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  #151  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:00 PM
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You mean, move to the right to get legislation passed.

It's legislation that changes people's lives - shit that gets passed into law -, not campaign promises.
No, I mean the republicans will recognize Biden is a gullible old man showing signs of senility and they will prey on him. Constantly pressuring him to move to the right (cut social security and medicare, appoint conservative judges) by saying they will work with him, and at the end of the day they probably wont.

They ran that scam on him with the ACA. The GOP kept saying 'make the legislation more conservative and we will vote for it' so Biden and the democrats would, and the GOP didn't vote for it anyway.
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  #152  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:00 PM
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1. He's not Trump.
2. He will follow the rule of law.
3. He will follow the Constitution.
4. He will nominate moderate judges (and not nominate wacko right wing ideologue judges)
5. He will protect and expand Obamacare - flawed though it may be is much better than what existed before and expanded coverage.
6. He will allow asylum seekers and immigrants to go through the normal process.
7. He won't put immigrants in cages.
8. He will put competent people in positions of power
9. He will try to increase taxes for the rich and keep taxation moderate for everyone else
10. He will protect the LGBTQ community.
11. Probably a lot of other shit.

I'd rather have 10-15 issues that are achieveable than 3 "signatures" that don't have shit chance of passing.
All of the same attributes that helped Hillary Clinton defeat Donald Trump.
  #153  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:05 PM
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All of the same attributes that helped Hillary Clinton defeat Donald Trump.
The main appeals of Biden is that as a white man he isn't threatening to rural whites as much as a socialist, a woman or a black person is.

He also reminds people of better times during the Obama years.

Every claim made by asahi about Biden can be made about every democratic candidate.

Also fuck moderate judges. Lets get some left wing judges appointed instead.
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Last edited by Wesley Clark; 03-03-2020 at 10:06 PM.
  #154  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:05 PM
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Assuming Biden gets the nom one way or another, he needs to hammer home on healthcare. That's probably the biggest shift as far as talking points/issues between the Clinton-Trump election and a potential Biden-Trump election. The message needs to be that Trump promised he had a better plan for Obamacare, couldn't come up with a plan and settled for trying to repeal the entire law through the courts.

I think there should also be a focus on Trump's abuse of the constitution and rule of law, but unfortunately it hasn't diminished Trump's approval at all so far. It's still probably better to keep bringing up Ukraine because we know Trump is going to be spewing conspiracy theories and if you don't actually respond it looks like conceding defeat.

Pointing out Trump's bigotry is probably important as far as drawing turnout from minority groups, but I unfortunately think that people have already picked sides for the most part on that.

Last edited by str8cashhomie; 03-03-2020 at 10:05 PM.
  #155  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:06 PM
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Not only that, but Biden will probably constantly move to the right to appease republicans into cooperating with him (and they won't cooperate with him).

Ah well.
Ah, well, Bernie can go back to the Senate floor and waggle his finger.
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  #156  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:17 PM
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Was there any monkey business in the Oklahoma caucus in 2016? Didn’t really follow that one. In Minnesota, the Bernie Bros tried to block all the parking at caucus sights in addition to their usual bullying.
Oklahoma was a primary four years ago (and before that too, but that wasn't relevant)
  #157  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:18 PM
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Biden is a centrist Democrat and the majority of Democrats are centrists. He does extremely well with black voters, and their lack of turnout in key states was sufficient to explain the narrow margins Trump won them by. He isn't a socialist.

And that last statement is everything. There's absolutely nothing wrong with being a democratic socialist of Bernie's ilk. Except to the people for whom the word socialist eats into their brains with all the terror of a ten-foot zombie tarantula. And that's probably half the country. If Sanders gets nominated, no matter what he says, no matter who supports him, no matter how good his ideas are, the country will hear SOCIALIST SOCIALIST SOCIALIST a thousand times a day. Nothing else will penetrate. The party will be so demonized that it might need a generation to recover.

Sanders is the worst possible candidate for the real America of 2020. Anyone hiding the word SOCIALIST until the bottom of a long post probably recognizes that unconsciously. It is death. You have to go back to Al Smith in 1928 when the word CATHOLIC was similar anathema to find an equivalent. Democrats told themselves then that being a Catholic was meaningless, that nobody really cared, that his plans and ideas were better than Hoover's. None of that mattered against the perpetual din of CATHOLIC CATHOLIC CATHOLIC. A generation later that identification no longer dominated. Today it's a total non-issue. A democratic socialist will be similarly accepted in another generation. Maybe sooner.

