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  #51  
Old 06-28-2019, 03:49 AM
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I find this far more offensive, speaking as a Chicagoan
Chicagoans don't have any legal or social standing to complain about how others eat their pizza, based on what they've done to the dish.

Last edited by MrDibble; 06-28-2019 at 03:51 AM.
  #52  
Old 06-28-2019, 05:11 AM
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I find this far more offensive, speaking as a Chicagoan, than ketchup on a hot dog.
I find your position interesting, as the first time I encountered a bottle with olive oil and chili flakes was back in '85. At a place somewhere on Addison between Wrigley Field and Lincoln.
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Old 06-28-2019, 06:30 AM
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Chicagoans don't have any legal or social standing to complain about how others eat their pizza, based on what they've done to the dish.
I mean, that's not even pizza. That's just a massive quiche, surely.
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Old 06-28-2019, 06:40 AM
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I find your position interesting, as the first time I encountered a bottle with olive oil and chili flakes was back in '85. At a place somewhere on Addison between Wrigley Field and Lincoln.
That must've been a phenomenal bottle of olive oil for you to remember it from the exact year of 1985. Are you sure those were just chili flakes?
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Old 06-28-2019, 06:55 AM
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That's just a massive quiche, surely.
No, the egg custard is one of the two defining features of a quiche (the other being the pastry shell)
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Old 06-28-2019, 09:55 AM
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Chicagoans don't have any legal or social standing to complain about how others eat their pizza, based on what they've done to the dish.
Oh, shoosh. It's weird how parochial people can get about pizza. For Christ's sake, the Neapolitans -- who practically invented it -- even deep fry theirs. Then you have the thick pan styles of Italy (al taglio), and stuffed pizzas like pizza di scarola.

"Pizza" is a very broad category of foods. Chicago deep-dish fits comfortably within the broad category. It's weird, as I've gotten into arguments here with people who believed that if it didn't have (red) sauce and metly cheese on it, it wasn't a pizza (one of the classic pizzas, Pizza Marinara, is cheeseless. And there are plenty of pizzas that are just finished with olive oil, like pizza con patate, a classic potato-and-rosemary pizza.)

So let's be pizza inclusivists! The world is a better place for have so many choices and styles for every mood.
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Old 06-28-2019, 10:04 AM
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I think it's one of those cases where qualifiers matter. The English word "pizza", without any qualifiers, includes tomato sauce and cheese. A white pizza, however, does not include tomato sauce. But a white pizza is not what people mean when they just say "pizza".
  #58  
Old 06-28-2019, 10:12 AM
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I think it's one of those cases where qualifiers matter. The English word "pizza", without any qualifiers, includes tomato sauce and cheese. A white pizza, however, does not include tomato sauce. But a white pizza is not what people mean when they just say "pizza".
For me, it doesn't. A white pizza or pizza marinara is still "pizza" to me without any qualifiers. I wouldn't look at anyone sideways if they served either of those, or the potato pizza mentioned before, as "pizza," but, I admit, I have very open-ended ideas about "pizza." I might ask "what kind of pizza?" if I'm curious.

That said, I admit that here in Chicago, when somebody says "wanna go out for a pizza?", deep-dish is definitely not my first thought, but I will ask "what kind?" for further clarification, as we have many styles available here. In my experience, they'll say "want to grab a deep-dish" or "want to go to Uno's/Lou's for dinner?" (two places famous for their deep dish, though I believe both also serve a thin crust. At least Lou's definitely does.) Even here in Chicago, deep-dish is not the default idea of a pizza. Deep-dish (and stuffed) is what Chicago is known nationally for, but the vast majority of pizza people eat here is some type of thin crust variety. As I’ve mentioned before, I was born and raised in Chicago, ate many pizzas as a kid, but didn’t even experience my first deep dish until into my teen years.

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  #59  
Old 06-28-2019, 10:29 AM
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The opposite of what I've been known to do with pizza-- take a napkin and blot it.
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Old 06-28-2019, 10:52 AM
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I think it's one of those cases where qualifiers matter. The English word "pizza", without any qualifiers, includes tomato sauce and cheese. A white pizza, however, does not include tomato sauce. But a white pizza is not what people mean when they just say "pizza".
Who died and made you Dr Johnson? Pizza, firstly, isn't an English word. And it doesn't - in my mind - equal cheese and tomato.

