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Old 05-03-2019, 02:29 PM
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10 Musicians You Don't Like From The 60s?


Their personalities.. You can like their music (or not).

To clarify, I consider a singer a musician.
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Old 05-03-2019, 03:07 PM
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I...don't...know any musicians from the 60's?? And I'm not in a position to judge someone from 50+ years ago. Was Jim Morrison a pretentious serial cheater? Maybe...Don't know him though. Eric Clapton a racist drunk d-bag? It was 50+ years ago!!!

uhhhh...I guess Led Zeppelin for throwing the only sober guy at Live Aid under the bus, Phil Collins.
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Old 05-03-2019, 03:11 PM
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Flo and Eddie. Times 5.
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Old 05-03-2019, 03:11 PM
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I couldn't stand Sha, never liked Na, but felt that Na was an OK guy.
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Old 05-03-2019, 03:23 PM
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#1. Jim Morrison. Just for being such a self-important douche.

My middle schooler once said "Y'know, all my favorite bands have dead guys in 'em."
"Like...?"
"Zeppelin, Who, Beatles, Doors."
"SOMEbody raised you right..."

While beaming with pride, I just had to point out that dying young was the best thing that could've happened to Jim Morrison. Had he lived even a couple more years, he'd've been an overweight diva screaming bad poetry on his "No, really, I AM The Lizard King, Dammit!" tour... a circuit of second-rate Vegas hotels and county fairs. Where he'd get hauled off by local cops every night for throwing F-Bombs at the audience and punches at Fair Security Officers.
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Old 05-03-2019, 03:54 PM
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OK, I'll play...

For starters, I think there is a... movement? Lack of wanting to press the issue? regarding 60/70s music stars and #MeToo. If you want to try to convince me that every sex act committed by the Beatles, Stones, Led Zep, etc was with fully consensual adults of clear minds and legal ages, you can try, but I'm likely not going to buy it.

John Lennon. Seemed like more than a bit of an asshole. Openly mocked people with physical and mental difficulties. Was cruel. Just... not a pleasant person.

Jim Morrison. Don't think he'd flame out as bad as predicted by digs, but he strikes me as a douche as well.

Last edited by JohnT; 05-03-2019 at 03:55 PM.
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Old 05-03-2019, 03:55 PM
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I never liked Joe Cocker.
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Old 05-03-2019, 04:01 PM
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John Lennon. Seemed like more than a bit of an asshole. Openly mocked people with physical and mental difficulties.
Napoleon XIV was kind of mean that way too.

"Ha-Haaa!" indeed.
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Old 05-03-2019, 04:50 PM
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Prefacing this with the fact that, obviously, I do not personally know them, so this is only based on reading articles about them, and interviews with them.

That said, my choice is Simon and Garfunkel. I love their music, and I love Paul's solo work from the decades that followed (I know little about Art's solo stuff). But...everything I've read, over the past few decades, indicates that Paul is, very frequently, a complete asshole, and that Art isn't a whole lot better.
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Old 05-03-2019, 04:52 PM
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#1. Jim Morrison. Just for being such a self-important douche.

My middle schooler once said "Y'know, all my favorite bands have dead guys in 'em."
"Like...?"
"Zeppelin, Who, Beatles, Doors."
"SOMEbody raised you right..."...
I thought you were going to the bit where the son says "Jim Morrison can't sing and Ray Manzarek is overrated" to which his Dad replies, "I told you to stop slamming the Doors!"


mmm
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Old 05-03-2019, 05:12 PM
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Prefacing this with the fact that, obviously, I do not personally know them, so this is only based on reading articles about them, and interviews with them.

That said, my choice is Simon and Garfunkel. I love their music, and I love Paul's solo work from the decades that followed (I know little about Art's solo stuff). But...everything I've read, over the past few decades, indicates that Paul is, very frequently, a complete asshole, and that Art isn't a whole lot better.
I can't stand Paul "Thief" Simon. He has a few nice songs, but who knows what continent it came from. He stole from Los Lobos and when confronted about it, he said "Sue me" - knowing he has better lawyers, and that it would cost a lot up front for anyone to proceed with litigation.

