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  #2601  
Old 02-17-2018, 05:58 PM
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Anyone who wasn't alive in 1988 should read the article at that link and familiarize themselves with recent history before mouthing off. The Soviet Union had broken up
No, it had not. My grandfather (an old socialist) took me* on a three week trip through the USSR in 1990: Moscow, Leningrad, Kiev, Dnepropetrovsk, and Odessa, plus smaller towns in between. There was a strike/protest in Kiev while we were there, but they had not yet declared independence. There was no sign of private enterprise anywhere, and we were proudly taken by Communist Party officials to tour a collective farm.

I’m also well aware that after calling it a honeymoon in his book, Bernie later saw the political wisdom of trying to walk that back. Whatever the case, he can’t walk back his support for the communist Sandinistas in Nicaragua (another place he visited although not for a honeymoon in that case), and he was obviously sympathetic to Soviet communism as well. (Psst: insisting that he was there for meetings rather than pleasure doesn’t help your cause.)

I just think Mueller should look into all of that in light of these revelations.

*At the time, I was a precocious teenage socialist myself, whereas in my dotage, I would now call myself a “radical centrist”: never tempted by the GOP, but trying to save the Democratic Party from being taken over by the Bernie brigade, which BTW includes my mother and my son.
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  #2602  
Old 02-17-2018, 06:12 PM
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Thanks for putting me straight on that. I thought I'd read somewhere a few years ago there was a restriction on it in Canada, because of all the lies it propagated. Too bad; I had hoped we might follow your Canadian model here in the USA.
Your other errors were in assuming that I follow Fox News, read Brietbart, etc. I do none of those things. Alex Jones is a con man, and infowars is a garbage website. I haven't read Brietbart since Andrew Brietbart died and it was taken over by the alt-right.

So in other words, your reply to me was 100% incorrect partisan knee-jerking.
  #2603  
Old 02-17-2018, 06:14 PM
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Your other errors were in assuming that I follow Fox News, read Brietbart, etc. I do none of those things. Alex Jones is a con man, and infowars is a garbage website. I haven't read Brietbart since Andrew Brietbart died and it was taken over by the alt-right.

So in other words, your reply to me was 100% incorrect partisan knee-jerking.
Except for the facts that were contained it it, none of which you refuted.
  #2604  
Old 02-17-2018, 06:31 PM
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Anyone who wasn't alive in 1988 should read the article at that link and familiarize themselves with recent history before mouthing off. The Soviet Union had broken up...
The USSR broke up in 1991. It was still very much intact in 1988.
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  #2605  
Old 02-17-2018, 06:58 PM
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The USSR broke up in 1991. It was still very much intact in 1988.
Yeah, 1988 was still scary shit fear of nuclear annihilation time for me as a 13-year-old. I had a keen interest in the military, so I wrote the DoD in 1988, and they sent me this menacing looking report (more like a book) on the Soviets entitled "Soviet Military Power: An Assessment of the Threat 1988." The DoD certainly thought the Soviet Union was our overt enemy. (Complete aside: one of the things I found out as a 13-year-old is that if you wrote every aircraft defense contractor asking about their aircraft, they would send you beautiful 8"x10" glossies of their fleet. I don't have the collection anymore, but pretty much everyone, Lockheed, Grumman, Northrop, General Dynamics, etc., had photos, pamphlets, etc., for the taking if you just asked. As a 13-year-old, this was like hitting the goldmine!)

It wasn't really until the wall fell at the end of the next year that I remember feeling some hope in US-Soviet relations.
  #2606  
Old 02-17-2018, 08:35 PM
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The USSR broke up in 1991. It was still very much intact in 1988.
My point was that the Russia of 1988-1991 as and after the Berlin Wall came down isn't the same as Putin's Russia of today. I'm pretty sure that was clear in spite of the chronological nitpicking. And I was 40 in 1988, so I remember first hand.
  #2607  
Old 02-17-2018, 09:23 PM
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The USSR broke up in 1991. It was still very much intact in 1988.
But perestroika and resulting reforms had meant massive changes to the USSR in 1988. By then, joint ventures between state ventures and foreign investors were in full swing.
  #2608  
Old 02-17-2018, 09:24 PM
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As for your 'hard evidence', none of the people above pled to anything involving Trump and Russian collusion. And it's looking like the FBI may have overreached with Flynn, and that case is being looked at again.
Oh, I donít think anyone else has yet mentioned what happened with the Flynn investigation this week.

