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Old 07-10-2018, 11:03 AM
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I pit Trump's pardons

This one goes too far, IMO.
Quote:
Dwight and Steven Hammond were convicted in 2012 of intentionally and maliciously setting fires on public lands. The arson crime carried a minimum prison sentence of five years, but a sympathetic federal judge, on his last day before retirement, decided the penalty was too stiff and gave the father and son much lighter prison terms.

Prosecutors won an appeal and the Hammonds were resentenced in October 2015 to serve the mandatory minimum.
Quote:
In a statement Tuesday, White House press secretary Sarah Sanders called that decision to resentence the Hammonds “unjust.”

“The Hammonds are devoted family men, respected contributors to their local community, and have widespread support from their neighbors, local law enforcement, and farmers and ranchers across the West,” she said. “Justice is overdue for Dwight and Steven Hammond, both of whom are entirely deserving of these Grants of Executive Clemency.”

The pardons are the latest in a growing list of clemency actions by Trump, who has been using his pardon power with increasingly frequency in recent months.
I'm sure that Charles Manson had the respect and widespread support of his local community, too. So what?

Neither of these people deserves this pardon, IMO: they are entitled jackasses who think they can just take what they want and destroy it if they can't have it. Fuck them.

Trump now seems to think that this is the populist move that will endear him to the public: freeing rich people, or freeing people liked by rich people, from prison.
Quote:
He has repeatedly referenced emotional video of Johnson being freed from prison and running into her family members’ arms, and has said he’s considering thousands more cases — both famous and not.

But critics say the president could be ignoring valid claims for clemency as he works outside the typical pardon process, focusing on cases brought to his attention by friends, famous people and conservative media pundits.
It's not like everyone is blind to the implications here:
Quote:
Aides say that Trump has been especially drawn to cases in which he believes the prosecution may have been politically motivated — a situation that may remind him of his own position at the center of the ongoing special counsel investigation into Russian election meddling.

Many have also seen the president as sending a signal with his pardons to former aides and associates caught up in the probe, or lashing out at enemies like former FBI Director James Comey, who oversaw the prosecution of lifestyle guru Martha Stewart, whom Trump has said he is thinking of pardoning.
So fuck Donald Trump, too; fuck him right up his stupid ass!
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Old 07-10-2018, 11:13 AM
enipla enipla is online now
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Jesus Christ. We now have FOURTEEN fires in Colorado. I'm smack dab in the middle of this shit. They should get much more than 5 years. This was intentional and malicious arson.
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Old 07-10-2018, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo View Post
Neither of these people deserves this pardon, IMO: they are entitled jackasses who think they can just take what they want and destroy it if they can't have it. Fuck them.
Agreed.

Quote:
So fuck Donald Trump, too; fuck him right up his stupid ass!
I'll leave that to you. I've no wish to be that near him.

Last edited by Quartz; 07-10-2018 at 11:15 AM.
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Old 07-10-2018, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Quartz View Post
I'll leave that to you. I've no wish to be that near him.
No worries; I'll outsource it to some guys I know who hang out at the Home Depot.
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Old 07-10-2018, 11:24 AM
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They probably don't want to be near him either.
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Old 07-10-2018, 12:39 PM
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They probably don't want to be near him either.
Maybe he meant the ones inside wearing the MAGA hats, benefitting from all the winning the tariffs have brought.
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Old 07-10-2018, 01:42 PM
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The President of the United States of America supports terrorism.
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Old 07-10-2018, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Blank Slate View Post
The President of the United States of America supports terrorism.
And obstruction of justice/destruction of evidence. Which is what these two yahoos where doing.

But of course we already know that about trump.
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Old 07-10-2018, 01:49 PM
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Careful, now!

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Originally Posted by Snowboarder Bo View Post
No worries; I'll outsource it to some guys I know who hang out at the Home Depot.
https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb...ht=immigration

  #10  
Old 07-10-2018, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Blank Slate View Post
The President of the United States of America supports terrorism.
But only domestic terrorism. Not the bad kind of terrorism.
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Old 07-10-2018, 05:50 PM
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It's not like everyone is blind to the implications here
This is Donald Trump's middle finger to the federal criminal justice system. His message is, "I AM the law."

Trump probably feels like getting into bed with white nationalism is his best chance to escape the long arm of justice. Prior to 2016-17, the conventional wisdom - even among Republicans - was that you can't win with just the white vote. But I get the sense that Donald Trump believes he can - he just needs to give more of them a reason to show up at the polls.
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Old 07-11-2018, 04:41 PM
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This "situation" does a couple of things.

Trump gives real law and order a big Fuck You signal.
Trump says the law will not punish you if you are "his kind" of people.
Trump gives rightwing extremist lunatics, sovereign citizens, and angry rednecks with guns the green light to do whatever they please, with his blessing.
It is a clear go-ahead to MORE Bundy types.
Trump uses this to distract from his giving public lands away to corporations - to plunder however they please (probably with a nice kickback to him).
Trump gets to say "fuck the law, I am the law"
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Old 07-11-2018, 05:00 PM
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These fine, Sovereign Citizens of the Land are finally free of the tyranny of the Federal Government!!

Jesus Ef-ing Christ. He couldn't just commute their damn sentences? He had to pardon fucking arsonists??? I'd say I'm surprised, but sadly, I'm not.
  #14  
Old 07-11-2018, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by John Mace View Post
These fine, Sovereign Citizens of the Land are finally free of the tyranny of the Federal Government!!