SMILE Paul, no one will ever think you're cool!
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Old 05-03-2019, 05:59 PM
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To clarify, I consider a singer a musician.
How about Phil Spector? Would you consider him a musician?
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Old 05-03-2019, 06:12 PM
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John Philips - Mamas & Papas heavy drug user, womanizer, including his own adult daughter.

https://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment...ory?id=8647172

Phil Spector - abused his wives & threatened people with guns. Convicted of murder.

Jim Morrison - have you seen the movie? He was a pretty terrifying guy.
7 controversial moments in his career
https://www.upvenue.com/article/1409...n-moments.html

Last edited by aceplace57; 05-03-2019 at 06:14 PM.
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Old 05-03-2019, 06:19 PM
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I gave Bob Dylan a plate of corn muffins to paint my chicken coop in 1961, and he never did it.
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Old 05-03-2019, 06:28 PM
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I gave Bob Dylan a plate of corn muffins to paint my chicken coop in 1961, and he never did it.
Those muffins were lousy!
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Old 05-03-2019, 06:40 PM
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I've always thought Mick Jagger is creepy.

As a teenager, I had a huge crush on Paul Simon, and thanks to my obession I uncovered a few remote links to him (my friend's sister's friend dated Art Garfunkel, that sort of thing). Although I never personally sensed it, my third- and fourth- hand reports are that yeah, Paul is an asshole.
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Old 05-03-2019, 06:50 PM
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How about Phil Spector? Would you consider him a musician?
Yes, even though he's mostly know as a producer.

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Old 05-03-2019, 07:45 PM
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...Paul is an asshole.
Turn me on, dead man.
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Old 05-03-2019, 09:38 PM
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John Lennon -left Cynthia Lennon to raise Julian alone.
mick Jagger Brian jones was their leader then took over dumped jones.,
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Old 05-03-2019, 09:50 PM
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John Lennon was an asshole. Then he met Yoko Ono and turned into a completely different kind of asshole.

And if George Harrison is to be believed, McCartney was just as big an asshole.

Stephen Stills wrote Suite Judy Blue Eyes about his lover, Judy Collins, and recorded it while she was sitting in the studio. A year later Stills wrote Love the One You're With. Somewhere in there there's was some sort of love triangle with Stills, Graham Nash and Rita Coolidge, and CSN(&Y) broke up.
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Old 05-03-2019, 10:04 PM
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1.-10. David Crosby.
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Old 05-03-2019, 11:40 PM
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Buddy Rich. He was supposed to be a phenomenal drummer but every time I heard him play it was painfully disconnected from the music accompanying him.

And he always acted like Johnny Carson just got done peeing on his cornflakes.
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Old 05-03-2019, 11:41 PM
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OK, I'll play...

For starters, I think there is a... movement? Lack of wanting to press the issue? regarding 60/70s music stars and #MeToo. If you want to try to convince me that every sex act committed by the Beatles, Stones, Led Zep, etc was with fully consensual adults of clear minds and legal ages, you can try, but I'm likely not going to buy it.

John Lennon. Seemed like more than a bit of an asshole. Openly mocked people with physical and mental difficulties. Was cruel. Just... not a pleasant person.

Jim Morrison. Don't think he'd flame out as bad as predicted by digs, but he strikes me as a douche as well.
It's no secret that Jimmy Page had a 14-year-old girlfriend for a while, until she turned 15, anyway. I've also heard that she was basically a beard - that he's at least bisexual if not outright gay. NOMB, of course, even if I knew him personally.

I could totally see said overweight Jim Morrison doing poetry slams 30 years before they had a name, and other people just plain old not getting it.
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Old 05-04-2019, 12:37 AM
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Charles Manson was a singer and songwriter. I'm not sure why, but something about him rubbed me the wrong way.
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Old 05-04-2019, 09:04 AM
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Buddy Rich. He was supposed to be a phenomenal drummer but every time I heard him play it was painfully disconnected from the music accompanying him.