For background, itís kind of old news that Flynn was....welll...Ēin like FlynnĒ with Russian Ambassador and spymaster Sergei Kislyak. Members of Trumps own staff were alarmed by this and tried their best to warn Flynn away, explictly warning him the Kislyak was, in all likelihood, being wiretapped.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...=.79562a871ba2

But remember that this is Stupid Watergate and Flynn didnít listen. So, right after Christmas Obama announced sanctions against Russia. Kislyak then initiated a series of calls with Flynn while Flynn was vacationing. These calls were wiretapped because KISLYAK was under surveillance. And Flynn shouldíve known it. And although the content of those calls has not yet been released, apparently these calls really alarmed all the security agencies. And they felt Flynn was compromised. I believe what they overheard was quite serious.

And they had a meeting with Obama and Susan Rice. Obama was very clear that the investigation of any crimes should be handled in a non-partisan manner by the security agencies and that the executive branch needed to remain uninvolved. They did express some concern about Flynn having access to certain information, such as the identities of undercover agents working at the Russian embassy.

And Susan Rice made a contemporaneous account of this very professional meeting and e-mailed it to herself, leaving an electronic ďpaper trailĒ.

This is an outrage, according to Devin Nunes and his buddies. Itís very suspicious that Rice would leave such a clear and unassailable record of this meeting. Itís almost like they thought Trump and Friends might try to distort or misrepresent this meeting. And the fact that they would think that means theyíre biased against Trump. So therefore Trump is innocent. And they were wiretapping Flynn !! Theyíre out to get him. Theyíre overreaching.!!

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/3...rself-on-trump

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Yes, the Russians appear to have run an election disinformation campaign. It's pretty clear that their intent wasn't to elect Trump, but to just sow discord and confusion. They also supported Bernie Sanders, and immediately after the election they funded protests on both sides of the aisle - both pro-Trump and anti-Trump. That's what they do.
.
Have you actually read the indictment? It specifically says , very early in the document, that ďthe defendantsí operations included supporting the presidental campaign of then candidate Donald J Trump (Trump Campaign) and disparaging Hillary Clinton). Nothing to the reverse. This is the only item in a list of one.

I do think that one of their objectives was to cause discord. And I do think that Putin wanted anyone but Hillary. And he saw Trump as this orange fool that had been kissing up to him for a decade or so. And what better way to sow discord? Anyone, the email chain where they didnít collude said that the Russian government supported Trump and wanted to give the Trump campaign disparing information on Hillary.

I also think they know that there is currently no chance of meaningfully influencing Trump. His Russia dealings are being too closely watched just like the adulterous husband whose wife watches him like a hawk because of the rumors about him.

Plus, Trump really canít be bought. You can give him money, you can give him the Presidency and heíll take itó but heíll never give you anything in return. You can threaten him with all the hooker pee videos in the world and he just wonít care - and neither will his supporters. You canít bribe someone thatís incapable of gratitude and you canít blackmail someone that has no shame.

So, I think the Kislyak Flynn conversations may be a smoking gun. Because I think Kislyak knew he was under surveillance. And I think he set up some deliberately incriminating information. And they might have more. And what better way to sow discord than fueling the Russia Investigation?
  #2609  
Old 02-17-2018, 09:50 PM
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Ann Hedonia, haven't you heard? Doing Your Job as National Security Advisor While Democrat is a crime nowadays.

Fine summary of the Nunes bullshit, by the way.
  #2610  
Old 02-17-2018, 10:00 PM
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I know I've got the rep of being a bit of a debbie downer, but the Mueller indictments were the best pieces of news I've seen in a while -- brilliant move by "The Bob".