But not in 2020.

The Democratic candidate cannot be a SOCIALIST. Nothing else compares. Nothing. Whatever Biden's faults are - and yes, they are many and he never was my candidate - at least he isn't a SOCIALIST. Every other adult politician in the party understands that, which is why Buttigeg and Klobuchar dropped out of the race and endorsed Biden. They did it for the Democratic party and because the only thing that matters in this election is defeating Trump. A SOCIALIST will lose the Presidency, keep the party from winning the Senate, and maybe lose the house as well. No sane Democrat could stand to see that happen.

You have two choices. A SOCIALIST and Trump winning or a non-socialist and the chance of defeating Trump. That's it. Like it or not. That's reality in 2020.
  #158  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Exapno Mapcase View Post
Biden is a centrist Democrat and the majority of Democrats are centrists. He does extremely well with black voters, and their lack of turnout in key states was sufficient to explain the narrow margins Trump won them by. He isn't a socialist.

And that last statement is everything. There's absolutely nothing wrong with being a democratic socialist of Bernie's ilk. Except to the people for whom the word socialist eats into their brains with all the terror of a ten-foot zombie tarantula. And that's probably half the country. If Sanders gets nominated, no matter what he says, no matter who supports him, no matter how good his ideas are, the country will hear SOCIALIST SOCIALIST SOCIALIST a thousand times a day. Nothing else will penetrate. The party will be so demonized that it might need a generation to recover.

Sanders is the worst possible candidate for the real America of 2020. Anyone hiding the word SOCIALIST until the bottom of a long post probably recognizes that unconsciously. It is death. You have to go back to Al Smith in 1928 when the word CATHOLIC was similar anathema to find an equivalent. Democrats told themselves then that being a Catholic was meaningless, that nobody really cared, that his plans and ideas were better than Hoover's. None of that mattered against the perpetual din of CATHOLIC CATHOLIC CATHOLIC. A generation later that identification no longer dominated. Today it's a total non-issue. A democratic socialist will be similarly accepted in another generation. Maybe sooner.

But not in 2020.

The Democratic candidate cannot be a SOCIALIST. Nothing else compares. Nothing. Whatever Biden's faults are - and yes, they are many and he never was my candidate - at least he isn't a SOCIALIST. Every other adult politician in the party understands that, which is why Buttigeg and Klobuchar dropped out of the race and endorsed Biden. They did it for the Democratic party and because the only thing that matters in this election is defeating Trump. A SOCIALIST will lose the Presidency, keep the party from winning the Senate, and maybe lose the house as well. No sane Democrat could stand to see that happen.

You have two choices. A SOCIALIST and Trump winning or a non-socialist and the chance of defeating Trump. That's it. Like it or not. That's reality in 2020.
Gee maybe if you spell out SOCIALIST in all caps one more time you might convince me!!
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  #159  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:31 PM
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Ah, well, Bernie can go back to the Senate floor and waggle his finger.
Ah well. Sanders has solid, and sometimes overwhelming majorities among voters under the age of 45, and each year millions of conservative older voters die off and are replaced by their grandkids at the ballot box.

Society is changing. It wont happen overnight but we will get a progressive movement in the coming decades.
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  #160  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:31 PM
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I don't give a fuck what you CALL his position. I believe it's the morally correct position. And I think it'd be possible to sell it to America with the right marketing, just like any other goddamn thing on God's earth.

I started out as a libertarian. Sanders successfully sold me on his ideas. I say "his ideas" because they're more than "SOCIALISM." The rapacious healthcare and insurance industries need to be smacked down. That's more important to me than anything else, and he's the only one who's going to get it done.
  #161  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:35 PM
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Biden is a centrist Democrat and the majority of Democrats are centrists. He does extremely well with black voters, and their lack of turnout in key states was sufficient to explain the narrow margins Trump won them by. He isn't a socialist.

And that last statement is everything. There's absolutely nothing wrong with being a democratic socialist of Bernie's ilk. Except to the people for whom the word socialist eats into their brains with all the terror of a ten-foot zombie tarantula. And that's probably half the country. If Sanders gets nominated, no matter what he says, no matter who supports him, no matter how good his ideas are, the country will hear SOCIALIST SOCIALIST SOCIALIST a thousand times a day. Nothing else will penetrate. The party will be so demonized that it might need a generation to recover.

