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  #1  
Old 05-07-2020, 06:08 AM
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We'll need a "Trump's Economy Wall" on the mall when this is over


Like the Vietnam Memorial, but with the names of everyone who's died of COVID-19, sacrificing their lives in the losing war to try to save Trump's economy.

Like with Vietnam, most of the names on that wall will have been conscripts, not heroes.

We're gonna need a bigger wall.
  #2  
Old 05-07-2020, 08:09 AM
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Do we build one for every country in the world with coronavirus deaths or just the US?
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Old 05-07-2020, 08:24 AM
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Do we build one for every country in the world with coronavirus deaths or just the US?
Just the ones in which Presidential incompetence (like appointing his worthless son-in-law and a bunch of young idiots to lead task forces for which they are totally unqualified), corruption, and grift increases the chances of people dying from the virus.
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Old 05-07-2020, 08:28 AM
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The guy does love walls...
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  #5  
Old 05-07-2020, 10:21 AM
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Do we build one for every country in the world with coronavirus deaths or just the US?
Every country can build one if they want but ours will be the biggest.
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Old 05-07-2020, 01:38 PM
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Just the ones in which Presidential incompetence (like appointing his worthless son-in-law and a bunch of young idiots to lead task forces for which they are totally unqualified), corruption, and grift increases the chances of people dying from the virus.
The worst case scenario is Belgium and if we had their deaths per capita we would have an extra 165,000 deaths so far.
I don't know how many presidents have saved the lives of 165,000 people but it can't be that many. Maybe we should be saving room on the mall for a monument to Trump as one of our country's greatest heroes, or maybe the president isn't a god-king and coronavirus deaths have very little to do with who is in charge of government
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Old 05-07-2020, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by puddleglum View Post
The worst case scenario is Belgium and if we had their deaths per capita we would have an extra 165,000 deaths so far.
I don't know how many presidents have saved the lives of 165,000 people but it can't be that many. Maybe we should be saving room on the mall for a monument to Trump as one of our country's greatest heroes, or maybe the president isn't a god-king and coronavirus deaths have very little to do with who is in charge of government
Or his juvenile, petty and vindictive policies are causing people to get sick and/or die.
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Old 05-07-2020, 01:53 PM
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No, the worst case scenario is global nuclear annihilation. Every president (at least, so far) has avoided that, so they're all responsible for saving billions of lives.
  #9  
Old 05-07-2020, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by puddleglum View Post
The worst case scenario is Belgium and if we had their deaths per capita we would have an extra 165,000 deaths so far.
I don't know how many presidents have saved the lives of 165,000 people but it can't be that many. Maybe we should be saving room on the mall for a monument to Trump as one of our country's greatest heroes, or maybe the president isn't a god-king and coronavirus deaths have very little to do with who is in charge of government
Did the president of Belgium put Jared Kushner in charge of a group trying to find needed medical supplies? If not, then Trump is doing a lot worse than the leader of Belgium.

Care to defend putting an idiot with zero qualifications in charge of an important group in a medical crisis? Or is that just fine for you?

Last edited by iiandyiiii; 05-07-2020 at 02:01 PM.
  #10  
Old 05-07-2020, 02:02 PM
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The worst case scenario is Belgium and if we had their deaths per capita we would have an extra 165,000 deaths so far.
I don't know how many presidents have saved the lives of 165,000 people but it can't be that many. Maybe we should be saving room on the mall for a monument to Trump as one of our country's greatest heroes, or maybe the president isn't a god-king and coronavirus deaths have very little to do with who is in charge of government
The Trump legacy according to one of his supporters: We should be grateful because he didn't kill as many Americans as he could have.
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Old 05-07-2020, 05:35 PM
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Not on the Mall, put it a Mar-A-Lago, which will have been seized to cover the class-action wrongful death suits.
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Old 05-08-2020, 01:39 AM
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Bottom-up activism, not top-down imposition: Memorial walls in every willing community but with no mention of Donny, whose name deserves no place on any public monument. Idea: an orange wig atop a tall pole beside each memorial wall, suitable for passing birds to shit upon. Hmmm, that's pretty painless, but it's a start.
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Old 05-08-2020, 01:51 AM
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Originally Posted by iiandyiiii View Post
Did the president of Belgium put Jared Kushner in charge of a group trying to find needed medical supplies? If not, then Trump is doing a lot worse than the leader of Belgium.

