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Old 02-08-2019, 11:24 PM
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Time Travel is impossible because



Time travel is impossible
If we were to travel ahead in time because of the constant evolution of bacterias and virusus we would be attacked and killed by bacteria that our bodies couldnt handle
if we traveled back in time we would make every body sick
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Old 02-08-2019, 11:35 PM
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That's not WHY it's impossible. That's just an issue we would have to take into consideration if it it WERE possible.
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Old 02-09-2019, 12:57 AM
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Related column.
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Old 02-09-2019, 01:09 AM
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the black plague was a failed experiment in time travel
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Old 02-09-2019, 01:16 AM
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the black plague was a failed experiment in time travel
You just said time travel was impossible. Now you say someone did in fact go back and give everyone the plague? Which is it?
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Old 02-09-2019, 01:48 AM
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There is no possible way to go back in time, although you can shrink time the faster you travel.

You cannot go forward in time.
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Old 02-09-2019, 05:04 AM
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There is no possible way to go back in time, although you can shrink time the faster you travel.

You cannot go forward in time.
Yes, you can. You're doing it right now. We all are.

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Old 02-09-2019, 08:44 AM
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Actually, time travel to the past can't be ruled out but there some non-trivial engineering issues that would have to worked out.
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How could one build a time machine? The simplest way currently being discussed is to take a wormhole (a tunnel connecting spatially separated regions of space-time) and give one mouth of the wormhole a substantial velocity with respect to the other. Passage through the wormhole would then allow travel to the past.
Thing is, even if it's successfully completed, no one be able to move further back than the time Project Stargate was brought on line. Great for our descendants living in 10000 ACE but no so great for us, and even they won't be able to visit the grassy knoll in Dallas in November, 1963. Furthermore, that downstream end will forever be moving towards those descendants at the rate of one second per second.

The article goes on to say that physicists have found no evidence of time travel in the universe, and they've been looking.

Last edited by DesertDog; 02-09-2019 at 08:46 AM.
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Old 02-09-2019, 02:20 PM
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If you have a powerful rocket then you can get relativistic time dilation effects.

Send one twin off on a high speed run out there and back. When the twin comes back he can get a Bad Disease from the other's twin descendants.

Nothing "impossible" about it from a Scientific point of view.

The Real Question is what happens when you put one end of the wormhole inside the other end? The ouroboros to end all ouroboroses.
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Old 02-16-2019, 01:40 PM
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I registered to comment on this topic. I believe that we are all looking at this wrong.

First, clearly time travel IS possible. Someone jokingly pointed out that we are traveling forward in time always. That isn't just a joke, it is a fact that needs to be considered. Second, others have mentioned Einstein's special theory of general relativity which hypothesizes that the laws of physics are the same for all non-accelerating observers and that the speed of light within a vacuum is the same no matter the speed at which an observer travels.

This allows for a different kind of time travel. It allows for us to travel forward in time (in theory - assuming we could overcome the difficulties involved) at a much faster rate of speed than "normal." This has been observed in space travel already.

There are tremendous implications here. Time is clearly not the constant we imagine. It is only a constant to the observer and is highly dependent on the velocity of the observer. An observer not moving at all may not experience time. Perhaps we are all experiencing time at the rate we do based on the speed of our planet revolving around the sun, and the speed of our solar system traveling through space and the speed of our galaxy traveling through the universe, none of which are negligible. What is time like for an observer moving at virtually zero mph?

And the faster we travel, the closer we come to time disappearing into infinity. Sounds a lot like God talk...

Here's where I think we fail. We make assumptions based on our senses. I like to consider a 2 dimensional man. Imagine the world to him. He simply cannot fathom things that are simple to us. For a two dimensional man, a circle looks like a straight line coming towards him. A straight line that is getting larger and larger. A line might look like a dot sometimes. It might look like a "line" at other times, depending on the angle at which the line is turned towards him. If he was looking at the line perpendicularly it would look like a massive line, or wall. If he was looking at it from 90 degrees off of perpendicular, it would look like a dot.

