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Old 02-10-2019, 08:50 PM
kaylasdad99 kaylasdad99 is online now
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ST:TOS Question

I WANTED to watch Star Trek during its first run, but I never had authority to be the Decider of What’s On. Until I was old enough to be the one paying for the TV, and by then, I never had the time.

Still, I did manage to catch an episode now and then. ISTR that Captain Kirk would often address the ship’s computer directly, and the computer would respond verbally in a woman’s voice that I would characterize as pleasant, and with a familiar, and one might say, seductive tone. In fact, I’m pretty sure I heard the voice address him as “darling” more than once (IIRC, the Captain reacted with visible embarrassment, and told the computer not to do that).

Are my memories accurate? Was the Enterprise’s computer smitten with Jim Kirk? Was it something that happened regularly on the show? Was it a comic relief thing?

Last edited by kaylasdad99; 02-10-2019 at 08:51 PM.
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Old 02-10-2019, 08:55 PM
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I remember that happening following a software update at the last starbase, but have no idea when it happened.

The computer was voiced by Majel Roddenberry, Gene's wife, and she also played Lwaxana Troi, Deanna's mother in ST:NG.
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Old 02-10-2019, 08:57 PM
Johnny L.A. Johnny L.A. is online now
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Originally Posted by Ethilrist View Post
The computer was voiced by Majel Roddenberry, Gene's wife, and she also played Lwaxana Troi, Deanna's mother in ST:NG.
And Nurse Christine Chapel in ST:TOS.
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Old 02-10-2019, 09:06 PM
galen ubal galen ubal is offline
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In Tomorrow Is Yesterday, the computer had recently been reprogrammed to give it some personality. From the article linked:
Quote:
Spock explains that the computer had recently been overhauled on the female-dominated planet Cygnet XIV (who thought the computer needed a personality).
Kirk was not amused.
Quote:

Capt. Kirk: Captain's log, supplemental. Engineering Officer Scott informs, warp engines damaged, but can be made operational and re-energized.

Enterprise Computer: Computed and recorded, dear.

Capt. Kirk: Computer, you will not address me in that manner. Compute.

Enterprise Computer: Computed... dear.

Capt. Kirk: Mr. Spock, I ordered this computer and its interlinking systems repaired.

Mr. Spock: I have investigated it, Captain. To correct the fault will require an overhaul of the entire computer system and a minimum of three weeks at a starbase.

Capt. Kirk: I wouldn't mind so much if only it didn't get so... affectionate.

Mr. Spock: It also has an unfortunate tendency to giggle.
From the IMDB entry.

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Old 02-10-2019, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Ethilrist View Post
I remember that happening following a software update at the last starbase, but have no idea when it happened.

The computer was voiced by Majel Roddenberry, Gene's wife, and she also played Lwaxana Troi, Deanna's mother in ST:NG.
Majel also played the computer voice in TNG. And the Federation computer voices in DS9 and Voyager as well.

The episode where the computer gets increasingly amorous with Kirk is Tomorrow is Yesterday from season 1.
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Old 02-10-2019, 09:12 PM
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The episode in question is "Tomorrow Is Yesterday" (in which the main plot line is the fact that the Enterprise has hit a black hole, been bounced back in time and arrives at earth in the mid-60s, and has to beam an Air Force pilot aboard, etc.). The computer glitch was a funny side bit. Here's a clip from the show highlighting the computer's female seductive effort.
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Old 02-10-2019, 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Ethilrist View Post
I remember that happening following a software update at the last starbase, but have no idea when it happened.

The computer was voiced by Majel Roddenberry, Gene's wife, and she also played Lwaxana Troi, Deanna's mother in ST:NG.
Sounds like Season One's Tomorrow Is Yesterday. That was during Gene Goon's stint as producer. He probably threw it in during one of his rewrites. Roddenberry would never have had his computer the center of a joke.
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Old 02-10-2019, 09:47 PM
kaylasdad99 kaylasdad99 is online now
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Thanks, all.

BTW, I also recall having seen at least some of an episode with the Enterprise in orbit above a Twentieth century Earth l, and in which a secretary played by Teri Garr plays a crucial (or at least significant) role. Same episode?
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Old 02-10-2019, 09:59 PM
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Thanks, all.

BTW, I also recall having seen at least some of an episode with the Enterprise in orbit above a Twentieth century Earth l, and in which a secretary played by Teri Garr plays a crucial (or at least significant) role. Same episode?
Different Episode - that was "Assignment Earth" - an attempted pilot episode for a new series - Gary Seven.

