Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-25-2018, 12:26 PM
Snowboarder Bo's Avatar
Snowboarder Bo is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 28,914

Republicans are ALWAYS the REAL victims! :rolleyes:


I'm getting sick of this shit, so I'm starting a thread to post examples of Republicans using this ploy. Here's the first entry, from New Hampshire.
Quote:
In an interview, Wazirís Republican opponent, Dennis Soucy, said he has been unfairly labeled as sexist and racist. He described growing up so poor in Manchester that he washed the familyís clothes in the polluted Merrimack River and got his first job at age 11.

ďIím the victim here,Ē he said. ďWe struggled, and here we are ó everyone is jumping all over her for doing absolutely nothing, for being a refugee.Ē
Yeah, she did nothing... nothing except learn a new language and culture and become proficient enough in it to put together a serious run for political office. At just 27 years old. While raising two daughters. After working two jobs and earning a college diploma.

That's a lot of "nothing" in 10 years.

So no, you aren't the real victim here, Dennis Soucy. You've lived in the most advanced society on the planet your whole life, never even having to relocate to a new country with a new language and culture once, let alone twice like Mrs. Wazir. You're no victim.
  #2  
Old 10-25-2018, 12:34 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
So, what is the ethic focused on here?

Who is the bigger victim?

Seems like a shitty criteria.
  #3  
Old 10-25-2018, 12:36 PM
manson1972's Avatar
manson1972 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,009
How about "If you say you are a victim, and you aren't actually a victim of anything, you are a douchebag"?
  #4  
Old 10-25-2018, 12:37 PM
Snowboarder Bo's Avatar
Snowboarder Bo is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 28,914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
So, what is the ethic focused on here?

Who is the bigger victim?

Seems like a shitty criteria.
You're just a repulsive asshole with bad reading comprehension, aren't you?
  #5  
Old 10-25-2018, 12:49 PM
Grrr!'s Avatar
Grrr! is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 16,917
Quote:
“We have to take care of our own,” he said. “We have to make America what it was.”
Wow, guess he traded in his dog whistle for a bullhorn.
  #6  
Old 10-25-2018, 12:51 PM
Paranoid Randroid's Avatar
Paranoid Randroid is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Dayton, OH
Posts: 1,956
This isn’t intended to be a “Democrats do it too!”, but the remarks of Dick Patten — whom Wazir defeated in the primary — were pretty astonishing as well:

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Guardian
At the polls, he told the Concord Monitor that minorities who recently arrived to Concord were “getting everything”. Speaking to the Boston Globe, he said: “It used to be the Heights would support a Heights person … but the Heights has changed, basically, from what it used to be. We have many immigrants in there now, and she’s from Afghanistan so she was treated like the princess.”
So he’s backing her opponent. Sounds like a pretty classy guy, I have to say.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...representative
  #7  
Old 10-25-2018, 12:56 PM
Kimstu is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 23,276
I think it's hard to beat the performance of Alabama State Representative (and former state Trump campaign co-chair) Ed Henry defending Senate candidate Roy Moore against sexual-misconduct allegations:
Quote:
State Rep. Ed Henry, a staunch supporter of Roy Moore's Senate campaign, said Friday he believes that Moore is the victim after being accused of sexual misconduct by a then-14-year-old girl. [...]

"I believe, in this instance, the accused is the victim." [...] "I don't believe them," Henry said of Moore's accusers. [...]

Henry said the women should be "accomplices" for any crimes that may have been committed because they did not come forward and, by their silence, helped cover up any crime.