Sanders is the worst possible candidate for the real America of 2020. Anyone hiding the word SOCIALIST until the bottom of a long post probably recognizes that unconsciously. It is death. You have to go back to Al Smith in 1928 when the word CATHOLIC was similar anathema to find an equivalent. Democrats told themselves then that being a Catholic was meaningless, that nobody really cared, that his plans and ideas were better than Hoover's. None of that mattered against the perpetual din of CATHOLIC CATHOLIC CATHOLIC. A generation later that identification no longer dominated. Today it's a total non-issue. A democratic socialist will be similarly accepted in another generation. Maybe sooner.

But not in 2020.

The Democratic candidate cannot be a SOCIALIST. Nothing else compares. Nothing. Whatever Biden's faults are - and yes, they are many and he never was my candidate - at least he isn't a SOCIALIST. Every other adult politician in the party understands that, which is why Buttigeg and Klobuchar dropped out of the race and endorsed Biden. They did it for the Democratic party and because the only thing that matters in this election is defeating Trump. A SOCIALIST will lose the Presidency, keep the party from winning the Senate, and maybe lose the house as well. No sane Democrat could stand to see that happen.

You have two choices. A SOCIALIST and Trump winning or a non-socialist and the chance of defeating Trump. That's it. Like it or not. That's reality in 2020.
People said Obama couldn't win because he was BLACK and people said Trump couldn't win because he was a TREASONOUS MORON but the voters keep surprising us.

Also there are trade offs. Biden will demoralize liberals and young voters, while Sander swill demoralize moderates and older voters.

There is no win/win in this situation. If you want a candidate who excites liberals, the black vote, older voters and the youth vote, they don't exist. Its a trade off.
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  #162  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:36 PM
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Okay, so what does the actual delegate count look like now?
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Old 03-03-2020, 10:36 PM
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All of the same attributes that helped Hillary Clinton defeat Donald Trump.
Yeah, and how is that working out for people who thought their votes didn't matter? How's that working out for Latinos who have family members getting deported? How's that working out for Black voters who see a Republican party working in overdrive to strip them of the right to vote? How's that working out for women who are seeing their abortion rights essentially repealed? How's that working out for ho-hum voters who complained about Obamacare but now realize they might not have shit else?

If you're pissed off and complaining about life under Trump and don't vote, fuck you, you deserve the shit river you're swimming in.
  #164  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:37 PM
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Oklahoma was a primary four years ago (and before that too, but that wasn't relevant)
My bad. He won Minnesota and Colorado caucuses the same day and I conflated that.
  #165  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:37 PM
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Yeah, and how is that working out for people who thought their votes didn't matter? How's that working out for Latinos who have family members getting deported? How's that working out for Black voters who see a Republican party working in overdrive to strip them of the right to vote? How's that working out for women who are seeing their abortion rights essentially repealed? How's that working out for ho-hum voters who complained about Obamacare but now realize they might not have shit else?

If you're pissed off and complaining about life under Trump and don't vote, fuck you, you deserve the shit river you're swimming in.
Right. And nothing here is in conflict with supporting Sanders.
  #166  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:38 PM
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I don't give a fuck what you CALL his position. I believe it's the morally correct position. And I think it'd be possible to sell it to America with the right marketing, just like any other goddamn thing on God's earth.

I started out as a libertarian. Sanders successfully sold me on his ideas. I say "his ideas" because they're more than "SOCIALISM." The rapacious healthcare and insurance industries need to be smacked down. That's more important to me than anything else, and he's the only one who's going to get it done.
Lots of young people have seen the massive failures of unregulated capitalism and regulatory capture. The brutal and unaffordable health care. Seeing the banks collapse and bring the world economy down with them. Unaffordable higher education. Unaffordable housing. Lack of job security. Low wages. Few benefits at work. Expensive daycare. A country where no matter which party wins, the rich and powerful maintain their cement like hold on power.

And when young people get upset about this, older people scream SOCIALISM at then like its supposed to shame them into ignoring the reality they see everyday.

People should listen to these voters rather than shame them because they don't think what people want them to think.
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  #167  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:40 PM
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I don't give a fuck what you CALL his position. I believe it's the morally correct position. And I think it'd be possible to sell it to America with the right marketing, just like any other goddamn thing on God's earth.

