court documents. In some cases, those seals have been overturned after being appealed to a higher court. In at least one of those cases, the appeals court explicitly stated that avoiding embarrassment for one or more parties was not a sufficiently good reason to seal a public court record.
  #109  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:18 PM
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I wonder there is such viciousness against Smollett. Nobody died, he didn't injure anyone. Sure, he lied to police. The police wasted time on this case that would be better spent elsewhere. I get that. But that doesn't explain the torrent of passion. Now Rahm Emmanuel wants to bill him for the policework. Yeah, right. That ALWAYS happens. Cops investigate something, file charges, the prosecutor drops the case but the accused has to somehow make the police whole.
  #110  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:24 PM
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Your name isn't Francis by chance?

Smollett is still going to be prosecuted by the court of public opinion which could hurt him more than a first time conviction.
I don't get the "Francis" reference unless you're referring to Stripes. Yes, I'm pissed. After the Mueller Report and the college admission scandal, this is the last straw for a week filled with different justice rendered for the rich and connected.

And the court of public opinion is not justice. Especially when his costars gloat and Smollet "weighs" a lawsuit against the CPD.

Comments of his costars - Yeah so it's ET, but it's the first I came across:

https://www.etonline.com/jussie-smol...nst-him-122217
  #111  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:30 PM
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SHRUG. In 2000 SC I did mine at Meals on Wheels and did a lot of good for them. No uniform like you show required. I kept volunteering after my mandatory service was over. I'm glad to see that in SC they are doing one thing uncommon and getting good results with it. Picking up papers wouldn't have done anything for me or for the community. I was able to actually do something to help instead of burning time. Handled much better than what other states must be doing.
  #112  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:36 PM
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And the court of public opinion is not justice. Especially when his costars gloat and Smollet "weighs" a lawsuit against the CPD.
Well, I would propose to many conservatives out there that I will not ever support any show where Smollet or Trump will appear in the future and to not vote for them ever too, deal?

Last edited by GIGObuster; 03-28-2019 at 12:37 PM.
  #113  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:37 PM
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I wonder there is such viciousness against Smollett. Nobody died, he didn't injure anyone. Sure, he lied to police. The police wasted time on this case that would be better spent elsewhere. I get that. But that doesn't explain the torrent of passion. Now Rahm Emmanuel wants to bill him for the policework. Yeah, right. That ALWAYS happens. Cops investigate something, file charges, the prosecutor drops the case but the accused has to somehow make the police whole.
He was trying to exacerbate racial animosity.
  #114  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:38 PM
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I wonder there is such viciousness against Smollett. Nobody died, he didn't injure anyone. Sure, he lied to police. The police wasted time on this case that would be better spent elsewhere. I get that. But that doesn't explain the torrent of passion. Now Rahm Emmanuel wants to bill him for the policework. Yeah, right. That ALWAYS happens. Cops investigate something, file charges, the prosecutor drops the case but the accused has to somehow make the police whole.
Easy. He leveraged racial and political division not seen since the Civil War and inflamed it further, he made it easier for the right to claim "Fake News" forever more, he made it more difficult for real victims to be taken seriously, he wasted the time and money of local government that could have been spent helping those in need of food, housing or justice, he further proved that the rich and connected get different treatment, and he did it all because $2.25 million a season wasn't enough. You don't have to be racist or a Trump supporter to be outraged at that.
  #115  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:42 PM
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I wonder there is such viciousness against Smollett. Nobody died, he didn't injure anyone. Sure, he lied to police. The police wasted time on this case that would be better spent elsewhere. I get that. But that doesn't explain the torrent of passion. Now Rahm Emmanuel wants to bill him for the policework. Yeah, right. That ALWAYS happens. Cops investigate something, file charges, the prosecutor drops the case but the accused has to somehow make the police whole.
If Donald Trump Jr (or any privileged white man) reported to police that 2 black men jumped him, beat him up, poured chemicals on him, and put a rope around his neck & played the victim on GMA....then it all turned out to be a hoax perpetrated by DTJ to further his agenda, would it bother you if he had all the charges dropped by the prosecutors office, because he had connections with powerful people?

