Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-17-2019, 12:14 PM
XT's Avatar
XT is offline
Agnatheist
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: The Great South West
Posts: 35,115

And now, for something completely different! (Discuss Idiocracy, the movie)


Yes, this thread won't be about China, or about Trump, or about politics. It's about the movie Idioracy. I'm putting this in IMHO, because it's more an opinion thing. Basically, the discussion from my perspective is based on this YouTube video called: IDIOCRACY: Is It Deep or Dumb? – Wisecrack Edition, BUTT (or, I should say by), of course, Wisecrack. It's one of the channels I subscribe too, and basically they critique movies to see if they are insightful or informative, or if the movies sort of miss the mark in what they are trying to do. So, a few things. First off, obviously, spoilers for the movie will almost certainly be happening, so if you don't want the movie (from 14 or so years ago) to be spoiled, you should probably move along. Secondly, you don't have to watch the video, as always...I provide it because I found it interesting. Based on past responses, that means only I will find it interesting.

Why this movie? I've seen this movie mentioned quite a bit in the past on the board, usually in passing, and mostly by using quotes or phrases from it that the posters don't go into detail about but are there and usually make me laugh or smile. I liked the movie when it came out, and watched it again a few months ago when it popped up on HBO. I don't think the movie is really insightful or predictive, so I agree with the video that it misses the mark. To me, the irony is that a lot of people who DO think the movie is some sort of prophetic vision of the future are doing so from a very biased and uninformed basis. Something I could see pseudo intellectual types with pretensions thinking is the trajectory we are on. It seems a lot of people think the world is getting dummer (it's not), that populations are out of control and it will be the 'stupid' people who take over (they aren't and it's not), that crime is out of control (it isn't) the world is going to hell in a hand cart (it isn't) and dogs and cats living together (ok...they actually are in this case) with MASS HYSTERIA!!! The reality is far different than the narrative, and I think that this movie demonstrates the narrative, but misses (mostly) the reality.

I still love the movie. It's one of my own dirty pleasures to watch it and if you haven't seen it (why are you still here?? SPOILERS!!) I recommend watching it at least once.

Anyway...thoughts?
__________________
-XT

That's what happens when you let rednecks play with anti-matter!

Last edited by XT; 04-17-2019 at 12:15 PM.
  #2  
Old 04-17-2019, 12:47 PM
awldune is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: NC
Posts: 1,730
Many people love the movie. It has a great premise. The actually movie is pretty unwatchable IMO.

Also surely this should be in CS?

Last edited by awldune; 04-17-2019 at 12:48 PM.
  #3  
Old 04-17-2019, 12:54 PM
Asimovian's Avatar
Asimovian is offline
Member
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maryland
Posts: 11,731
Moderator Note

Quote:
Originally Posted by awldune View Post
Also surely this should be in CS?
Agreed. Whatever the genre, if you're looking for discussion about the movie, Cafe Society would be the most appropriate venue. I'll relocate it from IMHO.
  #4  
Old 04-17-2019, 01:35 PM
Chronos's Avatar
Chronos is offline
Charter Member
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: The Land of Cleves
Posts: 83,796
One common mistake people make about this movie is thinking it's about the future. It's not. Like most science fiction, it's set in the future. But like all science fiction (and, indeed, most fiction of any sort), it's about the present. The main underlying premise is not that we're getting stupid, but that we already are. It's just exaggerated in the movie to drive the point home.

Which is also why the movie never shows us just who is making all of this wondrous technology that's so well-engineered that even idiots can use it.
  #5  
Old 04-17-2019, 01:45 PM
iiandyiiii's Avatar
iiandyiiii is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 34,498
I thought it was a sharp satire of consumer and advertising culture. And lots of funny jokes that were based on general absurdity.
  #6  
Old 04-17-2019, 01:51 PM
RealityChuck's Avatar
RealityChuck is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Schenectady, NY, USA
Posts: 42,580
It cribbed shamelessly from from Cyril Kornbluth's "The Marching Morons" (and his other works). At the very least, they should have given his estate credit.

I do like the movie, but the fact it was using another author's work left a bad taste in my mouth.
__________________
"If a person saying he was something was all there was to it, this country'd be full of rich men and good-looking women. Too bad it isn't that easy.... In short, when someone else says you're a writer, that's when you're a writer... not before."
Purveyor of fine science fiction since 1982.
  #7  
Old 04-17-2019, 01:54 PM
Just Asking Questions is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 7,035
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronos View Post
Which is also why the movie never shows us just who is making all of this wondrous technology that's so well-engineered that even idiots can use it.
Brilliant people who have been dead for a long, long time. Their society is running on inertia. Things are breaking down, and no one knows how to fix them. A plane crashes during the movie and no one seems to even notice. "My first wife was 'tarded. She's a pilot now.."

