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  #101  
Old 05-09-2020, 12:21 PM
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She suffered in silence for twenty-seven years, praising Biden, in love with Vladimir Putin, and then started changing her story with lie after lie.

Who's paying her to lie now; and what's the over-under on how much it took to buy her?

In the White House we have a proud pussy grabber, who told jokes that put Jeffrey Epstein in stitches, wants to fuck his own daughter, leers at 14-year old girls (and was credibly accused of raping one). Anyone who cares about this Tara Reade story is confused ... and hereby ordered to watch the Bill Maher excerpt SlackerInc links to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SlackerInc View Post
Bill Maher nails it in his latest "New Rules" rant:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ju1ZFuvjzYc

"Don't know. Never will. Don't care." Word.

And "why now", indeed. Why not before Super Tuesday, or after the November election? Could it have something to do with Putin? After all, in a now-deleted post, Bill notes that Reade said "I love Russia with all my heart...[Vladimir Putin] is intoxicating to American women." [sgs7 added emphasis] And I'm sure Putin would much rather this allegation be made after Biden has the nomination sewn up, but before he beats Trump in the general.
I wish SlackerInc had quoted Reade's love note to Putin in its entirety — it is hilarious.

I'm no longer consulting the I Ching nor sacrificing jackasses to read their entrails. I now seek my divine guidance from the space of valid word arithmetic puzzles:
TARA + READE = DEADLY + LIAR
TARA + READE = PUTIN + HAND

I ask anyone posting in support of Tara Reade to watch the Bill Maher YouTube and comment thereon.

Last edited by septimus; 05-09-2020 at 12:25 PM.
  #102  
Old 05-09-2020, 12:35 PM
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At least the 'woke folk' are conflicted. For Trump supporters, the moral high ground is a mythical peak miles and miles above, never to be glimpsed.
  #103  
Old 05-09-2020, 12:35 PM
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It's funny how little we hear about slut-shaming from the woke folk now [...] Reade gets called a nut and a floozy
I'm not saying this hasn't happened at all because the world and internet is a big place but I can say that I haven't been seeing this.
  #104  
Old 05-09-2020, 12:44 PM
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It's funny how little we hear about slut-shaming from the woke folk now, and how little we hear from them about treating accusers badly when Reade gets called a nut and a floozy and politically motivated and a liar.
If you ignore the many posts (including the many posts from me) that do just this, than perhaps. Perhaps you missed them. It is indeed wrong to denigrate women just for speaking out, including Reade. As I've said many, many times.

Quote:
Also funny how the response to this -

is to accuse somebody else of not caring about sexual assault.

Funny. Not ha-ha funny, but funny.
What post is this referring to? There's no link.

Last edited by iiandyiiii; 05-09-2020 at 12:48 PM.
  #105  
Old 05-09-2020, 12:58 PM
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Shodan, are you opposing slut-shaming now, or are you in favor of it? Or does it depend on who it benefits and harms? I'm not clear on what your position is, unless it's just drive-by snark.

Last edited by iiandyiiii; 05-09-2020 at 01:00 PM.
  #106  
Old 05-09-2020, 01:45 PM
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It's funny how little we hear about slut-shaming from the woke folk now, and how little we hear from them about treating accusers badly when Reade gets called a nut and a floozy and politically motivated and a liar.
Regards,
Shodan
I recall that when Reade's story first came out, everyone took it seriously and many people insisted that if shown to be credible, Biden would necessarily need to step down. This was said by many democrats and liberals on the board and in general.

As additional details began to emerge about Reade, her ever changing story, her documented questionable behavior, her social media history, and recent reporting about who is representing her... a picture began to emerge that was far less flattering and believable.

Now, is it your position that liberals/democrats/progressives have no right to change their minds and opinions based on new information about Reade because their "wokeness" prohibits them from doing so? If so, who made you the authority of enforcing these constraints and to sit in presumptive snide judgement?
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  #107  
Old 05-09-2020, 04:29 PM
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You've used this argument often, and it remains a poor one. Biden's "line" is not even remotely odd.

Biden, like any American with basic knowledge of our Constitution and legal system, acknowledges that Reade, like any other person, has a right to say whatever she wishes (outside the normal exceptions such as yelling 'Fire' in a crowded theater). In our system, a person may say whatever they wish about another person.