Or would it be no big deal because nobody died & he didn't injure anyone? If police spent $100k on their investigation, are you saying that DTJ wouldn't owe it to them to reimburse police for his hoax?

Last edited by Enola Gay; 03-28-2019 at 12:45 PM.
  #116  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:44 PM
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Well, I would propose to many conservatives out there that I will not ever support any show where Smollet or Trump will appear in the future and to not vote for them ever too, deal?
I don't know if you're implying that I'm a Trump supporter so I'll just say in 2020 I'd be more than happy to plow through a few hundred Trump supporters in my car, on my way to the polls, to vote for Jussie Smollet for President.
  #117  
Old 03-28-2019, 12:53 PM
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I don't know if you're implying that I'm a Trump supporter so I'll just say in 2020 I'd be more than happy to plow through a few hundred Trump supporters in my car, on my way to the polls, to vote for Jussie Smollet for President.
Past the edit window. Probably shouldn't have said some of that. Mods feel free to edit the part out about plowing through certain people with my car. My apologies.
  #118  
Old 03-28-2019, 01:10 PM
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I don't know if you're implying that I'm a Trump supporter ... [snip]
No, I pointed jokingly "out there", to the conservatives and trashy TV viewers * outside the thread and the forums.









* Not about the previous TV work of Smollet, but referring here to the future gigs that he is now likely to get in the future.
  #119  
Old 03-28-2019, 01:17 PM
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Now Foxx is saying he would have been convicted if they'd gone to trial. What a cluster.
  #120  
Old 03-28-2019, 01:58 PM
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Kid Charlemagne, since you apologized so promptly, I won't make this a Warning. But do not threaten violence.
  #121  
Old 03-28-2019, 03:56 PM
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Now Foxx is saying he would have been convicted if they'd gone to trial. What a cluster.
from your cite:

Foxx said that the deal, which essentially wipes Smollett’s record clear, was not a sign that the prosecution case was weak or that Smollett was innocent, and said similar low-level felony defendants are cut the same breaks.

That should be easy enough to verify. What percentage of first time offenders have the charges dropped for the level of crime Smollett is accused of.

I don't know if it would be considered double jeopardy to reopen the case but Smollett's continued insistence that he was attacked constitutes a false charge against the 2 men in question or the public at large.
  #122  
Old 03-28-2019, 04:25 PM
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That should be easy enough to verify. What percentage of first time offenders have the charges dropped for the level of crime Smollett is accused of.
Not that easy, apparently. The following email was circulated internally at the State's Attorney's Office on Tuesday. They are in major damage control mode, and while they have disposed of 5700 other felony cases with 'alternative prosecution', none have yet been found that have been handled like Smollett's case was handled.

Most importantly, the agreement was 'verbal' and he admitted NO wrong doing. In fact, he's doubled down by insisting he is innocent & is considering suing the City of Chicago and Chicago Police Department. If they do find any other such case, then they are as incompetent as can be. But I highly doubt any other accused felon had charges dropped without a formal plea agreement, including admission of guilt and agreement not to sue the city or PD for wrongful arrest.

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We are looking for examples of cases, felony preferable, where we, in excersing [sic] our discretion, have entered into verbal agreements with defense attorneys to dismiss charges against an offender if certain conditions were met, such as the payment of restitution, completion of community service, completion of class, etc., but the defendant was not placed in a formal diversion program.

Please ask your ASAs if they have examples of these types of dispositions and we will work with them further to figure out on what case it was done. Nobody is in trouble, we are just looking for further examples of how we, as prosecutors, use our discretion in a way that restores the victim, but causes minimal harm to the defendant in the long term.
  #123  
Old 03-28-2019, 04:25 PM
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from your cite:

Foxx said that the deal, which essentially wipes Smollett’s record clear, was not a sign that the prosecution case was weak or that Smollett was innocent, and said similar low-level felony defendants are cut the same breaks.