[...]
Ah, this reminds me of this classic exchange on Twitter:

https://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nl...-Why-not…-.png
  #14  
Old 05-08-2020, 09:53 AM
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Originally Posted by iiandyiiii View Post
Did the president of Belgium put Jared Kushner in charge of a group trying to find needed medical supplies? If not, then Trump is doing a lot worse than the leader of Belgium.

Care to defend putting an idiot with zero qualifications in charge of an important group in a medical crisis? Or is that just fine for you?
Apparently it has worked because the US has less than half the deaths per capita as Belgium so maybe they should have had Kushner. Should he get a monument too?

Last edited by puddleglum; 05-08-2020 at 09:54 AM.
  #15  
Old 05-08-2020, 09:56 AM
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Apparently it has worked because the US has less than half the deaths per capita as Belgium so maybe they should have had Kushner. Should he get a monument too?
Just on the off chance we actually live in the same universe, does it bother you that Trump has said many false and dangerous things about COVID, and that he's put incompetent and unqualified people in charge of many aspects of the response?
  #16  
Old 05-08-2020, 10:05 AM
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The Trump legacy according to one of his supporters: We should be grateful because he didn't kill as many Americans as he could have.
If that is the standard we should take out the FDR memorial. In just his first year of office 67,000 people died of tuberculosis.
Lincoln has a memorial but under his presidency 440,000 -500,000 people died of contagious diseases. He must have been an awful president to kill so many people.
  #17  
Old 05-08-2020, 10:10 AM
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If that is the standard we should take out the FDR memorial. In just his first year of office 67,000 people died of tuberculosis.
Lincoln has a memorial but under his presidency 440,000 -500,000 people died of contagious diseases. He must have been an awful president to kill so many people.
Did Lincoln and FDR appoint unqualified clowns to oversee important parts of their epidemic responses?
  #18  
Old 05-08-2020, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by puddleglum View Post
If that is the standard we should take out the FDR memorial. In just his first year of office 67,000 people died of tuberculosis.
In his first year! What a piker!!

The coronavirus has killed more Americans than that in the past five weeks.
Quote:
Lincoln has a memorial but under his presidency 440,000 -500,000 people died of contagious diseases. He must have been an awful president to kill so many people.
You mean, back when medical science was practically nonexistent by our standards?

Not to mention, this thing's just getting started. With states opening up, it's hard to see how the death rate goes down much. We could lose that many people to the coronavirus. Absent a change of President by resignation, impeachment, or the 25th Amendment (which almost surely won't happen), we could lose that many to the coronavirus before January 20.

The thing is, we have a ton of knowledge about how to deal with a novel virus like this one. Hell, Obama's people left a detailed playbook on this subject for the Trump people, they did a tabletop role-playing exercise with them during the transition, ranked it as one of the top three threats they might have to deal with, had a team on the NSC to take charge of dealing with the next pandemic - and Trump threw all that away.

Then when this particular virus came along, Trump went into denial mode for two months, pretending that it barely existed here and would soon vanish, then pretended to be a 'wartime President' for a week or so, then dumped all the responsibility for dealing with the worst worldwide pandemic since the 1918-1919 influenza epidemic onto the states. And forced them to bid against each other (and his own agencies) for resources, and on those occasions when they won the bidding, his minions swiped the PPE, ventilators, test kits, etc. out from under him.

The governor of my state was able to procure 500,000 testing kits from South Korea, and he had to guard the damn things with the state police and the Maryland National Guard. What insanity is this??

Not only does Trump have no idea what he's doing, but he's not willing to hire people who do know what they're doing, and turn the whole thing over to them.