The person or persons about whom something is said, then have their own right to bring suit for slander or libel (as the case may be).

Acknowledging a legal-and-moral right to speak is not the same thing as placing a seal of approval on what is said.

"She has a right to say it" is not within miles of what you imply it is. It is not 'I'm not opposing her claim.' It is not 'I agree with what she's said.' It is not 'She's telling the truth.'

What it is, is "she has a right to say" whatever she wants to say. Then Biden, in turn, has and can exercise his right to hold her accountable for her false claim. So far he's been doing that by asserting that her claim is false. No doubt legal action against Reade has been discussed within the campaign; possibly it's been rejected so far because the spectacle of taking a mentally-ill woman to court would be unpleasant and off-putting. The campaign may feel that denials, and the resulting impact on Reade's reputation, are sufficient to get the point across.

But I don't think anyone lacking a crystal ball can be sure that Reade is free and clear of potential legal consequences for her choice to say these things. (That doesn't change the fact that she, as Biden notes, has the right to say what she wants to say.)

That is an odd way to look at something. It is like saying that I have a "right" to rob a bank and then society has a corresponding right to put me in prison for 15 years or that a business has a right to have an unsafe workplace and a worker also has a right to sue a business for negligent injury or OSHA has a right to impose civil penalties. That's newspeak.

And it is just an odd way of saying things. Nobody does it. If you were accused of murder by a neighbor, would you respond by saying, "Well, the neighbor has the right to accuse me of murder, but the allegation is false. I didn't murder anyone"? Of course not; it's just a goofy thing to say.
  #108  
Old 05-09-2020, 04:39 PM
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It's funny how little we hear about slut-shaming from the woke folk now . . .
I don't put myself in the woke camp. But in their defense, I've been paying a fair amount of attention to news reports concerning Reade, and don't recall anything on how many sex partners she has had, or that she seduced a lot a men.
  #109  
Old 05-09-2020, 04:43 PM
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In an effort to disqualify Kavanaugh the Democrats hitched their cart to the sex accusation donkey and now it's running them off the path.

From my view the Kavanaugh and Biden accusations are similar with equal probability. Ford seemed more reliable than Reade but then Biden does have the shaky history of over-touching. It is highly unlikely that a 25+ year-old accusation is going to be proven one way or the other so it just comes down to he/she said.

Both sides are showering themselves in hypocrisy. Democrats--hoping that the accusation is untrue--are putting Reade's testimony through the ringer and using the same rationalizations they criticized Republicans for. I'll give some credit (for now) to Republicans: I haven't heard many, if any, GOP politicians call out Biden. I suppose the Dope will set me straight if they have.

To me the underlying problem is that the Democrats tried too hard to get rid of a SCOTUS candidate that they disliked using a weakly supported accusation. If they had hard evidence then absolutely go after him but now they look stupid and hypocritical.

But sadly being a hypocrite is par for politics.
I agree with this. I won't dispute who had the "better" story, Ford or Raede because the answer to that is subjective and the answer will depend on our own personal experiences and biases (apart from politics). Maybe one or the other reminds you of a friend from college who was assaulted. Maybe one or the other reminds you of a friend from college who was always causing trouble.

In all of these cases, nothing is based on solid evidence, it is all gut feelings filtered through bias.

And I also agree with you that very few, if any, Republicans are calling Joe Biden out because they believe that he sexually assaulted Raede. They are calling him out because of his hypocrisy on the issue. Biden has helped enact into law policies for courts, universities, and workplaces that, if applied to him, would disqualify him.

I would agree with you that any Republican claiming that Biden should drop out because he is guilty of sexual assault should be branded a hypocrite. However, at least my position has been consistent since Clarence Thomas, continuing through Bill Clinton to Donald Trump to Kavanaugh and now to Biden.

And my position is that I feel very badly if a woman is made to feel uncomfortable and if she is sexually assaulted, I will be angry. But I don't personally know any of these people. Without any physical evidence or any eyewitness account, I am simply forced to choose between the word of two people I don't know and use my gut to say that I think THIS person is telling the truth.

That's a terrible way to conduct these sorts of things and by adopting the standard of #metoo and "believe all women" or whatever modifier they have placed on that now you weaponize these allegations and encourage false ones.
  #110  
Old 05-09-2020, 06:54 PM
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You've used this argument often, and it remains a poor one. Biden's "line" is not even remotely odd.