And he always acted like Johnny Carson just got done peeing on his cornflakes.
Yeah, he had quite the reputation for being an asshole. There's even a joke I've heard told by drummers that basically involves somebody calling up Buddy Rich's house after he's dead three times, with the person answering the phone getting more and more irate saying "I've already told you twice...Buddy Rich is dead!" To which the caller responds, "I know, I know. I just wanted to hear it again!"

There's also a famous Buddy Rich rant where he just goes off on his musicians on the bus after what he perceived to be a sub-par gig. A few lines from that rant were used in Seinfeld episodes. I believe James Brown had a similar reputation of being hard on his musicians and docking them pay if they played "clams."
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Old 05-04-2019, 09:51 AM
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Yeah, Rich was a dick (and a crappy drummer), Stan Getz was a colossal dick, and Sinatra was a mega-dick.
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Old 05-04-2019, 10:38 AM
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Oh, for sure, David Crosby! Everything about him inspires loathing, from his hideous pornstache, his insane crack habit, his buying himself a new liver, his agreeing to inseminate Melissa Etheridge with his bad genes....just creeps me out. (though I admire his music). Yes, I'm shallow, and for all I know he is a fine, fine person IRL but just looking at him makes me cringe.

Miss Diana Ross of the Supremes - not a nice person, and to this day, still displays one of the biggest egos on the planet.

Grace Slick of Jefferson Airplane - why that C-word gets so much luuuuvvvv from men is beyond me, if she was an actual girlfriend she would be an utter nightmare. (same with Chrissie Hyndes, of the Pretenders)

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Old 05-04-2019, 10:43 AM
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If 1967 Grace Slick was my GF she’d be a Siamese cat of a girl. Under my thumb, she’d be the sweetest pet in the world.
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Old 05-04-2019, 11:15 AM
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Oh, for sure, David Crosby! Everything about him inspires loathing, from his hideous pornstache, his insane crack habit, his buying himself a new liver, his agreeing to inseminate Melissa Etheridge with his bad genes....just creeps me out. (though I admire his music). . . .
Loved his big hit, "Almost Cut My Nose Hair."
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Old 05-04-2019, 11:32 AM
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Bob Markley was one of the creepiest figures of that era. He was a trust fund kid who failed to make inroads as a musician. In his 30s he ended up managing the West Coast Pop Art Experimental Band comprised of some teenagers who were under this thumb. Some of their lyrics are quite creepy, in the vein of some of Gary Puckett's material, and in real life he had a penchant for getting with girls who were too young. He was also a friend of Kim Fowley's.

Last edited by Covfefe; 05-04-2019 at 11:33 AM.
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Old 05-04-2019, 11:42 AM
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It's no secret that Jimmy Page had a 14-year-old girlfriend for a while, until she turned 15, anyway. I've also heard that she was basically a beard - that he's at least bisexual if not outright gay. NOMB, of course, even if I knew him personally.
I've never heard the gay thing. If he was undercover, he was deep undercover considering he has 5 children with 5 different women over 3 decades..
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Old 05-04-2019, 12:10 PM
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The musicians I've heard the worst about from people who have worked with them include Paul Simon (who knew nothing about musicals but ruined Capetown by insisting it be done his way), Kris Kristopherson (mostly lucky), and Jackson Browne (whose first wife committed suicide and who once put Daryl Hannah in the hospital). And while I don't know anyone who knows him, Mick Jagger does creep the hell out of me.

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Old 05-04-2019, 02:59 PM
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Miss Diana Ross of the Supremes - not a nice person, and to this day, still displays one of the biggest egos on the planet.
Joke I heard:

Why did Diana Ross get a DUI?

You'd drink, too, if you looked like Michael Jackson.
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Old 05-04-2019, 03:06 PM
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Bob Markley was one of the creepiest figures of that era. He was a trust fund kid who failed to make inroads as a musician. In his 30s he ended up managing the West Coast Pop Art Experimental Band comprised of some teenagers who were under this thumb. Some of their lyrics are quite creepy, in the vein of some of Gary Puckett's material, and in real life he had a penchant for getting with girls who were too young. He was also a friend of Kim Fowley's.
Speaking of covfefe, I misread your first sentence as Bob MARLEY, lol.
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Old 05-04-2019, 03:25 PM
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The musicians I've heard the worst about from people who have worked with them include Paul Simon (who knew nothing about musicals but ruined Capetown by insisting it be done his way).
Too Rich To Let Pass...