That should be easy enough to verify. What percentage of first time offenders have the charges dropped for the level of crime Smollett is accused of.

I don't know if it would be considered double jeopardy to reopen the case but Smollett's continued insistence that he was attacked constitutes a false charge against the 2 men in question or the public at large.
It sounds to me like that claim was made without much evidence and now they're scrambling to find some:

Quote:
An internal email from the office of Cook County State’s Attorney Kim Foxx, obtained by Fox News on Wednesday, asked assistant state's attorneys to dig for any examples to bolster Foxx’s claim that the dropped charges in the Jussie Smollett case weren’t as uncommon or shocking as they seemed.

The email read in part, “We are looking for examples of cases, felony preferable, where we, in (exercising) our discretion, have entered into verbal agreements with defense attorneys to dismiss charges against an offender if certain conditions were met...”

...
https://www.foxnews.com/us/internal-...ollett-charges
  #124  
Old 03-28-2019, 04:34 PM
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Not that easy, apparently. The following email was circulated internally at the State's Attorney's Office on Tuesday. They are in major damage control mode, and while they have disposed of 5700 other felony cases with 'alternative prosecution', none have yet been found that have been handled like Smollett's case was handled.

Most importantly, the agreement was 'verbal' and he admitted NO wrong doing. In fact, he's doubled down by insisting he is innocent & is considering suing the City of Chicago and Chicago Police Department. If they do find any other such case, then they are as incompetent as can be. But I highly doubt any other accused felon had charges dropped without a formal plea agreement, including admission of guilt and agreement not to sue the city or PD for wrongful arrest.
IANAL but I think the wall in front of the fan just got a stucco coating.

If Smollett tries to sue the city then they would be forced to present the evidence they gathered. Even if double-jeopardy stops them from prosecuting him they can use it to sustain their original case.
  #125  
Old 03-28-2019, 05:38 PM
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Community service is something ordered by a judge, not volunteer work serving a special interest you like.
I don't think that statement is correct.

But what I really wanted to ask is: how likely is it that this restitution happens?

Last edited by Snowboarder Bo; 03-28-2019 at 05:43 PM.
  #126  
Old 03-28-2019, 05:57 PM
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I don't think that statement is correct.

But what I really wanted to ask is: how likely is it that this restitution happens?
He had already done the community service before the case against him was dropped. He volunteered for 2 days at Jesse Jackson's civil rights organization (Rainbow Push) selling civil rights gear & giving high school students advice about social media.
  #127  
Old 03-28-2019, 06:03 PM
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Chicago has now sent Jussie a bill for $130,000.
  #128  
Old 03-28-2019, 06:17 PM
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He had already done the community service before the case against him was dropped. He volunteered for 2 days at Jesse Jackson's civil rights organization (Rainbow Push) selling civil rights gear & giving high school students advice about social media.
Wow, I thought it was assigned by a judge and involved many hours of drudgery as a form of restitution to the community. Who knew?

I wonder if I could cash in previous volunteer work.
  #129  
Old 03-28-2019, 06:32 PM
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I must have thousands of banked hours of community service at this point (church, Boy Scouts, gun rights groups, various community organizations, etc). The going rate in Chicago appears to be about 1.1 hours of community service per felony, right?

Last edited by HurricaneDitka; 03-28-2019 at 06:33 PM.
  #130  
Old 03-28-2019, 06:46 PM
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He had already done the community service before the case against him was dropped. He volunteered for 2 days at Jesse Jackson's civil rights organization (Rainbow Push) selling civil rights gear & giving high school students advice about social media.
Is there a reason you quoted my post?
  #131  
Old 03-28-2019, 06:47 PM
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Wow, I thought it was assigned by a judge and involved many hours of drudgery as a form of restitution to the community. Who knew?
I did. Prolly many others, too.
  #132  
Old 03-28-2019, 07:12 PM
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...: how likely is it that this restitution happens?
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Is there a reason you quoted my post?
I must have misunderstood your post, but when you asked "how likely is it that this restitution happens?", I thought the restitution you were asking about was community service.
  #133  
Old 03-28-2019, 07:15 PM
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Wow, I thought it was assigned by a judge and involved many hours of drudgery as a form of restitution to the community. Who knew?

