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  #7001  
Old 05-03-2016, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Damuri Ajashi View Post
We have had a federal registry on NFA firearms for over 80 years and we have had some liberal administrations between then and now and somehow people on that registry have been able to keep their guns.
Not sure what point you are making to me, but I don't believe any amount of registration would lead to confiscation later.
  #7002  
Old 05-03-2016, 08:14 PM
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Oh but it does help keep track of those things.

If your gun is stolen, you have to report your gun stolen.

If your gun is registered you have to report any sale otherwise the cops might have some questions for you when the gun you illegally sold to some criminal shows up at a crime scene somewhere.
If I illegally buy a gun on the street or if I steal a gun, then no, it doesn't.
  #7003  
Old 05-04-2016, 02:20 PM
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Pardon me for being lame, but this entire fucking thread is my cite. 6998 posts in 39 months. How goddam much more do you want?
I don't think you know how cites work.

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Very rarely, I contend. Almost every other means is better most of the time.
Of course its very rare. But when you need a gun you really need a gun there are very few substitutes that would suffice in some situations.

Last edited by Damuri Ajashi; 05-04-2016 at 02:21 PM.
  #7004  
Old 05-04-2016, 02:23 PM
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Not sure what point you are making to me, but I don't believe any amount of registration would lead to confiscation later.
I was pointing out that we don't need to speculate about what the government would do if it got its hands on a registry. We have an example of a federal registry and the federal government has never tried to confiscate those guns. I mean if you were going to confiscate guns, wouldn't you start with the machine guns?
  #7005  
Old 05-04-2016, 02:39 PM
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I may be mis-remembering, but wasn't there a registry of assault rifles in one of the New England states (CT?) that was later used to implement a ban?
  #7006  
Old 05-04-2016, 02:46 PM
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I may be mis-remembering, but wasn't there a registry of assault rifles in one of the New England states (CT?) that was later used to implement a ban?
Just asking questions?
  #7007  
Old 05-04-2016, 03:05 PM
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I may be mis-remembering, but wasn't there a registry of assault rifles in one of the New England states (CT?) that was later used to implement a ban?
Yes, you are misremembering. The ban was put in place. Assault weapons may not be sold in NY and CT. Those who already have them may keep them if they register them. Presumably, that means that anyone found to be in possession of au unregistered assault weapon will be in violation and will have that weapon confiscated.
  #7008  
Old 05-04-2016, 03:09 PM
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So basically ... non-registration leads to confiscation. Chrissakes, the gun-clutchers can't catch a break can they?
  #7009  
Old 05-04-2016, 03:39 PM
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Only if the authorities actually find out you have one.
  #7010  
Old 05-04-2016, 03:43 PM
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If I illegally buy a gun on the street or if I steal a gun, then no, it doesn't.
The vast majority of guns "on the street" start off as guns legally purchased from an FFL.* Registration helps us keep track of these legally purchased guns and over a period of time would restrict the flow of these legally purchased registered guns into the hands of criminals. It would become more and more difficult for criminals to get their hands on guns and the flow of guns into criminal hands would be slower than the flow of guns out of criminal hands and would eventually lead to an equilibrium level (of criminals with guns) well below today. Its probably a bit slower and less effective than a total ban on guns but this method correctly puts the squeeze on criminals and not law abiding citizens. That's the theory at least.

*There are some guns smuggled in from places like Brazil and the Philippines but the vast majority of them were legally purchased at some point.
  #7011  
Old 05-04-2016, 03:53 PM
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I may be mis-remembering, but wasn't there a registry of assault rifles in one of the New England states (CT?) that was later used to implement a ban?
States do all sorts of crazy shit. California has used registries for confiscation after a ban. And if the Senate and House of the United States starts to look like the California general assembly then the presence or absence of a registry is not going to make much difference. But I can't name 30 states that would elect senators that would vote to confiscate guns. Heck I don't think I can name 20 states that would do that.

Well before you get to confiscation the political environment for registration will already have occurred and that registration will not be designed to protect the rights of gun owners with HIPAA type protections or come with a national carry license or pre-emption of state and local laws. I think you can craft a handgun registration law that would provide more freedom to law abiding citizens while restricting access to criminals.

OTOH, its not like the gun control side is open to the idea of a national gun license or pre-emption of state and local gun laws. They want the registry without any compromise from their side.
  #7012  
Old 05-04-2016, 04:58 PM
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OTOH, its not like the gun control side is open to the idea of a national gun license or pre-emption of state and local gun laws. They want the registry without any compromise from their side.
Well, you can't blame them, can you? All gun owners want to overthrow the government. All of them.
  #7013  
Old 05-05-2016, 10:52 AM
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Well, you can't blame them, can you? All gun owners want to overthrow the government. All of them.
OK, so obviously you think I am overgeneralizing. So tell me which gun control advocates are willing to preempt all state and local gun laws and a national carry license in exchange for a national registry?