Jesus Ef-ing Christ. He couldn't just commute their damn sentences? He had to pardon fucking arsonists??? I'd say I'm surprised, but sadly, I'm not.
He did commute the sentences, as far as I can tell. Is there a late-breaking pardon update I'm missing?
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Last edited by Bricker; 07-11-2018 at 05:08 PM.
  #15  
Old 07-11-2018, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blank Slate View Post
The President of the United States of America supports terrorism.
As long as he's not "palling around" with terrorists then Republicans have zero concern about it.
  #16  
Old 07-11-2018, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Bricker View Post
He did commute the sentences, as far as I can tell. Is there a late-breaking pardon update I'm missing?
Every story I see on this says it's a pardon. (cite, cite, cite). Are all these news sources mistaken?
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Old 07-11-2018, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Left Hand of Dorkness View Post
Every story I see on this says it's a pardon. (cite, cite, cite). Are all these news sources mistaken?
Apparently so. In that first NPR link, despite the headline, their own "list of pardons and commutations" shows it as a commutation.
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Old 07-11-2018, 05:23 PM
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Hmm. Then again, this and this sure make it look like they're "full and unconditional pardons." (PDF links)
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Old 07-11-2018, 05:23 PM
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Last edited by Bricker; 07-11-2018 at 05:23 PM.
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Old 07-11-2018, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Left Hand of Dorkness View Post
Every story I see on this says it's a pardon. (cite, cite, cite). Are all these news sources mistaken?
I wrote a long post explaining that I thought it was likely they were in fact mistaken, based on the clemency-but-not-pardon documents I linked.

Then I read Vinyl's links, and deleted my post, because those sources were apparently not mistaken.

I have no clue why the President issued a separate commutation and then a pardon, when the pardon of necessity includes an immediate end to any sentence.

But it appears he did. That zany Trump! He certainly is whacky!
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Last edited by Bricker; 07-11-2018 at 05:28 PM.
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Old 07-11-2018, 05:31 PM
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I agree with the OP. This one is really, really annoying.

Last edited by Tamerlane; 07-11-2018 at 05:33 PM.
  #22  
Old 07-11-2018, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Bricker View Post
I have no clue why the President issued a separate commutation and then a pardon, when the pardon of necessity includes an immediate end to any sentence.

But it appears he did. That zany Trump! He certainly is whacky!
My guess: he said something about clemency, or getting these guys out of prison, or their sentence is bullshit, and someone drafted a document to the best of their abilities to meet his demand. He signed it, they released it, then he bragged about pardoning them, and someone told him he hadn't actually signed a pardon. He flung a fresh turd at them and bared his teeth and hooted, and they drafted an actual pardon, and he signed that.
  #23  
Old 07-11-2018, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Vinyl Turnip View Post
Hmm. Then again, this and this sure make it look like they're "full and unconditional pardons." (PDF links)
That first cite looks like it's from the so-called Justice Department. Probably written by someone sitting on an island somewhere.
  #24  
Old 07-11-2018, 05:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bricker View Post
I wrote a long post explaining that I thought it was likely they were in fact mistaken, based on the clemency-but-not-pardon documents I linked.

Then I read Vinyl's links, and deleted my post, because those sources were apparently not mistaken.

I have no clue why the President issued a separate commutation and then a pardon, when the pardon of necessity includes an immediate end to any sentence.

But it appears he did. That zany Trump! He certainly is whacky!
Not zany at all. He's just making sure all his base are covered.
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Old 07-11-2018, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Blank Slate View Post
The President of the United States of America supports terrorism.
Of course he does; he called for Hillary to be murdered with a "Second Amendment solution" during the campaign. Support for political and religious terrorism is common among the Republicans and American right; everyone looks the other way because our entire society is devoted to sucking up to them.
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Old 07-11-2018, 09:22 PM
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I'm pretty sure he's looking to pardon the people that will piss off liberals the most. His directive from his handlers is to sow as much chaos and internecine hatred as possible. Pretty much all of his actions can be seen to fit in that perspective.
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Old 07-11-2018, 10:01 PM
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I'm starting to think there may be a real intention here to provoke everyone into a civil war. If enough of the righties have bought into their own (or rather, the NRA's) press, they may think that between lands held, sympathetic police agencies, and civilian firearms stockpiled, they can win. A clear and present danger, without a President to stop it, because he's part of it. The scary idea is that if enough of Congress are as well, they'll back it up. That could be the case if this has been in the works for the entire existence of groups the Federalist Society, of which I'm not convinced; or if the right wing just decide, "Hey, roll with it, we have the deviants where we can take them out now."
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Old 07-12-2018, 09:07 PM
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https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/do...ment-violence/

Trump has repeatedly encouraged violence ... but has not apparently had any guts to do it himself. He is a shit flinging, trolling coward. He wants his goons to do the fighting for him because he is a weakling and a coward.
  #29  
Old 07-13-2018, 11:46 AM
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But only domestic terrorism. Not the bad kind of terrorism.
If they're white I believe the government approved term for them is patriotic "Freedom fighters".
  #30  
Old 07-13-2018, 03:56 PM
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If they're white I believe the government approved term for them is patriotic "Freedom fighters".
I would prefer the term Convicted Felon.
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Old 07-14-2018, 03:16 AM
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"If crime fighters fight crime and fire fighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight?"
- George Carlin -
  #32  
Old 07-14-2018, 12:50 PM
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Neither of these people deserves this pardon, IMO: they are entitled jackasses who think they can just take what they want and destroy it if they can't have it. Fuck them.
In other words, they are mini-me versions of HIM.
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