Biden, like any American with basic knowledge of our Constitution and legal system, acknowledges that Reade, like any other person, has a right to say whatever she wishes (outside the normal exceptions such as yelling 'Fire' in a crowded theater). In our system, a person may say whatever they wish about another person.

The person or persons about whom something is said, then have their own right to bring suit for slander or libel (as the case may be).

Acknowledging a legal-and-moral right to speak is not the same thing as placing a seal of approval on what is said. ...
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That is an odd way to look at something. It is like saying that I have a "right" to rob a bank and then society has a corresponding right to put me in prison for 15 years
No. It isn't.

Robbing a bank is illegal. Saying someone assaulted you is not illegal.



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or that a business has a right to have an unsafe workplace and a worker also has a right to sue a business for negligent injury or OSHA has a right to impose civil penalties.
Whether or not a business has a "right to have an unsafe workplace" would depend on the particulars of the unsafe conditions and the laws that apply in the locality in question.

But whether or not an American has a right to make a claim about assault is not conditioned on locality; it's fully legal to speak out in that way.

In other parts of the world, as I noted in a previous post, there is no legal right to speak out (either de jure or de facto) against a prominent political figure.

But that's other nations. In the USA, it is legal.


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Originally Posted by UltraVires View Post
That's newspeak. And it is just an odd way of saying things. Nobody does it. If you were accused of murder by a neighbor, would you respond by saying, "Well, the neighbor has the right to accuse me of murder, but the allegation is false. I didn't murder anyone"? Of course not; it's just a goofy thing to say.
Biden's response was clearly intended both to deny the accusation, and to acknowledge that the world has changed with respect to women speaking out about sexual assaults.

As such there is nothing remotely odd about it, and your "murder by a neighbor" analogy is not on point.
  #111  
Old 05-09-2020, 07:15 PM
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This is a straw-man argument. And coming from an apparent supporter of Trump, it's not credible that you actually care about accusations of sexual assault.
I'm a "Conservative" & I support who will be the most consistently conservative. If Joe would do that I would support him... while also stating that I bet he's guilty as hell of this, plus the Worlds biggest Hypocrite for his loud vocal support for "Believe every Woman" WHILE DOING THIS STUFF!

Trump.... I'm betting he's been in some shady deals and used every tax loophole that IS IN the tax code plus plenty of gray areas.... and I bet he hasn't always been the nicest to women, ( most of whom were after his money ) but he's got a pretty good conservative track record politically and he's doing the things that I think need doing.

Last edited by Sdowiat; 05-09-2020 at 07:17 PM.
  #112  
Old 05-09-2020, 07:31 PM
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but he's got a pretty good conservative track record politically and he's doing the things that I think need doing.
What, making empty promises? Golfing? Holding rallies? Acting like he's still in a reality TV show?

Last edited by Skywatcher; 05-09-2020 at 07:33 PM.
  #113  
Old 05-09-2020, 07:32 PM
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"Believe every Woman"
This doesn't exist. #MeToo doesn't advocate that every single woman must be believed and never questioned -- #MeToo advocates that all allegations be taken seriously and investigated. Like the multiple allegations of sexual assault and rape against Trump, who has also bragged about sexual assault and violating women's consent on multiple occasions.
  #114  
Old 05-09-2020, 08:25 PM
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I'm a "Conservative" & I support who will be the most consistently conservative. If Joe would do that I would support him... while also stating that I bet he's guilty as hell of this, plus the Worlds biggest Hypocrite for his loud vocal support for "Believe every Woman" WHILE DOING THIS STUFF!

Trump.... I'm betting he's been in some shady deals and used every tax loophole that IS IN the tax code plus plenty of gray areas.... and I bet he hasn't always been the nicest to women, ( most of whom were after his money ) but he's got a pretty good conservative track record politically and he's doing the things that I think need doing.
What about the daily pathological lying and imbecilic blathering? Good with that too?
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  #115  
Old 05-10-2020, 12:49 AM
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How can we best explain to daughters that we "Believe Every Woman" .... except THIS ONE?

Why should we teach our daughters anything like this? How about "don't dismiss women's allegations out of hand"?


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Originally Posted by Jophiel View Post
I'm not saying this hasn't happened at all because the world and internet is a big place but I can say that I haven't been seeing this.