My point being that we are in a 3d world with five senses and we have also created equipment that can measure other things within our dimensions. You could make an argument (that I would not be comfortable with) that time is the fourth dimension. But I find that hard because time seems very malleable - or at least it is not a constant - except from the observer's pov.

Time seems to be a construct or an invention. Something created so that we can experience a 3d world in a sensible way.

There is so much interesting discussion to be had on these topics. I am not challenging or arguing with anyone, just trying to learn more and trying to see if there is a way to understand something that is clearly on the outer edge of our ability to comprehend. It may simply not be something we can understand from our limited perspective. Like the 2D man trying to comprehend 3D structures. But it is fun to try.

I'd love to hear from anyone with theories and ideas on this topic.

One thing that does SEEM to be impossible is traveling in time BACKWARDS. It appears that anything that has happened is unchangeable. I can't prove that, but I also haven't heard an argument that would allow for it happening and it seems to create paradoxes and other impossible situations.

Time Travel _seems_ to be limited to changing the speed at which we can travel forward, slower or faster.

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Old 02-16-2019, 04:01 PM
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I've always like the hypothesis that time travel backward happens all the time. It plays hell with causality of course, and stability in the system is finally achieved when the time machine is eventually prevented by a traveler from being invented.

Oh, and .
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Old 02-16-2019, 04:08 PM
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You just said time travel was impossible. Now you say someone did in fact go back and give everyone the plague? Which is it?
I think you may have blown his mind.
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Old 02-16-2019, 04:58 PM
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I registered to comment on this topic. I believe that we are all looking at this wrong.

Welcome to the board, hope you find more to stay for!


Gotta say, I was kind of shocked to reach the end and see the signature. Didn't realize that you were a big nerd. Now I'm waiting for John Boy to weigh in...
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:31 PM
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I've always like the hypothesis that time travel backward happens all the time. It plays hell with causality of course, and stability in the system is finally achieved when the time machine is eventually prevented by a traveler from being invented.

Oh, and .
Niven's Law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niven%...re_Time_travel)

"If the universe of discourse permits the possibility of time travel and of changing the past, then no time machine will be invented in that universe."
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Old 02-16-2019, 10:25 PM
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Time travel can mean different things, but Iíve always had one major issue with the most common sci-fi version; i.e. a human, as presently constituted (ďBack to the FutureĒ-style with all current memories, knowledge, chemical construction, etc.) can take his or her whole self to a specific place in the past. My issue is that weíre each essentially the combination of all the specific atoms and molecules in our bodies. So letís just say that I want to go back to 100 years ago. The water, carbon, calcium and iron in my body was already ďin useĒ doing something else on earth. If I jump in the Delorean and take myself to the year 1919, would I somehow ďborrowĒ each individual molecule necessary to recreate myself when I get there? The silver filling in my tooth might have been in the necklace of another person at that time. That silver canít be in two places at once.

There are theories that the water in earth arrived much later than the original forming of earth, most through ice-filled asteroids or comets. What would happen if I set the time machine to earth before the arrival of water? How would I, who is basically a bag of water, possibly be able to exist at that time? That water was still in some asteroid flying around the cosmos. If I went further back, the iron in my blood might not have even been in existence yet. Maybe the supernova that created it hadnít yet occurred. So where am I getting the iron for my blood when I get there if it hasnít even been created yet, or is still buried in some aging star?
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Old 02-17-2019, 12:51 AM
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Time travel is impossible because there's no such thing as time.
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Old 02-17-2019, 07:25 AM
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And the faster we travel, the closer we come to time disappearing into infinity. Sounds a lot like God talk...
it's a one-way trip, though; no coming back and wowing the locals with your infinite knowledge of the future.

D'ja ever read Tao Zero? A Bussard ram jet has an accident and can neither slow down nor shut off the jet -- they must accelerate until makes billions of years pass in in a subjective moment for the crew.
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Old 02-17-2019, 10:10 AM
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What is time like for an observer moving at virtually zero mph?
Whilst there is a "speed limit" to the universe, there isn't the opposite. You can't come to a universal full stop.
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Old 02-17-2019, 12:36 PM
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What is time like for an observer moving at virtually zero mph?