And failing that, what exactly is the gun control side willing to compromise on in exchange for a national registry?

Because as far as I can tell the compromise is that they won't ask for anything else... ... for now.

That is a pretty shitty compromise for the gun control side giving up something that many of its members consider pretty fucking horrible.
  #7014  
Old 05-05-2016, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Damuri Ajashi View Post
OK, so obviously you think I am overgeneralizing. So tell me which gun control advocates are willing to preempt all state and local gun laws and a national carry license in exchange for a national registry?

And failing that, what exactly is the gun control side willing to compromise on in exchange for a national registry?

Because as far as I can tell the compromise is that they won't ask for anything else... ... for now.

That is a pretty shitty compromise for the gun control side giving up something that many of its members consider pretty fucking horrible.
What is your obsession with a national registry? I mean, since gundamentalists like to analogize guns with cars, why not envision an analogous form of registration? There is no "national registry" of cars, but in this day and age, when a guy from Maine who gets in trouble in Arizona, the car gets identified in very short order.

IOW, state-based registration with interchange would serve the function without being a tyrannical national registry.
  #7015  
Old 05-09-2016, 07:17 PM
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Responsible gun owner shoots a gun through a bathroom door because the guy in it was taking too long.
  #7016  
Old 05-09-2016, 08:05 PM
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Gun owner loses all common sense when drunk, commits felony with gun. So, as they should, authorities come down on him with lead boots.
  #7017  
Old 05-09-2016, 08:07 PM
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Gun owner loses all common sense when drunk
Tell us what the real problem is here.
  #7018  
Old 05-09-2016, 10:31 PM
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Tell us what the real problem is here.
No doubt you understand exactly how he felt. He was having a bad day and now look.
  #7019  
Old 05-10-2016, 02:36 AM
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One of those guns that recognizes only its owner wouldn't work in the drunk case. Perhaps a built-in breathalyzer - "just exhale forcefully into the barrel".
  #7020  
Old 05-10-2016, 03:16 AM
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Gun owner loses all common sense when drunk, commits felony with gun. So, as they should, authorities come down on him with lead boots.
The guy inside is still alive through dumb luck. Would you brush it off so easily if he'd been killed?

Also, you forgot to say "responsible" gun owner loses all common sense when drunk. That's what he was before he lost his shit, right? He had a legal permit and everything. I doubt he got a brain transplant with a different personality that made him shoot through the door.
  #7021  
Old 05-10-2016, 07:08 AM
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Gun owner loses all common sense when drunk, commits felony with gun.
Yeah, because if he didn't have a gun, no telling what might have happened. He might even have drunk dialed his ex.
  #7022  
Old 05-10-2016, 07:52 AM
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Also, you forgot to say "responsible" gun owner loses all common sense when drunk.
"Law-abiding", too.
  #7023  
Old 05-10-2016, 07:56 AM
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He was having a bad day and now look.
His "bad day" means nothing compared to the bad day of a guy who nearly got killed by a human being with normal levels of self-control, including the willingness to get drunk on occasion (something I expect you yourself know well), who had the means to act on his reduced impulse control.

IOW, you haven't identified the real problem yet, although I do think you subsconsciously recognize it in yourself, as your constant references to having bad days attest. Now try a little harder and see where that realization gets you.
  #7024  
Old 05-10-2016, 12:20 PM
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One of those guns that recognizes only its owner wouldn't work in the drunk case. Perhaps a built-in breathalyzer - "just exhale forcefully into the barrel".
The muzzle-breathalyzer-lock would not be activated until after you disengage the safety.
  #7025  
Old 05-10-2016, 12:54 PM
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What is your obsession with a national registry? I mean, since gundamentalists like to analogize guns with cars, why not envision an analogous form of registration? There is no "national registry" of cars, but in this day and age, when a guy from Maine who gets in trouble in Arizona, the car gets identified in very short order.

IOW, state-based registration with interchange would serve the function without being a tyrannical national registry.
We have 50 states that require car registration. What do you think the odds are of getting gun registration in 50 states without a federal mandate?

And why is a federal registry any more tyrannical than 50 state registries
  #7026  
Old 05-10-2016, 12:58 PM
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My favorite entries in this thread are, far and away, the ones where the antis (who are all about not wanting people killed, they keep telling us) start wishing harm or death on gun owners. These are largely the same people who will pule and moan in other threads over the death of a burglar because "we don't have the death penalty for burglary." I love it when you show your true beliefs as it reinforces that compromising with you has no good end.
  #7027  
Old 05-10-2016, 01:02 PM
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The guy inside is still alive through dumb luck. Would you brush it off so easily if he'd been killed?