"If anybody knows of a crime that there's a predator out there and you sit back and wait for 40 years to say anything about it and let those kinds of things happen, then you should be as guilty as they are for allowing that to occur," Henry said.
I mean, wow. "THEY'RE LIARS SLANDERING AN INNOCENT MAN BUT IF THIS INNOCENT VICTIM OF SLANDER WAS IN FACT A PREDATOR THEN HIS CRIMES ARE TOTALLY THEIR FAULT FOR NOT ACCUSING HIM EARLIER."
  #8  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:11 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo View Post
You're just a repulsive asshole with bad reading comprehension, aren't you?
Yes. Youíve unmasked me.
  #9  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:14 PM
Little Nemo is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Western New York
Posts: 85,094
Pretty bad. But I think Trump publicly apologizing to Brett Kavanaugh is worse: "On behalf of our nation, I want to apologize to Brett and the entire Kavanaugh family for the terrible pain and suffering you have been forced to endure."

http://time.com/5419064/trump-apolog...h-swearing-in/
  #10  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:14 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by manson1972 View Post
How about "If you say you are a victim, and you aren't actually a victim of anything, you are a douchebag"?
Whatís so fucking great about being a victim?

Why is this a thing that conveys worth?
  #11  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:18 PM
manson1972's Avatar
manson1972 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
Whatís so fucking great about being a victim?

Why is this a thing that conveys worth?
I don't think being a victim conveys worth. I think that claiming you're a victim when you're not conveys assholism.
  #12  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:20 PM
Grrr!'s Avatar
Grrr! is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 16,917
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
Whatís so fucking great about being a victim?

Why is this a thing that conveys worth?
Dude, WTF are you on about? Just go ahead and say what you want to say and stop with Socratic bs.
  #13  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:28 PM
Kimstu is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 23,276
Quote:
Originally Posted by manson1972 View Post
I think that claiming you're a victim when you're not conveys assholism.
Especially when it's used by somebody who's done something shitty to somebody else and then adds insult to injury by saying "Hey, MY suffering is what's important here".

Even if you are a victim of attacks provoked by your own shitty behavior, you should not be trying to focus attention on your own suffering. Example: the W. Virginia county official Pamela Taylor who posted on Facebook calling Michelle Obama "a Ape in heels" and then whined about people calling her racist.
  #14  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:32 PM
Thudlow Boink's Avatar
Thudlow Boink is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Lincoln, IL
Posts: 28,636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grrr! View Post
Quote:
ďWe have to take care of our own,Ē he said. ďWe have to make America what it was.Ē
Wow, guess he traded in his dog whistle for a bullhorn.
Yeah, that jumped out at me, too.

That said: Just from reading the OP, before I clicked through to the article, I didn't understand what the big deal was. It quoted Republican Guy as saying that he had been unfairly accused of racism and sexism and of having had it easy, without explaining why these weren't unfair accusations. So: Semi-fail.
  #15  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:33 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by manson1972 View Post
I don't think being a victim conveys worth. I think that claiming you're a victim when you're not conveys assholism.
No one tries to claim something that has no value.
  #16  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:37 PM
manson1972's Avatar
manson1972 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
No one tries to claim something that has no value.
Well, he claimed he was a victim. And yet you say being a victim has no value.

So, why do YOU think he claimed it then?
  #17  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:41 PM
Snowboarder Bo's Avatar
Snowboarder Bo is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 28,914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
Yes. Youíve unmasked me.
You unmasked yourself. Take some personal responsibility ffs.
  #18  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:52 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by manson1972 View Post
Well, he claimed he was a victim. And yet you say being a victim has no value.

So, why do YOU think he claimed it then?
Because victim hood conveys value. It gives you both sympathy and status. It can give you protection against some criticisms, an it can give you an authority to speak out on topics others canít because of your ďperspective.Ē It can give you an authority.

It can be very very useful. It can be very attractive.
  #19  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:53 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo View Post
You unmasked yourself. Take some personal responsibility ffs.
Your modest. You deserve the credit.
  #20  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:56 PM
manson1972's Avatar
manson1972 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
Because victim hood conveys value. It gives you both sympathy and status. It can give you protection against some criticisms, an it can give you an authority to speak out on topics others canít because of your ďperspective.Ē It can give you an authority.

It can be very very useful. It can be very attractive.
If you think that, then why did you ask this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
Whatís so fucking great about being a victim?

