Straight Dope Message Board

[Mahaloth]

Les paid $2000 at an auction for an item even though he knew most of what made it valuable was fake. What is it and why did he pay so much?

Originally Posted by Go_Arachnid_Laser

Was Les a counterfeiter?

Did he need to recover the item so he wouldn't be found out?

Was it a painting?

A statue?

A vehicle?

An activity?

No to all. 801

[Personal]

Currency?
Plates to make currency? 802

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Personal

Currency?
Plates to make currency?

No 803

[Chronos]

Would Les have paid a high price for it were it not mostly fake?
Is Les counting on someone else not knowing that it's mostly fake?
Was it known to all of the people bidding on it that it was mostly fake?
Is it a copy of some original that isn't fake?
Is it a piece of artwork?
Is it a historical artifact (or replica of one)?
Is it a paleontological artifact (or replica of one)?
Is it something utilitarian?
Did Les expect to profit from his purchase of it? 804

[am77494]

Did he intend to buy the item and sell it for a profit ?

Did he have an emotional attachment to or feelings for the item ?

Did he have an emotional repulsion to the item ?

Did he buy the item to destroy it ?

Is the item an antique or a replica ? 805

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Chronos

Would Les have paid a high price for it were it not mostly fake?

YES (I think so....speculative)

Is Les counting on someone else not knowing that it's mostly fake?

NO

Was it known to all of the people bidding on it that it was mostly fake?

YES

Is it a copy of some original that isn't fake?

I need this question rephrased or clarified.

Is it a piece of artwork?

NO

Is it a historical artifact (or replica of one)?

NO

Is it a paleontological artifact (or replica of one)?

NO

Is it something utilitarian?

NO

Did Les expect to profit from his purchase of it?

NO (I don't think so....speculative)

Originally Posted by am77494

Did he intend to buy the item and sell it for a profit ?

NO (I don't think so....speculative)


Did he have an emotional attachment to or feelings for the item ?

Probably (I don't know....speculative)

Did he have an emotional repulsion to the item ?

NO

Did he buy the item to destroy it ?

NO

Is the item an antique or a replica ?

NO

kk 806

[Biotop]

Is it mostly fake because there is at least one in existence not mostly fake?

Is it fake because it was at some point it was presented as real to fool someone?

Or is fake in the same way mannequin is a fake person but everyone knows it is not a real person?

Is it fake in the way the Piltdown Man was fake or the alien autopsy was fake?

Would the item be of value to a lot of people not at the auction?

Would the average Joe know it is mostly fake?

Was the value of the item that it was mostly fake?

Was the value of the item in the part(s) not fake?

Is Les a human rational adult?

Could Les sell the item a month or two later and expect to get about what he paid for it?

Did Les buy it because he is a collector?I

If any of the not fake part living? 807

[Go_Arachnid_Laser]

The item, was it:

An object?

An animal?

A human?

An idea?

A concept?

A plant?

Made mostly of metal?

Made mostly of wood?

Made mostly of plastic?

Bigger than an average person?

About as big as an average person?

Smaller than an average person? 808

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Biotop

Is it mostly fake because there is at least one in existence not mostly fake?

YES

Is it fake because it was at some point it was presented as real to fool someone?

YES

Or is fake in the same way mannequin is a fake person but everyone knows it is not a real person?

NO

Is it fake in the way the Piltdown Man was fake or the alien autopsy was fake?

NO (not really)

Would the item be of value to a lot of people not at the auction?

YES

Would the average Joe know it is mostly fake?

NO

Was the value of the item that it was mostly fake?

YES

Was the value of the item in the part(s) not fake?

YES(less so, but yes)

Is Les a human rational adult?

YES

Could Les sell the item a month or two later and expect to get about what he paid for it?

YES

Did Les buy it because he is a collector?

YES(I think so)

If any of the not fake part living?

NO

Originally Posted by Go_Arachnid_Laser

The item, was it:

An object?

YES

An animal?

NO

A human?

NO

An idea?

NO

A concept?

NO

A plant?

NO

Made mostly of metal?

NO

Made mostly of wood?

NO

Made mostly of plastic?

NO

Bigger than an average person?

NO

About as big as an average person?

NO

Smaller than an average person?

YES

kk 809

[Biotop]

Is the fake value

Historical?

Religious?

The monetary value of the material itself?

Amusing?

Kitschy?

Related to a famous person? Animal?

Was the item made in the 21st century?

Was the item made in X century (assuming I am going to type them all, please fill in X)?

If you posted the name of the item not in the context of this thread, would we know what it is?

Was it used in movies, tv, or theater?

Does special care need to be used to preserve the item? 810

[Peter Morris]

Did the fake object resemble:
- precious metal ?
- other metal ?
- gemstone(s) ?
- paper ?
- canvas ?
- wood ?

Was it created by a famous forger? Van Meegeren? 811

[Go_Arachnid_Laser]

Is it made of stone?

Is it jewelry?

Was it's original function decorative?

Is it something you could hold in your hand? 812

[Mahaloth]

Les paid $2000 at an auction for an item even though he knew most of what made it valuable was fake. What is it and why did he pay so much?