Heck, my local independent pizzeria does a white pizza which doesn't even have cheese on it.
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Old 06-28-2019, 11:01 AM
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No, the egg custard is one of the two defining features of a quiche (the other being the pastry shell)
Alright, cheese and tomato flan.
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Old 06-28-2019, 11:04 AM
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Who died and made you Dr Johnson? Pizza, firstly, isn't an English word. And it doesn't - in my mind - equal cheese and tomato.

Heck, my local independent pizzeria does a white pizza which doesn't even have cheese on it.
WTF??!!! It doesn't have sauce OR cheese but you still consider it a pizza? Sure, you prescriptive and descriptive nerds can duke it out over word definitions but, cmon!
  #63  
Old 06-28-2019, 11:04 AM
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I think it's one of those cases where qualifiers matter. The English word "pizza", without any qualifiers, includes tomato sauce and cheese. A white pizza, however, does not include tomato sauce. But a white pizza is not what people mean when they just say "pizza".
Yup, this. As an analogy, if I told someone that I wanted a burger and they started suggesting we have a Salmon Burger, a Gyros Burger or a Cheeseburger Lettuce Wrap we're gonna have words. A "burger" is ground beef (I'll grudgingly accept meat blends where beef is the star as well) lodged between a sliced bun. Cheese is optional but highly suggested. Anything else is not a "burger"...the qualifier is required.
  #64  
Old 06-28-2019, 11:15 AM
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WTF??!!! It doesn't have sauce OR cheese but you still consider it a pizza? Sure, you prescriptive and descriptive nerds can duke it out over word definitions but, cmon!
As I said above, there are pizzas in Italy that have neither, and if it's good enough for the Italians, it's good enough for me.
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Old 06-28-2019, 11:16 AM
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WTF??!!! It doesn't have sauce OR cheese but you still consider it a pizza? Sure, you prescriptive and descriptive nerds can duke it out over word definitions but, cmon!
To be fair, my wife was quite cheesed off when she ordered - she now pays closer attention to the ingredients list.
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Old 06-28-2019, 11:23 AM
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Pizza is absolutely an English word. It's also an Italian word. And the Italian word and the English word probably have different, though related, meanings, which is why I specified that I was talking about the English word. The only information I have about the Italian word is long out of date (my great-grandfather, who was a baker in Rome, considered "pizza" to be "bread with oil and little fishies", but he left Italy over a century ago).
  #67  
Old 06-28-2019, 11:29 AM
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Sure, but I also bet that what "pizza" means in English depends on what part of the English-speaking world you live in. So even the English word is quite variable in meaning, as evidenced even by inter-American arguments about what pizza is and isn't. As more and more styles become available to everyone, I think we should allow the word itself to expand in meaning to encompass all the various types.
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Old 06-28-2019, 11:39 AM
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Iíve lived in Italy for a bit. When I had pizza they put a drizzle of oil when finished. Not soaking.
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Old 06-28-2019, 12:05 PM
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How can anybody not like deep-dish pizza?!?

It's divine! If you're ever in MPS/STP, visit The Green Mill and sample their little bit of Heaven!
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  #70  
Old 06-28-2019, 01:35 PM
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When it comes to olive oil on a pizza. No, it isn't a particularly british thing to do to put it on a pizza.

I think what happens is that some restaurants, the one specifically I'm thinking of, Pizza Express, will have a bottle on the table. Plus parmesan. They are probably there for whatever some people use them for. Maybe for some pasta dishes. Or dressing for salad.

Some people see it there, and go sploosh (was that Pam?) with it. They're also the ones who are a bit mad and very fat, ie: the fodder of fat and poor shaming which is common on british television (watch the bailiffs repossess poor peoples tellys, watch some poor unemployed cannabis smoker have the lowest point of their life as they are ejected from their house). It is not normal for uk pizzas.