Why is this a thing that conveys worth?
  #21  
Old 10-25-2018, 01:58 PM
crowmanyclouds's Avatar
crowmanyclouds is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: ... hiding in my room ...
Posts: 4,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
Because victim hood conveys value. It gives you both sympathy and status. It can give you protection against some criticisms, an it can give you an authority to speak out on topics others canít because of your ďperspective.Ē It can give you an authority.

It can be very very useful. It can be very attractive.
Kinda like claiming to have waterboarded yourself so you could say how awful it is instead of accepting what EVERYONE else was saying about it?

CMC fnord!
  #22  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:03 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by manson1972 View Post
If you think that, then why did you ask this:
I was hoping you or somebody else would say it.

The fact is that victim hood does convey those things, because society grants them to victims.

I can think of no reason why this should be so.
  #23  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:06 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by crowmanyclouds View Post
Kinda like claiming to have waterboarded yourself so you could say how awful it is instead of accepting what EVERYONE else was saying about it?

CMC fnord!
No. Itís kind of hard to claim victim hood about something you do to yourself deliberately. What that was was attention whoring, not victim hood.
  #24  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:10 PM
manson1972's Avatar
manson1972 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
I was hoping you or somebody else would say it.

The fact is that victim hood does convey those things, because society grants them to victims.

I can think of no reason why this should be so.
Maybe, but I wouldn't value someone more because they were a victim. I might have sympathy, but I wouldn't say "Well, he/she was a victim, therefore they are better suited to be a Congressman or whatever"
  #25  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:11 PM
Kimstu is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 23,276
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
I was hoping you or somebody else would say it.
Uh, you asked a question you felt you already knew the answer to because you were hoping that somebody else would express your own opinion?

Ok, whatever.

Back on topic, I think complaints about liberal "incivility" from conservatives who've been jeering "fuck your feelings" at "libtards" also fall into this category.
  #26  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:15 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
And actually iím Kind of proud of that!

I became internet famous over that, and got emails from journalists wanting to see me and interview me over that thread, including the WSJ.

The best thing though was that I started a trend. I wouldnít do it again or be interviewed about it, so several journalists went out and got waterboarded on tv after that. It became a thing for a while.

And, I would like to think that in some small way, that brought attention to the very real fact that it is torture, and possibly limited or ceased itís use in some circumstances.

I started the whole thing. I was the first. Itís awesome. I actually changed the world for the better, even if it was just a little bit, while goofing off on the internet.

Thanks for bringing that up!
  #27  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:16 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by manson1972 View Post
Maybe, but I wouldn't value someone more because they were a victim. I might have sympathy, but I wouldn't say "Well, he/she was a victim, therefore they are better suited to be a Congressman or whatever"
Well, good! Me too.

But I do sense that that is happening to some degree. Donít you?
  #28  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:18 PM
BigT's Avatar
BigT is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: "Hicksville", Ark.
Posts: 37,271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
So, what is the ethic focused on here?

Who is the bigger victim?

Seems like a shitty criteria.
When you first came back, you didn't seem to want to be disingenuous. You offered long, thoughtful statements about the subjects actually being brought up. Sure, I pointed out flaws, but at least you seemed to be trying to engage rationally.

Now you're trying basic bullshit tactics. Short statements to make it look like you're winning, while trying to shift the conversation away from the actual topic. The OP pointed out that a Republican was claiming fake victimhood, so you try to attack the OP for bringing up the concept. Nevermind he only brought it up because the Republican did.

And, yes, part of the point was just to piss off the OP so they'd attack you, again distracting from the topic of the thread.

Let me make this fucking clear: we're not idiots here. You can't pull this shit. Even if some people fall for it, others will point out your deceit.