I started out as a libertarian. Sanders successfully sold me on his ideas. I say "his ideas" because they're more than "SOCIALISM." The rapacious healthcare and insurance industries need to be smacked down. That's more important to me than anything else, and he's the only one who's going to get it done.
He's not going to get it done because people don't want it done. 2020 is not the first year in which healthcare has been an issue. Obama got it done. It wasn't perfect, but it was better than nothing, and it also made imagining M4A possible.
  #168  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:40 PM
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Okay, so what does the actual delegate count look like now?
of delegates won so far tonight

294 for Biden
249 for Sanders

as of 11:40pm
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  #169  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:41 PM
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Okay, so what does the actual delegate count look like now?
Quite the coincidence: this just came across my Twitter feed and I came over here to post it.
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Ryan Struyk
@ryanstruyk

Latest @CNN national delegate count as of 11:30 p.m. -->

Delegates needed to win nomination: 1,991

Biden 204
Sanders 183
Buttigieg 26
Warren 15
Klobuchar 7
Bloomberg 4
Gabbard 1
Ask and ye shall receive.
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  #170  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:43 PM
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People said Obama couldn't win because he was BLACK and people said Trump couldn't win because he was a TREASONOUS MORON but the voters keep surprising us.

Also there are trade offs. Biden will demoralize liberals and young voters, while Sander swill demoralize moderates and older voters.

There is no win/win in this situation. If you want a candidate who excites liberals, the black vote, older voters and the youth vote, they don't exist. Its a trade off.
A catholic will never win
A 'Peanut farmer' will never win
A washed up actor will never win
A black man will never win

Trump cant win
  #171  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:43 PM
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CNN has a delegate tracker here.
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  #172  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:45 PM
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Okay, so what does the actual delegate count look like now?
NPR has a running total, as well as a state-by-state total.

They seem to be ahead of CNN's count.
  #173  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:46 PM
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Lots of young people have seen the massive failures of unregulated capitalism and regulatory capture. The brutal and unaffordable health care. Seeing the banks collapse and bring the world economy down with them. Unaffordable higher education. Unaffordable housing. Lack of job security. Low wages. Few benefits at work. Expensive daycare. A country where no matter which party wins, the rich and powerful maintain their cement like hold on power.

And when young people get upset about this, older people scream SOCIALISM at then like its supposed to shame them into ignoring the reality they see everyday.

People should listen to these voters rather than shame them because they don't think what people want them to think.
And they’re mad as hell and not going to take it anymore. They’re going to run out and vote for someone who isn’t a corporate Wall Street establishment closeted Republican. Youth turnout will surge! The politics of complacency are over! Radical change now!!!!

Nah. Those petulant children can have a pat on the head, mommy will make them a hot pocket, and they can go back to the basement and get on the tweety bird.
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  #174  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:47 PM
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1. He's not Trump.
2. He will follow the rule of law.
3. He will follow the Constitution.
4. He will nominate moderate judges (and not nominate wacko right wing ideologue judges)
5. He will protect and expand Obamacare - flawed though it may be is much better than what existed before and expanded coverage.
6. He will allow asylum seekers and immigrants to go through the normal process.
7. He won't put immigrants in cages.
8. He will put competent people in positions of power
9. He will try to increase taxes for the rich and keep taxation moderate for everyone else
10. He will protect the LGBTQ community.
11. Probably a lot of other shit.

I'd rather have 10-15 issues that are achieveable than 3 "signatures" that don't have shit chance of passing.
The last Dem didn't do all that...what makes you think the one who puts the DEM in Dementia will?
  #175  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:52 PM
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At what point do Sanders supporters acknowledge that Sanders hasn't grown his base in 5 years? He's been campaigning practically continuously since 2016. His message never changes, he just repeats the same points over and over and over. He's not doing as well in 2020 as he did in 2016. His base is with him, but no one else.

What is this magic messaging marketing trick he's going to pull to persuade a majority of voters to support him, when he hasn't been able to do it in 5 years? Now might be the moment to use it. Wasn't tonight supposed to be the night?
  #176  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:58 PM
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And they’re mad as hell and not going to take it anymore. They’re going to run out and vote for someone who isn’t a corporate Wall Street establishment closeted Republican. Youth turnout will surge! The politics of complacency are over! Radical change now!!!!

Nah. Those petulant children can have a pat on the head, mommy will make them a hot pocket, and they can go back to the basement and get on the tweety bird.
The condescension in this post is ugly. Really ugly.
  #177  
Old 03-03-2020, 10:59 PM
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So - about all those states remaining after tonight - do they favor Biden or Bernie?