Last edited by simster; 02-10-2019 at 10:00 PM.
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Old 02-10-2019, 10:06 PM
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I've heard Teri Garr won't talk about her experience. Must've been pretty egregious.
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Old 02-10-2019, 10:12 PM
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I've heard Teri Garr won't talk about her experience. Must've been pretty egregious.
Really?? Thats....disturbing
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Old 02-10-2019, 11:00 PM
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I've heard Teri Garr won't talk about her experience. Must've been pretty egregious.
She's talked about it. She's made it pretty clear she wasn't happy about it, but she's talked about it.

Legend has it that Valera Noland, who played Daras in Patterns of Force, was so disillusioned by the whole experience that she left show business. IMDB shows she made one movie after ST, so who knows.
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Old 02-11-2019, 09:45 AM
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Different Episode - that was "Assignment Earth" - an attempted pilot episode for a new series - Gary Seven.
I've been in love with Teri Garr ever since.
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Old 02-11-2019, 10:26 AM
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She's talked about it. She's made it pretty clear she wasn't happy about it, but she's talked about it.
I thought she hadn't. ISTR there was an issue where Roddenberry wanted her to wear a shorter dress, and she didn't want to, but that doesn't seem such a big issue that it would earn her everlasting animosity. Do you know what happened, and what she said about it?
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Old 02-11-2019, 10:47 AM
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And Nurse Christine Chapel in ST:TOS.
And, she was the first officer on the pilot episode (which was later broken up into two episodes in TOS.
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Old 02-11-2019, 11:23 AM
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I thought she hadn't. ISTR there was an issue where Roddenberry wanted her to wear a shorter dress, and she didn't want to, but that doesn't seem such a big issue that it would earn her everlasting animosity. Do you know what happened, and what she said about it?
Roddenberry had an exceptionally strong libido, so I doubt things ended with the "shorter costume" incident. (Bill Theiss eventually gave in and rehemmed the skirt, even though it was cut on the bias.) In addition, many people (including members of the TOS "family") found William Shatner's personality extremely off-putting. It was rumored that Kirstie Alley lost interest in portraying Lt Saavik after the second Star Trek movie precisely for this reason.

FWIW, I've read that Robert Lansing ("Gary Seven" in "Assignment: Earth") lost the role of Gen Frank Savage on 12 O'Clock High because he was very difficult to work with.

In addition, sexual harassment at both Desilu and NBC apparently went far beyond Gene Roddenberry. (At least one executive hit on Nichelle Nichols.)

All of the above may have contributed to Teri's bad experience.
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Old 02-11-2019, 11:37 AM
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According to The Making of Star Trek (Whitfield and Roddenberry, 1968), the Enterprise computer was given a female voice because it was found IRL that they cut through ambient noise better than male voices and ensure shorter response times from both men and women. It was only in "Tomorrow Is Yesterday" that the voice was flirty.

In "Mirror, Mirror," the Evil Empire computer had a male voice. Hearing it for the first time, the contrast was startling.
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Old 02-11-2019, 02:00 PM
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And, she was the first officer on the pilot episode (which was later broken up into two episodes in TOS.
That character ("Number One") is apparently back in this season of Discovery.
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Old 02-11-2019, 03:41 PM
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Roddenberry had an exceptionally strong libido...
We ALL have exceptionally strong libidos. The ability to control our sexual urges is what separates us from the animals.*

Too bad he didn't have an exceptionally strong moral code. I guess the casting couch was business as usual for Roddenberry. It's like he wanted to be like the big studio cheifs, but since Desliu was small, he only got to have sex with Star Trek cast women. Using "I have a strong libido" as an excuse is just that - an excuse for bad behavior.

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In addition, sexual harassment at both Desilu and NBC apparently went far beyond Gene Roddenberry. (At least one executive hit on Nichelle Nichols.)
Roddenberry slept with her, too.

I will never understand women like Barrett that put up with that kind of crap. But it's their life. Whatever.



*that, and the use of cutlery.

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Old 02-11-2019, 04:39 PM
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Roddenberry had an exceptionally strong libido, so I doubt things ended with the "shorter costume" incident. (Bill Theiss eventually gave in and rehemmed the skirt, even though it was cut on the bias.) In addition, many people (including members of the TOS "family") found William Shatner's personality extremely off-putting. It was rumored that Kirstie Alley lost interest in portraying Lt Saavik after the second Star Trek movie precisely for this reason.

FWIW, I've read that Robert Lansing ("Gary Seven" in "Assignment: Earth") lost the role of Gen Frank Savage on 12 O'Clock High because he was very difficult to work with.

