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Old 04-20-2020, 07:51 PM
nelliebly is offline
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Washington
Posts: 3,058
Sage Rat, not sure why such a post would have to focus on small government vs. big government.

Maybe because the OP hid the Ann Hedonia post he refers to, most people didn't read it? I agree with the OP that AH, a self-described liberal, did an excellent job of getting into a conservative mindset and explaining it without stereotypes, snarks, or insults.

I can't volunteer myself for the job because I skew liberal. I'm wondering if a conservative can mirror what Ann Hedonia did. Maybe they can't.

Here's the post:

Originally Posted by Ann Hedonia
Iím going to give it shot and try to get into the head of the middle America Trump voter, with a little empathy.

Itís Easter Sunday, 2020.

You are a lifelong citizen of Smalltown USA.

Your church and religion is very important to you. You believe that the hand of God is behind the success of your farm or small business, even as you have become less and less successful. Your feel that every time you open your mail, itís a tax bill or notice of a new regulation that costs you money. If you are a farmer, there are regulations about what you can grow and how much you can sell it for. You may not even own your land, you lease it and are tied into stringent rules that put the well-being of you and your family below that of prairie dogs and snakes. If you own a small business, there are rules about who you can hire and fire, the size and layout of your store, everything. Rules made by rich men living in coastal cities thousands of miles away. Men that care nothing about you or your family. Their solution is always another government program that ďgivesĒ you back part of what was taken from you. Then they make fun of you for not clamoring for their crumbs and accuse you of voting against your self-interest.

And they are always accusing you of racism, even though your closest friends and neighbors, the family that owns the next farm over, are black.

Even though you are successful, itís hard. You succeed only through the grace of God. And you truly believe that it wouldnít be nearly so hard if the government would step back.

This year itís worse. Youíve been regulated out of your church. The government has taken Easter away from you. Because there is a pandemic affecting the coastal cities, the places that are the root of all evil. And the government has scientists and experts that are telling you that you canít go to church because of this, even though you donít know or donít know anyone that knows someone thatís been sick.
So you stay home from church, the place you want to be more than any other place in the world.
You turn on the TV to watch the news, and see a bunch of liberal newscasters making fun of you and calling you a murderer for wanting to go to church. Your President (more on him later) wanted you to be able to go, but the liberal newscasters made fun of him and called him a murderer, too.

Then the news ends and the network begins their Easter evening programming. The Greatest Story Ever Told? The Sound of Music? - No, itís Jesus Christ Superstar, a musical about your Lord and Savior. You watch in horror as a bunch of multicultural hippies spray paint ďJesusĒ all over the set and generally portray Jesus as the leader of a hippie cult. You watch as Jesus is caressed by a prostitute. You are further outraged by the sympathetic portrayal of a black Judas that looks like a gang member. Youíre outraged that this is now normal. Youíre outraged that your kids seem to think this production, while a little ďout thereĒ, is great because it makes religion more accessible. Youíre outraged that your grandkids love it. You want the America of your youth back.

Three years ago, you elected a President that claimed to understand you. But even he is no match for the forces that have been working to undermine you and your America. Because here is, surrounded by the rich elites you hate, telling you you canít go to church in a tone that makes it clear that heís speaking under duress. And heís trying his best to signal to you that heís being held hostage. But heís still your strong man, look at how he gets in some nasty jabs at his captors.

And he was winning. Look at how heís defied the FBI and Congress. Look at how heís smacking down all those liberal governors that are trying to take your freedom. You cheer every time he fires another rich elite thatís been sent to control him. You canít wait to vote for him again so he can finish the job. Now theyíve tried to destroy the economy he has built back up just to take him out. But you wonít let them. You want his autocracy and you want him to grab as much power for himself as he can. Because you really do believe that only he can fix this.

ó-end empathyó-

Thatís what we are up against and itís formidable and multi-faceted. Blaming it on racism and misogyny, while it may be true in some sense, is a vast oversimplification of a deeper dissatisfaction and will lead to a Democratic loss in November.
Old 04-20-2020, 11:37 PM
Lance Turbo is online now
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 4,779
Originally Posted by UltraVires View Post
There is where you lose people like me who are rural, conservative Republicans.
We care about people as well.
But rant mode off, we care about people every bit as much as your side does.
No you don't.