(That is, all the remaining 50 states when deducting Iowa, New Hampshire, S.C., Nevada, and all of the Super Tuesday states)

Last edited by Velocity; 03-03-2020 at 10:59 PM.
  #178  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:00 PM
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of delegates won so far tonight

294 for Biden
249 for Sanders

as of 11:40pm
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Thank you all.
  #179  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:00 PM
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State of Cher: Biden 100%
  #180  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:02 PM
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As a Sanders supporter, one sad realization is the fact that in 2016 many Sanders supporters weren't voting for Sanders, they were voting against Hillary Clinton. They didn't like Sanders, they just disliked Hillary. Sanders is doing worse in states in 2020 than he did in 2016, including his home state.

But its also good because I assume a lot of people voting for Biden are voting 'for' Biden because they like him. And hopefully he has good turnout in November if he is the nominee. Hillary got about 66 million voters, but the democratic nominee is probably going to need at least 67-68 million to deal with the bias in the electoral college (Obama got 69 million in 2008). I really hope Biden has 70+ million voter turnout if he is the nominee when the general election happens.
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  #181  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:03 PM
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Liz really withheld a lot of votes that could have gone to Bernie.
  #182  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:04 PM
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With 57% of the vote in Biden has taken the lead in Texas as of shortly after 11pm.
  #183  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:06 PM
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And they’re mad as hell and not going to take it anymore. They’re going to run out and vote for someone who isn’t a corporate Wall Street establishment closeted Republican. Youth turnout will surge! The politics of complacency are over! Radical change now!!!!

Nah. Those petulant children can have a pat on the head, mommy will make them a hot pocket, and they can go back to the basement and get on the tweety bird.
Look, I like Pete a lot, unlike many Bernie fans. I'm willing to weigh the pros and cons of everyone, and I'm open to having my perspective changed.

I realize that Biden is a moderate and that he may SEEM like a "safe bet" to someone like you who's a centrist. And I don't consider the word "centrist" to be an insult, unlike so many other people. But I look at Biden and all I can see, and hear, is a man whose faculties are in decline.

He's a godawful communicator. Since you were in the Pete camp, I know that you appreciate how important that is. Biden sucks ass at it.
  #184  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:08 PM
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Well, tonight proves yet again that I still don't know shit about politics. I'm surprised at how badly Warren just got crushed. I knew she was hurting, but I thought she'd do better than getting 10 of 91 delegates in fucking Massachusetts. Yikes! She's smart, accomplished, pretty progressive, a sharp debater, and isn't quite as doddering as Biden or Sanders. I really thought she'd do better today. She pretty much has to drop out now, doesn't she? Who does she throw her support behind?
  #185  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:12 PM
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Roy Moore didn't make it out of the Republican primary for Senate in Alabama. The runoff is Jeff Sessions vs. Tommy Tuberville. The winner of that faces incumbent Democrat Doug Jones in the general.
  #186  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:12 PM
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Anyone know sources for turnout by demographics?
  #187  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:13 PM
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And they’re mad as hell and not going to take it anymore. They’re going to run out and vote for someone who isn’t a corporate Wall Street establishment closeted Republican. Youth turnout will surge! The politics of complacency are over! Radical change now!!!!

Nah. Those petulant children can have a pat on the head, mommy will make them a hot pocket, and they can go back to the basement and get on the tweety bird.
Give it time. Those 20 somethings and 30 somethings will someday be in their 40s and 50s, and lots of hateful old dinosaurs will be gone.
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Last edited by Wesley Clark; 03-03-2020 at 11:13 PM.
  #188  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:13 PM
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Liz really withheld a lot of votes that could have gone to Bernie.
... and Bloomberg withheld a lot of votes that could have gone to Biden.
  #189  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:15 PM
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Look, I like Pete a lot, unlike many Bernie fans. I'm willing to weigh the pros and cons of everyone, and I'm open to having my perspective changed.

I realize that Biden is a moderate and that he may SEEM like a "safe bet" to someone like you who's a centrist. And I don't consider the word "centrist" to be an insult, unlike so many other people. But I look at Biden and all I can see, and hear, is a man whose faculties are in decline.