Just look around you--you are surrounded by things moving at virtually zero MPH--Olympic sprinters, race cars, speeding bullets, jet fighters--all are traveling nearly as slowly as it is possible to travel (just as our environment is very nearly as cold and very nearly as low-gravity as it is possible to get.)
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Old 02-17-2019, 12:47 PM
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Obviously, if you go back in time, then all of your atoms go back in time, too. It's not like you need to use the atoms that are "already there".
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Old 02-17-2019, 01:00 PM
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Obviously, if you go back in time, then all of your atoms go back in time, too. It's not like you need to use the atoms that are "already there".

Right--but be very careful to not touch the earlier version of yourself.
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Old 02-17-2019, 03:26 PM
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Obviously, if you go back in time, then all of your atoms go back in time, too. It's not like you need to use the atoms that are "already there".
And serious people have proposed that antiparticles can be understood to be normal particles moving back in time - so (for example) an interaction between an electron and a positron could be interpreted as a self-interaction between the electron and that same electron moving backwards in time at a later point along its worldline.
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Old 02-17-2019, 04:06 PM
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And serious people have proposed that antiparticles can be understood to be normal particles moving back in time - so (for example) an interaction between an electron and a positron could be interpreted as a self-interaction between the electron and that same electron moving backwards in time at a later point along its worldline.
If I went back in time, how easy would it be to touch a particular electron in my body to one in my alter ego's ?
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Old 02-17-2019, 04:16 PM
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All electrons are interchangeable. If you were in the process of going back in time, that might potentially make your electrons positrons (and your protons and neutrons antiprotons and antineutrons), which would make touching anything, including air, extremely ill-advised. But once you "arrived" and started moving forward in time again as normal, that shouldn't be an issue any more, no more than it's an issue for your particles to touch other particles in our normal timeline world.
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Old 02-18-2019, 12:31 AM
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Obviously, if you go back in time, then all of your atoms go back in time, too. It's not like you need to use the atoms that are "already there".
But itís not like I spontaneously created all the atoms and molecules in my body. They all came from somewhere else. I just watched Hamilton on Broadway today. Think of one single iron atom in Hamiltonís blood during the final years of the 18th century. In fact , letís give the atom a name. Call it OFIA, as in ďour favorite iron atom.Ē

When Hamilton was shot and killed in that famous duel, some of his blood spilled on that field in New Jersey, and letís assume that OFIA was in that pool of blood. I know this is a stretch, but now letís say that, through a series of natural events, OFIA made it into the spinach that I ate last week. My body absorbed OFIA and now itís in my blood (along with millions of other iron atoms).

Now letís say that next week, I build a time machine and go back to the time of Hamilton to the days before he was shot. Iím there, in 18th century New York, walking around in horse shit, with OFIA still in my blood. But OFIA is also in Hamiltonís blood, since heís still alive walking around. How can OFIA be in my blood at the same time itís in Hamiltonís blood? That would mean that matter was created spontaneously, and now more iron exists than was actually present at that time.
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Old 02-18-2019, 04:25 AM
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That would mean that matter was created spontaneously, and now more iron exists than was actually present at that time.
It wasn't spontaneously created, it arrived through the time machine. And those extra atoms would vanish again when the back-in-time you themselves went back in the time machine.

And if you went back and killed yourself? I don't know if we actually know what would happen in such a paradoxical situation. The ways of using super fast speeds to travel through time at different rates given above don't give the option of being around at the same time as a different version of you, so the paradox doesn't apply.
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Old 02-18-2019, 05:56 AM
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But itís not like I spontaneously created all the atoms and molecules in my body. They all came from somewhere else. I just watched Hamilton on Broadway today. Think of one single iron atom in Hamiltonís blood during the final years of the 18th century. In fact , letís give the atom a name. Call it OFIA, as in ďour favorite iron atom.Ē

When Hamilton was shot and killed in that famous duel, some of his blood spilled on that field in New Jersey, and letís assume that OFIA was in that pool of blood. I know this is a stretch, but now letís say that, through a series of natural events, OFIA made it into the spinach that I ate last week. My body absorbed OFIA and now itís in my blood (along with millions of other iron atoms).