Engage honestly, or don't engage at all. Or, well, be treated like octopus--ironically a poster who likes to pretend to be the victim.
  #29  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:21 PM
Kimstu is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 23,276
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
But I do sense that that is happening to some degree. Donít you?
No. Except of course in the case of something like granting refugee status, where the severity of somebody's victimization is supposed to be a factor in the decision.

I'm not seeing anybody making the case that the mere fact of having been a victim automatically gives someone more claim to something that has nothing to do with their victimization. Can you give some specific examples of where you "sense that that is happening"?
  #30  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:23 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimstu View Post
Uh, you asked a question you felt you already knew the answer to because you were hoping that somebody else would express your own opinion?

Ok, whatever.

Back on topic, I think complaints about liberal "incivility" from conservatives who've been jeering "fuck your feelings" at "libtards" also fall into this category.

Yes. I agree.

Where we disagree is that this is one of these things that is not a liberal/conservative thing, but a human thing.

Victim hood - people against me donít know how I feel, and are insensitive to what I am going through. People who are against me, donít deserve sympathy and understanding, and their feelings are not legitimate as they serve a bad end. This is a human thing, not a political thing. We all feel this way.

Another one is the whole rape/abuse of women issue. As far as I can tell there is no correlation between a manís politics and whether or not he is a sexual predator, yet we all like to pretend itís indicative when the other dide does it.
  #31  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:32 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
When you first came back, you didn't seem to want to be disingenuous. You offered long, thoughtful statements about the subjects actually being brought up. Sure, I pointed out flaws, but at least you seemed to be trying to engage rationally.

Now you're trying basic bullshit tactics. Short statements to make it look like you're winning, while trying to shift the conversation away from the actual topic. The OP pointed out that a Republican was claiming fake victimhood, so you try to attack the OP for bringing up the concept. Nevermind he only brought it up because the Republican did.

And, yes, part of the point was just to piss off the OP so they'd attack you, again distracting from the topic of the thread.

Let me make this fucking clear: we're not idiots here. You can't pull this shit. Even if some people fall for it, others will point out your deceit.

Engage honestly, or don't engage at all. Or, well, be treated like octopus--ironically a poster who likes to pretend to be the victim.

Your critique of my debating style is not interesting to me, so iíll Address the part that you are missing that is.

Some asshole politician acting like an asshole is not interesting. It is like bitching about the rain.

What is interesting though is what he is being an asshole about, which is victimhood.

It has enough political capital that politicians are willing to fight and debate about their victim status in order to claim it (whether actual or fraudulent.)

Which is interesting and pit worthy because, in my opinion it doesnít rationally mean anything, but we are not questioning that.
  #32  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:32 PM
iiandyiiii's Avatar
iiandyiiii is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 37,403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
Another one is the whole rape/abuse of women issue. As far as I can tell there is no correlation between a manís politics and whether or not he is a sexual predator, yet we all like to pretend itís indicative when the other dide does it.
I agree with this. But there is a difference, in the last year or two (not much before then), how the "two sides" respond when one of their own is credibly accused of sexual assault. The Democrats have, finally, begun to actually respond with decency and care and hold their own responsible, in general. The Republicans have not, in general. Most Republicans in office (and most of their supporters) continue to support and celebrate a man who bragged about sexual assault and violating the consent of women, and has been credibly accused by multiple women, as well as refusing to fully investigate credible allegations against their SCOTUS nominee.
  #33  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:36 PM
Kimstu is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 23,276
Another one for the books: Republican Congressman Claimed There Was a 'Racial War' in America Started by Blacks on Whites
Quote:
Republican Congressman Jason Lewis of Minnesota [...] claimed black people have an "entitlement mentality" and warned that were waging a "racial war" against white people.

"There's a cultural problem in the African-American community that is leading to this. The entitlement mentality," Lewis said [...]

Lewis, who is is also up for re-election this year, claimed such a mentality led to violence in the black community.

"You're a victim. It's OK to hate [...]"

Lewis's disparaging comments about black people did not end there. He has falsely claimed that "the real victims of most racial violence are not are not members of the minorities in America. They are white people."