It's brilliant because he didn't initiate the criminal case as a matter of the US DoJ against Trump; rather, he played it well and legitimized his investigation by starting with the US DoJ against "Russians". It's "Us" against "Them". The American public might actually buy into that (and of course, this is 100% what the investigation is about anyway, but perhaps this can at least allay some fears in Trump country that this is a politically-motivated investigation).

It's brilliant because now whenever a GOP talking head comes and speaks out about the perceived unfairness of the investigation, they look like an anti-American cunt. It's one thing to say "The head of my party's the victim of a witch hunt." Mueller's not going that route - not yet. He's saying, "Look, Russians are trying to influence our election." Who can't argue against defending our country against attempts to influence our system?

Mueller's a million times smarter than I. And you. Go, Bob, go!
  #2611  
Old 02-17-2018, 10:06 PM
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asahi, I felt a weight off my chest for the first time in a year and a half when I learned of the indictments and admit I even quietly sobbed a bit. I trust in Mueller because I've followed his career since he and Comey stood their ground in the John Ashcroft Incident. He is worthy of our trust and admiration -- and yes, he is brilliant.

We're about to watch a master at work as he reveals his strategy. I have no problem agreeing he is a million times smarter than me and most everyone else.
  #2612  
Old 02-17-2018, 10:12 PM
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But perestroika and resulting reforms had meant massive changes to the USSR in 1988. By then, joint ventures between state ventures and foreign investors were in full swing.
But like I said, I was there two years later, and in 1990 the only sign of private ventures was the McDonaldís in Moscow and the hard currency stores they already had well before Gorbachev.
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  #2613  
Old 02-17-2018, 10:22 PM
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Some talking head on MSNBC ( Ken Dilanian, actually an NBC correspondent) just made an interesting point. It’s a legal point and I’m not sure if it’s true.

He said that in order to prove or charge conspiracy there needs to be an underlying crime. He also said that once there is a crime involved people can be charged with conspiracy if you acted to aid and abet that crime, even if your actions are not directly criminal. So these indictments may be a first step, even if they can’t ever bring the defendants to trial. Now they can charge other people with conspiracy.

And also the fact that there is now an underlying crime legitimizes the investigation and makes Mueller’s job safety. Or not. He could push to fire Mueller on the grounds that the investigation should be over.
  #2614  
Old 02-17-2018, 10:40 PM
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Some talking head on MSNBC ( Ken Dilanian, actually an NBC correspondent) just made an interesting point. Itís a legal point and Iím not sure if itís true.

He said that in order to prove or charge conspiracy there needs to be an underlying crime. He also said that once there is a crime involved people can be charged with conspiracy if you acted to aid and abet that crime, even if your actions are not directly criminal. So these indictments may be a first step, even if they canít ever bring the defendants to trial. Now they can charge other people with conspiracy.

And also the fact that there is now an underlying crime legitimizes the investigation and makes Muellerís job safety. Or not. He could push to fire Mueller on the grounds that the investigation should be over.
Interesting POV. So now behavior that may be legal without context is illegal if it enhanced the Russian conspiracy to influence our elections?

I've heard Scheniderman in NY has some RICO case building, but who knows if that is just baseless rumor. There are so many rumors going on.
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  #2615  
Old 02-17-2018, 10:52 PM
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<snip>It's brilliant because now whenever a GOP talking head comes and speaks out about the perceived unfairness of the investigation, they look like an anti-American cunt. It's one thing to say "The head of my party's the victim of a witch hunt." Mueller's not going that route - not yet. He's saying, "Look, Russians are trying to influence our election." Who can't argue against defending our country against attempts to influence our system?<snip>
Who can't argue against that????