Originally Posted by Biotop

Is the fake value

Historical?

KIND OF? (not really, I think)

Religious?

NO

The monetary value of the material itself?

NO

Amusing?

YES

Kitschy?

NO

Related to a famous person? Animal?

RELATED TO A FAMOUS PERSON

Was the item made in the 21st century?

NO

Was the item made in X century (assuming I am going to type them all, please fill in X)?

20th Century

If you posted the name of the item not in the context of this thread, would we know what it is?

NO

Was it used in movies, tv, or theater?

NO

Does special care need to be used to preserve the item?

YES

Originally Posted by Peter Morris

Did the fake object resemble:
- precious metal ?
- other metal ?
- gemstone(s) ?
- paper ?
- canvas ?
- wood ?

IT IS PAPER(not resembling, but is paper)

Was it created by a famous forger?

YES, though person not famous as a forger

Van Meegeren?

NO

Originally Posted by Go_Arachnid_Laser

Is it made of stone? NO

Is it jewelry? NO

Was it's original function decorative? NO

Is it something you could hold in your hand? YES

813

[Biotop]

Is the famous creator an artist?
An actor/actress?
Chef?
Still alive? 814

[Go_Arachnid_Laser]

Is it a book?

A manuscript?

Was it the fake Hitler diaries? 815

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Biotop

Is the famous creator an artist?

Yes(of a type, not a painter)

An actor/actress?

NO

Chef?

NO

Still alive?

NO

Originally Posted by Go_Arachnid_Laser

Is it a book?

A manuscript?

Was it the fake Hitler diaries?

NO to everything. 816

[Chronos]

Does the paper bear writing on it?

Does the paper bear a picture on it?

Does the paper bear any sort of markings on it?

Is there anything about the paper that would be remarkable if it didn't have markings on it? 817

[Go_Arachnid_Laser]

Is it a blueprint?

A map?

Scrolls? 818

[Peter Morris]

Is the paper a fake banknote? 819

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Chronos

Does the paper bear writing on it?

YES

Does the paper bear a picture on it?

YES

Does the paper bear any sort of markings on it?

YES

Is there anything about the paper that would be remarkable if it didn't have markings on it?

NO (I am going with my definition of markings, which I hope is the same as yours. Care to define or clarify?)

Originally Posted by Go_Arachnid_Laser

Is it a blueprint?

A map?

Scrolls?

NO to everything here

Originally Posted by Peter Morris

Is the paper a fake banknote?

NO 820

[Go_Arachnid_Laser]

You said he fake was made in the 20th century. Was the original it intended to mimic also from the 20th century?
If not, XIX?
XVIII?
XVII?
XVI?
XV?
XIV?
Before that? 821

[Chronos]

Is the text handwritten?
Is the text printed?
Does it bear a picture of a person?
Does it bear a picture of a landscape scene?
Does it bear a picture of a small inanimate object?

Does it bear a picture that was photographically captured?
Does it bear a picture that was drawn by a human?
Does it bear a picture that was generated by a computer? 822

[Chronos]

Is the text handwritten?
Is the text printed?
Does it bear a picture of a person?
Does it bear a picture of a landscape scene?
Does it bear a picture of a small inanimate object?

Does it bear a picture that was photographically captured?
Does it bear a picture that was drawn by a human?
Does it bear a picture that was generated by a computer? 823

[Go_Arachnid_Laser]

Is it related to music? 824

[Peter Morris]

Does the paper mainly consist of written or printed words?
nm, Chronos already asked.

Is it some kind of contract? A will?

Was it Chamberlain's piece of paper? 825

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Go_Arachnid_Laser

You said he fake was made in the 20th century. Was the original it intended to mimic also from the 20th century?

20th century.

Originally Posted by Chronos

Is the text handwritten? YES
Is the text printed? YES
Does it bear a picture of a person? YES
Does it bear a picture of a landscape scene? NO
Does it bear a picture of a small inanimate object? NO

Does it bear a picture that was photographically captured? YES
Does it bear a picture that was drawn by a human? NO
Does it bear a picture that was generated by a computer? NO

Originally Posted by Go_Arachnid_Laser

Is it related to music?

YES

Originally Posted by Peter Morris

Is it some kind of contract? A will?

NOPE

Was it Chamberlain's piece of paper

NO

?

826

[Go_Arachnid_Laser]

Was it an autographed picture?

The picture was real but the autograph was not?

Was Elvis involved? 827

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Go_Arachnid_Laser

Was it an autographed picture?

YES

The picture was real but the autograph was not?

YES

Was Elvis involved?

NO

kk 828

[Go_Arachnid_Laser]

Popstar?

Rockstar?

Male?

Female?

Dead?

Michael Jackson? 829

[Mahaloth]

Les paid $2000 at an auction for an item even though he knew most of what made it valuable was fake. What is it and why did he pay so much?

Originally Posted by Go_Arachnid_Laser

Popstar?

NO

Rockstar?

YES

Male?

YES

Female?

NO

Dead?

YES

Michael Jackson?