I haven't called her a "floozy". But a "nut"? Sure. If the shell fits...


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Originally Posted by UltraVires View Post
And it is just an odd way of saying things. Nobody does it. If you were accused of murder by a neighbor, would you respond by saying, "Well, the neighbor has the right to accuse me of murder, but the allegation is false. I didn't murder anyone"? Of course not; it's just a goofy thing to say.

Cosigned. Biden's comment there combined with his vow to undo the changes in Title IX is just a


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Originally Posted by Sherrerd View Post
Robbing a bank is illegal. Saying someone assaulted you is not illegal.

Falsely accusing someone of assault is slander. Falsely reporting a crime to police is a crime. Reade did report this to the police just recently, which means that Biden believes she is guilty of a crime (and he is not).
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  #116  
Old 05-10-2020, 02:09 AM
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We are going into the dirtiest political campaign ever.
I think Jefferson's 1796 campaign against then-VP John Adams called him a "hideous hermaphroditical" creature. Correction: it came from a partisan supporter. Close enough, and hard to beat, though invective is WWW-supercharged now. For fun, see 9 Insults That Make the Presidential Campaign Seem Civilized (Merriam-Webster).

I fear Team Tramp will skip "dirty" for "felonious". The politicized DoJ will handle that, with trumped-up charges, probes, seized files, arrests, "accidental" leaks - everything Putin and his puppy can throw at Biden. They are serious, deadly serious. Don't be surprised if tragedy ensues.
  #117  
Old 05-10-2020, 02:12 PM
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I think Jefferson's 1796 campaign against then-VP John Adams called him a "hideous hermaphroditical" creature. Correction: it came from a partisan supporter. Close enough, and hard to beat, though invective is WWW-supercharged now. For fun, see 9 Insults That Make the Presidential Campaign Seem Civilized (Merriam-Webster).

I fear Team Tramp will skip "dirty" for "felonious". The politicized DoJ will handle that, with trumped-up charges, probes, seized files, arrests, "accidental" leaks - everything Putin and his puppy can throw at Biden. They are serious, deadly serious. Don't be surprised if tragedy ensues.
Indeed. People don't realize how much dirtier politics was in bygone days. I think Chump is going to try to outdo it though.
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  #118  
Old 05-13-2020, 07:44 PM
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https://www.salon.com/2020/05/07/wom...S1_btireno0cM8

Woman who had accused Dr. Anthony Fauci of sexual assault now claims she was paid to lie about the public health expert by a pair of President Donald Trump's supporters.

The woman says right-wing provocateur Jacob Wohl and his frequent accomplice Jack Burkman persuaded her to cast Fauci as the assailant using details from an actual sexual assault she survived just after high school, and they paid her to do it, reported Reason
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  #119  
Old 05-13-2020, 09:28 PM
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Wow. I am disgusted, but I can’t say as I am completely surprised.
  #120  
Old 05-15-2020, 04:13 AM
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https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbc...mp/ncna1207516

Biden says don't vote for him if you believe Tara Reade.

Who are you thinking to replace Biden at the convention?

Can any Democrat governors poke their heads above the piles of corpses in their state?
  #121  
Old 05-15-2020, 07:50 AM
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PBS NewsHour tracked down and interviewed 74 former Biden staffers:
Quote:
The PBS NewsHour spoke with 74 former Biden staffers, of whom 62 were women, in order to get a broader picture of his behavior toward women over the course of his career, how they see the new allegation, and whether there was evidence of a larger pattern.

None of the people interviewed said that they had experienced sexual harassment, assault or misconduct by Biden. All said they never heard any rumors or allegations of Biden engaging in sexual misconduct, until the recent assault allegation made by Tara Reade. Former staffers said they believed Reade should be heard, and acknowledged that their experiences do not disprove her accusation.
Most people didn't remember Reade, those who did remembered her poor job performance leading to her dismissal and question her account of being asked to serve drinks. The article also notes that, while Biden did use the gym in the Capitol, his route to and from the gym was well known and "A recent walk through that area showed the subway tunnel contains no out-of-view areas, like an alcove" as Reade claims she was assaulted in.
  #122  
Old 05-15-2020, 04:04 PM
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A Politico article has come into contact with numerous people in California who report that Reade was, in effect, a lying deadbeat, forever hard up for money and coming up with excuses not to pay rent.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...ntances-260771

Quote:
This lack of money was hugely problematic for her, she was always on the ropes in that way.”