The coronavirus isn't his fault, but the absence of a coherent national response to it is entirely his fault. We might have had several thousand deaths under the best of responses, but we didn't have to have anywhere near 77,000 deaths. Most of those deaths are on him. And we'll almost surely have that many more to come, and all those deaths are on him.

He deserves a memorial that says, "these are all the Americans Trump killed." Because he did.
  #19  
Old 05-08-2020, 02:38 PM
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And there is this tweet from Trump's 2020 campaign manager, Brad Parscale, comparing Trump with the Death Star getting ready to destroy a planet full of innocent people.

He hasn't vaporized an entire planet, but 77,000 Americans is all too horrendous a start.

This time, his incompetence and stupidity doesn't protect us from his evil nature.
  #20  
Old 05-08-2020, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by puddleglum View Post
If that is the standard we should take out the FDR memorial. In just his first year of office 67,000 people died of tuberculosis.
Lincoln has a memorial but under his presidency 440,000 -500,000 people died of contagious diseases. He must have been an awful president to kill so many people.
A lot of people may have died of diseases during Lincoln's and Roosevelt's administrations. But both presidents were generally opposed to that.

Trump is the first president we've had that encouraged people to ignore professional medical advice and go out and contract a disease. Or as you put it, Trump is an awful president who killed a lot of people.

Back in 2016, while he was running for President, Donald Trump said that he could get away with openly killing somebody in the middle of New York City. At the time, I didn't realize it was the one campaign promise he planned on keeping.
  #21  
Old 05-08-2020, 04:39 PM
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Trump Economy Wall, huh?

Do we get New Mexico to pay for it?
  #22  
Old 05-08-2020, 04:55 PM
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Here's the numbers everyone needs to keep in mind.

Covid 19 deaths by country:

1. United States - 78,492
2. United Kingdom - 31,241
3. Italy - 30,201
4. Spain - 26,299
5. France - 26,230
6. Brazil - 9,637
7. Belgium - 8,521
8. Germany - 7,468
9. Iran - 6,541
10. Netherlands - 5,359
11. China - 4,633
12. Canada - 4,567
13. Turkey - 3,689
14. Sweden - 3,175
15. Mexico - 2,961
16. India - 1,985
17. Russia - 1,723
18. Peru - 1,714
19. Switzerland - 1,823
20. Ecuador - 1,654

Out of the two hundred or so heads of state:
Donald Trump has not done the best job.
Donald Trump has not done a good job.
Donald Trump has not done an average job.
Donald Trump has not done a bad job.

Out of the two hundred or so heads of state:
Donald Trump has done the worst job.

And it's by a strong margin. He's done more than twice as bad as Boris Johnson, who's in second place.

Donald Trump is the worst leader in the entire world.

Last edited by Little Nemo; 05-08-2020 at 04:56 PM.
  #23  
Old 05-09-2020, 12:52 AM
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This video points out that Trump hasn't just done a terrible job in handling the medical crisis. He's also done a terrible job in handling the economic crisis.

Why we're seeing mass layoffs in the US but not the UK

Another set of numbers

Unemployment claims as share of labor force:

United States: 14.8%
Ireland: 11.4%
Canada: 9.8%
Iceland: 9.7%
Turkey: 9.0%
Norway: 4.8%
United Kingdom: 4.1%
Australia: 3.8%
Austria: 3.7%
Denmark: 3.1%
Sweden: 1.9%
Israel: 1.8%
New Zealand: 1.6%
Spain: 1.3%
Mexico: 0.6%

Source: The effect of COVID-19 and disease suppression policies on labor markets: A preliminary analysis of the data

Also: Coronavirus hits European economies but governments help shield workers
  #24  
Old 05-09-2020, 09:16 AM
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puddleglum, do you think it's coincidence that after Trump downplayed the pandemic and did virtually nothing, and putting clowns and bootlickers in charge of our response, the US has the WORST COVID outbreak in the world?
  #25  
Old 05-09-2020, 11:21 AM
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puddleglum, do you think it's coincidence that after Trump downplayed the pandemic and did virtually nothing, and putting clowns and bootlickers in charge of our response, the US has the WORST COVID outbreak in the world?
I'm guessing the new right wing narrative is "But Belgium!" It's joined the list alongside Benghazi and e-mails.