In one instance, he claimed there was a "racial war" already ongoing in the United States.
See, black people shouldn't have an "entitlement mentality" about being "victims" just because of little stuff like slavery and lynchings and Jim Crow and persistent racism and racial discrimination. But it's totally legit for white people to think of themselves as "the real victims" of a "racial war"!
  #34  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:38 PM
manson1972's Avatar
manson1972 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
Well, good! Me too.

But I do sense that that is happening to some degree. Donít you?
Sure. That's why he's claiming to be a victim. Like I said, it's assholish.
  #35  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:39 PM
BigT's Avatar
BigT is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: "Hicksville", Ark.
Posts: 37,271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimstu View Post
No. Except of course in the case of something like granting refugee status, where the severity of somebody's victimization is supposed to be a factor in the decision.

I'm not seeing anybody making the case that the mere fact of having been a victim automatically gives someone more claim to something that has nothing to do with their victimization. Can you give some specific examples of where you "sense that that is happening"?
You already pointed out his deliberate dishonesty and attempt to hijack the thread.

There is no need to continue with his hijack, or point out how no one has said something. Of course they haven't: that's him being dishonest.

I post about how this board doesn't fall for this shit. Please don't make a liar out of me.
  #36  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:45 PM
steatopygia's Avatar
steatopygia is offline
Experimental FOC Test Pilot
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: North Idaho mostly
Posts: 2,161
Scylla, what has changed in your life?

You went from being an interesting and funny writer to someone who wastes his time defending assholes.

Seriously. I don't understand. I'm fine with conservative views. I am very fiscally conservative. But the Republican party has become the party of the stupid, not the party of conservatives. And you are pretty much just posting to defend that.

What happened?
  #37  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:49 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by iiandyiiii View Post
I agree with this. But there is a difference, in the last year or two (not much before then), how the "two sides" respond when one of their own is credibly accused of sexual assault. The Democrats have, finally, begun to actually respond with decency and care and hold their own responsible, in general. The Republicans have not, in general. Most Republicans in office (and most of their supporters) continue to support and celebrate a man who bragged about sexual assault and violating the consent of women, and has been credibly accused by multiple women, as well as refusing to fully investigate credible allegations against their SCOTUS nominee.
I watched every second of the Blasey/Kavanaugh hearings twice. The accusation was not credible enough to be a reasonable factor. I feel confident that I would apply the same standard had he been a Democratic nominee. It was played very much like a last minute smear by the Democrats, and I think that the way they used and treated Ford was really shitty.

Trump is very problematic. No question. He is horrible to women. He is pretty obvious about it. No way around that.

You seem to view this as evolutionary, like the Democrats are getting better and the Republicans are getting worse. I doubt that. I think if Clinton were in office, the Democrats would be treating him the way they did when he was.
  #38  
Old 10-25-2018, 02:57 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by steatopygia View Post
Scylla, what has changed in your life?

You went from being an interesting and funny writer to someone who wastes his time defending assholes.

Seriously. I don't understand. I'm fine with conservative views. I am very fiscally conservative. But the Republican party has become the party of the stupid, not the party of conservatives. And you are pretty much just posting to defend that.

What happened?

I donít post funny stuff online because it gets stolen. The people who steal it occasionally get caught and try to defend themselves by suggesting I stole it from them. I just write those things for myself.

And, Iím really not defending Republicans/conservatives, at least not as my mission.

I am trying to go after myopic political viewpoints. You know, reopen the dialogue, promote healthy self-analysis and an open criticism to oneís own viewpoints, a sympathy to opposing viewpoints, the realization that we live in the best of times, agree on 90% of things, should be greatful, etc etc.

Basically, I am trying to heal the political rift and bring the country together again.