I think a point lost by casual viewers is that the society is right on the verge of a country-wide famine. Once they started using Brawndo on plants, they have no food growing at all. Take the throw-away scene with the Carl's Jr kiosk. It didn't give food because the machine was broke, or run by idiots, but because there is no food! If it wasn't for Joe, 70-100% of America would be dead within a year. And they wouldn't even know it was happening.

Last edited by Just Asking Questions; 04-17-2019 at 01:56 PM.
  #8  
Old 04-17-2019, 01:56 PM
Chronos's Avatar
Chronos is offline
Charter Member
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: The Land of Cleves
Posts: 83,796
It's not really all that similar to Kornbluth's work. Those weren't about humanity getting dumber, but about humanity splitting into a dumb population and a smart one.
  #9  
Old 04-17-2019, 02:03 PM
XT's Avatar
XT is offline
Agnatheist
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: The Great South West
Posts: 35,115
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asimovian View Post
Moderator Note

Agreed. Whatever the genre, if you're looking for discussion about the movie, Cafe Society would be the most appropriate venue. I'll relocate it from IMHO.
That's fine. Sorry I didn't put it in there to start, figured it was an IMHO sort of thing.
__________________
-XT

That's what happens when you let rednecks play with anti-matter!
  #10  
Old 04-17-2019, 02:22 PM
xizor's Avatar
xizor is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Nashville, TN
Posts: 5,449
It is funny to note in the 13 years since the movie came out, how large the anti-vax movement has grown, or how many people will now blindly believe a "fact" if it is printed on a meme. The dumbing down of society is already here.
  #11  
Old 04-17-2019, 03:17 PM
Larry Borgia's Avatar
Larry Borgia is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Washington DC
Posts: 10,524
Quote:
Originally Posted by xizor View Post
It is funny to note in the 13 years since the movie came out, how large the anti-vax movement has grown, or how many people will now blindly believe a "fact" if it is printed on a meme. The dumbing down of society is already here.
But that's the point of the video linked in the OP. The problem isn't anti-intellectualism, it's pseudo-intellectualism. Flat earthers and anti-vaxxers construct complicated arguments for their positions. They are complete BS, but they are more than "Does that look round to you!?" or "Ain't nobody sticking no needle in my baby!" People aren't any more dumb than they ever were, but the new media allows misinformation to spread incredibly fast.
  #12  
Old 04-17-2019, 03:25 PM
Dinsdale is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: May 2000
Posts: 18,311
As I recall - I thought it started out quite good, but then ran out of steam. Really loved the very beginning part, when they discuss why some folk have fewer offspring than others.
__________________
I used to be disgusted.
Now I try to be amused.
  #13  
Old 04-17-2019, 03:47 PM
Wesley Clark is online now
2018 Midterm Prediction Winner
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 21,993
I liked the movie for multiple reasons. For one less educated people actually do have more kids. I'm not sure of the connection between iq and fertility but there is a negative correlation between education and fertility. It won't matter as biotechnology and machine intelligence advance but it's a trend.

But also idiocracy is actually better than a real life idiocracy.

The president was black and people tolerated different races. Women held positions of power. The leaders admitted when they were wrong and needed help from people smarter than themselves. None of that happens in a real life idiocracy.
__________________
Sometimes I doubt your commitment to sparkle motion
  #14  
Old 04-17-2019, 03:58 PM
Ludovic is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: America's Wing
Posts: 29,984
I never saw the movie: does it feature a man with a tape recorder in his nose?
  #15  
Old 04-17-2019, 05:42 PM
Ellis Dee is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: New England
Posts: 14,230
"Son, have you ever heard the expression 'Lead, follow, or get out of the way'?"