Reade had spoken highly of Biden, the former boss who employed her as a staff assistant from late 1992 to August 1993, and never mentioned assault or harassment, Wrye recalls. But what Wrye remembers most is that by the time Reade left their property and moved on, Wrye felt burned.

After her husband suffered a brain injury that forced the couple to sell the property, Wrye said, Reade turned on them.

“She became really difficult,” Wrye said. “She said, ‘You’re going to have to pay me to get me to leave.’”
There's more.

And yes, I obviously take back my earlier musings about the possibility that she might have been inappropriately pinched or whatever.

Reade's a scam artist, it would seem.
  #123  
Old 05-15-2020, 04:13 PM
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A Politico article has come into contact with numerous people in California who report that Reade was, in effect, a lying deadbeat, forever hard up for money and coming up with excuses not to pay rent.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...ntances-260771



There's more.

And yes, I obviously take back my earlier musings about the possibility that she might have been inappropriately pinched or whatever.

Reade's a scam artist, it would seem.
And the fact that republican Operatives Jacob Wohl and his frequent accomplice Jack Burkman are writing checks to get women to lie... doesn't look good.
  #124  
Old 05-15-2020, 06:07 PM
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A Politico article has come into contact with numerous people in California who report that Reade was, in effect, a lying deadbeat, forever hard up for money and coming up with excuses not to pay rent.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...ntances-260771



There's more.

And yes, I obviously take back my earlier musings about the possibility that she might have been inappropriately pinched or whatever.

Reade's a scam artist, it would seem.
I read that article in full and let me say "Holy Shit! .

Look, you can get complaints about anyone, but the pattern there is highly suspicious and damning.
  #125  
Old 05-15-2020, 06:57 PM
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A Politico article has come into contact with numerous people in California who report that Reade was, in effect, a lying deadbeat, forever hard up for money and coming up with excuses not to pay rent.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...ntances-260771



There's more.

And yes, I obviously take back my earlier musings about the possibility that she might have been inappropriately pinched or whatever.

Reade's a scam artist, it would seem.
It amazes me that she apparently thought she could get away with this. Or maybe she just wanted the payoff, but somebody was sure dumb enough to think that this could get real traction. I can only think of one individual (colloquially sometimes referred to as "Individual 1") who could be that dumb.

Next up: Fox News declares Tara Reade's allegations to be now proven to be indisputably true.
  #126  
Old 05-15-2020, 07:33 PM
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Well if her ex landlords say she's a fake rape victim I guess that's it.
  #127  
Old 05-15-2020, 08:20 PM
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Well if her ex landlords say she's a fake rape victim I guess that's it.
Did you read the article?
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  #128  
Old 05-15-2020, 08:35 PM
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Did you read the article?
Yeah it wasn't "she dressed provocatively" it was the other one.
  #129  
Old 05-15-2020, 09:53 PM
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Did you read the article?
Yes.

But I doubt the reporter, even though she is good, had the time to search as carefully for negative information from past acquaintances and friends of the people who said those terrible things about Tara Reade. Maybe every last one has skeletons in their closet. A lot of us do.

I do NOT think, for a minute, that Joe Biden raped a woman anywhere, let alone in a public hallway. That's because evidence, for that extraordinary claim, is lacking. And the wisdom of the expired stature of limitations tells me it is too late to be developed. But if Joe is a rapist, he quite possibly only tries it with women who live in their own glass houses -- like Tara Reade.

Character assassination without physical evidence, or at least multiple first-hand witnesses to the act itself, leads to nothing good. It's easy for strangers to say that women should come forward no matter what, but their real personal friends might have different advice.

Does this mean a large fraction of rapists will get away with it? Yes. It's part of the tragedy of human existence.

It's not Joe Biden's fault he's more hopeful, and less willing to accept this tragedy, than I am. In a way, it's admirable. So I'm not going to call him a hypocrite for having bought into believe-women. And it's certainly not Joe's fault that his accuser makes enemies.
  #130  
Old 05-15-2020, 10:22 PM
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It amazes me that she apparently thought she could get away with this. Or maybe she just wanted the payoff, but somebody was sure dumb enough to think that this could get real traction. I can only think of one individual (colloquially sometimes referred to as "Individual 1") who could be that dumb.

