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  #201  
Old 04-30-2020, 04:46 PM
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She didn't really impress me much when she was my senator, but Duckworth would be a smart, strategic pick. She's from the all-important midwest. She holds Obama's former seat, which creates a nice narrative. A democratic governor would pick her replacement. She's fairly young and is good at going after Trump (Cadet Bone Spurs). As a wounded warrior, she may be able to turn vets and military members into a mini swing vote. There are those pictures of her casting Senate votes while holding her baby, right after giving birth, which would win over a lot of women voters who get most of their news from People & US Weekly.

The only downside is another round of birtherism would be inevitable, as she was not born in the US.
  #202  
Old 04-30-2020, 04:57 PM
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Joe's dilemma: picking someone voters will accept as his successor when he croaks in a few months.

While I don't really want established (D) senators ripped lured from the legislative to the executive, Kamala Harris wouldn't be replaced by an (R). She's non-male and non-white and non-ancient enough to balance Joltin' Joe, but she's also from Ecotopia and so will alienate many... who might not have voted for Biden anyway.

Kamala seems to own a bit of national name recognition. Is it mostly positive, negative, or indifferent?
I'm sorry I don't really know how to use this board yet. However I really think Harris should be Bidens choice for attorney general. I'd like to see Mayor Pete as the VP choice but Biden has said he was going to choose a female VP . So maybe Klobachar.
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  #203  
Old 04-30-2020, 04:58 PM
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Are there elected female governors or members of congress with medical experience? That would also be a smart pick during these times.

I know Lauren Underwood is a nurse and a very likable politician who won an upset election, but sh'es just a first-term House rep unfortunately.

ETA: nm Underwood would be 34 at the time of inauguration anyway.

Last edited by pjacks; 04-30-2020 at 05:01 PM.
  #204  
Old 04-30-2020, 05:19 PM
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She's fairly young and is good at going after Trump (Cadet Bone Spurs). As a wounded warrior, she may be able to turn vets and military members into a mini swing vote.
I think it's been conclusively proven now that veterans and the military don't give a fuck if someone's a draft evader or a war hero, the Republicans will vote Republican and the Democrats will vote Democrat.
  #205  
Old 04-30-2020, 05:29 PM
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I think it's been conclusively proven now that veterans and the military don't give a fuck if someone's a draft evader or a war hero, the Republicans will vote Republican and the Democrats will vote Democrat.
Fair point. But I think even in that demographic, there are cynical nonpartisans and persuadable nonvoters who could be convinced to vote for a ticket with a wounded warrior. It certainly wouldn't repel them further at least.
  #206  
Old 04-30-2020, 05:44 PM
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This line of reasoning makes no sense to me. The "Benghazi trap" is a known quantity of negative, destructive baggage. It's not about what anyone "deserves." If there's a fucking bear trap right in front of you with big signs marked "BEAR TRAP", and you step into the bear trap and die...you're dead. That's all there is to it. The "you" here is the Democratic Party. It would be squarely on THEM for fucking up in this situation, not the "American people."
65M people voted for the person who was the subject of the hearings, the smears, and the conspiracies over Benghazi. Trey Gowdy, a partisan hollering hack, ultimately failed in getting the outcome of that hearing he wanted. I don't believe Susan Rice becoming the Vice Presidential nominee is going to re-litigate that subject outside of the right-wing media who to this day want to indict Hillary Clinton, and a media who never was going to be kind to whoever Biden picked. That's what I mean by calling it a trap.
  #207  
Old 04-30-2020, 06:05 PM
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Are there elected female governors or members of congress with medical experience?
No, but Gina Raimondo has a good story to tell:

Rhode Island has been conducting an average of 283 tests per 100,000 residents a day, compared with 79 tests per 100,000 people in the United States over all.
  #208  
Old 04-30-2020, 06:29 PM
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I actually heard her interviewed on NPR a couple days ago, and she came off as extremely intelligent, well-spoken and in control.

So, the opposite of Biden, which makes her a good pick.

