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  #1  
Old 05-23-2015, 10:21 PM
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aceplace57, what the fuck is wrong with you?


Maybe I'm overreacting a little, but your comments in the thread about Josh Duggar are absolutely disgusting:


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Originally Posted by aceplace57 View Post
Josh was a young teen when this occurred. The father reported it to the police. Since then Josh has had no further known issues.

Its pretty silly to label a young teen a pedo for being curious about girls. What he did was wrong and illegal. But it in no way reflects on his behavior as an adult. He was a curious and horny teen with hormones running wild. Just like any other horny young boy who gets his first erection. Their dick gets hard when the wind blows.

He lived in a huge family. He would have been caught if he had gone into their bedrooms and continued touching the girls. AFAIK theres been no further incidents since it was reported to the police.

TLC must have known.

So apparently, Josh was just a young teen who was horny, not a predator! I mean, I guess he could have resorted to Rosie Palm, but hey, all those girls in the family, why not? And hey, they did go to the police, right? (Except, not.)



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Originally Posted by aceplace57 View Post
I'll show you mine if you show me yours was a common childhood game. Kids are inquisitive. Puberty stirs up a lot of mixed up feelings.

It's true most young boys don't fondle their sisters. But it does happen. Thankfully in most cases that's all there is too it. Parents have to use their best judgement in correcting the problem.

I can't believe people can't see the difference in a young boy going through puberty and a sexually deviant adult. The whole point of parenting is to instruct and correct behavior. So that their kids grow up to be responsible adults.

Are people suggesting a young boy is already beyond help? Lets label a kid a pedo?
I know, we all played doctor when we were fourteen with five-year-olds. It's natural!

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Originally Posted by aceplace57 View Post
I don't know for certain that Josh hasn't touched a kid since he was caught and talked to the State police. But, so far there's no indication that he has done anything but live an upstanding life as an adult.

Yep, he's a real prince:

Quote:
That’s not the only whiff of hypocrisy emanating from the repugnant story. Until Friday, Josh represented the Family Research Council, which claimed in a 1999 publication that “one of the primary goals of the homosexual rights movement is to abolish all age of consent laws and to eventually recognize pedophiles as the ‘prophets’ of a new sexual order,” according to the Southern Poverty Law Center.
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Exercising personal religious beliefs does not make someone a bad person. These days it takes quite a bit of courage to openly endorse fundamental religious beliefs that have been held true for over two thousand years.

I don't agree with much of what the Duggars follow. My wife and I sought out and attend a moderate church. Our congregation and deacons wouldn't hire an ultra conservative pastor. But, I do respect people in religions that I don't follow.
Yeah, you gotta have respect for a religious bigot who thinks it's okay to discriminate against gays and women. Because, you know, that takes courage.



Go sit on a cactus, ace.
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  #2  
Old 05-24-2015, 12:06 AM
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Oh, and BTW, Christian fundamentalism is NOT two-thousand years old. It's only a little over one-hundred years old.
  #3  
Old 05-24-2015, 01:17 AM
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Ace is the place for the helpful....shit, little help here?
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Old 05-24-2015, 08:31 AM
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Ace is the place for the helpful....shit, little help here?
Hard teen man?
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Old 05-24-2015, 08:50 AM
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Ace is the place for the helpful....shit, little help here?
57 flavors?
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Old 05-24-2015, 09:53 AM
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Ace is the place for the helpful....shit, little help here?
Helpful hardon man?
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Old 05-25-2015, 03:58 AM
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Oh, and BTW, Christian fundamentalism is NOT two-thousand years old. It's only a little over one-hundred years old.
Yeah, but it was a reaction to the theological liberalism that had been developing throughout the Enlightenment. Up until the 1700s, pretty much all organized Christianity, whether it be Catholic, Orthodox, or Protestant, leaned fundamentalist.
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Old 07-14-2017, 07:43 PM
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Oh, and BTW, Christian fundamentalism is NOT two-thousand years old. It's only a little over one-hundred years old.
It was "invented" in this country, during the mid to late 1800's.
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Old 07-02-2018, 10:17 PM
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Oh, and BTW, Christian fundamentalism is NOT two-thousand years old. It's only a little over one-hundred years old.
This. It is a bunch of bullshit, a British and American phoney "theology", invented in the late 19th and early 20th centuries.
  #10  
Old 05-24-2015, 02:17 AM
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God, this has been a long time coming. Think he'll bother to show up?
  #11  
Old 05-24-2015, 02:22 AM
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I should probably tell him he's being Pitted.
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Old 05-24-2015, 11:02 AM
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Aceplace is making an unpopular assertion, big deal - people do that all the time. It's not an assertion I agree with; but if the assertion is totally misguided, there were no cites that I could see that anyone cared to share with the board relevant to that.