Now letís say that next week, I build a time machine and go back to the time of Hamilton to the days before he was shot. Iím there, in 18th century New York, walking around in horse shit, with OFIA still in my blood. But OFIA is also in Hamiltonís blood, since heís still alive walking around. How can OFIA be in my blood at the same time itís in Hamiltonís blood? That would mean that matter was created spontaneously, and now more iron exists than was actually present at that time.
Any iron atom has extent in duration - so you're using one portion of its lifespan while Hamilton is using another portion of its lifespan. It's been seriously proposed that there's only one electron in the universe - weaving back and forth through time, and appearing to us as the billions of electrons and positrons that make up the world https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-electron_universe
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Old 02-18-2019, 09:36 AM
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And, boy, are its arms tired!
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Old 02-18-2019, 10:03 AM
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Time travel is impossible because there's no such thing as time.
"Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so." - HHG

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You cannot go forward in time.
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Yes, you can. You're doing it right now. We all are.

I love smartass answers that have the added benefit of being the truth.
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Old 02-18-2019, 10:28 PM
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Of course, you won't have to worry about the germs of the year 1319, if that was your destination, because you'd land in the vacuum of space since Earth has moved quite a bit in 700 years.
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Old 02-18-2019, 11:00 PM
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Intentional, and planned or targeted time travel is impossible. To understand this one must first understand that the universe's time isn't the same as earthling's chronological time. Time is not a year, or month, day or hour to the universe. To the universe, it is the movement of all that is contained within it. If all that is within the universe ceased to move, the universe would cease to exist. Also, this movement is in one direction, so it is said time moves forward. However, the truth of the matter is the movement of what is contained in the universe moves forward.

To travel back in time one would have to reverse all that is contained in the universe. It all would have to backtrack the exact steps (if you will) it took to move forward until the universe is configured front to back, top to bottom exactly the same as it was in that moment in the past. However, the supposed traveler is part of that as well and would be constrained to be where he/she/it was at that same instant as well.

One cannot travel forward in time as that hasn't happened yet. All that is contained in the universe has not moved there, where ever there turns out to be. Since this location is an unknown, the future is literally an unknown, and to travel one must have a destination.

It is easy to look at a watch as you spin its stem making the hands rotate backward and imagine that's what is being spoken about regarding traveling back in time. Rotate the stem in the other direction, it seems there's an easy illustration of traveling forward in time. This is anthropomorphic reasoning regarding time. As such it is highly fantastical and highly impossible.

Though, if you're as quick-witted as most wish to be then you'll recall I prefaced this with "Intentional, and planned or targeted time travel...." This wasn't just to string words together to seem smart. (That's the purpose of all that followed from there. ) It has been theorized or postulated that there could be things called wormholes, and these wormholes could actually connect two different phases of time.

Traveling through a wormhole could (theoretically) deliver someone to a random place in time. It then followed (by sci fi writers) that given the right technology a wormhole could be fabricated. This theory, even though Einstein liked it, does not take into account that the past and future no longer exist, so the likelihood of a destination existing at the end of a theoretical wormhole is slim to none.

But, don't let a thing like the actual factual stop you sci fi writers out there. I'm a big H.G. Wells fan, myself.
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Old 02-19-2019, 12:54 AM
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Intentional, and planned or targeted time travel is impossible. To understand this one must first understand that the universe's time isn't the same as earthling's chronological time. Time is not a year, or month, day or hour to the universe. To the universe, it is the movement of all that is contained within it. If all that is within the universe ceased to move, the universe would cease to exist. Also, this movement is in one direction, so it is said time moves forward. However, the truth of the matter is the movement of what is contained in the universe moves forward.