Last edited by pjacks; 04-30-2020 at 06:30 PM.
  #209  
Old 04-30-2020, 06:31 PM
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65M people voted for the person who was the subject of the hearings, the smears, and the conspiracies over Benghazi. Trey Gowdy, a partisan hollering hack, ultimately failed in getting the outcome of that hearing he wanted. I don't believe Susan Rice becoming the Vice Presidential nominee is going to re-litigate that subject outside of the right-wing media who to this day want to indict Hillary Clinton, and a media who never was going to be kind to whoever Biden picked. That's what I mean by calling it a trap.
"The negatives are baked in," in other words. Let's see how that goes again.
  #210  
Old 05-01-2020, 12:00 AM
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Picking Hillary would be a bad idea and it's not going to happen.

Picking Warren would be a bad idea, and I really hope it's not going to happen.

I do however think we have seen another clue that it's going to be a white woman (or at least not a black woman). The first clue was Biden's pledge, at the same debate where he promised a female running mate, to appoint the first black woman to the SCOTUS. That was the consolation prize in advance for the fact that he was not going to tap one for veep. The more recent hint was from Jim Clyburn, who recently retracted his comments that Biden ought to pick a black woman. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/202...-says-n1194926 That tells me that Biden let him know that was not where he was leaning, and so Clyburn is papering over this potential disagreement before it goes public.

I still think it's Klobuchar.


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I'm sorry I don't really know how to use this board yet. However I really think Harris should be Bidens choice for attorney general. I'd like to see Mayor Pete as the VP choice but Biden has said he was going to choose a female VP . So maybe Klobachar.

No apology necessary: looks to me like you're doing just fine!



Mike Murphy was pushing her on the Hacks on Tap podcast. However, as even he acknowledged, the problem there is that she has made many enemies among organized labor.
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Last edited by SlackerInc; 05-01-2020 at 12:02 AM.
  #211  
Old 05-01-2020, 12:12 AM
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I'm sorry I don't really know how to use this board yet. However I really think Harris should be Bidens choice for attorney general. I'd like to see Mayor Pete as the VP choice but Biden has said he was going to choose a female VP . So maybe Klobachar.
You're doing fine. No apologies necessary.
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  #212  
Old 05-01-2020, 12:18 PM
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NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO
Ya know if you're gonna shit on my idea, I wish you'd come right out and tell me. All this hem-hawing around and beating around the bush isn't doing either one of us any good.
  #213  
Old 05-01-2020, 12:53 PM
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Ya know if you're gonna shit on my idea, I wish you'd come right out and tell me. All this hem-hawing around and beating around the bush isn't doing either one of us any good.
The shame of it is I agree with you that she'd be an excellent VP (and would have made at least a very good POTUS). I just believe she's exactly the wrong person to be the VP candidate in this election.

FTR I like the idea of Duckworth.
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Old 05-01-2020, 06:54 PM
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I agree with whoever it was upthread who basically said Democrats get taken with the idea that candidates like Duckworth are some kind of anti-GOP Kryptonite. The reality, I'm afraid, is that it's still true that the kind of candidates who appeal best to swing voters are white, native-born Americans with no disabilities. I'm not saying that's how it should be, but I do believe it is how it is.
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  #215  
Old 05-01-2020, 10:39 PM
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I didn't word it exactly that way, but I did say that veterans and military members don't just automatically find someone sympathetic or relatable just because that person served in the military, whether it's a random person or someone running for political office. It's a lot more nuanced than "that person is a veteran" or "that person was wounded in combat" and "therefore I should like them."

For every Democratic or liberal veteran who tries to play the veteran card, 10 more veterans will come out of the woodwork to call them out. I've seen it time and again, for instance, with gun control, to name just one issue. Someone on Facebook will say, "I carried weapons of war in Iraq, and I can tell you as a veteran that assault weapons have no place on our streets." Then 10 other people will say, "well I, too, carried weapons of war [wherever], and in fact have more deployments than you did/was in a "real" combat arms MOS/generally saw more shit than you think you have, and I say you're wrong!"

There's also an enlisted/officer divide. In my experience, former enlisted are more likely to lean more conservative, former officers are more likely to be moderates or liberal. Any time a liberal former officer tries to play the veteran card on some hot button issue, a bunch of former enlisted will say, "oh, they're just an elitist officer". Oh, and former officers will say, "oh, they're one of the shitty officers, like that one asshole officer I once had."