The Duggars and Josh's behavior and attitudes seem pretty skeevy to me - but I don't see Aceplace really doing anything wrong other than having an unpopular opinion.
  #13  
Old 05-24-2015, 11:08 AM
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The Duggars and Josh's behavior and attitudes seem pretty skeevy to me - but I don't see Aceplace really doing anything wrong other than having an unpopular opinion.
Fondling a five year old goes way beyond skeevy.
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Old 05-24-2015, 11:17 AM
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Fondling a five year old goes way beyond skeevy.
I agree with that - I'm as grossed out sickened by this as anyone.

My point is that as far as I can tell Aceplace is defending sickening behavior, but is that in and of itself wrong? Maybe it is, but the Dope generally is a place where these issues can be discussed in a critical manner; Aceplace does not seem to be going against board norms in his posting, he is just taking a very unpopular view.

Is taking an unpopular view and trying to explore it and defend in a logical way a truly pit worthy offense? Perhaps it is, perhaps not YMMV.
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Old 05-24-2015, 11:59 AM
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My point is that as far as I can tell Aceplace is defending sickening behavior, but is that in and of itself wrong?
Yes, it is.
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Old 05-24-2015, 03:05 PM
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My point is that as far as I can tell Aceplace is defending sickening behavior, but is that in and of itself wrong? Maybe it is, but the Dope generally is a place where these issues can be discussed in a critical manner; Aceplace does not seem to be going against board norms in his posting, he is just taking a very unpopular view.
Even if that were true, it's just one addition to a posting record that marks aceplace57 as one of the biggest fucking mouth-breathing morons on this board. The guy is a walking testament to ignorance and stupidity.

While ralph124c represents the faux-inquisitive New England version of clueless idiocy on this message board, aceplace57 is the slack-jawed backwoods Arkansas representative. If all of the ill-considered, stupid, badly researched, and poorly articulated threads started by these two separated-at-birth brain donors were removed from the database, it would probably speed up board performance by about fifty percent.
  #17  
Old 05-24-2015, 03:16 PM
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And that is my biggest problem with Aceplace57. It seems there is nothing he reads or watches that he does not thereupon start a thread about it. Often he casts these threads in the most extreme light (You could be arrested for taking a photo of Old Faithful this summer!) in order to get more bites from us billy goats.

Thank you, Guin, for bringing him to task for something so I could express this.

ETA: referencing mhendo's post.

Last edited by jimbuff314; 05-24-2015 at 03:17 PM.
  #18  
Old 05-24-2015, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Nylock View Post
I agree with that - I'm as grossed out sickened by this as anyone.

My point is that as far as I can tell Aceplace is defending sickening behavior, but is that in and of itself wrong? Maybe it is, but the Dope generally is a place where these issues can be discussed in a critical manner; Aceplace does not seem to be going against board norms in his posting, he is just taking a very unpopular view.

Is taking an unpopular view and trying to explore it and defend in a logical way a truly pit worthy offense? Perhaps it is, perhaps not YMMV.
Are you retarded?