Next up: Fox News declares Tara Reade's allegations to be now proven to be indisputably true.
If its all fake, the question is who is behind it?

Trump? Some right wing organization? Putin? Some other actor?

We need investigations into that too if these allegations fall apart. If right wing extremists or foreign actors are able to just offer someone a 6 figure check to have this happen, it needs to be published.

Reade seems to have a long history of money problems.
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  #131  
Old 05-15-2020, 10:36 PM
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Well if her ex landlords say she's a fake rape victim I guess that's it.
According to the article, she has a long history of money problems and conning people.

Both of which could play a huge role in her accusation. IF someone offered her money to make up the accusation, then thats a serious issue that needs to be looked into.

Fake criminal complaints do happen. The Duke LaCrosse players can tell you that.
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  #132  
Old 05-15-2020, 10:44 PM
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If its all fake, the question is who is behind it?

Trump? Some right wing organization? Putin? Some other actor?

We need investigations into that too if these allegations fall apart. If right wing extremists or foreign actors are able to just offer someone a 6 figure check to have this happen, it needs to be published.

Reade seems to have a long history of money problems.
Well, look above. Jacob Wohl and his frequent accomplice Jack Burkman paid a woman to accuse Dr Fauci of Rape.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Wohl
Jacob Wohl (born December 12, 1997 in Greater Los Angeles) is an American far-right conspiracy theorist, fraudster, and internet troll.[15]

Wohl is known for his involvement with lobbyist and conspiracy theorist Jack Burkman in multiple plots that attempted to frame public figures for fictitious sexual assaults, including in October 2018 against U.S. Special Counsel Robert Mueller, in April 2019 against 2020 Democratic presidential candidate Pete Buttigieg, and in April 2020 against White House Coronavirus Task Force member Dr. Anthony Fauci.[14][16][17] Wohl has created and promulgated other false or unfounded claims and conspiracy theories, mainly against Democratic Party politicians such as Joe Biden, Hillary Clinton, Kamala Harris, Ilhan Omar, and Elizabeth Warren.[4][5][18][19][20] To aid his schemes, Wohl has created multiple fake private intelligence agencies, and has fabricated death threats and protests against himself.[21][22] On February 26, 2019, Twitter permanently banned Wohl for violating its rules regarding creating and operating fake accounts.[23]
  #133  
Old 05-15-2020, 11:00 PM
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Yes but I'm sure there are many other right wing organizations that do that. There need to be thorough investigations into this.


As was mentioned above by Jophiel, the PBS investigation found the hallway where she said it happened has no alcoves, and has a lot of foot traffic. So if Biden had done it, there would probably be witnesses.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politic...es-allegations

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The layout of that route and building has not changed. A recent walk through that area showed the subway tunnel contains no out-of-view areas, like an alcove. The remaining portion of the route includes multiple stairwells as well as corridors lined with offices. It is a main thoroughfare for senators and staffers.

Some former staffers told the NewsHour that if Biden did assault Reade in any of these places, it would have been a brazen attack in an area with a high risk of being seen.

“When I worked in the Senate, it was always crowded [and] packed with lobbyists, staff and tourists,” said Sheila Nix, who was Biden’s chief of staff on the 2012 presidential campaign and previously worked as chief of staff to two other Democratic senators.
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Last edited by Wesley Clark; 05-15-2020 at 11:02 PM.
  #134  
Old 05-15-2020, 11:13 PM
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We don't "need thorough investigations" into any of this. That's just digging deeper into the weeds. ANY findings of ANY such investigation - and I mean ANY findings WHATSOEVER - are still going to be called bullshit by the people who want to believe that Biden did this. THERE IS NO POINT. When are people going to realize?
  #135  
Old 05-16-2020, 12:06 AM
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We don't "need thorough investigations" into any of this. That's just digging deeper into the weeds. ANY findings of ANY such investigation - and I mean ANY findings WHATSOEVER - are still going to be called bullshit by the people who want to believe that Biden did this. THERE IS NO POINT. When are people going to realize?
Yeah we do. If Reade is being paid to say these things, that needs to be investigated.

