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  #101  
Old 03-11-2020, 09:14 PM
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I hope Belkar winds up with Shojo, drinking single-malt scotch and smoking cigars rolled with poorly-written legal documents.
  #102  
Old 03-11-2020, 10:05 PM
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It'll be a major character-development victory if, by the end of his life, he's counted as Chaotic Neutral instead of Evil. No way he makes it all the way to Good.

But then, when you're starting at 5 kiloNazis, you take what you can get.
  #103  
Old 03-11-2020, 11:33 PM
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Nitpick - he was never at 5 KN. When he met Roy, he was over 3 KN, and projected to rise to 8 or more. Under Roy's influence he decreased to about one half a KN, and has likely decreased still further since then.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0489.html
  #104  
Old 03-12-2020, 06:19 AM
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Ah, right, 5 kNz was the hypothetical offspring of Cruella deVille and Sauron.
  #105  
Old 03-16-2020, 08:49 AM
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  #106  
Old 03-16-2020, 09:37 AM
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Huh, the new layout includes the title of the comic at the bottom. I never noticed that before; it's a good change. Previously there was no easy way to see the title of a non-current comic.
  #107  
Old 03-23-2020, 12:27 PM
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  #108  
Old 03-23-2020, 12:32 PM
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I'm trying to remember what dad agreed to, if it was stated.
  #109  
Old 03-23-2020, 01:54 PM
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Never seeing his family again.
  #110  
Old 03-24-2020, 06:08 PM
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I remember that now.
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  #111  
Old 03-30-2020, 07:03 PM
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  #112  
Old 03-30-2020, 07:23 PM
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Never change, Elan.
  #113  
Old 03-30-2020, 08:19 PM
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What I don't see on that map are any creatures, the Paladins' ex-scouting post, or any hint of the two mysterious Outsiders who abducted them. Which means they either got out of Haley and V's search locus, or they've enough illusion or camouflage to fade a 16th level Rogue's (admittedly-less-than-grand) Spot or Search skills and a 16th level Wizard probably running True Seeing and any other Divination spell s/he can think of.
  #114  
Old 03-31-2020, 07:49 AM
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Elan, breaching the boundaries between the diegetic and non-diegetic.
  #115  
Old 03-31-2020, 08:17 AM
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I laughed out loud at the 'hex grid' comment.
  #116  
Old 03-31-2020, 09:02 AM
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I laughed out loud at the 'hex grid' comment.
Made me think of lighter-hearted times in the strip: https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0175.html

I wonder how the Order will start? Hide, and see if they can ambush Team Evil after a dungeon crawl? Try to find the paladins?
  #117  
Old 03-31-2020, 09:30 AM
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The paladins, especially O-Chul, are enormous assets against Team Evil. Roy's not dumb enough not to want to connect and coordinate with them. O-Chul is, perhaps literally, the toughest person in the world and absolutely committed to good. Sort of an anti-Xykon. If anyone can communicate with Redcloak it'll be O-Chul.

Last edited by Jonathan Chance; 03-31-2020 at 09:30 AM.
  #118  
Old 03-31-2020, 02:18 PM
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The paladins, especially O-Chul, are enormous assets against Team Evil. Roy's not dumb enough not to want to connect and coordinate with them. O-Chul is, perhaps literally, the toughest person in the world and absolutely committed to good. Sort of an anti-Xykon. If anyone can communicate with Redcloak it'll be O-Chul.
Redcloak might still hold a grudge.
  #119  
Old 03-31-2020, 03:53 PM
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I don't think he would hold a grudge... for that. Until Xykon shot him down, he considered the loss of the eye a minor inconvenience. What he might hold a grudge for, is that O-Chul is a member of the paladin order that destroyed his village and slew most of his friends and family. Without knowing, of course, that he also joined that order only to reform it from within, after stopping them from slaying other goblins.

Actually... That's an interesting question. Jirix was probably present for that. I think he was probably, in fact, the Supreme Leader that O-Chul negotiated with. If Jirix recognizes him, he might remember that, and might have told Redcloak about it. Which might even make Redcloak more amenable to negotiating with him.
  #120  
Old 03-31-2020, 07:10 PM
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Didn't O-Chul kill Jirix?
  #121  
Old 03-31-2020, 07:57 PM
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He got better.
  #122  
Old 03-31-2020, 08:18 PM
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Didn't O-Chul kill Jirix?
Yes, but he got better.
  #123  
Old 03-31-2020, 08:26 PM
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I don't think he would hold a grudge... for that. Until Xykon shot him down, he considered the loss of the eye a minor inconvenience. What he might hold a grudge for, is that O-Chul is a member of the paladin order that destroyed his village and slew most of his friends and family. Without knowing, of course, that he also joined that order only to reform it from within, after stopping them from slaying other goblins.