I am surprised that your many Close Personal Friends in the Music Industry didn't clue you in that the musical Paul Simon wrote, produced and perfomed was entitled "The Capeman" NOT "Capetown".

Seems like ol' Paul Simon (a true musical genius, but by all accounts a truly vain, arrogant, egotistical little man) isn't the only one who "knows nothing about musicals" around here.
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Old 05-04-2019, 04:03 PM
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Too Rich To Let Pass...

I am surprised that your many Close Personal Friends in the Music Industry didn't clue you in that the musical Paul Simon wrote, produced and perfomed was entitled "The Capeman" NOT "Capetown".

Seems like ol' Paul Simon (a true musical genius, but by all accounts a truly vain, arrogant, egotistical little man) isn't the only one who "knows nothing about musicals" around here.
I read a biography on Simon. I think the guy may be a low end sociopath or perhaps has Asperger's.
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Old 05-04-2019, 04:26 PM
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I read a biography on Simon. I think the guy may be a low end sociopath or perhaps has Asperger's.
And he has a reputation for claiming "borrowed" material as is own, going back many years before the notorious Graceland allegations.
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Old 05-04-2019, 04:44 PM
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Yeah, he had quite the reputation for being an asshole. There's even a joke I've heard told by drummers that basically involves somebody calling up Buddy Rich's house after he's dead three times, with the person answering the phone getting more and more irate saying "I've already told you twice...Buddy Rich is dead!" To which the caller responds, "I know, I know. I just wanted to hear it again!"

There's also a famous Buddy Rich rant where he just goes off on his musicians on the bus after what he perceived to be a sub-par gig. A few lines from that rant were used in Seinfeld episodes. I believe James Brown had a similar reputation of being hard on his musicians and docking them pay if they played "clams."
Tasmanian cartoonist Linzee Arnold illustrates the bus episode:
http://buddyshabits.blogspot.com/
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Old 05-04-2019, 04:55 PM
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Ginger Baker

Brilliant drummer and a complete a-hole, then and now. I met him 30+ years ago at a breakfast radio show and he while he wasn't a complete jerk, but he was arrogant, joking about if I was going to pay for his and his groups breakfast . I got his autograph figuring he'd be the first to go from Cream. Well he fooled me...he's not only still alive, but he's still (arguably) the best drummer around!
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Old 05-04-2019, 05:32 PM
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Yeah, he had quite the reputation for being an asshole. There's even a joke I've heard told by drummers that basically involves somebody calling up Buddy Rich's house after he's dead three times, with the person answering the phone getting more and more irate saying "I've already told you twice...Buddy Rich is dead!" To which the caller responds, "I know, I know. I just wanted to hear it again!"

There's also a famous Buddy Rich rant where he just goes off on his musicians on the bus after what he perceived to be a sub-par gig. A few lines from that rant were used in Seinfeld episodes. I believe James Brown had a similar reputation of being hard on his musicians and docking them pay if they played "clams."
I had to look up "clams". when have enough free time I'm going to superimpose Riche's face on a clam shell with a red diagonal line through it. Maybe print it out on some business cards and sneak them into music venues. Or better yet, make beer coasters.

Last edited by Magiver; 05-04-2019 at 05:33 PM.
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Old 05-04-2019, 05:47 PM
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I've never heard the gay thing. If he was undercover, he was deep undercover considering he has 5 children with 5 different women over 3 decades..
According to this, he's been married twice, and two of those children are adopted (stepchildren). The first inkling I heard that he was NOT gay was when I read about the car accident that nearly killed Robert Plant, probably about 10 years after it happened, and that Page's daughter was in the car, although she was not seriously injured.

ETA: Oops, almost forgot to post a link.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Page#Personal_life

Dennis DeYoung still has an impressive set of pipes, but I've always heard that he also has an ego to match and that's why he was fired from Styx. I realize this is stretching the whole 60s things a bit, but Styx did release their first album in 1972, and he performed professionally before that.