I think I've seen (because I watched them do it), some takeaway deep pan pizza places brush olive oil on the crust of their pizzas. It might be more common in one are or another, I don't eat a lot of pizza.
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Old 06-28-2019, 01:43 PM
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That must've been a phenomenal bottle of olive oil for you to remember it from the exact year of 1985. Are you sure those were just chili flakes?
I was an exchange student in Chicago in 1985. I had never seen such a thing and asked about what it was. The other condiments on the table were a shaker of Parmesan, a shaker with chili flakes (they called them pizza peppers) and a bottle of some hot sauce, not Tabasco.

It was my first time in the U.S. and my first pizza in the U.S. I was living on Addison, very near the L station. In the same area was also the first Dunkin' Donuts I had ever seen.

Next time you serve something up, hold the snark.
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Old 06-28-2019, 01:54 PM
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I was an exchange student in Chicago in 1985. I had never seen such a thing and asked about what it was. The other condiments on the table were a shaker of Parmesan, a shaker with chili flakes (they called them pizza peppers) and a bottle of some hot sauce, not Tabasco.

It was my first time in the U.S. and my first pizza in the U.S. I was living on Addison, very near the L station. In the same area was also the first Dunkin' Donuts I had ever seen.

Next time you serve something up, hold the snark.
Wonder if that place was D'Agostino's. It's still there. Don't recall chili oil last time I visited, but it's been about 8 or 9 years. It's on Addison, and the sign says "Est. 1968," though I don't know for certain if it means that location (although I suspect it does, as it's an old-timey looking joint that just underwent some rehab a year or two or so ago.)
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Old 06-28-2019, 02:41 PM
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If the crust is good, i will dip it- olive oil, or balsamic, or whatever i can get.

But drizzled over the toppings? Ecch.

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  #74  
Old 06-28-2019, 08:05 PM
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I'm not a Brit and don't do this, but I'm mostly perplexed that the olive oil is the thing being picked out as being "unhealthy" in this situation.
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Old 06-28-2019, 11:16 PM
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I'm not a Brit and don't do this, but I'm mostly perplexed that the olive oil is the thing being picked out as being "unhealthy" in this situation.
Itís like buttering a donut. Yeah, Iíd say itís worth an eyebrow raise.

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  #76  
Old 06-29-2019, 02:52 AM
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I'm not a Brit and don't do this, but I'm mostly perplexed that the olive oil is the thing being picked out as being "unhealthy" in this situation.

it amazes me that in 2019 people are still terrified of dietary fats. Ancel Keys should be dug up and eviscerated.
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Old 06-29-2019, 03:53 AM
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Wonder if that place was D'Agostino's. It's still there. Don't recall chili oil last time I visited, but it's been about 8 or 9 years. It's on Addison,
Could be, but my memory places it further west. So I did a little checking on Google Street view, and I think it's a place that is now called Bartoli's, but used to be called Carreno's. It's on Addison and Damen.


To this day, If I slice the pie myself, I still do it as a grid, not as wedges. And I swipe the four center squares for myself.
  #78  
Old 06-29-2019, 04:00 AM
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So let's be pizza inclusivists! The world is a better place for have so many choices and styles for every mood.
Did I say at any point that Chicago deep-dish isn't pizza? Or did I that there's only one kind of pizza? No, I did not. That was, in fact, the whole point of my pointing out that chicago-style pizza exists. I'm no pizza purist - my documented love of Hawaiian pizza should give the lie to that.

Kindly redirect your rant at your fellow Chicagoan telling us what is and isn't acceptable, not me.

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Old 06-29-2019, 04:07 AM
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How can anybody not like deep-dish pizza?!?
I love my heart?
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Old 06-29-2019, 07:40 AM
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Did I say at any point that Chicago deep-dish isn't pizza? Or did I that there's only one kind of pizza? No, I did not. That was, in fact, the whole point of my pointing out that chicago-style pizza exists. I'm no pizza purist - my documented love of Hawaiian pizza should give the lie to that.

Kindly redirect your rant at your fellow Chicagoan telling us what is and isn't acceptable, not me.
I was ranting?

Don't take it personally. Originally, the post was supposed to be a response to the quiche comment, but yours provided more context. I'm just saying "it's all good!" in the pizza world.

And, yes, I don't care if anyone puts ketchup on their hot dog (though I usually won't on mine, but it depends on the type of dog.)
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Old 06-29-2019, 07:53 AM
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Itís like buttering a donut.
Uhm, no it isn't.