This isn't just an "unpopular view". An unpopular view would be something like chocolate is gross, or kittens are ugly. This is a guy who said that someone molesting his own sisters is just a horny kid who couldn't help himself. That's not an "unpopular" opinion. That's just downright disturbing.

Not all "opinions" are worthy of being defended. Especially when they're coming from a guy with turds for brains like ace.

Last edited by Guinastasia; 05-24-2015 at 04:41 PM.
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Old 05-24-2015, 05:50 PM
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Not all "opinions" are worthy of being defended.
A Relevant PSA.
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Old 05-24-2015, 06:48 PM
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Are you retarded?
It's possible; I have not been tested in a while.

Quote:
Not all "opinions" are worthy of being defended. Especially when they're coming from a guy with turds for brains like ace.
In large part I can agree with that, but there is always this idea in my head that all opinions should be allowed a voice.

On the other hand - this isn't exactly the kind of thing I want go to the mat to defend. I don't really find aceplace's arguments compelling so far, and I don't find the behavior defensible; I think it is disgusting and twisted - I probably should have just stayed out of this debate.
  #21  
Old 05-24-2015, 08:37 PM
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Is taking an unpopular view and trying to explore it and defend in a logical way a truly pit worthy offense? Perhaps it is, perhaps not YMMV.
What the fuck is the pit for if not for shouting at people you disagree with? Jesus you're fucking dumb.
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Old 05-24-2015, 09:29 PM
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What the fuck is the pit for if not for shouting at people you disagree with? Jesus you're fucking dumb.
Sorry. I'll just go back to my usual types of threads I post in - I'm not really a pit kind of poster, it is true.

It may in fact be because I lack the intelligence required to engage in this high level type of discourse, I can accept that.

Last edited by Mr. Nylock; 05-24-2015 at 09:33 PM.
  #23  
Old 05-28-2015, 01:48 PM
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What the fuck is the pit for if not for shouting at people you disagree with? Jesus you're fucking dumb.
I don't think he's Jesus.
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Old 05-24-2015, 11:12 AM
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Good gawd Ace. Josh is a dumb fuck under any definition of the word. I wouldn't trust him around an elementary school if he had a platoon of FBI agents watching him.
  #25  
Old 05-24-2015, 11:51 AM
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The Duggars and Josh's behavior and attitudes seem pretty skeevy to me - but I don't see Aceplace really doing anything wrong other than having an unpopular opinion.
Well, handwaving away a teenage kid fondling his sisters while they slept as a benign case of "you show me yours I'll show you mine" between innocent kids could be construed, by some of our overly sensitive, bleeding heart readers as severely fucking fucked up.
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Old 05-24-2015, 12:00 PM
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Ace never even pinged my radar until about a year ago, but since then everything he posts is either stupdi, creepy, or straight out of right-wing radio.
  #27  
Old 05-24-2015, 12:07 PM
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Ace never even pinged my radar until about a year ago, but since then everything he posts is either stupdi, creepy, or straight out of right-wing radio.
And often two out of three.
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Old 05-24-2015, 03:16 PM
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Ace never even pinged my radar until about a year ago, but since then everything he posts is either stupdi, creepy, or straight out of right-wing radio.
I feel the same way. When I first took note of him, I remember thinking he seemed pretty cool, if a bit old-fashioned. Then, all of the sudden, everything he posted was outrageously bigoted and moronic. When I became aware of the new pattern, I actually felt disgusted with myself for ever thinking he was okay.
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Old 05-24-2015, 12:02 PM
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Unpopular opinions are pitted all the time around here. This board has never been tolerant of all ideas, thoughts, and opinions equally. No one is saying ace should get banned over his opinion, fer cryin' out loud.
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Old 05-24-2015, 11:21 AM
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I just hope Ace's sister turned out OK.
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Old 05-24-2015, 12:10 PM
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The most frustrating part is that he remained stubbornly ignorant of the facts throughout much of the thread. He didn't seem to comprehend that it was five victims, not just one. He kept characterizing it as a stupid mistake instead of an obvious pattern of abuse. He had no clue that the Duggars homeschool their kids or that the "counseling" Josh and his victims received was faith-based, victim blaming, and based on the teachings of a guy accused of sexually harassing many different women himself. I wondered whether ace was even reading the thread.