Who gives a fuck what Trump's base thinks. They think Trump is a moral, intelligent person who cares about them on a personal level. They're delusional.

however if there is a domestic or international effort to bribe people into committing slander and libel, it needs to be uncovered and punished.
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  #136  
Old 05-16-2020, 12:08 AM
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Well if her ex landlords say she's a fake rape victim I guess that's it.
No, her ex-landlords say she's a grifter who is constantly looking to have people give her money and free stuff then ditches you with a pile of bills and damaged or stolen property. And someone who only ever spoke well of Biden and name-dropped him numerous times to get access to more services. Including with an attorney who had a background in domestic violence and who Reade hit up for free services and was turned down because the attorney didn't see her as credible.

How people want to incorporate that information into determining the validity of her recent allegations is up to them.
  #137  
Old 05-16-2020, 12:35 AM
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Obvious liar is ever more obvious.
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  #138  
Old 05-16-2020, 05:10 AM
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Next up: Fox News declares Tara Reade's allegations to be now proven to be indisputably true.
Nah, they'll just run with another shiny object - look, Obamagate! - and let Reade drop into the memory hole.
  #139  
Old 05-16-2020, 06:51 AM
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We don't "need thorough investigations" into any of this. That's just digging deeper into the weeds. ANY findings of ANY such investigation - and I mean ANY findings WHATSOEVER - are still going to be called bullshit by the people who want to believe that Biden did this. THERE IS NO POINT. When are people going to realize?
Actually, I'm finding these investigations very helpful and useful. It's a good and positive thing when these, and any allegations, are thoroughly investigated.
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  #140  
Old 05-16-2020, 08:42 AM
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Being a shitty tenant doesn't make you a liar about sexual assault, this is just getting weird. Animals crap on floors owned by people who rent to people who were sexually assaulted who leave without paying rent.

Just admit you don't know what happened and stop being mean.
  #141  
Old 05-16-2020, 09:06 AM
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Being a shitty tenant doesn't make you a liar
No, but being a liar makes you a liar, and if someone has an established history of lying for financial gain or to get rid of a financial burden, then we have established a pattern of conduct, which is material to finding out whether or not we should take her claims of "rape" seriously.

There was once some circumstantial evidence that somewhat supported the idea that her claims could be true, and I until recently, I was among those who openly said I wouldn't be surprised to find out Biden had at some point harassed her somehow.

But the evidence to date has stopped at circumstantial. And now we're finding out that the accuser herself has an established record of deceit, of deceit for financial gain, and of just being a very difficult person to trust. Accusers have rights. The accused also have rights. But above all else, we have the right to judge who's telling the truth. It's not Reade.

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Just admit you don't know what happened and stop being mean.
By that same token, you weren't there, either. Just accusing someone of rape doesn't mean rape occurred. You need evidence to support the claim. I'm seeing a disturbing pattern among some of the "bro-est" of Bernie Bros, which is a tendency to assume that truth and facts are only important to the extent that they support your political leanings. That's not how a healthy democracy works.
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Old 05-16-2020, 09:55 AM
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Just admit you don't know what happened and stop being mean.
You're right. We don't know what happened. The woman making the allegations has changed her story numerous times and has no evidence aside from some friends and family who also changed their stories and shifting claims about a report she may or may not have filed. Her story has numerous holes and question and the best anyone can do to answer them is deflect with some "This is why women don't report; aren't you the real monster for asking questions?" remarks.

However, based on that, this woman demands that the presidential nominee step down and people shouldn't vote for him. Given the lack of evidence she can provide, it's not "mean" to take whatever information is available in establishing this woman's credibility before blindly accepting her account as fact.

Last edited by Jophiel; 05-16-2020 at 09:57 AM.
  #143  
Old 05-16-2020, 04:28 PM
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It's a good case for landlord information to be confidential.
  #144  
Old 05-16-2020, 05:47 PM
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By that same token, you weren't there, either. Just accusing someone of rape doesn't mean rape occurred. You need evidence to support the claim. I'm seeing a disturbing pattern among some of the "bro-est" of Bernie Bros, which is a tendency to assume that truth and facts are only important to the extent that they support your political leanings. That's not how a healthy democracy works.

Yeah, I hope and believe that if it were the other way 'round and Bernie were the target of such a dubious allegation, I'd be equally skeptical. I'm not so sure certain other people who are looking for any excuse to tank Biden would be so consistent.