I'll point out that Belgium apparently is trying to find out who has Covid 19 and who is dying of it. They've conducted 44,456 tests per million people. The American equivalent rate is 25,119. Which means that statistically, a lot more people are dying of Covid 19 in the United States without having ever been tested for it.

So Belgium's higher rate of Covid 19 deaths per capita is a reflection that they're more aware of why people are dying. The Covid 19 death rate per capita in the United States is less accurate because of less testing and probably doesn't reflect the real rate.

Cite: Rate of coronavirus (COVID-19) tests performed in the most impacted countries worldwide as of May 8, 2020 (per million population)
  #26  
Old 05-10-2020, 03:32 AM
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puddleglum, do you think it's coincidence that after Trump downplayed the pandemic and did virtually nothing, and putting clowns and bootlickers in charge of our response, the US has the WORST COVID outbreak in the world?
I think it's no coincidence that making America a sicker, weaker, poorer nation serves enemy interests. I think some minion calculated that further waves of carnage make a good excuse for emergency martial law, internment of dissidents, etc. COVID handed this POTUS a golden opportunity to destroy the US.
  #27  
Old 05-10-2020, 03:39 PM
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I think it's no coincidence that making America a sicker, weaker, poorer nation serves enemy interests. I think some minion calculated that further waves of carnage make a good excuse for emergency martial law, internment of dissidents, etc. COVID handed this POTUS a golden opportunity to destroy the US.
I doubt there's this much planning going on in the Trump White House. I think the real reason Trump wants to end the lockdown is because he misses his rallies.
  #28  
Old 05-10-2020, 08:22 PM
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Forget the wall.

What we'll need is a Truth and Reconciliation Committee.
  #29  
Old 05-11-2020, 02:46 AM
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I doubt there's this much planning going on in the Trump White House. I think the real reason Trump wants to end the lockdown is because he misses his rallies.
It's easy to think him that shallow; and with Fox psychos as his kitchen cabinet, he's obviously untethered from certain realities. But he's expended great effort to hide his financials because those will show that he is foreign-owned. And while no Deep Thinker himself, some of his minions seem slick, slimy, evil plotters. So don't say it can't happen.

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Forget the wall.

What we'll need is a Truth and Reconciliation Committee.
Remove cancer first. Heal later. And rather than a wall, plant trees.
  #30  
Old 05-11-2020, 11:12 AM
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No, the worst case scenario is global nuclear annihilation. Every president (at least, so far) has avoided that, so they're all responsible for saving billions of lives.
I have also managed to avoid causing global nuclear annihilation (so far). When are those noble prize winning journalists going to give me some credit?!
  #31  
Old 05-11-2020, 11:23 AM
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Ah, this reminds me of this classic exchange on Twitter:

https://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nl...-Why-not…-.png
I thought the best response to that tweet was “Why not? Would she get mad at you?
  #32  
Old 05-11-2020, 12:49 PM
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In his first year! What a piker!!

The coronavirus has killed more Americans than that in the past five weeks.
You mean, back when medical science was practically nonexistent by our standards?

Not to mention, this thing's just getting started. With states opening up, it's hard to see how the death rate goes down much. We could lose that many people to the coronavirus. Absent a change of President by resignation, impeachment, or the 25th Amendment (which almost surely won't happen), we could lose that many to the coronavirus before January 20.

The thing is, we have a ton of knowledge about how to deal with a novel virus like this one. Hell, Obama's people left a detailed playbook on this subject for the Trump people, they did a tabletop role-playing exercise with them during the transition, ranked it as one of the top three threats they might have to deal with, had a team on the NSC to take charge of dealing with the next pandemic - and Trump threw all that away.