Actually... That's an interesting question. Jirix was probably present for that. I think he was probably, in fact, the Supreme Leader that O-Chul negotiated with. If Jirix recognizes him, he might remember that, and might have told Redcloak about it. Which might even make Redcloak more amenable to negotiating with him.
None of that - learned though it is, my friend - is respondent to the question of what Roy and the Order should do. The paladins are too important to not have around at the final push.
  #124  
Old 04-01-2020, 12:20 AM
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The paladins, especially O-Chul, are enormous assets against Team Evil. Roy's not dumb enough not to want to connect and coordinate with them. O-Chul is, perhaps literally, the toughest person in the world and absolutely committed to good. Sort of an anti-Xykon. If anyone can communicate with Redcloak it'll be O-Chul.
You make sense. Joining up with the paladins would be a really good move.

Re-reading the strip to try and remember how the Order was supposed to meet up with the paladins in the first place, I thought of a problem. (Besides the all-powerful entity and its henchthing that have scooped up the pallys.) The Tomb is at or very near the North Pole. Lien's Sending to V said that, "O-Chul and I are holding position on the southeast ledge over ravine." https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1189.html

But all directions are South when you're at the North Pole. Enough so that even with the ravine providing some structure to the directions, I can see it being really confusing trying to find just where that ledge is. Especially if V and Haley are hidden or invisible, the paladins are trying really hard not to be seen, and both sets of parties are doing everything to stay off Team Evil's radar. There's a lot of ledges to choose from.

I'm probably overthinking it.

I'd love for the events in How the Paladin Got His Scar (one of Burlew's best bits of writing in awhile, IMHO) to play a role in the denouement. I guess RedCloak can call up Jirix to discuss O-Chul if he wants to. Cloister's long worn off, right? Would RedCloak Send to Jirix to discuss any potential proposal involving The Dark One, by either the Order or O-Chul?
  #125  
Old 04-01-2020, 09:37 AM
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Oh, absolutely the Order should meet up with the paladins-- I don't think that's even in question. Or at least, they should try. In the current situation with the paladins abducted, the party might find themselves facing the question of whether they should try to track down and rescue the paladins first, or save that for after they save the world, and that's not such an easy question.

And I don't see Redcloak asking Jirix about O-Chul now. But the three of them spent many months together, back in Azure CityGobbotopia. If it were to have come up, I'd expect it to have been then.
  #126  
Old 04-01-2020, 10:03 AM
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Roy's not dumb enough not to want to connect and coordinate with them. O-Chul is, perhaps literally, the toughest person in the world and absolutely committed to good. Sort of an anti-Xykon. If anyone can communicate with Redcloak it'll be O-Chul.
Narratively, I have a hard time thinking that Durkon was tasked, by his god, in person, with talking to Redcloak and is going to delegate the task to O-Chul. O-Chul might play some backing role in it but the heavy lifting is going to be from the dwarven cleric of Thor. No, the other one. The one with the beard.

Besides, O-Chul big narrative moment is going to be with Monster in the Dark.
  #127  
Old 04-01-2020, 10:40 AM
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Can't argue with that. If Redcloak and Durkon need to connect then certainly O-Chul and MitD need to connect.

We need some sort of closure on the MitD, after all. He's a good person who fell in with bad friends.
  #128  
Old 04-01-2020, 10:54 AM
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Can't argue with that. If Redcloak and Durkon need to connect then certainly O-Chul and MitD need to connect.

We need some sort of closure on the MitD, after all. He's a good person who fell in with bad friends.
Agree with Jophiel re Durkon. That clearly needs to happen.

MitD didn't "fall in with bad friends", he was enchanted. That enchantment has been wearing off. But yes, we do need him to connect to O-Chul. And I expect all of them to interact on some level.
  #129  
Old 04-01-2020, 11:32 AM
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Xykon put some sort of mind-whammy on him, but that was just to eat Redcloak and spit out the phylactery if Redcloak ever turns on him. All the rest of his association with Team Evil is, in fact, falling in with bad friends.
  #130  
Old 04-02-2020, 03:24 PM
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I don't think he would hold a grudge... for that. Until Xykon shot him down, he considered the loss of the eye a minor inconvenience. What he might hold a grudge for, is that O-Chul is a member of the paladin order that destroyed his village and slew most of his friends and family. Without knowing, of course, that he also joined that order only to reform it from within, after stopping them from slaying other goblins.