Last edited by SaharaTea; 05-24-2015 at 12:14 PM.
  #32  
Old 05-24-2015, 01:02 PM
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I wondered whether ace was even reading the thread.
He never seems to respond to anything in threads just throws out his ignorant opinion. Clearly he reads some part of the threads as it's not completely random where he replies. I wish he'd actually engage in some way.
  #33  
Old 05-24-2015, 01:03 PM
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He never seems to respond to anything in threads just throws out his ignorant opinion. Clearly he reads some part of the threads as it's not completely random where he replies. I wish he'd actually engage in some way.
Be careful what you wish for.
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Old 05-24-2015, 03:30 PM
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It's lack of critical thinking skills. He sees some inflammatory headline, doesn't really comprehend what he's reading, makes the most ass backwards assumptions and then posts it. I know he wasn't the one who started the thread about the black actress who'd been filmed walking down the street being cat called and summarily called her a pejorative in the title (like calling her a prostitute when that couldn't be further from the truth), ignoring all the evidence to the contrary, but that's exactly what he's like.

Then when it's pointed out that he's a million miles off base from his supposition, he doubled down on the stupid. Refusing to really address the meat of the matter, like shown above, and instead focusing on whatever the voices in his head are telling him that doesn't reflect reality one iota. And after he's completely shit up a thread with his mixture of bigoted inanity, disappears and just starts another one with the same MO. It's ridiculous.
  #35  
Old 05-24-2015, 04:26 PM
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I remember a thread in which he posted about the police "protecting" the Selma marchers. As if protection came to mean spraying them with firehoses and beating them with billy clubs.

How you can live in the South and not know this history is beyond me.
  #36  
Old 05-24-2015, 09:07 PM
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I remember a thread in which he posted about the police "protecting" the Selma marchers. As if protection came to mean spraying them with firehoses and beating them with billy clubs.

How you can live in the South and not know this history is beyond me.
Wasn't this the guy who thought that MLK did things the right way by getting permits for his marches, so the cops couldn't bother him? I remember telling some guy that MLK was actually arrested like 50 times and they seemed actually surprised.
  #37  
Old 05-25-2015, 11:06 AM
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Wasn't this the guy who thought that MLK did things the right way by getting permits for his marches, so the cops couldn't bother him? I remember telling some guy that MLK was actually arrested like 50 times and they seemed actually surprised.
To be fair, I know a lot about King--I've read his entire "Letter from a Birmingham Permit Office"--and didn't know that.

The idea of sealing juvenile records is not a terrible thing. but there's some things to think about with that:

1) Someone that did this as a kid, if they've not already been prosecuted, probably should not be prosecuted. That does NOT mean that they should be held up as a paragon of sexual virtue.
2) The case appears never to have been investigated; the girls never appear to have received appropriate counseling. IF this is true (and no, Bricker, I don't have absolute evidence it's true), then airing the case publicly might provide them with a chance to hear people saying: no, it wasn't your fault. No, it wasn't okay. Yes, you are allowed to be furious with your brother.
3) While JOsh's actions were horrifying, there is the meager excuse of his being a juvenile, for whatever that's worth. HIS PARENTS HAVE NO SUCH EXCUSE. A lot of this story is focusing on the completely terrible way his parents handled the case. And it's a too too common approach: when sexual abuse happens in a family, parents will punt by blaming the victim, by downplaying the seriousness, by sweeping things under the rug. This public conversation is helpful in part because it may dissuade other parents from taking this approach--but only if people don't wring their hands in sympathy for the goddamned parents.
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Old 05-25-2015, 11:30 AM
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This public conversation is helpful in part because it may dissuade other parents from taking this approach--but only if people don't wring their hands in sympathy for the goddamned parents.
Hell yes!