How have you been?
  #39  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:06 PM
Chingon is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: the hypersphere
Posts: 953
It's rain, seriously.
  #40  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:07 PM
Bryan Ekers's Avatar
Bryan Ekers is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 59,965
Stop dog-piling on Scylla. It's not his fault that his mom smoked too much crack while pregnant with him, but that's not her fault since she was recovering from a beating from her pimp and had to self-medicate because she lacked access to an affordable health-insurance option, so blame the Democrats!
  #41  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:09 PM
Snowboarder Bo's Avatar
Snowboarder Bo is online now
Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 28,914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
Basically, I am trying to heal the political rift and bring the country together again.
Liar.
  #42  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:23 PM
Scylla is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 16,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo View Post
Liar.
Goddamn it! Nothing slips by you.
  #43  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:31 PM
Bryan Ekers's Avatar
Bryan Ekers is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 59,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
Goddamn it! Nothing slips by you.
Personally, I thought you were trying to be funny again and recapture some long-past glory, but it reads more like Groucho in his later post-stroke days.
  #44  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:34 PM
SteveG1 is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Van Nuys CA
Posts: 14,847
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
So, what is the ethic focused on here?

Who is the bigger victim?

Seems like a shitty criteria.
Bitch has it made, bitch is still a whiny needy bitch?
  #45  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:35 PM
Blank Slate's Avatar
Blank Slate is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,653
I invented the phrase "me too." I just tossed it into a casual conversation one day, but boy howdy did it become a thing. When it started I was constantly fielding calls from the media for quotes but I thought, nah, it's not about me. I mean, I basically started a movement that improved the lives of millions. Come to think of it, I've probably save actual lives, but I'm not looking for The Presidential Medal of Freedom or a Nobel Peach Prize. Gosh golly no.
  #46  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:43 PM
naita is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Norway
Posts: 6,846
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
I think if Clinton were in office, the Democrats would be treating him the way they did when he was.
Yes, because President is the only political office in the land, and politicians also never talk about people in positions of power who aren't politicians, and even if neither of those things are true there is not a shit ton of evidence that Republicans, on average, are more likely to circle the waggons and cry "fake news!" and "Well she was probably asking for it, and we like him", while screaming for the blood of anyone remotely connected to a scandal and the Democrats.
  #47  
Old 10-25-2018, 03:48 PM
steatopygia's Avatar
steatopygia is offline
Experimental FOC Test Pilot
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: North Idaho mostly
Posts: 2,161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
I donít post funny stuff online because it gets stolen. The people who steal it occasionally get caught and try to defend themselves by suggesting I stole it from them. I just write those things for myself.

And, Iím really not defending Republicans/conservatives, at least not as my mission.

I am trying to go after myopic political viewpoints. You know, reopen the dialogue, promote healthy self-analysis and an open criticism to oneís own viewpoints, a sympathy to opposing viewpoints, the realization that we live in the best of times, agree on 90% of things, should be greatful, etc etc.

Basically, I am trying to heal the political rift and bring the country together again.

How have you been?
Thank you, great answer.

I have never had any original writing stolen (I'm in no danger of that), I imagine that would be something that would eat at me, seeing someone claim my work for theirs. If they also profited from that, yeah, I'd be pissed. I'm sorry that happened. Genuinely. I have seen ideas stolen, rather routinely, in academia. The consequences go much further than just the original idea. Once again, sorry.

That is a good reason for not giving us your best stuff. How about some second rate stuff then?

Your second point, healing the rift, is very much on my mind. I'm 56 years old and I've never seen political times like these. Families not talking, not seeing each other etc. because of things that have little direct effect on them. People interacting with each other based on their perceived political views. I don't think America can thrive if this continues. So, I agree with you 100% there.

But ISTM, that you, who should be great at that, aren't really trying. There is some stuff that is worth defending, there must be. Pick that. Trump is really indefensible. The unemployment rate is the only thing that I would say that he hasn't made worse.
But you are so much better at that than me, so find those things. Convince us that things aren't so bad, that we DO live in the best of times, that at heart, we DO agree on most things.