Also, you forgot to say "responsible" gun owner loses all common sense when drunk. That's what he was before he lost his shit, right? He had a legal permit and everything. I doubt he got a brain transplant with a different personality that made him shoot through the door.
I don't know how "responsible" it is to get drunk while in possession of a firearm.

In fact its illegal in many places.

With that said, much like drunk driving, some people with guns still get drunk.
  #7028  
Old 05-10-2016, 05:59 PM
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So, in your view, at what point did this latest yahoo become no longer "law-abiding"? And what would you propose to do to prevent or limit the danger that such yahoos present to the rest of us?

Not seeing anything about that but the usual facile sermons from you, pard.
  #7029  
Old 05-10-2016, 10:39 PM
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So, in your view, at what point did this latest yahoo become no longer "law-abiding"? And what would you propose to do to prevent or limit the danger that such yahoos present to the rest of us?

Not seeing anything about that but the usual facile sermons from you, pard.
We could stop the rape epidemic by preemptively castrating men, because every rapist was originally a law-abiding citizen until they committed their first rape. A human being with normal levels of self-control, including the willingness to get drunk on occasion, who had the means to act on his reduced impulse control. I nominate ElvisL1ves for the pilot program.
  #7030  
Old 05-11-2016, 06:48 AM
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You don't have a serious answer, do you? It's a serious problem, and you need to think about it for a change.

It's telling that you equate being unarmed with being castrated. Not surprising, no, but telling anyway.
  #7031  
Old 05-11-2016, 10:57 AM
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You don't have a serious answer, do you? It's a serious problem, and you need to think about it for a change.

It's telling that you equate being unarmed with being castrated. Not surprising, no, but telling anyway.
OK, I'll try to spell it out in short simple words that even you might understand.

What you're proposing- severely limiting what weapons people can own- is what's legally called prior restraint: someone hasn't done anything wrong, but they might and therefore they can't be trusted. Your position, as amply attested to in multiple threads on this board, is that the vast majority of people shouldn't be trusted with firearms to begin with, and that the misuse of them justifies eliminating the legal right of people who've never done anything wrong to own them. In other words, that civil society is to be based on a degree of helplessness: not that people should be taught right from wrong, expected to take responsibility for their actions, and punished when they harm others, but that they must be depowered to limit how much harm they could do.

My castration example was facetious but logically identical to the arguments made for gun control. Think about it.
  #7032  
Old 05-11-2016, 11:41 AM
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[QUOTE=Lumpy;19322765]OK, I'll try to spell it out in short simple words that even you might understand.

What you're proposing- severely limiting what weapons people can own- is what's legally called prior restraint: someone hasn't done anything wrong, but they might and therefore they can't be trusted. Your position, as amply attested to in multiple threads on this board, is that the vast majority of people shouldn't be trusted with firearms to begin with, and that the misuse of them justifies eliminating the legal right of people who've never done anything wrong to own them. In other words, that civil society is to be based on a degree of helplessness: not that people should be taught right from wrong, expected to take responsibility for their actions, and punished when they harm others, but that they must be depowered to limit how much harm they could do.

My castration example was facetious but logically identical to the arguments made for gun control. Think about it./QUOTE]

You know you're talking to Elvis, right? He's the guy that other gun control folks think is too stupid to be on their side.
  #7033  
Old 05-11-2016, 10:20 PM
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I don't know how "responsible" it is to get drunk while in possession of a firearm.

In fact its illegal in many places.

With that said, much like drunk driving, some people with guns still get drunk.
Half marks for getting half the point.

Was he a responsible gun owner before he got drunk?
  #7034  
Old 05-11-2016, 10:39 PM
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Here's the latest stupid gun news: Young girl finds gun under pillow and kills self .