Then when this particular virus came along, Trump went into denial mode for two months, pretending that it barely existed here and would soon vanish, then pretended to be a 'wartime President' for a week or so, then dumped all the responsibility for dealing with the worst worldwide pandemic since the 1918-1919 influenza epidemic onto the states. And forced them to bid against each other (and his own agencies) for resources, and on those occasions when they won the bidding, his minions swiped the PPE, ventilators, test kits, etc. out from under him.

The governor of my state was able to procure 500,000 testing kits from South Korea, and he had to guard the damn things with the state police and the Maryland National Guard. What insanity is this??

Not only does Trump have no idea what he's doing, but he's not willing to hire people who do know what they're doing, and turn the whole thing over to them.

The coronavirus isn't his fault, but the absence of a coherent national response to it is entirely his fault. We might have had several thousand deaths under the best of responses, but we didn't have to have anywhere near 77,000 deaths. Most of those deaths are on him. And we'll almost surely have that many more to come, and all those deaths are on him.

He deserves a memorial that says, "these are all the Americans Trump killed." Because he did.
A tabletop role playing game? I had no idea that boardgames could stop pandemics. I guess I should have remembered how Chutes and Ladders stopped the swine flu epidemic.

Where did you get the idea that a scenario where only a couple thousand people die of the coronavirus? It is highly contagious and deadly. It has killed people in just about every country where they keep track. The US is the hub of the international economy, it has millions of people flying in from other countries. As yet there is no effective treatment so we have no idea how bad it is going to get or the factors that will determine it.
  #33  
Old 05-11-2020, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Little Nemo View Post
Here's the numbers everyone needs to keep in mind.

Covid 19 deaths by country:

1. United States - 78,492
2. United Kingdom - 31,241
3. Italy - 30,201
4. Spain - 26,299
5. France - 26,230
6. Brazil - 9,637
7. Belgium - 8,521
8. Germany - 7,468
9. Iran - 6,541
10. Netherlands - 5,359
11. China - 4,633
12. Canada - 4,567
13. Turkey - 3,689
14. Sweden - 3,175
15. Mexico - 2,961
16. India - 1,985
17. Russia - 1,723
18. Peru - 1,714
19. Switzerland - 1,823
20. Ecuador - 1,654

Out of the two hundred or so heads of state:
Donald Trump has not done the best job.
Donald Trump has not done a good job.
Donald Trump has not done an average job.
Donald Trump has not done a bad job.

Out of the two hundred or so heads of state:
Donald Trump has done the worst job.

And it's by a strong margin. He's done more than twice as bad as Boris Johnson, who's in second place.

Donald Trump is the worst leader in the entire world.
So it is Trump's fault US has 30 times the population of Belgium?

By this metric the best leader in the world is Pierre Nkurunziza, the eternal supreme guide of Burundi. I wonder if we could get a constitutional change, he would be interested in becoming US president? I am sure Biden could be persuaded to step down if such a good replacement was found.
  #34  
Old 05-11-2020, 01:15 PM
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puddleglum, do you think it's coincidence that after Trump downplayed the pandemic and did virtually nothing, and putting clowns and bootlickers in charge of our response, the US has the WORST COVID outbreak in the world?
The US does not have the worst outbreak in the world. We don't know which country is the worst because China and Iran are not sharing correct information, each country is testing at different rates and most countries have not gathered the necessary data.

For the most part it is coincidence. The US has a higher population than any European country and is more integrated into the global economy than India and China. That is why the US has more victims than other countries.

Do you think it is coincidence that New York and New Jersey have democratic governors and have more deaths than every state with a republican governor combined, or is it as simple as vote for democrats and die?
  #35  
Old 05-11-2020, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by puddleglum View Post
Do you think it is coincidence that New York and New Jersey have democratic governors and have more deaths than every state with a republican governor combined
No, it's not a coincidence -- NY and NJ very large states, population wise, and are centered around the biggest and most international city in the country, NYC. And of course the biggest and most international city in the country is going to be the first to see and feel the effects of an international pandemic (and therefore will have the most deaths at the beginning/early middle stages). And of course the biggest and most international city in the country is going to be lead by Democrats. Diverse city folk are the most fundamental part of the Democratic party base.