In addition, sexual harassment at both Desilu and NBC apparently went far beyond Gene Roddenberry. (At least one executive hit on Nichelle Nichols.)

All of the above may have contributed to Teri's bad experience.
I haven't heard anything about Kirstie not playing Saavik again because of Shatner. My impression was he had his hands full putting in his finest performance since the first season of TOS to be a huge pain in the ass. Meyer was riding him to do better, he didn't worry about his weight. he had tons of acting challenges to satisfy his ego...etc...
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Old 02-11-2019, 04:57 PM
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Regarding Kirstie Alley: several sources I can find online have quotes from her indicating that she chose to not appear in The Search for Spock because she was offered the same (or maybe even less) money as she'd made for The Wrath of Khan, when she was an unknown, and Saavik's role in TSfS was going to be even larger than it was in TWoK.

Now, those are quotes from decades later, and I have no idea if that was the only reason, but it's Alley's stated reasoning.

Sources:
http://www.startrek.com/article/catc...-kirstie-alley
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...305-story.html

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Old 02-11-2019, 05:05 PM
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I thought she hadn't. ISTR there was an issue where Roddenberry wanted her to wear a shorter dress, and she didn't want to, but that doesn't seem such a big issue that it would earn her everlasting animosity. Do you know what happened, and what she said about it?
She has talked about Star Trek. There are quotes from her in the book These Are The Voyages TOS Season Two.
According to the author's notes, the quotes are from Garr's autobiography, Speedbumps: Flooring It Through Hollywood. (available on Amazon) and also a book called Star Trek's Greatest Guest Stars.

There's an account of the skirt incident that says Garr limited her reaction to Roddenberry's dress-tinkering to eye-rolling, but costume designer Bill Theiss argued with Roddenberry about it. Considering some of the costumes Theiss came up with, Roddenberry must have been WAY out of line.
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Old 02-11-2019, 05:06 PM
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I haven't heard anything about Kirstie not playing Saavik again because of Shatner. My impression was he had his hands full putting in his finest performance since the first season of TOS to be a huge pain in the ass. Meyer was riding him to do better, he didn't worry about his weight. he had tons of acting challenges to satisfy his ego...etc...
I read about it in some checkout-line rag, which is why I refer to it as rumor. F'rinstance, it was reported at some point that Shatner stepped on a piece of styrofoam and cried (with his characteristic humor) "Argh! I've crushed a ball!" To which Kirstie was said to reply "Too bad it wasn't one of yours."

FWIW, when Shatner once tried to apologize for any bad feelings on the TOS set, Nichelle Nichols said "Oh, we all hated you!" When told that under the terms of his contract he had owned a piece of the show from the beginning, she said "That explains everything!"
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Old 02-11-2019, 05:34 PM
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There is also heartache toward both of the Roddenberry’s over money and the cast. Many of the cast felt they were underpaid. But Gene and Majel ensured they were paid.

While nurse Chapple wasn’t in every episode, the computer voice certainly was, ensuring that she has paid then and in syndication. Alexander Courage wrote the Star Trek theme, and was surprised that he only received half pay for his work. When he asked about it, he was told that the pay check was correct. He’d get half and the writer of the lyrics would get half. Courage, was surprised because there were no lyrics. But Roddenberry wrote lyrics, which were horrid and would never be used, so that he could get half of the royalties. Courage was convinced for the rest of his days that he got screwed.
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Old 02-11-2019, 05:37 PM
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I will never understand women like Barrett that put up with that kind of crap. But it's their life. Whatever.
Any straight male who says he wouldn't have liked to bang some of the women who were on Star Trek is either impotent or a big fat liar! (Or maybe a Mormon missionary.)

Roddenberry tastes were both Liberal (with a capital L) and catholic (with a small C). He and Nichelle went back to at least 1963, when she was a guest star on The Lieutenant. There was also an incident where he was working late at night and made a pass at his secretary. They were getting it on when Barret showed up at his office's back door at the same moment Mrs Roddenberry (Eileen) started knocking on the front door.

Such stories were legendary. At least one writer (I don't remember which) saw Gene busy with a woman on his couch through the window of his office. "I couldn't believe it!" he was quoted as saying. "Anybody could have seen them!"

Success may allow some people to do things they wouldn't have done before, but no one turns into a hound dog overnight. It's a pattern of behavior that goes way back.

In my experience, people in a situation like that either remain in it because they (a) enjoy it, (b) figure the benefits outweigh the costs, or (c) both of the above. I've known plenty of people for whom (c) was true. It's my understanding that Roddenberry and Barret truly loved one another (they stayed together until his death, eventually marrying and producing a child), but she was more than willing to accept things the way they were.
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Old 02-11-2019, 05:50 PM
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There is also heartache toward both of the Roddenberry’s over money and the cast. Many of the cast felt they were underpaid. But Gene and Majel ensured they were paid.