NO

830

[Chronos]

Is the rockstar the one who was pictured?
Is the purported autograph of the rockstar?
Are pictures of this rockstar rare?
Does the picture date from the timespan the rockstar was performing?
Is the picture of the rockstar performing music?
Is the picture one that could plausibly be the rockstar performing music?
Does the picture show the rockstar doing anything he would have preferred not to be seen doing? 831

[Biotop]

Is the signed name a pseudonym -something like "Ziggy Stardust" but signed by Bowie or "Billy Shears" signed by a Beatle? 832

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Chronos

Is the rockstar the one who was pictured?

YES (Edited: The rockstar is in the picture, but is not the only one in the picture)

Is the purported autograph of the rockstar?

YES

Are pictures of this rockstar rare?

NO

Does the picture date from the timespan the rockstar was performing?

YES

Is the picture of the rockstar performing music?

NO

Is the picture one that could plausibly be the rockstar performing music?

NO

Does the picture show the rockstar doing anything he would have preferred not to be seen doing?

NO

Originally Posted by Biotop

Is the signed name a pseudonym -something like "Ziggy Stardust" but signed by Bowie or "Billy Shears" signed by a Beatle?

NO 833

[Biotop]

Is it a relative of the rock star, something like John Lennon signing for Julian Lennon? 834

[Biotop]

Or a rock star who signed a silly picture of some kind purporting to be another rock star as an attempt at humor? 835

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Biotop

Is it a relative of the rock star, something like John Lennon signing for Julian Lennon?

No. Nice idea, but no.

Originally Posted by Biotop

Or a rock star who signed a silly picture of some kind purporting to be another rock star as an attempt at humor?

YES

I think we can fully solve this and have a great little wrap-up. Anyone want to go a bit further? I think it's too early to call it solved, the specifics are great. 836

[Biotop]

Were they in the same band?
Were they friends?
Rivals?
Was the humor critically meant? (For example someone making fun of KennyG.) 837

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Biotop

Were they in the same band?

YES

Were they friends?

YES

Rivals?

YES(sometimes)

Was the humor critically meant? (For example someone making fun of KennyG.)

NO

kk 838

[Biotop]

Beatles?
Nirvana?
The Doors?
The Who? 839

[Mahaloth]

Originally Posted by Biotop

Beatles?
Nirvana?
The Doors?
The Who?

Beatles. We'll call this one solved.

John Lennon signed all four of the Beatles names on a picture in a newspaper. He wrote "All the best from the Beatles" at the top and then signed for Paul, Ringo, himself(the only "real" part), and George.

The fact that Lennon did this made it unique and more valuable. Apparently, people think he just did it for a laugh.

I changed a detail. Les was the photographer, not the buyer. He was the one to realize Lennon had signed all four names and consequently, made it more valuable.

See the picture and read about the story here. 840

[Biotop]

I might have thought that such a thing would sell for more than $2000.00, Mahaloth. Good stuff.

+++++++++


Here is one inspired by that recent riddle about hiring. It reminded me of something I had heard recently and I googled it to confirm. Yep.

**********

A man unexpectedly brought a balloon to a job interview and primarily because of this he was hired for the job. What was the position?

Helpful(?) and tangentially relevant hint: Years later this same man will be credited with inventing the cell phone.

********** 841

[Chronos]

Dibs on the next puzzle, after this.

Was the balloon inflated?
Was it inflated with air?
Was it inflated with helium?
Was the balloon of a size that could comfortably fit into a normal-sized office?
Was the mere fact that he brought the balloon considered an asset for the position?
Was something the man did with the balloon considered an asset for the position?
Does the job involve working with people?
Does the job involve working with children?
Did the job relate to electronics? 842

[Biotop]

reply to Chronos

Was the balloon inflated? Yes

Was it inflated with air? Yes

Was it inflated with helium? No

Was the balloon of a size that could comfortably fit into a normal-sized office? No

Was the mere fact that he brought the balloon considered an asset for the position? Yes

Was something the man did with the balloon considered an asset for the position? Yes

Does the job involve working with people? Yes

Does the job involve working with children? Occasionally

Did the job relate to electronics? No 843

[Folly]

Was it a hot air balloon?

Did he bring his own balloon to a company that gave balloon rides? 844

[Biotop]

reply to Folly

Was it a hot air balloon? Yes

Did he bring his own balloon to a company that gave balloon rides? No 845

[kk fusion]

Was the balloon meant to carry passengers?
Did it carry equipment?
Did it display advertising? 846

[Aspidistra]

Did he arrive in the balloon?

Were the skills used to operate the balloon ones which would be useful for the position he wanted?

Did his happen before 1950?

In the USA?

Was it an entry-level position? 847

[Biotop]

reply to kk fushion

Was the balloon meant to carry passengers? Yes
Did it carry equipment? No
Did it display advertising? Yes 848

[Biotop]

reply to Aspidistra

Did he arrive in the balloon? Yes

Were the skills used to operate the balloon ones which would be useful for the position he wanted? No

Did his happen before 1950? yes

In the USA? Not sure

Was it an entry-level position? No 849

[Telemark]

Was it the Wizard of Oz? 850