Also, De Blasio is a shitty mayor and made many dumb decisions that got people sick and probably dead.

So no, not a coincidence at all.

And your suggestion that it's not a coincidence that demonstrably abysmal management is occurring at the same time as the highest deaths is just ludicrous. Apparently you're not even able to consider the possibility that Trump's flaws actually can affect the real world.

Last edited by iiandyiiii; 05-11-2020 at 02:00 PM.
  #36  
Old 05-11-2020, 09:35 PM
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Did the president of Belgium put Jared Kushner in charge of a group trying to find needed medical supplies?
Obviously not, as there is no president of Belgium.
__________________
My great-grandparents came through emigrating to a new country.
My grandparents came through the Great War and the Great Depression.
My parents came through the Great Depression and World War II.
We will come through this pandemic. Hang on tight to the ones you love.

Last edited by Northern Piper; 05-11-2020 at 09:36 PM.
  #37  
Old 05-11-2020, 11:38 PM
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So it is Trump's fault US has 30 times the population of Belgium?
I responded to this post two days before you made it.
  #38  
Old 05-11-2020, 11:59 PM
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The fact that you can say this:

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Originally Posted by puddleglum View Post
For the most part it is coincidence. The US has a higher population than any European country and is more integrated into the global economy than India and China.
Immediately followed by this:

Quote:
Do you think it is coincidence that New York and New Jersey have democratic governors and have more deaths than every state with a republican governor combined, or is it as simple as vote for democrats and die?
Is either hilarious or disturbing in it's doublethink. Who could imagine that incredibly densely populated areas would have higher disease transmissions than more rural areas? Besides you, as the above quote shows, obviously.
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Old 05-12-2020, 12:07 AM
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And who could imagine that the 3rd most-populated country in the world could have the highest number of coronavirus deaths?

And why is it that the second most densely-populated city in America has an absurdly low number of deaths? Could it be because Cuomo and DiBlasio actually made some really bad decisions?
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Old 05-12-2020, 11:01 AM
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No, it's not a coincidence -- NY and NJ very large states, population wise, and are centered around the biggest and most international city in the country, NYC. And of course the biggest and most international city in the country is going to be the first to see and feel the effects of an international pandemic (and therefore will have the most deaths at the beginning/early middle stages). And of course the biggest and most international city in the country is going to be lead by Democrats. Diverse city folk are the most fundamental part of the Democratic party base.

Also, De Blasio is a shitty mayor and made many dumb decisions that got people sick and probably dead.

So no, not a coincidence at all.

And your suggestion that it's not a coincidence that demonstrably abysmal management is occurring at the same time as the highest deaths is just ludicrous. Apparently you're not even able to consider the possibility that Trump's flaws actually can affect the real world.
All of the reasons that New York has had a worse outbreak than Alabama are the same as the reasons the US has had a worse outbreak than Iceland.

Cuomo is a a bad governor and has done a bad job with the outbreak and Trump is a bad president who has done a bad job with the outbreak. But in both cases the affect on the real world is small. If both had done everything the best experts had advised doing at precisely the time they advised doing it there would still have been an outbreak and New York and the US would both still be leading in death toll because of population size and connectedness to the global economy and possibly many other factors we don't know about.

If you look around the world, many countries and many different leaders are having worse outcomes than the US. That shows that the problem is not unique to the US unlike Trump who is.
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Old 05-12-2020, 11:17 AM
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If you look around the world, many countries and many different leaders are having worse outcomes than the US. That shows that the problem is not unique to the US unlike Trump who is.
Many countries, like SK and Germany, are doing much, much better, because of superior leadership and decision making. Furthermore, they've been much more successful without decimating their economies -- because they've provided much more assistance in the meantime (as well as reducing the deaths -- and deaths are bad for the economy).