While nurse Chapple wasn’t in every episode, the computer voice certainly was, ensuring that she has paid then and in syndication. Alexander Courage wrote the Star Trek theme, and was surprised that he only received half pay for his work. When he asked about it, he was told that the pay check was correct. He’d get half and the writer of the lyrics would get half. Courage, was surprised because there were no lyrics. But Roddenberry wrote lyrics, which were horrid and would never be used, so that he could get half of the royalties. Courage was convinced for the rest of his days that he got screwed.
The whole point of Roddenberry creating the series was to ensure he and his heirs would own a valuable property, instead of having to rely on occasional writing assignments for his income. After many years of doing piecework myself, I understand his rationale very well.

If you don't like the paychecks you get as an actor, maybe you should try another line of work.

The issue of the theme song lyrics has been dealt with more than once in this forum. My basic view is that if Courage didn't bother to read the contract before he signed it, it's his own damned fault.
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Old 02-11-2019, 06:28 PM
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Any straight male who says he wouldn't have liked to bang some of the women who were on Star Trek is either impotent or a big fat liar!
Sure I would (well, not Barrett. I just don't see it.)

But you see, I'm not their boss! Sleeping with your employees always creates a power imbalance, and if there is any sense of favoritism, resentment in the other cast.

And my point about marrying someone like that - if you think marrying a horndog that sleeps with anything that moves is OK with you, then fine. Who am I to say. But I don't get why you would think that's a good idea.
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Old 02-11-2019, 07:05 PM
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And my point about marrying someone like that - if you think marrying a horndog that sleeps with anything that moves is OK with you, then fine. Who am I to say. But I don't get why you would think that's a good idea.
Why one would think that's a good idea.
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Old 02-11-2019, 07:47 PM
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Any straight male who says he wouldn't have liked to bang some of the women who were on Star Trek is either impotent or a big fat liar! (Or maybe a Mormon missionary.)
Irrelevant; just because a man wants to have sex with somebody doesn't mean they are irresistibly compelled to harass, pressure or assault them. Not acting on every random impulse is a basic part of civilized behavior; and claiming that men are incapable of civilized behavior is not only a bad excuse, it's insulting to the entire gender.
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Old 02-11-2019, 07:58 PM
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Not acting on every random impulse is a basic part of civilized behavior; and claiming that men are incapable of civilized behavior is not only a bad excuse, it's insulting to the entire gender.
Who claims that?
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Old 02-11-2019, 08:51 PM
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Who claims that?
The way I read your previous post, you do.

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Roddenberry had an exceptionally strong libido, so I doubt things ended with the "shorter costume" incident.
As if that explains away his casting couch mentality.
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Old 02-11-2019, 09:11 PM
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The way I read your previous post, you do.
Then you're reading it wrong. I would never claim that only males are capable of perfidy.


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As if that explains away his casting couch mentality.
Uhm, yeah, it does. I think you're confusing "explain" with "justify."
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Old 02-11-2019, 10:04 PM
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Definition of "explain away"

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transitive verb

1 : to get rid of by or as if by explanation
2 : to minimize the significance of by or as if by explanation
explains his faults, but does not try to explain them away
— M. K. Spears
Quote:
Examples of explain away in a Sentence

after the surprise attack, military leaders struggled to explain away the nation's unpreparedness
tried to explain away his adulterous affairs by saying that men are promiscuous by nature
In short, literally a textbook example.

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Old 02-12-2019, 07:53 AM
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The whole point of Roddenberry creating the series was to ensure he and his heirs would own a valuable property, instead of having to rely on occasional writing assignments for his income. After many years of doing piecework myself, I understand his rationale very well.

If you don't like the paychecks you get as an actor, maybe you should try another line of work.

The issue of the theme song lyrics has been dealt with more than once in this forum. My basic view is that if Courage didn't bother to read the contract before he signed it, it's his own damned fault.
You seem very eagar to give Roddenerry a pass on his dickish behavior. That's your call of course. But we've all be in situations where we've be treated wrongly by others. Either because we were young, though we didn't deserve better, decided the immediate crapstorm was worth it or we just didn't have a better option. None of these situations mitigate that someone was an a-hole. Using power over others that have less of it doesn't mitigate that you're being a tool.