There's no amount of combat experience that a Democratic veteran could have, that would outweigh their political position to conservative veterans, because there is NO shortage of equally-combat-experienced conservative veterans to be mouthpieces for the other side.

I used to think otherwise, but at this point after following politics for as long as I have, military service in a political candidate seems to be a wash in terms of their electability and popularity.
  #216  
Old 05-01-2020, 11:15 PM
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I didn't word it exactly that way, but I did say that veterans and military members don't just automatically find someone sympathetic or relatable just because that person served in the military, whether it's a random person or someone running for political office. It's a lot more nuanced than "that person is a veteran" or "that person was wounded in combat" and "therefore I should like them."

For every Democratic or liberal veteran who tries to play the veteran card, 10 more veterans will come out of the woodwork to call them out.
From another earlier vp thread:

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Duckworth is not well-liked by many career soldiers. She is perceived as a hot-dog who put lives at risk when she was shot down.
  #217  
Old 05-01-2020, 11:32 PM
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Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying she wouldn't be a good pick - she seems as good as any, which is to say, without any negatives that stand out - just that the military history isn't going to sway a substantial number of people who weren't going to vote Democratic already.
  #218  
Old 05-02-2020, 05:31 AM
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Am I allowed to address an "elephant in the room" in that Gretchen Whitmer is smoking hot? Obviously that's just my opinion but I'd at least like to think I'm not alone.

I'm sure we'd all agree that Michigan is a big-time swing-state, so if Biden were to pick Whitmer as his VP, are her "looks" a big deal? a little deal? or no deal?

Could that ever work for / against her, even with the Fox dirtbags?

Last edited by Win Place Show; 05-02-2020 at 05:36 AM.
  #219  
Old 05-02-2020, 06:52 AM
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I'd really prefer you didn't.
  #220  
Old 05-02-2020, 07:38 AM
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you don't have to look like a model but you have to look at least OK. In most cases you have to be normal weight and have decent hair. I know Trump is overweight but he hides it pretty well. I think it would be hard for a bald guy to be president or VP now.
  #221  
Old 05-02-2020, 03:16 PM
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I agree that appearance (including height) is germane to politics.
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  #222  
Old 05-03-2020, 07:17 AM
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Someone should tell Abrams campaigning for a job she won't get makes her look bad.
  #223  
Old 05-03-2020, 07:47 AM
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you don't have to look like a model but you have to look at least OK. In most cases you have to be normal weight and have decent hair. I know Trump is overweight but he hides it pretty well. I think it would be hard for a bald guy to be president or VP now.
Charisma is way more important than appearance. Bald can be beautiful on the right person.
  #224  
Old 05-03-2020, 07:56 AM
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What I like most about Duckworth is not that she's a veteran; it's that she's a tenacious fighter. Sure, the Republicans will try to Swiftboat her, but unlike Kerry, she'll fight back against it.
  #225  
Old 05-07-2020, 01:08 AM
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Kerry is probably the most underrated candidate ever. He came within a few thousand votes in Ohio (despite the marriage amendment on the ballot) of winning a race against an incumbent president who had an approval rating above 50 percent. That's actually pretty amazing.
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  #226  
Old 05-08-2020, 11:43 PM
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Maybe relevant to the conversation, maybe not.

I don't know why I thought that in a typical election year (outside of today's COVID-19 "new normal") a Presidential candidate would've already selected his/her running mate long ago (prior to mid-May), and that at this point Biden is just leaving us twisting in the wind and keeping us in suspense, just to goof on us. Turns out - not surprisingly - that I'm an idiot.

I thought this might be worth sharing, that apparently (even in "normal" times) a VP running-mate doesn't typically get named until 60 - 90 days from now. Lots of Julys and Augusts listed in here, so I guess I've been breathlessly refreshing the news sites for no reason these last several weeks.

https://www.thoughtco.com/when-are-p...chosen-3367681

Not sure how many (like me) totally had their timelines screwed up, and might find this as interesting as I did. For 90% of you, I'll grant you that this is "old news", but it answered a question I had nonetheless.
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