I think it will also enlightened a lot of clueless people out there who don't see the big deal, because 1) either they were groped by an older sibling and turned out okay or 2) they were the one doing the groping and they aren't Satan incarnate. Perhaps hearing the public's reactions to this story will make these people realize that abuse is abuse, it's not normal, and it's not okay.

I also hope it makes people more skeptical about the role models they choose to put up on pedestals. Everyone needs to stop getting their "family values" from people on TV.
  #39  
Old 05-25-2015, 11:54 AM
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To be fair, I know a lot about King--I've read his entire "Letter from a Birmingham Permit Office"--and didn't know that.
Very well done.

I found ace's version of how the civil rights protests went down. What's really interesting is that he contrasted the orderliness and peacefulness of the protests in Selma and Montgomery with the out-of-control and reckless behavior by five players on the St Louis Rams who walked into the football field with their hands up, shortly after the unrest began in Ferguson last year.

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/...0&postcount=61
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Old 05-24-2015, 08:18 PM
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Explains the touring company production of Hair. Nothing else does.
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Old 05-25-2015, 12:33 AM
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The Borgias had family values. So did the Romanovs, the Tudors. At its base, family values are little more uplifting than the Darwinism of the preying mantis or the fruit fly.
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Old 05-25-2015, 01:04 AM
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In Acey's defense, the guy is retarded. Like, legitimately. So the guy's actually doing pretty well from a functional standpoint, all things considered. Cut the poor guy some slack. He's trying.
  #43  
Old 05-25-2015, 02:34 AM
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In Acey's defense, the guy is retarded. Like, legitimately. So the guy's actually doing pretty well from a functional standpoint, all things considered. Cut the poor guy some slack. He's trying.
I don't remember him ever saying such a thing. He's just a gullible idiot who gets all of his news from The Daily Mail.
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Old 05-25-2015, 09:41 PM
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I don't remember him ever saying such a thing. He's just a gullible idiot who gets all of his news from The Daily Mail.
LOL.
  #45  
Old 05-25-2015, 05:08 AM
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I see my comments about Josh Duggar drew some heated attention.

I feel very strongly that what a juvenile does is wiped clean when they become an adult. It's a basic concept of the juvenile courts that all records are sealed. Giving the person a fresh start in life. I know Josh didn't get prosecuted. He should have been, and then the juvenile court judge could have ordered long term therapy for Josh, and professional counseling for the victims. But thats old water under the bridge. The statue of limitations has long ago expired. Dragging this incident up now is simply a way to destroy and permanently discredit him and the entire Duggar family because of their religious beliefs and political activism. It's also traumatizing his victims all over again. Forcing them to relive the horror of what happened twelve years ago. But no one cares about that. They simply want to blindly hate the adult man for something terrible he did as a young teen 12 years ago.

Enough. I know my opinion is unpopular. So be it. But lets be clear. I find what Josh did morally repugnant and sickening. I can only hope that he's not victimized anyone else. If evidence of any adult crime emerges than he should be imprisoned for a long time. But I won't join in and pile on the hate for Josh's troubled childhood unless evidence of any adult crimes emerge. If he's really a pedo or sexual predator there will be a long list of victims throughout the past 12 years.

I suggest reading some books on criminal rehabilitation. Society made the decision to shift away from vengeance based prison sentencing to a focus on rehabilitation and forgiveness. The juvenile courts and criminal rehabilitation programs are one of our country's biggest achievements in the early to mid 20th century. It wasn't done entirely from compassion or kindness. It's known that vengeance based, harsh prison sentences don't prevent recidivism. A new approach had to be found.