For instance, I am grateful that I live in America in the 21st century. My life is better than 99% of all the other people that have ever been born. That makes me want to make the world better. It makes me want to share in my luck. I was lucky to have been born when I was, to have had a great education, to have had the opportunities to be successful. Sure I could have screwed that up and lots do, but I had the opportunity to be successful, it wasn't all me. I think America stands for that. I don't think that current Republican policies are in line with that in any way at all. They seem to be more along the line of protecting the ones that need the least protection, of making the few very lucky, even luckier.

To me, this thread s about that. About denying that white male privilege is a thing. And you, who I know could defend whatever side you choose (because you are a great writer) aren't really giving it your best stuff. You've given a fair answer for why you aren't doing that and I appreciate it. Sorry for the hijack.
  #48  
Old 10-25-2018, 06:33 PM
iiandyiiii's Avatar
iiandyiiii is online now
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 37,403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
I watched every second of the Blasey/Kavanaugh hearings twice. The accusation was not credible enough to be a reasonable factor. I feel confident that I would apply the same standard had he been a Democratic nominee. It was played very much like a last minute smear by the Democrats, and I think that the way they used and treated Ford was really shitty.

Trump is very problematic. No question. He is horrible to women. He is pretty obvious about it. No way around that.

You seem to view this as evolutionary, like the Democrats are getting better and the Republicans are getting worse. I doubt that. I think if Clinton were in office, the Democrats would be treating him the way they did when he was.
No matter how it came out it would have been described as a "smear" by supporters of his. But that's not important -- what's important was how the majority party responded. And they responded by not expending serious effort to determine if the allegations were true. They did as little as they thought they could get away with (and they were right at least for the short term). Further, they expended no effort to see if Kavanaugh was telling the truth.

That's not treating accusers with decency and respect. There was no urgency -- only politics.

The Democrats have demonstrably changed. Those accusations against Senator Franken would have gone nowhere just a few short years ago. But they've actually responded with a bit of decency to the MeToo movement. The Republicans have done nothing, and have not stopped celebrating an admitted and multiply-accused abuser.

It's not credible to me to say that the two parties are handling sexual assault and rape allegations in the same way in the present. If this is what you're saying, I think you're either delusional or dishonest.
  #49  
Old 10-25-2018, 07:13 PM
asahi's Avatar
asahi is online now
Guest
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: On your computer screen
Posts: 12,533
At their core, conservatives are bullies. They need to feel superior to someone. Even if they can't feel superior economically or academically, they can always fall back on their sense of virtue. Conservatives enjoy beating other people over the head with their sense of superiority right up until the time that they feel like they've been beaten at their own game. Then they cry like little babies.
  #50  
Old 10-25-2018, 08:06 PM
CarnalK's Avatar
CarnalK is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 19,770
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scylla View Post
And actually i’m Kind of proud of that!

I became internet famous over that, and got emails from journalists wanting to see me and interview me over that thread, including the WSJ.

The best thing though was that I started a trend. I wouldn’t do it again or be interviewed about it, so several journalists went out and got waterboarded on tv after that. It became a thing for a while.

And, I would like to think that in some small way, that brought attention to the very real fact that it is torture, and possibly limited or ceased it’s use in some circumstances.

I started the whole thing. I was the first. It’s awesome. I actually changed the world for the better, even if it was just a little bit, while goofing off on the internet.

Thanks for bringing that up!
You weren't the first. I told you in that thread that it had already been done by a reporter on national television. Only he got a couple of ex-navy SEALs to do it rather than his wife, iirc.

Last edited by CarnalK; 10-25-2018 at 08:08 PM.
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:40 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Send questions for Cecil Adams to: cecil@straightdope.com

Send comments about this website to: webmaster@straightdope.com

Terms of Use / Privacy Policy

Advertise on the Straight Dope!
(Your direct line to thousands of the smartest, hippest people on the planet, plus a few total dipsticks.)

Copyright © 2019 STM Reader, LLC.

 
Copyright © 2017