Umm... The people you are talking about, are trumps base. They actually voted for him. I'm going to have to double your Debbie downer, these people are pretty much unreachable. We still see that here on the SDMB.
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  #2616  
Old 02-18-2018, 12:40 AM
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Um, I did not vote for Trump, being Canadian and all.
Well, who would you have voted for? Surely not the Witch of Benghazi.
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I have been calling out Russian meddling in western elections for decades.
Oooh, you're so very very special. Exactly which issue of Foreign Policy was it where you provided your erudite guidance for world leaders? IIRC, American right-wing idiots of decades ago were more concerned with hating the United Nations and the SCOTUS than they were about communism. So what were you? The right-wing imbecile, smarter than the idiots?

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Of course, back then all that money was funneled exclusively through the Left, so the protestations of people like me generally fell on deaf ears. It seems Russian 'meddling' is only worth having the vapors over if there's a chance it might have helped the Republicans.
Oh, "people like [you]" are so mistreated when you have the vapors. And of course now you have no choice but to turn about and condone Russian meddling, since we all ignored your vapors when you wrote the decades-ago articles in Foreign Policy.

Special snowflake is so mistreated. Our thoughts and prayers go out to you.
  #2617  
Old 02-18-2018, 06:16 AM
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Some talking head on MSNBC ( Ken Dilanian, actually an NBC correspondent) just made an interesting point. Itís a legal point and Iím not sure if itís true.

He said that in order to prove or charge conspiracy there needs to be an underlying crime. He also said that once there is a crime involved people can be charged with conspiracy if you acted to aid and abet that crime, even if your actions are not directly criminal. So these indictments may be a first step, even if they canít ever bring the defendants to trial. Now they can charge other people with conspiracy.

And also the fact that there is now an underlying crime legitimizes the investigation and makes Muellerís job safety. Or not. He could push to fire Mueller on the grounds that the investigation should be over.
The long play.

Here is the analysis of what Mueller learned from the Enron case - this, to me, is central to understanding what Mueller learned about detangling complex financial transactions and sequencing his legal moves very thoughtfully, and over a long time. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/13/o...stigation.html
  #2618  
Old 02-18-2018, 09:21 AM
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This morning’s tweets by President Asterisk have him 1) smearing the FBI by stating they cannot carry on two investigations simultaneously; and 2) claiming the the Russian indictments vindicate him completely NO COLLUSION NO COLLUSION.

Ignore number one. Number two confuses me, though, because there is no reason or logic to it. The indictments do anything BUT vindicate the administration. (The claim is also being parroted by commenters at the Fox and Breitbart websites without any sane backup HE HAS NOTHING MUELLER HAS NOTHING.)

Is it Trump’s plan to claim that ANY action or statement or evidence occurring in the real world proves his innocence? Photos of Putin handing him big cartoon sacks of cash with dollar signs on the sides?
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  #2619  
Old 02-18-2018, 09:29 AM
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...
Ignore number one. Number two confuses me, though, because there is no reason or logic to it. The indictments do anything BUT vindicate the administration. (The claim is also being parroted by commenters at the Fox and Breitbart websites without any sane backup HE HAS NOTHING MUELLER HAS NOTHING.)
You're doing that thing again, trying to apply logic. Here's the logic: black is white, up is down, truth is whatever I say right now (but maybe not later).

Quote:
Is it Trumpís plan to claim that ANY action or statement or evidence occurring in the real world proves his innocence? Photos of Putin handing him big cartoon sacks of cash with dollar signs on the sides?
Well, except for the part where there is no plan, yes. .
  #2620  
Old 02-18-2018, 09:37 AM
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...Here's the logic: black is white, up is down, truth is whatever I say right now (but maybe not later)...
Jesus, that sounds exhausting. Where does the Golf-Cart Vulgarian find the energy to keep that up?
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  #2621  
Old 02-18-2018, 09:44 AM
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Jesus, that sounds exhausting. Where does the Golf-Cart Vulgarian find the energy to keep that up?
I don't think it requires energy. It's consistency and remembering what you said yesterday and five minutes ago that are exhausting. Thump is like an untrained puppy--just urp out whatever wants to come out/up in the moment with no restraint or awareness of the effect on anything. Maybe if someone rubbed his nose in it-- not that I think that is the right way to train a puppy, but puppies are smart and capable of learning. Thump, not so much.
  #2622  
Old 02-18-2018, 09:51 AM
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The long play.