He's a godawful communicator. Since you were in the Pete camp, I know that you appreciate how important that is. Biden sucks ass at it.
I agree that there will be a ton of surrogates out helping Biden win. I do think that Biden and Obama know it’s time to pass the torch. Hillary/Bernie/Biden aren’t the future. So, yes, this election will need to feature Pete/Kamala/Cory/Beto and many others on the trail. I wish like hell Biden and Bernie would have sat this out. But, they didn’t and here we are.
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  #190  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:21 PM
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As a Sanders supporter, one sad realization is the fact that in 2016 many Sanders supporters weren't voting for Sanders, they were voting against Hillary Clinton. They didn't like Sanders, they just disliked Hillary. Sanders is doing worse in states in 2020 than he did in 2016, including his home state.

But its also good because I assume a lot of people voting for Biden are voting 'for' Biden because they like him. And hopefully he has good turnout in November if he is the nominee. Hillary got about 66 million voters, but the democratic nominee is probably going to need at least 67-68 million to deal with the bias in the electoral college (Obama got 69 million in 2008). I really hope Biden has 70+ million voter turnout if he is the nominee when the general election happens.
And I do think a lot of them that actually liked Sanders have moved on. I met plenty of former 2016 Bernie people on the Pete campaign. I’ve said that Bernie 2020 is the Caddyshack II of campaigns. Nothing has really grown with Bernie, it’s the same old speech and same empty promises. Wild eyed college kids that were in love with Bernie have graduated and have jobs now. While they may want college debt relief, they don’t think a septuagenarian will ride in on a white unicorn and make it go away.
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Last edited by dalej42; 03-03-2020 at 11:22 PM.
  #191  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:26 PM
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The condescension in this post is ugly. Really ugly.
Yeah, well as a corporate establishment Wall Street shill that has had everything thrown at him from Bernie bros, I’d like to know where the fucking revolution is? Where’s that surge of new voters? Who’s fed up with the same Repulocrats?

Bernie has a troll army on Twitter and that’s it.
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  #192  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:30 PM
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I know it's only 24 delegates, but danged if Maine isn't a nail-biter. As of 12:22amEST, there are less than 750 votes between Biden (the leader) and Sanders, with 70% reporting.

FiveThirtyEight had Bernie winning this by 10 percentage points.

Last edited by Happy Lendervedder; 03-03-2020 at 11:32 PM.
  #193  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:39 PM
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I agree that there will be a ton of surrogates out helping Biden win. I do think that Biden and Obama know it’s time to pass the torch. Hillary/Bernie/Biden aren’t the future. So, yes, this election will need to feature Pete/Kamala/Cory/Beto and many others on the trail. I wish like hell Biden and Bernie would have sat this out. But, they didn’t and here we are.
I agree with this. I'd have liked to have seen Kamala Harris do better. Or Jay Inslee. Or Julian Castro. Probably even Corey Booker. But they didn't, and you go with the candidate you have than can win.

This is not 2016. Trump is now a known despicable quantity. People are turning out in record numbers for all elections because they are terrified of a second Trump term. He's a corrupt crook, and voters will be thinking about this when Bill Barr and other Trump henchmen such as Chuck Grassley, Lindsey Graham and Ron Johnson roll out their smear campaigns and attempt to indict a Democratic nominee for president. Hard to get a true bill out of a grand jury with no actual evidence.

Yes, Biden is past his prime. He's tired. Campaigning is grueling and exhausting. He's been doing battle on dual fronts since the very start of the campaign. He makes too many mistakes. He will need help.

What Biden does have is a lifelong dedication to decency and basic human goodness. He also has numerous relationships that have been built over his very lengthy time in government in many different capacities.

Frankly, I feel sorry for him. Who wants to be the poor president who has to come in behind Trump and clean up this unimaginable mess? Biden is going to need all the help he can get. It would be nice if he could get some from Sanders supporters when they finally accept that Sanders can't win. The map favors Biden in the primaries going forward, and it did even before South Carolina.
  #194  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:41 PM
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I know it's only 24 delegates, but danged if Maine isn't a nail-biter. As of 12:22amEST, there are less than 750 votes between Biden (the leader) and Sanders, with 70% reporting.

FiveThirtyEight had Bernie winning this by 10 percentage points.
Biden will win more states, but it appears as if California 'could' be a blowout, which could net Sanders a ton of delegates.

Texas looks to be mostly tied right now.
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  #195  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:54 PM
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Biden will win more states, but it appears as if California 'could' be a blowout, which could net Sanders a ton of delegates.