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition...e-oil#section4
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  #82  
Old 06-29-2019, 07:56 AM
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I love my heart?
Deep-dish won't damage your heart any more than your standard flat pizza. Considering the volume of tomato sauce they contain, I'd say even less so.
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Old 06-29-2019, 07:58 AM
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Can we now conclude that no, this is not Some Weird British Thing about Pizza?
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Old 06-29-2019, 08:24 AM
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Can we now conclude that no, this is not Some Weird British Thing about Pizza?
Hopefully. It's something I'm sure some people do but it's definitely not the norm.

There seem to be a lot of threads lately where people see one person do something slightly strange in a British TV show and assume it applies to all of the UK. Are there more UK reality shows being shown in the US or something?
  #85  
Old 06-29-2019, 09:30 AM
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Deep-dish won't damage your heart any more than your standard flat pizza. Considering the volume of tomato sauce they contain, I'd say even less so.
If "deep dish" style encourages you to eat more then it will be more damaging.

I think the size of USA pizza portions in general is unhealthy. A thin, Neopolitan-style with minimal topping and plenty of olive oil, eaten in moderation seems by far a healthier option.
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Old 06-29-2019, 10:48 AM
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If "deep dish" style encourages you to eat more then it will be more damaging.

I think the size of USA pizza portions in general is unhealthy. A thin, Neopolitan-style with minimal topping and plenty of olive oil, eaten in moderation seems by far a healthier option.
Don't know about you, but I eat only until I'm full. Anything left over I put in the fridge for later.

Thin, minimal anything served with olive oil and eaten in moderation is pretty much healthier in general.
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Old 06-29-2019, 02:49 PM
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Olive oil is certainly better than most other dietary fats, and it probably does have benefits when eaten in moderation. And fat in general is no problem when eaten in moderation.

The problem is just that our appetites evolved in a time when fat was scarce enough that "too much fat" was almost impossible, and so, when you put those appetites in a context where unlimited fat is available, we tend not to eat it in moderation. Same story for sugar and salt. Brussels sprouts would be bad for you if you ate too many of them, too, but nobody needs to be told to eat Brussels sprouts only in moderation.
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Old 06-29-2019, 04:32 PM
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Don't know about you, but I eat only until I'm full.
"me" or "you" aren't the issue. There is evidence enough out there to suggest that we are not well adapted to moderating our intake and having larger portions of more calorific food is going to cause problems in enough cases for it to be concerning.
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Old 06-29-2019, 04:37 PM
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"me" or "you" aren't the issue. There is evidence enough out there to suggest that we are not well adapted to moderating our intake and having larger portions of more calorific food is going to cause problems in enough cases for it to be concerning.
Natural selection in action. Death is nature's way of showing that gluttony is bad.
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Old 06-30-2019, 01:43 AM
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As a Brit, I find the idea of Americans complaining about British pizza quite amusing. Pizza in Britain is generally far closer to actual Italian pizza than the thick doughy (but admittedly also tasty) monstrosities you tend to get in the US.

As for the oil, it was probably chilli oil, not plain olive oil.
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Old 06-30-2019, 01:56 AM
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Well at least it's better than British Nachos, cucumber slices with cottage cheese.
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Old 06-30-2019, 07:01 AM
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Well at least it's better than British Nachos, cucumber slices with cottage cheese.
someone is definitely pulling your leg there.
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Old 06-30-2019, 08:45 AM
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As a Brit, I find the idea of Americans complaining about British pizza quite amusing. Pizza in Britain is generally far closer to actual Italian pizza than the thick doughy (but admittedly also tasty) monstrosities you tend to get in the US.
That's going to depend on the area a lot. I don't find New York or Chicago/Midwestern thin styles to be doughy at all (in fact, many of the cracker crusts here in the Midwest or Upper Midwest area are thinner than Neapolitan pies, as they are run through a dough sheeter.) I don't even find a standard Domino's pizza doughy. But we definitely do also have thicker styles like pan pizzas and the like. Those are closer to the al taglio or Sicilian styles you'd get in Italy. It's not all thin Neapolitan pies in Italy.

The main difference for me in American pies is how much sauce, cheese, and toppings are used here.