You seem to think that because he got away with it, it was ok for him to be a jerk,
but it's not. The ends do not always justify the means. That shouldn't be all that hard to understand.
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Old 02-12-2019, 01:04 PM
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According to The Making of Star Trek (Whitfield and Roddenberry, 1968), the Enterprise computer was given a female voice because it was found IRL that they cut through ambient noise better than male voices and ensure shorter response times from both men and women....
Michael Crichton mentioned a Strategic Air Command study to that effect in The Andromeda Strain (1969).
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Old 02-12-2019, 03:58 PM
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Michael Crichton mentioned a Strategic Air Command study to that effect in The Andromeda Strain (1969).
I read somewhere that the audible "Pull up! Pull up!" from aircraft warning systems is female for that reason. OTOH a ham radio operator mentioned to me that women are difficult for him to understand on single side band. I think the reason for a feminine voice is that we are used to obeying our mothers.
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Old 02-12-2019, 04:05 PM
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We ALL have exceptionally strong libidos. The ability to control our sexual urges is what separates us from the animals.*
"Human nature, Mr. Allnot, is what we were put on this earth to rise above."
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Old 02-12-2019, 04:23 PM
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"Human nature, Mr. Allnot, is what we were put on this earth to rise above."
"Ah...Dear, what did you say your first name was?"
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Old 02-12-2019, 04:57 PM
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I read somewhere that the audible "Pull up! Pull up!" from aircraft warning systems is female for that reason.
She's a female in the Navy. We call her "bitch'n Betty."
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Old 02-12-2019, 05:22 PM
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She's a female in the Navy. We call her "bitch'n Betty."
Do sailors talk to their mama like that?
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Old 02-12-2019, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by spifflog View Post
She's a female in the Navy. We call her "bitch'n Betty."


That's my sister, and she makes a good livin lookin after you flyboys
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Old 02-12-2019, 07:04 PM
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[Moderating]

The talk about Roddenberry's libido and/or his shenanigans with female cast members is threatening to get out of hand, and it's off the thread's original topic. Let's drop that here.
  #43  
Old 02-12-2019, 08:05 PM
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Originally Posted by BobBitchin' View Post
That's my sister, and she makes a good livin lookin after you flyboys
Tell that to the marines!
  #44  
Old 02-15-2019, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by spifflog View Post
She's a female in the Navy. We call her "bitch'n Betty."
When I was in the Navy, the part that did direction-finding and radio intercepts, there was a rumor that there had been an intercept of a Soviet general who'd crashed his fighter, apparently while holding down the mic button. The Russian equivalent of, "Pull up, pull up," can be heard and he exclaimed, "Shut up, bitch! I know what I'm doing!" moments before he augered in.

There was an episode of Babylon 5 I felt was a tip of the hat to TOS where the station computer had a personality module installed and it took a couple days to get rid of it. The voice was Harlan Ellison's so the personality was anything but amorous and the one scene I remember is Garibaldi getting on an elevator while the computer is nagging him. As the doors close, without changing his deadpan expression, or even looking, he pulls his PPG and shoots out the speaker.
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Old 02-15-2019, 01:53 PM
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"Ah...Dear, what did you say your first name was?"

I now pronounce you man and wife. Proceed with the execution!


One of my very favorite movies.
  #46  
Old 02-15-2019, 03:45 PM
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When I was in the Navy, the part that did direction-finding and radio intercepts, there was a rumor that there had been an intercept of a Soviet general who'd crashed his fighter, apparently while holding down the mic button. The Russian equivalent of, "Pull up, pull up," can be heard and he exclaimed, "Shut up, bitch! I know what I'm doing!" moments before he augered in.
That is too funny to be true. Is "bitch" derogatory in Russian?
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Old 02-15-2019, 04:14 PM
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That is too funny to be true. Is "bitch" derogatory in Russian?
I would imagine he was not saying the equivalent of "female dog."
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Old 02-15-2019, 04:22 PM
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I would imagine he was not saying the equivalent of "female dog."
Perhaps the ever popular Russian curse, "F--k your mother".
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Old 02-16-2019, 07:49 AM
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Don't know for sure as I didn't actually hear the recording* and don't speak Russian even if I had. One of the decisions a translator has to make is whether to translate vernacular word-for-word or into something that makes more sense in the translated-to language. For example, a common expression in German for describing someone with a pale complexion is kaese-weiss -- cheese-white. Do you translate that or use, "pale as a sheet" instead.

*That's why I said 'rumored.'
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Old 02-16-2019, 08:46 AM
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I would imagine he was not saying the equivalent of "female dog."
I can imagine him saying it. Calling someone a "bitch" or "son of a bitch" is certainly derogatory in Russian: "Блядь, вот суки!" &c
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