According to the initial investigation, police say the girl found the gun in an upstairs bedroom and shot herself while the grandmother was downstairs. Police say two other young children, ages 1 and 3, also were upstairs at the time. They weren't injured.
  #7035  
Old 05-12-2016, 12:58 AM
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The Tooth Fairy's not messing around.
  #7036  
Old 05-12-2016, 01:28 AM
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I'm not worried. I still have my trusty Potato Gun
And I have my pea shooter.
  #7037  
Old 05-12-2016, 01:33 AM
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One gun for sale. Auction starts tomorrow. Guess the seller.
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The firearm for sale is the firearm that was used to defend my life and end the brutal attack from Trayvon Martin on 2/26/2012. The gun is a Kel-Tec PF-9 9mm. It has recently been returned to me by the Department of Justice. The pistol currently has the case number written on it in silver permanent marker. Many have expressed interest in owning and displaying the firearm including The Smithsonian Museum in Washington D.C. This is a piece of American History. It has been featured in several publications and in current University text books. Offers to purchase the Firearm have been received; however, the offers were to use the gun in a fashion I did not feel comfortable with. The firearm is fully functional as the attempts by the Department of Justice on behalf of B. Hussein Obama to render the firearm inoperable were thwarted by my phenomenal Defense Attorney.
  #7038  
Old 05-12-2016, 04:59 AM
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Oh George, you fucking wanker.
  #7039  
Old 05-12-2016, 07:12 AM
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You know you're talking to Elvis, right? He's the guy that other gun control folks think is too stupid to be on their side.
Which is how you should probably view Lumpy, but maybe the gap between you isn't large.
  #7040  
Old 05-12-2016, 07:17 AM
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What you're proposing- severely limiting what weapons people can own- is what's legally called prior restraint.
And it's something that is widely used in many other areas, for very good reason. But guns are holy and exempt from conventional reality.

You were asked what you would propose. You have nothing. But you don't have the integrity to admit it. All you can do is deflect.

Quote:
My castration example was facetious but logically identical to the arguments made for gun control. Think about it.
You now say it's facetious, but it's the first thing you could think of. Now think about it some more: Who is at risk from your balls and your own imperfect ability to control them? We already know about Scumpup and toddlers, so maybe there's a point there, but I don't think even you would claim it's "logically equivalent".

Damuri also once again has no answer to a serious issue about saving lives other than to deride the question and questioner. He too has demonstrated a basic incapability of understanding the most basic principle of society - Thou Shalt Not Kill.

One cannot reach the mentally ill, such as any of you, by pure reason, no, but it's still necessary to get you to realize that you are ill.
  #7041  
Old 05-12-2016, 07:38 AM
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One gun for sale. Auction starts tomorrow. Guess the seller.
Am I reading this right? The bidding starts at $5000?
  #7042  
Old 05-12-2016, 08:11 AM
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Am I reading this right? The bidding starts at $5000?
Hey, it's "an American Firearm Icon."

Think how nice it will look mounted on your wall next to the gun that killed MLK and OJ's knife!
  #7043  
Old 05-12-2016, 11:07 AM
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And the auction has been pulled with no explanation.
  #7044  
Old 05-12-2016, 03:46 PM
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And it's something that is widely used in many other areas, for very good reason. But guns are holy and exempt from conventional reality.
Just for laughs, give us some examples.

Quote:
You were asked what you would propose. You have nothing. But you don't have the integrity to admit it. All you can do is deflect.
My proposal is one you've repeatedly rejected out of hand: more people being armed for self-defense

Quote:
Who is at risk from your balls and your own imperfect ability to control them?
No one- exactly like my gun. But like a radical lesbian who denounces all men as rape monsters, you refuse to believe in gun owners' restraint and judgment.[/quote]

Quote:
the most basic principle of society - Thou Shalt Not Kill.
Very true; but when someone else breaks that principle and the choice is either I die or they die, I prefer for charity to begin at home.

Quote:
One cannot reach the mentally ill, such as any of you, by pure reason, no, but it's still necessary to get you to realize that you are ill.
I would scoff at your hyperbole, but unfortunately there actually are people so "progressive" that they would ideologically redefine the conservative mindset as mental illness, like was done in the Soviet Union.
  #7045  
Old 05-12-2016, 04:09 PM
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B. Hussein Obama, huh?
  #7046  
Old 05-12-2016, 04:29 PM
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So the Zimmerman gun auction has been moved to another site, but apparently the number of people trying to reach it has crashed their site. Unless it was an attack.
  #7047  
Old 05-12-2016, 04:42 PM
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So the Zimmerman gun auction has been moved to another site, but apparently the number of people trying to reach it has crashed their site. Unless it was an attack.
I hope the gun can stand its ground.
  #7048  
Old 05-12-2016, 04:46 PM
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So the Zimmerman gun auction has been moved to another site, but apparently the number of people trying to reach it has crashed their site. Unless it was an attack.
What other site? Where did you hear this?
  #7049  
Old 05-12-2016, 05:39 PM
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What other site? Where did you hear this?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ids-5-000.html
  #7050  
Old 05-12-2016, 05:49 PM
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And the second site appears to be unreachable now. Zimmerman's gun will probably be endlessly stalked by DDoS attacks as soon as the hosting site is announced.
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