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Old 06-30-2019, 08:47 AM
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someone is definitely pulling your leg there.

yeah, that would be Flanders-style nachos.


https://www.cartooncuisine.com/the-s...landers-style/
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Old 06-30-2019, 08:55 AM
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As a Brit, I find the idea of Americans complaining about British pizza quite amusing. Pizza in Britain is generally far closer to actual Italian pizza than the thick doughy (but admittedly also tasty) monstrosities you tend to get in the US.
I once had pizza at a place off Leicester Square (in London). It was the same as standard American pizza, except it had weird toppings like fresh-out-of-the-tin tuna and niblets of what was probably once frozen corn (the yellow stuff that grows on ears).
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  #96  
Old 06-30-2019, 09:04 AM
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I once had pizza at a place off Leicester Square (in London). It was the same as standard American pizza, except it had weird toppings like fresh-out-of-the-tin tuna and niblets of what was probably once frozen corn (the yellow stuff that grows on ears).
Yeah, there's this weird quirk I've seen in various parts of Europe (and, yes, I know Europe is a big place, yaddayaddayadda, so if your local country doesn't do it, I understand), where corn will be put on pizza, and often labeled as something like "American pizza." (I've seen this mostly in Central Europe, including Germany.) Take, for example, Dr Oetker's BBQ pizza from their "Big Americans" line of frozen pizzas. Or, their version of a Supreme Pizza, which also includes corn niblets in it as well. (Yes, those are frozen pizzas, but I've seen the same thing at some sit-down restaurants.) Now, I understand associating corn with America, but it's always struck me as odd, as I've never seen corn anywhere on a pizza in America and 99.9% of us would find that weird, I would think. (I imagine some fancy-pants place somewhere has corn, but it is a really odd topping for us.)

ETA: Here's another one. This is a Hungarian Pizza Hut menu. The "Texas" pizza is grilled chicken, red onions, corn, mozzarella, BBQ sauce. Whence the corn?

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  #97  
Old 06-30-2019, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pulykamell View Post
Yeah, there's this weird quirk I've seen in various parts of Europe (and, yes, I know Europe is a big place, yaddayaddayadda, so if your local country doesn't do it, I understand), where corn will be put on pizza, and often labeled as something like "American pizza." (I've seen this mostly in Central Europe, including Germany.) Take, for example, Dr Oetker's BBQ pizza from their "Big Americans" line of frozen pizzas. Or, their version of a Supreme Pizza, which also includes corn niblets in it as well. (Yes, those are frozen pizzas, but I've seen the same thing at some sit-down restaurants.) Now, I understand associating corn with America, but it's always struck me as odd, as I've never seen corn anywhere on a pizza in America and 99.9% of us would find that weird, I would think. (I imagine some fancy-pants place somewhere has corn, but it is a really odd topping for us.)

ETA: Here's another one. This is a Hungarian Pizza Hut menu. The "Texas" pizza is grilled chicken, red onions, corn, mozzarella, BBQ sauce. Whence the corn?

don't get me started on what Japan has done to pizza. Corn is the least of the WTF

Last edited by jz78817; 06-30-2019 at 09:19 AM.
  #98  
Old 06-30-2019, 09:45 AM
pulykamell is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jz78817 View Post
don't get me started on what Japan has done to pizza. Corn is the least of the WTF
Oh, I don't mind what you put on your pizza, just don't name it after us if it has nothing to do with us. (Of course, this happens with various foodstuffs around the world, and certainly the US is guilty of it, too. I just find it amusing and a bit head-scratching.)
  #99  
Old 07-02-2019, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terentii View Post
I once had pizza at a place off Leicester Square (in London). It was the same as standard American pizza, except it had weird toppings like fresh-out-of-the-tin tuna and niblets of what was probably once frozen corn (the yellow stuff that grows on ears).
That serves you right for eating anything from a kiosk near Leicester Square, the tourist trap capital of the Capital.
  #100  
Old 07-02-2019, 07:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pulykamell View Post
ETA: Here's another one. This is a Hungarian Pizza Hut menu. The "Texas" pizza is grilled chicken, red onions, corn, mozzarella, BBQ sauce. Whence the corn?
I doubt it has anything to do with actual American style pizza, and everything to do with using US type ingredients, such as corn, or spicy chicken.
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