Here are two books I've read and found quite informative. There are others that I read many years ago. But these are two recent ones that I found informative. The Gideon book is a textbook and isn't light reading. I spent over a year working my way through it.

Balanced discussion on the successes and failures of criminal rehabilitation. The chapter on sexual offenders is very good.
Rethinking Corrections: Rehabilitation, Reentry, and Reintegration Lior Gideon and Hung-En Sung

This is a very good life story of a former career criminal. A fast read because its so fascinating.
Choose to do Right: A Proven Path to Criminal Rehabilitation by Andrew E Matson

Finally, the books that originally sparked my interest in rehabilitating juveniles back in my high school years. The story of gang leader Nicky Cruz is fascinating and it clearly shows how a troubled teen can reform and lead a responsible adult life.
Run Baby Run by Nicky Cruz
too get another perspective of his story... read
The Cross and the Switchblade David Wilkerson and Elizabeth Sherrill

Last edited by aceplace57; 05-25-2015 at 05:11 AM.
  #46  
Old 05-25-2015, 07:14 AM
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Nothing changes. Way to not respond to the criticism laid out before you.

I wonder if your just some type of right wing bot 5hat just responds to key words.
  #47  
Old 05-25-2015, 01:42 PM
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Nothing changes. Way to not respond to the criticism laid out before you.

I wonder if your just some type of right wing bot 5hat just responds to key words.
My position is not difficult to understand. I've made it clear that Duggar's actions were wrong. Thankfully it didn't go beyond groping and fondling. That's still disgusting and traumatic for the victims.

I believe strongly in second chances for children. I can't agree with destroying somebody's reputation for something they did many years ago in childhood. This isn't a new scandal for the family. It's something they all went through and dealt with long ago. It was reported to a state police officer and much later there was a formal police investigation in 2006. It's a private family matter that is now being exploited because people disagree with the Duggar's political activism.

Last edited by aceplace57; 05-25-2015 at 01:45 PM.
  #48  
Old 05-25-2015, 01:54 PM
LavenderBlue is offline
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NOTHING is private with the Duggars. Nothing. Why the hell should this be?

Dear god I spent years hearing about every stupid detail of Michelle Duggar's menstrual cycle and childbearing choices. The stupid bitch decides to go for child number nineteen and poor Josie's premature birth was all over the news for weeks. For years, many of us have been unable to open a newspaper, go online or even walk past a supermarket checkout line without seeing those dumb bastards smirk at us. For years, they've literally told us every single fucking thing. Every idiotic thought they have. Worse, they have spent the last ten years of their lives demanding we hold them up as moral exemplars. They've also spent that time hiding the abuse.

At the very least the authorities should be entitled to know if anything has happened since then and if efforts have been taken to prevent it from happening again.

Last edited by LavenderBlue; 05-25-2015 at 01:55 PM.
  #49  
Old 05-26-2015, 04:04 PM
control-z is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LavenderBlue View Post
NOTHING is private with the Duggars. Nothing. Why the hell should this be?

Dear god I spent years hearing about every stupid detail of Michelle Duggar's menstrual cycle and childbearing choices. The stupid bitch decides to go for child number nineteen and poor Josie's premature birth was all over the news for weeks. For years, many of us have been unable to open a newspaper, go online or even walk past a supermarket checkout line without seeing those dumb bastards smirk at us. For years, they've literally told us every single fucking thing. Every idiotic thought they have. Worse, they have spent the last ten years of their lives demanding we hold them up as moral exemplars. They've also spent that time hiding the abuse.

At the very least the authorities should be entitled to know if anything has happened since then and if efforts have been taken to prevent it from happening again.
I am trying to figure out what this thread is about, but you seem to know a whole lot about something you claim to hate. A lot of hostility there.
  #50  
Old 05-26-2015, 04:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by control-z View Post
I am trying to figure out what this thread is about, but you seem to know a whole lot about something you claim to hate. A lot of hostility there.
You could say the same about me and Nazi Germany.
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