Here is the analysis of what Mueller learned from the Enron case - this, to me, is central to understanding what Mueller learned about detangling complex financial transactions and sequencing his legal moves very thoughtfully, and over a long time. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/13/o...stigation.html
Interesting. Thanks for the link.
  #2623  
Old 02-18-2018, 04:22 PM
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Former Trump aide Rick Gates to plead guilty; agrees to testify against Manafort, sources say

Paul Manafort was in pretty bad shape before. Now he's super fucked.

He may be faced with a choice of dying in jail or pissing off folks who like to play polonium surprise with people who piss them off.
  #2624  
Old 02-18-2018, 04:26 PM
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Paul Manafort was in pretty bad shape before. Now he's super fucked.
Especially with the new charges.
  #2625  
Old 02-18-2018, 04:57 PM
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Especially with the new charges.
Not to get all up in your grill with Fotheringay-Phipps-type nitpickery, but one of the paragraphs in your linked article specifically states that no new charges are involved.

Yet, admittedly.
  #2626  
Old 02-18-2018, 05:05 PM
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Former Trump aide Rick Gates to plead guilty; agrees to testify against Manafort, sources say

Paul Manafort was in pretty bad shape before. Now he's super fucked.

He may be faced with a choice of dying in jail or pissing off folks who like to play polonium surprise with people who piss them off.
If he flips, Dopers in remote areas of the country should start looking for new tall, dark neighbors who complain about ordering Chicken Kiev and getting mcnuggets and margarine ... like a regular schnook.
  #2627  
Old 02-18-2018, 05:56 PM
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Former Trump aide Rick Gates to plead guilty; agrees to testify against Manafort, sources say

Paul Manafort was in pretty bad shape before. Now he's super fucked.

He may be faced with a choice of dying in jail or pissing off folks who like to play polonium surprise with people who piss them off.
Now, if the next headline to come out of the investigation is "Manafort to plead guilty, agrees to testify against Trump".....I'd be oh so happy.
  #2628  
Old 02-18-2018, 06:30 PM
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Not to get all up in your grill with Fotheringay-Phipps-type nitpickery, but one of the paragraphs in your linked article specifically states that no new charges are involved.

Yet, admittedly.
Mueller to the judge in the Manafort case, "Oh hey, while we're talking about bail, I'm just going to mention that I have recently received evidence of more crimes committed by the defendant that I'll be sending your way shortly."

I don't think the timing of this story and the, "Gates to testify against Manafort," story are unrelated.
  #2629  
Old 02-18-2018, 07:03 PM
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"Former Trump aid to plead guilty"
Remember when that shit was happening all the time, or even once, when Obama was President? Neither do I. Fuck you, Republicans, all of you. Fuck right the fuck off.
  #2630  
Old 02-18-2018, 07:09 PM
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Mueller to the judge in the Manafort case, "Oh hey, while we're talking about bail, I'm just going to mention that I have recently received evidence of more crimes committed by the defendant that I'll be sending your way shortly."

I don't think the timing of this story and the, "Gates to testify against Manafort," story are unrelated.
That's exactly right. I read another story (can't find it now) that indicated Mueller would be prepared to file additional charges alleging bank and mortgage fraud at the next bail proceeding. He's also asking for a full revocation of Manafort's bail and for the court to remand him into custody.

I'm looking forward to it.
  #2631  
Old 02-18-2018, 07:11 PM
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"Former Trump aid to plead guilty"
Remember when that shit was happening all the time, or even once, when Obama was President? Neither do I. Fuck you, Republicans, all of you. Fuck right the fuck off.
No but I do remember the tan suit. Same thing really. Also the mustard was a clear reveal of Obama's anti-americanism.