I wonder if I could cash in previous volunteer work.
Planning something? (joke - JOKE!)
  #134  
Old 03-28-2019, 09:28 PM
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I must have misunderstood your post, but when you asked "how likely is it that this restitution happens?", I thought the restitution you were asking about was community service.
Ah; yes, you misunderstood. If I had meant community service, I would have said "community service". I was asking about the $130,000 restitution that the Chicago PD is now seeking from Mr. Smollett; I should have been more specific. And I was asking because at the moment, it seems to me that their chances of collecting that $130,000 is very close to zero, if not actually zero.

Last edited by Snowboarder Bo; 03-28-2019 at 09:29 PM.
  #135  
Old 03-28-2019, 09:37 PM
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Ah; yes, you misunderstood. If I had meant community service, I would have said "community service". I was asking about the $130,000 restitution that the Chicago PD is now seeking from Mr. Smollett; I should have been more specific. And I was asking because at the moment, it seems to me that their chances of collecting that $130,000 is very close to zero, if not actually zero.
Gotcha. And I just read the demand letter that was sent to Smollett from the city of Chicago & it basically says pay up, or we'll take further 'legal action'. I am not certain what legal remedies are available to them, now that charges have been dropped. Would love to hear from anyone in-the-know out there.
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Old 03-28-2019, 09:53 PM
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Gotcha. And I just read the demand letter that was sent to Smollett from the city of Chicago & it basically says pay up, or we'll take further 'legal action'. I am not certain what legal remedies are available to them, now that charges have been dropped. Would love to hear from anyone in-the-know out there.
Can a city sue in a civil court type of lawsuit, genuine question I have no idea.
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  #137  
Old 03-28-2019, 09:55 PM
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Missed edit window, as my pasta was boiling....but anyway, where was I? The letter did cite municipal code violations/remedies, but "legal experts" on the news said those didn't apply since charges had been dropped & records had been sealed.

Question: Can the city of Chicago subpoena the sealed court records if they need them to prove they didn't defame/falsely arrest him?

ETA: Pool that's an interesting question. I don't know either.

Last edited by Enola Gay; 03-28-2019 at 09:57 PM.
  #138  
Old 03-28-2019, 09:58 PM
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Somewhere said that they are allowed to ask for up to triple damages. So if he refuses to pay the $130,00000, they can demand $390,000 that he will refuse to pay.
  #139  
Old 03-29-2019, 12:42 AM
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I wonder there is such viciousness against Smollett. Nobody died, he didn't injure anyone. Sure, he lied to police. The police wasted time on this case that would be better spent elsewhere. I get that. But that doesn't explain the torrent of passion.
It's caught up in national cultural politics now, so the potential for vitriol is almost limitless. Witness the Orange Hairdo in Chief getting involved, and expressing more outrage than he did over actual killings.

I'm pissed at Smollett, and I think he's an asshole. But I don't particularly want prison time for him. We put too many people in prison already. In fact, I'd be happy wit a fine and community service or probation.

But to get that, he should have to plead guilty and admit that he did it. As it stands now, he gets off and still gets to (try to) maintain his innocence.
  #140  
Old 03-29-2019, 01:09 AM
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This shit keeps getting more amazing:


Last edited by HurricaneDitka; 03-29-2019 at 01:10 AM.
  #141  
Old 03-29-2019, 07:21 AM
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Somewhere said that they are allowed to ask for up to triple damages. So if he refuses to pay the $130,00000, they can demand $390,000 that he will refuse to pay.
He might opt for the $390K if he doesn't have the $13 million.
  #142  
Old 03-29-2019, 09:17 AM
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Foxx is getting crushed by lawyer groups. The Illinois Prosecutors Bar Association was particularly scathing.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chi...story,amp.html

http://www.fox32chicago.com/news/loc...ed-the-public-
  #143  
Old 03-29-2019, 01:38 PM
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I was just coming to post about the Illinois State Prosecutors.