And BTW, if Biden were to drop out or even die, that doesn't mean Bernie gets to be the nominee. I feel quite confident it would be someone else (although that would be a nightmare because the Bernie crowd would be even more livid than they are now).
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  #145  
Old 05-17-2020, 12:46 AM
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https://www.salon.com/2020/05/07/wom...S1_btireno0cM8

Woman who had accused Dr. Anthony Fauci of sexual assault now claims she was paid to lie about the public health expert by a pair of President Donald Trump's supporters.

The woman says right-wing provocateur Jacob Wohl and his frequent accomplice Jack Burkman persuaded her to cast Fauci as the assailant using details from an actual sexual assault she survived just after high school, and they paid her to do it, reported Reason
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Wow. I am disgusted, but I can’t say as I am completely surprised.
I am not the least little bit surprised.
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  #146  
Old 05-17-2020, 07:13 AM
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It's a good case for landlord information to be confidential.
Did you not read the article? The reporters didn’t dig up some records or something. They interviewed people who used to know Reade. Some of those people had rented her a room. Are they not able to speak about that experience? If Reade can publicly recount her “memories” from decades ago, isn’t it only reasonable that others be allowed the same opportunity?
  #147  
Old 05-17-2020, 09:42 AM
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Did you not read the article? The reporters didn’t dig up some records or something. They interviewed people who used to know Reade. Some of those people had rented her a room. Are they not able to speak about that experience? If Reade can publicly recount her “memories” from decades ago, isn’t it only reasonable that others be allowed the same opportunity?
He apparently just wants trump to win.
  #148  
Old 05-17-2020, 01:14 PM
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It's a good case for landlord information to be confidential.
That's not the only article that challenges her credibility, though, Manwich. There was another investigation by PBS News Hour in which the reporters spoke to more than 70 people who worked with Biden, including a few who remember Reade during her brief time there.

Not one of them supported her claim or even recall a time when she made a claim that was even remotely similar to what she's saying now. Moreover, they called into question the plausibility that her claim could have even occurred as described. The place where she claims the assault took place is pretty much out in the open and visible to passersby. It just doesn't add up.

I get that you don't dig Biden's vibe, but you can't turn an allegation into the truth because that's what you want to believe about him. You need facts and evidence to support an allegation. People listened to Tara Reade. They investigated her claims and her background. They've been investigating Biden's background for years. The evidence doesn't support what Read is saying.

If you want to attack Biden for his politics, you can do so but it hurts your credibility as a poster if you defend someone like Reade and her apparently baseless attacks on Biden.

Last edited by asahi; 05-17-2020 at 01:15 PM.
  #149  
Old 05-17-2020, 02:50 PM
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That's not the only article that challenges her credibility, though, Manwich. There was another investigation by PBS News Hour in which the reporters spoke to more than 70 people who worked with Biden, including a few who remember Reade during her brief time there.

Not one of them supported her claim or even recall a time when she made a claim that was even remotely similar to what she's saying now. Moreover, they called into question the plausibility that her claim could have even occurred as described. The place where she claims the assault took place is pretty much out in the open and visible to passersby. It just doesn't add up.

I get that you don't dig Biden's vibe, but you can't turn an allegation into the truth because that's what you want to believe about him. You need facts and evidence to support an allegation. People listened to Tara Reade. They investigated her claims and her background. They've been investigating Biden's background for years. The evidence doesn't support what Read is saying.

If you want to attack Biden for his politics, you can do so but it hurts your credibility as a poster if you defend someone like Reade and her apparently baseless attacks on Biden.
My feelings exactly and expressed far better than I could.

I’ve met people like Tara Reade. They’re toxic. You try to help a broken bird and you get bit. There’s always a sob story that’s constantly changing and you wonder if they even know what the truth is.

And yes, her story about the assault is just not believable. It sounds like a scene from a really bad Lifetime movie.


Washington isn’t like Hollywood. You don’t sleep your way to the top. A job like Tara’s is a dead end job that you hold for a year or two as a resume builder and networking opportunity.
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  #150  
Old 05-17-2020, 03:01 PM
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..

And yes, her story about the assault is just not believable. It sounds like a scene from a really bad Lifetime movie.
...y.
Oddly it sounds exactly, almost word for word, like a scene in a self-published novel her father wrote.
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