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  #2632  
Old 02-18-2018, 08:03 PM
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No but I do remember the tan suit. Same thing really. Also the mustard was a clear reveal of Obama's anti-americanism.

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There was also the time he made a speech encouraging children to study hard and stay in school. There's no comparison, really. MAGA!!
  #2633  
Old 02-18-2018, 08:53 PM
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This Buchwald column works too.
  #2634  
Old 02-18-2018, 09:20 PM
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The thing is, when Nixon finally went, it was the Republicans who told him he had to go.

When the GOP Torpedoed Nixon
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.... Sen. Barry Goldwater, Ariz., the 1964 GOP presidential nominee, was a respected conservative leader in a Senate whose Republican ranks were less conservative than now. On Aug. 6, 1974, at the regular Senate Republican Conference lunch, Goldwater fumed: "There are only so many lies you can take, and now there has been one too many. Nixon should get his ass out of the White House -- today!"

Goldwater called William Timmons, a White House aide, to set up a meeting. He told Timmons he wanted to tell the president that many GOP senators wanted him to resign.

Nixon agreed to see Goldwater on the following day. But he insisted that the top GOP congressional leaders accompany him. So Goldwater arrived with Sen. Hugh Scott, Pa., the minority leader, while Scott's House counterpart, Rep. John Rhodes, Ariz., came separately.

"There's not more than 15 senators for you," Goldwater said. Nixon asked the pipe-smoking Scott for his views. "I think 12 to 15," said Scott, who had once had defended Nixon on the basis of a doctored Watergate transcript that had been shown to him privately....
Why did Nixon lose Republican support?
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Reporters wrote that it was the Watergate scandal and the strong likelihood of his impeachment by the House and his conviction by the Senate that prompted him to quit.
Today it's not clear that the Republicans would desert thump even if he were convicted of shooting someone on Fifth Avenue.
  #2635  
Old 02-18-2018, 09:37 PM
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There was also the time he made a speech encouraging children to study hard and stay in school. There's no comparison, really. MAGA!!
To quote Xander from BtVS: "That bastard!"

You mean like the speech Trump gave to Boy Scouts encouraging to mistrust the press and recounting stories of, well, it was just strange. Man, that feels so long ago. It has been a LONG year.

Last edited by BeepKillBeep; 02-18-2018 at 09:40 PM.
  #2636  
Old 02-18-2018, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by ThelmaLou View Post
The thing is, when Nixon finally went, it was the Republicans who told him he had to go.

When the GOP Torpedoed NixonWhy did Nixon lose Republican support? Today it's not clear that the Republicans would desert thump even if he were convicted of shooting someone on Fifth Avenue.
What makes you think he would be convicted?
  #2637  
Old 02-18-2018, 09:47 PM
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"Former Trump aid to plead guilty"
Remember when that shit was happening all the time, or even once, when Obama was President? Neither do I. Fuck you, Republicans, all of you. Fuck right the fuck off.
Relevant Cracked.com "Here's Some News" video from November 2017: Weird How Everyone President Trump Knows Does Crimes
  #2638  
Old 02-18-2018, 09:48 PM
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Originally Posted by ThelmaLou View Post
The thing is, when Nixon finally went, it was the Republicans who told him he had to go.

When the GOP Torpedoed NixonWhy did Nixon lose Republican support? Today it's not clear that the Republicans would desert thump even if he were convicted of shooting someone on Fifth Avenue.
They would definitely be concerned and would criticize the President's actions as "unhelpful". What more could they possibly do?