http://www.ilpba.org/announcements/7249825
  #144  
Old 03-29-2019, 02:15 PM
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So was Foxx paid off, or what?
  #145  
Old 03-29-2019, 03:21 PM
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I don't know if it would be considered double jeopardy to reopen the case but Smollett's continued insistence that he was attacked constitutes a false charge against the 2 men in question or the public at large.
I don't know the conditions of the agreement, the sealing of records and whatnot. It's possible double jeopardy would apply. It is also likely that his continued public assertion he was attacked does not meet the grounds of filing an official record, such that he could be prosecuted for it as a separate occurrence.

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Gotcha. And I just read the demand letter that was sent to Smollett from the city of Chicago & it basically says pay up, or we'll take further 'legal action'. I am not certain what legal remedies are available to them, now that charges have been dropped. Would love to hear from anyone in-the-know out there.
Again, I don't know if they can prosecute him for anything, especially since that would require the Prosecutor's Office to actually enforce. However, I think the city could press a civil suit for costs and damages.

Alternately, Jussie could sue the city for continued "disparagement". Either way, further legal action should open the sealed records for the court to evaluate. Wouldn't necessarily make them public, but would be evidence to justify the city's case in either situation.

Also, it would be really interesting if Foxx ends up doing jail time for some sort of corruption - bribery, influence, whatever.
  #146  
Old 03-29-2019, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Two Many Cats View Post
Gah! Just fire the guy from the show and be done!
Maybe he could do a project with Joss Whedon and get a Juice Newton song for the theme.
  #147  
Old 03-29-2019, 07:37 PM
Magiver is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren Garrison View Post
So was Foxx paid off, or what?
It would take a lot of money to replace a career. Based on the public statements made by the legal community I imagine she will come under some kind of legal review.

And Smollett's continued insistence of innocence means the police have a duty to continue the investigation and that would require access to the sealed files.

All of this will mean time for FOIA requests to work their way through the court system.

Last edited by Magiver; 03-29-2019 at 07:38 PM.
  #148  
Old 03-30-2019, 04:05 PM
Enola Gay is offline
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Originally Posted by Irishman View Post
I don't know the conditions of the agreement, the sealing of records and whatnot. It's possible double jeopardy would apply. It is also likely that his continued public assertion he was attacked does not meet the grounds of filing an official record, such that he could be prosecuted for it as a separate occurrence.



Again, I don't know if they can prosecute him for anything, especially since that would require the Prosecutor's Office to actually enforce. However, I think the city could press a civil suit for costs and damages.

Alternately, Jussie could sue the city for continued "disparagement". Either way, further legal action should open the sealed records for the court to evaluate. Wouldn't necessarily make them public, but would be evidence to justify the city's case in either situation.

Also, it would be really interesting if Foxx ends up doing jail time for some sort of corruption - bribery, influence, whatever.
I think he can still be prosecuted in federal court since there are federal laws against hate crimes.

And Kim Foxx is up for reelection next year. I doubt she'll be prosecuted, although I think she should be. Turns out she lied about recusing herself (she was using the term "colloquially" and not in the legal sense. I'm not a resident of Cook County, but if I was I would never reelect someone who is so dishonest. She makes the city of Chicago look really corrupt.
  #149  
Old 03-30-2019, 04:56 PM
Gatopescado is offline
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Originally Posted by Enola Gay View Post
She makes the city of Chicago look really corrupt.
This made me laugh.
  #150  
Old 03-30-2019, 05:56 PM
Dewey Finn is offline
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The Chicago Tribune ran an op-ed piece yesterday by Kim Foxx, the Cook County State's Attorney, to explain why she dropped the charges.

Last edited by Dewey Finn; 03-30-2019 at 05:56 PM.
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