I'm angry because the government has done such a shitty job, and this has lead to more deaths and more economic decimation. You should be too.
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Old 05-12-2020, 12:21 PM
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If you look around the world, many countries and many different leaders are having worse outcomes than the US.
You're wrong. No country has had a worse outcome than the United States. No leader has done a worse job than Donald Trump. I cited the numbers.
  #43  
Old 05-14-2020, 08:08 PM
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A tabletop role playing game? I had no idea that boardgames could stop pandemics. I guess I should have remembered how Chutes and Ladders stopped the swine flu epidemic.
I'm not even gonna waste any more of my time on someone who posts something this deliberately obtuse. Nice no longer knowing you.
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Old 05-14-2020, 08:24 PM
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So it is Trump's fault US has 30 times the population of Belgium?
The reason Belgium has a much larger Covid 19 case load is that they are using a different metric than the rest of the world in how they count cases. Rather than counting confirmed cases, they are counting suspected cases along with confirmed cases.
  #45  
Old 05-15-2020, 11:07 AM
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Many countries, like SK and Germany, are doing much, much better, because of superior leadership and decision making. Furthermore, they've been much more successful without decimating their economies -- because they've provided much more assistance in the meantime (as well as reducing the deaths -- and deaths are bad for the economy).

I'm angry because the government has done such a shitty job, and this has lead to more deaths and more economic decimation. You should be too.
The government has done a bad job, but the focus on one man obscures what the actual problems are.

The amount of regulations imposed is to slow decisions down and make sure something like thalidomide can't happen. Every action by the government has to go through an obstacle course before anything can be done. Multiple layers have to sign off and there are lots of veto points and bottlenecks. In normal times it makes government frustrating to deal with. It is the reason new drugs cost 2 billion dollars each, why it takes more time and money to build infrastructure than it did 100 years ago, and why high speed rail is impossible.

In an actual crisis it goes from frustrating to deadly. That is why tests were delayed, the reason information could not be shared between hospitals, why masks could not be imported, etc. It is a failure of the regulatory state that has been building for 60 years. Blaming Trump for all this is like saying it is the captain's fault a cruise ship is not as fast as a cigarette boat.
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Old 05-15-2020, 11:08 AM
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The reason Belgium has a much larger Covid 19 case load is that they are using a different metric than the rest of the world in how they count cases. Rather than counting confirmed cases, they are counting suspected cases along with confirmed cases.
That is one of the reasons why it is impossible to state with confidence which country is doing the best or the worst.
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Old 05-15-2020, 12:08 PM
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Regardless of whether Trump is "among the worst" or "THE worst," it's pretty much indisputable that his response has been utterly dishonest ("I knew it was a pandemic before anyone else did") and bungled.


I cannot think of a president that has been gifted more and done less with it than Trump. He was gifted a strong economy but insisted on devoting airtime to other unpopular topics instead, thus dragging down his popularity. Then he was gifted an opportunity to make everyone forget about impeachment, scandal, etc. by turning in a strong performance on Covid - had he done well, he could have made this the Covid election, and won on the strength of his good handling of a crisis - and he bungles that as well.

It's like giving a golfer countless mulligans, and he screws each and every single one up. Like a football team that can't get a first down despite being given a 5th, 6th, 7th down to get those ten yards.
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Old 05-15-2020, 12:44 PM
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That is one of the reasons why it is impossible to state with confidence which country is doing the best or the worst.
So your argument now is that the number of confirmed cases we now have might be smaller if we added the number of suspected cases to the number of confirmed cases?

You're disputing how addition works?
  #49  
Old 05-15-2020, 01:15 PM
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https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/15/us-r...pril-2020.html

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Retail sales fell 16.4% in April, far worse than the 12.3% predicted.

Damage was felt across the board, with clothing stores faring worst and grocers showing the only gains.

Restaurants lagged badly as did service stations
The biggest name on Trump's Economy Memorial will be the American middle class, which will be reduced to a heap of jobs that used to exist and probably won't come back for at least a year. Some jobs will never come back.

I'll say it again: we're already moving away from v-shape recession/recovery - that ship has sailed.

It's just a question of whether this becomes the Great Recession II or the Great Depression II. I'd say we're rapidly approaching the latter. A year from now, our collective (and I dare say individual) image of self will be vastly different than what it is now.
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