You care about yourself, people close to you, and people like you.

We can read your posts. You are incapable of caring about or even understanding people who aren't like you. Furthermore, you project that onto us.

It simply isn't true.


Originally Posted by UltraVires View Post
And sure AIDS killed tons of people in Africa. But that's "over there" not here. Call it racist or xenophobic, but that is how people react to things. You ever listen to the radio and hear that an earthquake hit and killed 3,000 people and you lean in and hear, "in Pakistan" and you change the channel? If they had said "in California" you would have said "oh my God!" and read all of the articles when you got home. It is not because you hate Pakistanis or brown people in general. People feel what hits their own backyard.
Old 04-21-2020, 12:27 PM
Velocity is online now
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 17,491
Originally Posted by nelliebly View Post
I can't volunteer myself for the job because I skew liberal. I'm wondering if a conservative can mirror what Ann Hedonia did. Maybe they can't.
Eh, I'll give it a shot, being conservative, despite also being the OP myself:


You're a liberal living in San Francisco (or Seattle, or NYC, or Boston, or Chicago...)

You grew up in a conservative Christian family, actually, but never felt the religion. On the contrary, it was rammed down your throat by your parents, who forced you to go to church whether you liked it or not, and gave scolding or dismissive replies any time you brought up tough questions like why God's existence seem to have such weak evidence, or isn't it excessively severe for people to burn in Hell for trillions and trillions of years, or why so many Christians live a hypocritical life. When you asked pastors or other Christians these same questions, you got no satisfactory responses either, only a stream of cliches and trite platitudes with no substance behind them. To top it off, these same Christians spread all kinds of fake-news and conspiracy theories on Facebook, along with chain emails, while at the same time making strident posts about evidence for Jesus' resurrection - and also false prophets or others who make utterly unfounded prophecies or "declarations" in the name of faith.

You are deeply anxious about climate change and the heating of the planet, knowing it's a ticking clock, yet conservatives dismiss it as a hoax. You consider it essential for a woman to have access to abortion (since the financial, emotional and social costs of an unwanted pregnancy are immense,) but Republicans want to ban the practice as much as they can. You know firsthand how bosses and companies can exploit workers, but Republicans oppose labor unionizing. You lived for a while in Canada and shake your head over how the U.S. healthcare system charges $40,000 for an appendectomy when Canadians get something much better. You are appalled at the Columbines, Sandy Hooks, Orlando, Virginia Techs, Las Vegas shootings, but the response of the 2nd-Amendment crowd is "more guns." You see the U.S. defense budget of $700 billion a year - more than the rest of the world spends on their militaries combined - and keep thinking, "why can't we take a big chunk of that and spent it on much more urgent needs like teacher pay, hospitals, the homeless, scholarships, etc. instead?"

All of this was bad enough for you before 2016. You were already a reliably blue voter; you voted Clinton, Gore, Kerry, and Obama. But now you watch as Donald Trump rises to the top of the Republican primaries. Is this a....joke?? At first Trump's success is actually cause for liberal relief and some schadenfreude; he should be the weakest of all GOP candidates, makes him easiest for Hillary to defeat. But then Trump consistently remains within only 2-5% behind Hillary (why isn't she beating him by 40%?!), and any relief is replaced by deep-seated worry. And then Election Night 2016 happens, and the worst fears are confirmed. Nor has it escaped your attention that the party that blasted Bill Clinton for his affairs in the 1990s has now elected Trump to the White House.

You aren't exactly a fan of the Democratic Party - the big tent with all its infighting, constant mind-changing, factions going at each other - but they are much better in your opinion than the Republicans. You find that Bernie lines up most closely with your views, but since the DNC would never let Bernie win, you had to reluctantly go along with Hillary in 2016 and Biden this time around.


Last edited by Velocity; 04-21-2020 at 12:29 PM.


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