Last edited by Defensive Indifference; 02-18-2018 at 09:48 PM.
  #2639  
Old 02-19-2018, 01:09 AM
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Originally Posted by BeepKillBeep View Post
No but I do remember the tan suit. Same thing really. Also the mustard was a clear reveal of Obama's anti-americanism.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
And how can anyone forget Obama putting his feet up on the Resolute desk?!!?? Impeachment grounds right there!
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  #2640  
Old 02-19-2018, 01:12 AM
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Originally Posted by running coach View Post
What makes you think he would be convicted?
New Yorker jury.
  #2641  
Old 02-19-2018, 01:20 AM
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Originally Posted by EddyTeddyFreddy View Post
New Yorker jury.
they'd convict him for ordering his steaks well done
  #2642  
Old 02-19-2018, 01:40 AM
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they'd convict him for ordering his steaks well done
Death penalty for the ketchup.
  #2643  
Old 02-19-2018, 02:59 AM
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Originally Posted by EddyTeddyFreddy View Post
New Yorker jury.
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Originally Posted by Batano View Post
they'd convict him for ordering his steaks well done
Quote:
Originally Posted by EddyTeddyFreddy View Post
Death penalty for the ketchup.
What jury, straight to the hangin' tree for eating pizza with a fork!

CMC fnord!
  #2644  
Old 02-19-2018, 03:08 AM
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they'd convict him for ordering his steaks well done
He'll be dancing to the Porterhouse Rock.
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  #2645  
Old 02-19-2018, 05:48 AM
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Aaaaaaand it's official - Newsflash: Russians meddled in U.S. election!

Wonder how much these "Results and Outcomes" cost taxpayers?

Now we return to your regularly scheduled Liberal-Democrat circle jerk...
So, just to clarify, you think the Russian meddling was such an obvious fact that no one should be at all surprised at this verification? That a person might even be worthy of mockery if they had not seen how obvious it was? And that the investigation to uncover the extent and impact of this conspiracy has been somewhat excessive?

Cause I seem to recall that Trump fired the man originally entrusted with investigating this threat to US security and stability, claiming it was all a hoax.


If this is a circle-jerk, why do you insist on crawling into the middle of it?
  #2646  
Old 02-19-2018, 06:19 AM
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So, just to clarify, you think the Russian meddling was such an obvious fact that no one should be at all surprised at this verification? That a person might even be worthy of mockery if they had not seen how obvious it was? And that the investigation to uncover the extent and impact of this conspiracy has been somewhat excessive?
As often happens in political threads, I turn to the great British TV series Yes, Minister:
Quote:
Bernard Woolley: What if the Prime Minister insists we help them?

Sir Humphrey Appleby: Then we follow the four-stage strategy.

Bernard Woolley: What's that?

Sir Richard Wharton: Standard Foreign Office response in a time of crisis.

Sir Richard Wharton: In stage one we say nothing is going to happen.

Sir Humphrey Appleby: Stage two, we say something may be about to happen, but we should do nothing about it.

Sir Richard Wharton: In stage three, we say that maybe we should do something about it, but there's nothing we *can* do.

Sir Humphrey Appleby: Stage four, we say maybe there was something we could have done, but it's too late now.
Welcome to stage four, everyone.
  #2647  
Old 02-19-2018, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by EddyTeddyFreddy View Post
And how can anyone forget Obama putting his feet up on the Resolute desk?!!?? Impeachment grounds right there!
Impeachment? Not enough. Bring out the firing squad!
  #2648  
Old 02-19-2018, 08:19 AM
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And people say these guys don't have a sense of humor! That's some wit, right there! OK, maybe about half, but its a start!
  #2649  
Old 02-19-2018, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Not Carlson View Post
So, just to clarify, you think the Russian meddling was such an obvious fact that no one should be at all surprised at this verification? That a person might even be worthy of mockery if they had not seen how obvious it was? And that the investigation to uncover the extent and impact of this conspiracy has been somewhat excessive?

Cause I seem to recall that Trump fired the man originally entrusted with investigating this threat to US security and stability, claiming it was all a hoax.


If this is a circle-jerk, why do you insist on crawling into the middle of it?
It's been a rough few days for Benny, and things aren't looking up. Don't take it personally when he lashes out. With time, he'll be back to his old loveable self.
  #2650  
Old 02-19-2018, 09:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Not Carlson View Post
If this is a circle-jerk, why do you insist on crawling into the middle of it?
Somebody likes being the cookie, I guess.
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