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Old 05-04-2019, 05:57 PM
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ETA II: (Missed the edit deadline) Page has ONE adopted stepchild, and two biological children with that child's mother.
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Old 05-04-2019, 05:58 PM
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And he has a reputation for claiming "borrowed" material as is own, going back many years before the notorious Graceland allegations.
Who else did he steal from?
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Old 05-04-2019, 06:51 PM
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Tasmanian cartoonist Linzee Arnold illustrates the bus episode:
http://buddyshabits.blogspot.com/
That's pretty awesome. Thanks for sharing!
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Old 05-04-2019, 06:59 PM
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a famous Buddy Rich rant where he just goes off on his musicians on the bus after what he perceived to be a sub-par gig. A few lines from that rant were used in Seinfeld episodes. I believe James Brown had a similar reputation of being hard on his musicians and docking them pay if they played "clams."
Before Buddy Rich and James Brown led their own bands, Benny Goodman was famous for the “death ray,” a stinkeye aimed at musicians after they played crummy solos.

Perfectionist bandleaders are always called assholes by their sidemen, but we should probably appreciate their ability to herd “cats.”
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Old 05-04-2019, 07:11 PM
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Before Buddy Rich and James Brown led their own bands, Benny Goodman was famous for the “death ray,” a stinkeye aimed at musicians after they played crummy solos.

Perfectionist bandleaders are always called assholes by their sidemen, but we should probably appreciate their ability to herd “cats.”
No, they're dicks. Now, mind you, I don't mind short-tempered people who push you to do your best. I react fine to that sort of treatment. But the people I know who are like that are assholes in general, and it's not necessary to have this kind of approach to bring the best out of people. So, I just think they're all assholes. Plus I don't much like Buddy Rich's music, so it's easier for me to pile on him. (I've never once cared to hear a song Rich played on, but if you told me Morello was on the skins, I'm all ears.) James Brown is a bit more difficult. He was a bit more "important" in my eyes in musical history than Rich was. Goodman, I don't know enough about.

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Old 05-04-2019, 07:21 PM
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Listen to Buddy on the trio recordings with Lester Young and Nat King Cole. In a small combo he doesn’t show off his chops so much. IMO, he was one of the top dozen drummers in jazz history.

Also, try on some more Benny Goodman. He wasn’t called the King of Swing because he preferred them to the slide and the monkey bars.
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Old 05-04-2019, 07:21 PM
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mick Jagger Brian jones was their leader then took over dumped jones.,
Eh, that one is probably unfair. I mean Jagger probably IS a bit of a jackhole - he is at the very least a compulsive and serial philanderer, which is apparently what killed his marriages. I believe one of his ex's once commented that he was a pretty good dad, but a shitty husband.

But Brian Jones' ouster was rather more complex than some dictatorial whim of Jagger's. Basically he alienated everybody.

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It's no secret that Jimmy Page had a 14-year-old girlfriend for a while, until she turned 15, anyway. I've also heard that she was basically a beard - that he's at least bisexual if not outright gay.
He moved on when she was a relatively ancient 16, actually . And then just to the next groupie in line, Bebe Buell. That she was a beard seems very, VERY unlikely. There are safer ones than a 14 year old kid and more helpfully visible ones than a 14 year-old you're keeping under tight lock and key for fear you'll get charged with statutory rape.

Last edited by Tamerlane; 05-04-2019 at 07:24 PM.
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Old 05-04-2019, 07:22 PM
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But I do agree that Buddy was a dick.
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Old 05-04-2019, 07:25 PM
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Posts: 41,607
Quote:
Originally Posted by TreacherousCretin View Post
And he has a reputation for claiming "borrowed" material as is own, going back many years before the notorious Graceland allegations.
I really didn't see much of that in the book. Some of the allegations were just bullshit or the product of the (apparently) lifelong spat between him and Garfunkle. Some of the Graceland stuff was also overblown, as he had permission to use the material and was later accused by a member of Ladysmith who felt he should have gotten more money. Simon didn't always treat people very well, but he really has socialization issues.
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