"Yeah, I always got out of the way."
  #16  
Old 04-17-2019, 08:30 PM
manson1972's Avatar
manson1972 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 11,399
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronos View Post
Which is also why the movie never shows us just who is making all of this wondrous technology that's so well-engineered that even idiots can use it.
I too always wondered that.
  #17  
Old 04-17-2019, 08:54 PM
Locrian is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Valley Village, CA
Posts: 4,217
I'd discuss, but I'm watching guys get kicked in the nuts on TV.
  #18  
Old 04-17-2019, 10:04 PM
RealityChuck's Avatar
RealityChuck is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Schenectady, NY, USA
Posts: 42,580
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronos View Post
It's not really all that similar to Kornbluth's work. Those weren't about humanity getting dumber, but about humanity splitting into a dumb population and a smart one.
No, it was about society getting dumber, and for the exact same reason shown in the movie. The only difference was that in Kornbluth some people saw the trend and managed to keep things from falling into chaos.

They also both had the device of putting the protagonist into suspended animation. Common enough, but I can't believe the screenwriters never read Kornbluth.

They didn't use Kornbluth's ending, which is very problematic, not to mention that it contradicts itself. ("It's impossible to do this." "Now we're doing that and it's working.")
__________________
"If a person saying he was something was all there was to it, this country'd be full of rich men and good-looking women. Too bad it isn't that easy.... In short, when someone else says you're a writer, that's when you're a writer... not before."
Purveyor of fine science fiction since 1982.
  #19  
Old 04-17-2019, 10:14 PM
Leaper is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: In my own little world...
Posts: 12,568
Isn’t that the eugenics movie?

  #20  
Old 04-17-2019, 10:44 PM
Horatius is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Ottawa, ON
Posts: 1,111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wesley Clark View Post
The leaders admitted when they were wrong and needed help from people smarter than themselves. None of that happens in a real life idiocracy.


This right here is why I get annoyed whenever I see someone compare Trump to President Camacho. We'd be way better off if Trump were as "stupid" as President Camacho.
  #21  
Old 04-18-2019, 01:46 AM
Just Asking Questions is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 7,035
Quote:
Originally Posted by Horatius View Post
This right here is why I get annoyed whenever I see someone compare Trump to President Camacho. We'd be way better off if Trump were as "stupid" as President Camacho.
The proper comparison isn't Camacho and trump. It's the people that voted for trump and the average citizen in the movie.
  #22  
Old 04-18-2019, 02:16 AM
bucketybuck is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Ireland
Posts: 3,193
I must be one of the few people who enjoyed this movie for itself without worrying too much about the deeper message. I get what the satire is of course, but as an amusing story with some great quotes I'll always happily sit and watch if I come across it channel hopping.
  #23  
Old 04-18-2019, 06:28 AM
Jonathan Chance is offline
Domo Arigato Mister Moderato
Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: On the run with Kilroy
Posts: 22,717
Actually, I think the movie makes its point fairly clear.

The real critique of the movie - other than the broad ones - is in the audience reaction. It provides an excuse for certain people to feel superior to the masses even when they are part of the masses.

A great part of the intended reaction to the movie is for people to point and mock the stupidity of the people in it. That's fine. But that doesn't actually make the people doing the mockery any better or smarter than the people being mocked.

The people who say things like, "Yes, this is where we're heading" would be the ones bringing us there if we were actually going there. But we're not, of course. The world gets smarter and more accomplished every decade. We make dumb decisions sometimes, as a group, but in general the trend is upward. Art becomes better at expression, technology becomes more convenient and useful and society becomes more open.

The movie really serves as a foil to allow those who feel a need to be superior to feel that way. It's not unlike that XKCD cartoon that shows a subway car where each person is feeling superior to the 'sheep' around them.

https://xkcd.com/610/

We're all in this together, my friends.
  #24  
Old 04-18-2019, 08:13 AM
Icarus's Avatar
Icarus is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: In front of my PC, y tu?
Posts: 5,118
No, you are all wrong!

The real critique is that the movie doesn't show people on the internet all day arguing about trivial matters.
  #25  
Old 04-18-2019, 09:54 AM
Just Asking Questions is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 7,035
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icarus View Post
No, you are all wrong!

The real critique is that the movie doesn't show people on the internet all day arguing about trivial matters.
Can't post. 'Batin'.
  #26  
Old 04-18-2019, 11:45 AM
Horatius is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Ottawa, ON
Posts: 1,111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Icarus View Post
No, you are all wrong!

The real critique is that the movie doesn't show people on the internet all day arguing about trivial matters.