Actually... That's an interesting question. Jirix was probably present for that. I think he was probably, in fact, the Supreme Leader that O-Chul negotiated with. If Jirix recognizes him, he might remember that, and might have told Redcloak about it. Which might even make Redcloak more amenable to negotiating with him.
You guys are DELIBERATELY trying to make me feel bad about missing stories that I'd have to buy on Ookoodook, aren't you?
  #131  
Old 04-02-2020, 03:31 PM
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Also, when would O-Chul have had an opportunity to interact with Jirix in his (Jirix's) role as Supreme Leader? O-Chul was ESCAPE'd away by MitD while Jirix was still a dead second-in-command, wasn't he?
  #132  
Old 04-02-2020, 04:20 PM
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How the Paladin Got his Scar (which, yes, is an excellent story, well worth the price). Without going into too much detail, there's interaction between O-Chul and the hobgoblin we'd seen online as Redcloak's predecessor as Supreme Leader. I wouldn't say that the interaction was exactly "friendly", but it was at least diplomatic. It's never been confirmed, but I suspect that that hobgoblin was Jirix.
  #133  
Old 04-04-2020, 09:53 AM
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  #134  
Old 04-04-2020, 10:27 AM
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Guess Rich is keeping busy under Shelter in Place!
  #135  
Old 04-04-2020, 11:02 AM
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I, for one, am grateful that he's still working from home!
  #136  
Old 04-04-2020, 11:14 AM
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I'm wondering if "Caring about the lives of other people really limits one's strategic options" is a jab at current events.
  #137  
Old 04-04-2020, 11:58 AM
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duplicate post

Last edited by puzzlegal; 04-04-2020 at 11:59 AM.
  #138  
Old 04-04-2020, 12:16 PM
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I'm wondering if "Caring about the lives of other people really limits one's strategic options" is a jab at current events.
Rich Burlew use his comic strip to lampoon those he feels aren't as socially conscious as he is? Nah.

(Though I didn't pick up the jibe until you pointed it out.)

Funny, that the Order think's it's Xykon painting all of the doors. Guess Lien didn't mention that little bit of rebellion by the MITD. If the Gate is actually behind one of those doors, any odds that it's behind one of the extra ones the MITD painted?
  #139  
Old 04-04-2020, 01:56 PM
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On the other hand, I recently read a story where a hero points out to the villain that the hero has a major advantage in their fight, because he doesn't have to survive to achieve his objective (protecting the people he loves), but the villain does have to survive.
  #140  
Old 04-04-2020, 02:23 PM
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On the other hand, I recently read a story where a hero points out to the villain that the hero has a major advantage in their fight, because he doesn't have to survive to achieve his objective (protecting the people he loves), but the villain does have to survive.


Was that a Dresden story? I think Butcher made that point in a supplementary story (told from POV of Dresden's doggie).
  #141  
Old 04-04-2020, 02:54 PM
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I Decided now was a good time to sign up for his patreon.
  #142  
Old 04-04-2020, 06:19 PM
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Yup. "My name is Mouse and I am a Good Dog. Everyone says so."
  #143  
Old 04-04-2020, 07:40 PM
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How the Paladin Got his Scar (which, yes, is an excellent story, well worth the price). Without going into too much detail, there's interaction between O-Chul and the hobgoblin we'd seen online as Redcloak's predecessor as Supreme Leader. I wouldn't say that the interaction was exactly "friendly", but it was at least diplomatic. It's never been confirmed, but I suspect that that hobgoblin was Jirix.
I'd be very surprised if it was Jirix. If nothing else, Redcloak must have defeated the previous Supreme Leader in order to take command of the hobgobblins and I expect that defeat=kill in this context. Also, the Spreme Leader in the O-Chul story was significantly more corpulent than Jirix and the one that Redcloak defeated, so I'm going to guess there are three different hobgobblin Supreme Leaders here.
  #144  
Old Yesterday, 04:14 AM
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I'd be very surprised if it was Jirix. If nothing else, Redcloak must have defeated the previous Supreme Leader in order to take command of the hobgobblins and I expect that defeat=kill in this context. Also, the Spreme Leader in the O-Chul story was significantly more corpulent than Jirix and the one that Redcloak defeated, so I'm going to guess there are three different hobgobblin Supreme Leaders here.
The guy Redcloak vanquished was just a run-of-the-mill hobgoblin cleric.

https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0149.html

And I THINK the actual Supreme Leader had different lower teeth than Jirix.

Last edited by kaylasdad99; Yesterday at 04:16 AM.
  #145  
Old Yesterday, 04:56 AM
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The guy Redcloak vanquished was just a run-of-the-mill hobgoblin cleric.

https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0149.html

And I THINK the actual Supreme Leader had different lower teeth than Jirix.
That's true of the guy he vanquished on-screen. The real Supreme Leader shows up after that. But in the next strip, Redcloak is now the Supreme Leader, so he must have defeated the real Leader off-screen.
  #146  
Old Yesterday, 08:17 AM
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The real Supreme Leader effectively ceded his title peacefully. The whole point of that strip is that he's not correcting Redcloak's mistake as to who the Supreme Leader is, because he'd rather let Redcloak have the job than die for it.

And the corpulent guy in HtPGhS died before the end of the story, to be replaced by a hobgoblin cleric of normal build.
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