Texas looks to be mostly tied right now.
Kornacki on MSNBC just explained how, even if Sanders gets your absolute blowout in California, the very worst Biden will do is beat Sanders with total Super Tuesday electoral college votes by roughly 13 votes. That's worst case scenario.

It's not going to be an absolute blowout in California. Biden will do reasonably well there. He is going to win the majority of electoral college votes on Super Tuesday -- which was supposed to be the day that Sanders would show everyone how he was the only viable candidate who could beat Trump.

Biden has pulled ahead of Sanders in Texas by more than 27,000 votes.
  #196  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:54 PM
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Biden will win more states, but it appears as if California 'could' be a blowout, which could net Sanders a ton of delegates.

Texas looks to be mostly tied right now.
Sanders could get some 100 delegates more than Biden out of California. I don’t think enough to swamp all the other Biden wins.
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Old 03-03-2020, 11:56 PM
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For those who doubt Biden can win please explain why his opponent was willing to risk impeachment to stop him from running against him? Bottom line, we can all be amateur pundits and pontificate about what people will or won't vote for but the man with the most to lose clearly does not want this man to run against him. You know who he urged his followers to cross over and vote for in SC? Oh yeah, Bernie Sanders.

Ideologically, I am Bernie all the way but the best idea men are not the best candidates and I'm quite comfortable backing the guy who scares the crap out of his opponent.

I believe that the fear is that he will appeal to the never Trumpers who are a minority in the party but he is deathly afraid that Biden gives them an alternative to vote for which Clinton didn't and Sanders wouldn't.

Quote:
He also can’t attack Trump for being racist. Biden has worked with some profoundly virulent racists over the course of his career. He spoke at Strom Thurmond’s funeral. He called Obama ‘Clean’ and ‘Articulate’. And yeah, Obama picked him for VP, but it’s 2020. The “I have black friends” defence carries very little weight these days. Besides, what specifically has Biden done for Black Americans? What’s he sponsored? What’s he voted for? He needs to have a quick and convincing answer to this question because Trump will be asking it a lot.
Man, I really want some of what you're smoking tonight I really do.

It is precisely that he has "black friends" that this turn around happened. So he spoke at
Strom Thurmond's funeral. That should make him toxic in South Carolina.

But it was the blacks in the very same South Carolina who rallied behind him. As the honorable Jim Clyburn stated:

“Joe Biden has stood for the hard-working people of South Carolina,” Clyburn tweeted. “We know Joe. But more importantly, he knows us. In South Carolina, we choose presidents. I’m calling on you to stand with Joe Biden.”

The whole "that his support is because black people think white people would support him" is incredibly condescending and just plain wrong. I grew up in SC, I have family that still lives there.

They supported Hillary and Biden because like Clyburn said, "he knows us". The Clinton's have always been incredibly popular in the state and ditto Obama and Biden. Who can beat Trump never entered into the calculus and in fact, they were looking for alternatives that could beat Trump until Clyburn reminded them why they should back Biden. If it was beating Trump then they would never have voted Biden because he looked like a cooked goose before Saturday and he was not polling anywhere near what he ended up winning by. They saved the bacon of the guy who had gotten destroyed in the lily white states of Idaho and New Hampshire. There was no calculus that would assume that whites would support the guy they had been proving they didn't support. If they wanted the guy that was not Bernie to beat Trump they'd have gone to Buttigieg or even Warren or Klobuchar all of whom were beating Biden at that point.
  #198  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:56 PM
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Biden will win more states, but it appears as if California 'could' be a blowout, which could net Sanders a ton of delegates.
I mailed my California ballot yesterday and it might not be counted for a few days, while the mega-counties down south will surely take even longer. Mail-ins don't respond to exit polls. We'll have no idea how California goes till next week probably. But keep hoping.

Meanwhile, I'm surprised at all the badmouthing here of Biden as a weak, vulnerable candidate. The orange terror obviously fears Biden the most. Should I suspect lurking Trampian assets on SDMB?
  #199  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:59 PM
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Sanders could get some 100 delegates more than Biden out of California. I don’t think enough to swamp all the other Biden wins.
Exactly, those Biden blowouts were huge and even a Bernie blow out in CA can’t make up for that.
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  #200  
Old 03-03-2020, 11:59 PM
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He is going to win the majority of electoral college votes on Super Tuesday -- which was supposed to be the day that Sanders would show everyone how he was the only viable candidate who could beat Trump.
That would indeed be unprecedented and probably illegal.
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