Naw, that would require reading words like some kind of fag.
  #27  
Old 04-18-2019, 12:13 PM
ElvisL1ves is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: The land of the mouse
Posts: 49,777
And your shit's all retarded.
  #28  
Old 04-18-2019, 01:58 PM
xizor's Avatar
xizor is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Nashville, TN
Posts: 5,449
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElvisL1ves View Post
And your shit's all retarded.
Wait, do you like sex AND money? Me too!
  #29  
Old 04-18-2019, 02:59 PM
furryman's Avatar
furryman is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Collinwood, Collinsport
Posts: 3,924
It's not a bad movie, but I feel like they ran out of good jokes after the first 15 minutes. If you ever want to see something hilarious and totally not safe for work look up the Brawndo commercial on Youtube.

Last edited by furryman; 04-18-2019 at 03:00 PM.
  #30  
Old 04-18-2019, 03:36 PM
bucketybuck is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Ireland
Posts: 3,193
Quote:
Originally Posted by furryman View Post
If you ever want to see something hilarious and totally not safe for work look up the Brawndo commercial on Youtube.
Its got electrolytes.
  #31  
Old 04-18-2019, 05:02 PM
Chronos's Avatar
Chronos is offline
Charter Member
Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: The Land of Cleves
Posts: 83,796
But the movie isn't about them. It's about us.
  #32  
Old 04-18-2019, 06:35 PM
F. U. Shakespeare is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Baltimore or less
Posts: 4,129
There are a few priceless, life-imitates-art moments:
- The tower clock blinking 12:00. There's a working class town near Baltimore that has a tower clock that's pretty much always wrong.
- When it came out in 2005, Jesse Ventura had already been mentioned as a future presidential candidate. Anyone want to bet how long until a porn star steps up?
But the overall product just doesn't cut it.
  #33  
Old 04-19-2019, 10:46 AM
Horatius is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Ottawa, ON
Posts: 1,111
Quote:
Originally Posted by F. U. Shakespeare View Post
There are a few priceless, life-imitates-art moments:
- The tower clock blinking 12:00. There's a working class town near Baltimore that has a tower clock that's pretty much always wrong.
- When it came out in 2005, Jesse Ventura had already been mentioned as a future presidential candidate. Anyone want to bet how long until a porn star steps up?
But the overall product just doesn't cut it.


And on that note: Camacho's speech to Congress, where he starts off, "Shit. I know shit's fucked up right now..." As they pan around, you see that's literally what's on his Teleprompter.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGUNPMPrxvA

Last edited by Horatius; 04-19-2019 at 10:48 AM.
  #34  
Old 04-21-2019, 08:14 PM
TBG is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 9,067
Quote:
Originally Posted by bucketybuck View Post
Its got electrolytes.

What plants crave.
  #35  
Old 05-30-2019, 03:29 AM
Mijin's Avatar
Mijin is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Shanghai
Posts: 8,993
Re-opening this pseudo-zombie because by coincidence I also saw this 13 year-old movie recently.

I disagree with those who say it ran out of steam after the first 15 minutes -- I thought it was all great, apart from maybe the finale where it dipped a little. For example, the scene where he's trying to convince the senators to use water instead of brawndo is about 2/3 in, and is arguably the best scene in the movie. Terry Crews doesn't appear until the second half I think and he's in great form in this movie (I also enjoyed Dax's performance (the lawyer)). Altogether the running time went by very fast for me.

And I am going to admit I cracked up laughing when they showed the guy getting hit in the balls TV show. So...I guess I'm part of the problem

I have recommended the movie to a couple of chinese friends. That'll be interesting...their society does not share many of the same concerns that this movie is based on, although some of course are universal.
  #36  
Old 05-30-2019, 07:40 AM
flaming yawn is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: central ma
Posts: 229
This movie is quoted in our house at least once every 2 weeks.

"Water? Like what's in the toilet?"
  #37  
Old 06-01-2019, 12:03 AM
Mcmechanic is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 66
Here in one of the fly-over states, we even enjoy this movie. My trump supporter friends see it as an indictment as to the reality of progressive policies over time, and that’s hilarious evidently. I tend to just laugh along with them, for different reasons.
  #38  
Old 06-01-2019, 01:30 AM
TriPolar is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: rhode island
Posts: 40,367
It's not a documentary?

Last edited by TriPolar; 06-01-2019 at 01:30 AM.
  #39  
Old 06-01-2019, 01:55 PM
k9bfriender is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 10,946
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriPolar View Post
It's not a documentary?
It, as is the case with most dystopian sci-fi, is a warning.
  #40  
Old 06-12-2019, 09:09 PM
TBG is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 9,067
Welcome to costco, I love you.
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:01 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@straightdope.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Copyright 2018 STM Reader, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017