To travel back in time one would have to reverse all that is contained in the universe. It all would have to backtrack the exact steps (if you will) it took to move forward until the universe is configured front to back, top to bottom exactly the same as it was in that moment in the past. However, the supposed traveler is part of that as well and would be constrained to be where he/she/it was at that same instant as well.

One cannot travel forward in time as that hasn't happened yet. All that is contained in the universe has not moved there, where ever there turns out to be. Since this location is an unknown, the future is literally an unknown, and to travel one must have a destination.

It is easy to look at a watch as you spin its stem making the hands rotate backward and imagine that's what is being spoken about regarding traveling back in time. Rotate the stem in the other direction, it seems there's an easy illustration of traveling forward in time. This is anthropomorphic reasoning regarding time. As such it is highly fantastical and highly impossible.

Though, if you're as quick-witted as most wish to be then you'll recall I prefaced this with "Intentional, and planned or targeted time travel...." This wasn't just to string words together to seem smart. (That's the purpose of all that followed from there. ) It has been theorized or postulated that there could be things called wormholes, and these wormholes could actually connect two different phases of time.

Traveling through a wormhole could (theoretically) deliver someone to a random place in time. It then followed (by sci fi writers) that given the right technology a wormhole could be fabricated. This theory, even though Einstein liked it, does not take into account that the past and future no longer exist, so the likelihood of a destination existing at the end of a theoretical wormhole is slim to none.

But, don't let a thing like the actual factual stop you sci fi writers out there. I'm a big H.G. Wells fan, myself.
What is your source for these statements?
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Old 02-19-2019, 07:57 AM
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But, don't let a thing like the actual factual stop you sci fi writers out there. I'm a big H.G. Wells fan, myself.
Some examples of science fiction are more fictiony than others. That's why TV Tropes invented the Mohs scale of science fiction hardness. The three snippets of dialog they use to illustrate soft, hard, and really hard s-f involve how a time machine works.
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Old 02-20-2019, 01:32 AM
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What is your source for these statements?
Common knowledge at this point, my man. Or, common sense if you will.
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Old 02-20-2019, 12:02 PM
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Common knowledge at this point, my man. Or, common sense if you will.
Or assumptions without evidence, if you will.
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Old 02-20-2019, 02:45 PM
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Common knowledge at this point, my man. Or, common sense if you will.
Cool! So you have a worked-out theory that explains why closed timelike loops are impossible even though they seem to be allowed by General Relativity? Have you published it?
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Old 02-28-2019, 02:50 PM
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But itís not like I spontaneously created all the atoms and molecules in my body. They all came from somewhere else. I just watched Hamilton on Broadway today. Think of one single iron atom in Hamiltonís blood during the final years of the 18th century. In fact , letís give the atom a name. Call it OFIA, as in ďour favorite iron atom.Ē

When Hamilton was shot and killed in that famous duel, some of his blood spilled on that field in New Jersey, and letís assume that OFIA was in that pool of blood. I know this is a stretch, but now letís say that, through a series of natural events, OFIA made it into the spinach that I ate last week. My body absorbed OFIA and now itís in my blood (along with millions of other iron atoms).

Now letís say that next week, I build a time machine and go back to the time of Hamilton to the days before he was shot. Iím there, in 18th century New York, walking around in horse shit, with OFIA still in my blood. But OFIA is also in Hamiltonís blood, since heís still alive walking around. How can OFIA be in my blood at the same time itís in Hamiltonís blood? That would mean that matter was created spontaneously, and now more iron exists than was actually present at that time.
As long as matter and energy summed are conserved, no problem. Perhaps in order to time travel the "mass's equivalent (as energy) must be removed from the universe at the time where/when you are deposited. Since there's no truly good working theory to accomplish this, my guess is as good as any.
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Old 02-28-2019, 05:28 PM
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Conservation of energy doesn't work the way that most people think it does. What it actually says is, basically, if you have a box, then the change in the energy in the box is equal to the energy that flows through the walls of the box. If the energy flows into the box in the form of a time-traveling spaceship flying into it, that's just fine (at least, as far as conservation of energy is concerned).
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