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  #201  
Old 07-11-2018, 09:18 AM
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I am pumping clean oxygen into my exosuit dock, but it keeps taking wrong element damage. Anybody know what the deal is?
Oh, it appears to be damaged from being in an environment with hydrogen?
  #202  
Old 07-11-2018, 09:22 AM
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I am pumping clean oxygen into my exosuit dock, but it keeps taking wrong element damage. Anybody know what the deal is?
The gas pump may be taking in more than oxygen even if the oxygen you feed is clean. You need to put a filter between the gas pump and the exosuit dock. Yes, setting up an airlock room, air purifier, exosuit stations, gas pump, filter, associated piping, wiring and switches is involved.
  #203  
Old 07-11-2018, 12:44 PM
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I am pumping clean oxygen into my exosuit dock, but it keeps taking wrong element damage. Anybody know what the deal is?
Exosuit doc? Holy hell I have a long way to go. . .
  #204  
Old 07-11-2018, 12:46 PM
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Exosuit doc? Holy hell I have a long way to go. . .
Ha! I haven't ever even made it out of the starting biome before things go all wahooni-shaped.
  #205  
Old 07-11-2018, 01:57 PM
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Look for a cool steam vent somewhere on the map. I'm not sure if every map has it, but I think I've read that all maps have at least certain things in common and that may be one of them. It erupts like a geyser periodically creating new water.

My problem has been power generation. I picked all the coal off the map. I have 3 electrolyzers going, but they don't feed a hydrogen generator consistently. Should I scale up my electrolyzer operation?

I have all the oil I could need, but with the manual oil refinery I just can't get it to work. People go down there and twist the crank a few times and come back. Is that the correct behavior? Or is there a way to make them operate it for longer? If I could get them to operate it longer, I could build up a petroleum reserve and generate a reasonable amount of power that way, as well as plastic.
4 hatches = 1 coal generator's worth of coal, for an equal weight in veggies or twice the weight in rock. A full size ranch, then, can run 2 generators by itself, while requiring no power.

A single electrolyzer should be able to run a hydrogen generator by itself, assuming your electrolyzer is always running. Do you have a system for separating and distributing the gasses?
  #206  
Old 07-11-2018, 02:10 PM
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4 hatches = 1 coal generator's worth of coal, for an equal weight in veggies or twice the weight in rock. A full size ranch, then, can run 2 generators by itself, while requiring no power.
Be aware, though, that if your dupes develop a taste for omelettes, you can destroy your ranch. I didn't even realize what was happening until my last two hatches were elderly; and by then it was too late, I got no new eggs. The ranch sits empty and forlorn.
  #207  
Old 07-11-2018, 06:44 PM
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Just dig down, plant some pinchas in the heat, and make them eat BBQ. It requires a bit more input on your part to cull the older hatches, but you can make it work for you.
  #208  
Old 07-11-2018, 07:46 PM
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Just dig down, plant some pinchas in the heat, and make them eat BBQ. It requires a bit more input on your part to cull the older hatches, but you can make it work for you.
Well, we've got a pretty decent sleet wheat farm set up (I finally got just enough radiant piping going on that the water is neither warm enough to kill the wheat nor cold enough to crack the pipes), and between that and my pincha patch, my dupes pig out on delicious pepper bread every day.
  #209  
Old 07-12-2018, 04:40 PM
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I just made it through a really rough patch that required a lot of micromanagement. The heat in my base was increasing, I used airlocks to seal off my farms for a while to keep them cooler longer, but I had to get a cooling loop up. It took quite a while to make the loop since it was so far from my base, and most of my farm overheated and died in the meantime. I pumped freezing air in, but it worked pretty slowly, recovering one plant at a time. In the meantime I had to micromanage what everyone ate - several people starving at once, I had to decide when I could let them bypass the mush fry line and just eat raw ingredients vs when I could save them to make something better. My petroleum power plant was barely working during this time due to the 1 turn and done weirdness with the oil refinery, so I was low on base power this whole time, with brownouts happening regularly, often affecting the cooking stations. So I had to shut things off and manually turn them on when necesary to squeeze out enough power to keep the food coming. During this time everyone was really stressed out from the decrease in quality of food so I ended up trying to keep them sane and just under the stress threshold by occasionally running the massage tables to save power. At one point someone that was a stress vomiter got overstressed and vomited at least 500 gallons which covered entire floors of my base.

I was able to eventually fix the petroleum problem. I don't really know what I did - I just scrapped everything and designed a new loop, and the second time it worked for some reason. I was able to get someone to pump the oil refinery for extended periods of time, allowing me to run the generator, which alleviated my power problems, and around the same time my farms were cool enough to be back at most of their capacity. I think I've made it through the rough patch.

But now for the first time I've got slimelung in my base and I'm not sure how. I have exosuit checkpoints at every place to leave the base.

Last edited by SenorBeef; 07-12-2018 at 04:42 PM.
  #210  
Old 07-12-2018, 06:44 PM
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I'm having trouble getting my dups to repair things in a timely fashion sometimes. For instance, I've had a damaged exosuit dock for about 5 cycles now. I set it up to priority 9, and it still says awaiting 10kg copper repair material. Is there a job/priority associated with repair? I have someone on pretty much every job, and sometimes things get repaired, so I don't really get why these won't.
  #211  
Old 07-12-2018, 08:47 PM
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I'm having trouble getting my dups to repair things in a timely fashion sometimes. For instance, I've had a damaged exosuit dock for about 5 cycles now. I set it up to priority 9, and it still says awaiting 10kg copper repair material. Is there a job/priority associated with repair? I have someone on pretty much every job, and sometimes things get repaired, so I don't really get why these won't.

Do you have the materials ? In this particular case you need refined copper, not mere copper ore. Threw me for a loop at one point.
I believe the repair action falls under tidying while delivering the repair stuff is supplying, but I could be wrong.
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  #212  
Old 07-13-2018, 03:51 AM
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I just made it through a really rough patch that required a lot of micromanagement. The heat in my base was increasing, I used airlocks to seal off my farms for a while to keep them cooler longer, but I had to get a cooling loop up. It took quite a while to make the loop since it was so far from my base, and most of my farm overheated and died in the meantime. I pumped freezing air in, but it worked pretty slowly, recovering one plant at a time. In the meantime I had to micromanage what everyone ate - several people starving at once, I had to decide when I could let them bypass the mush fry line and just eat raw ingredients vs when I could save them to make something better. My petroleum power plant was barely working during this time due to the 1 turn and done weirdness with the oil refinery, so I was low on base power this whole time, with brownouts happening regularly, often affecting the cooking stations. So I had to shut things off and manually turn them on when necesary to squeeze out enough power to keep the food coming. During this time everyone was really stressed out from the decrease in quality of food so I ended up trying to keep them sane and just under the stress threshold by occasionally running the massage tables to save power. At one point someone that was a stress vomiter got overstressed and vomited at least 500 gallons which covered entire floors of my base.

I was able to eventually fix the petroleum problem. I don't really know what I did - I just scrapped everything and designed a new loop, and the second time it worked for some reason. I was able to get someone to pump the oil refinery for extended periods of time, allowing me to run the generator, which alleviated my power problems, and around the same time my farms were cool enough to be back at most of their capacity. I think I've made it through the rough patch.

But now for the first time I've got slimelung in my base and I'm not sure how. I have exosuit checkpoints at every place to leave the base.
A fast and easy solution that's more effective than airlocks is ice sculptures. They're labor intensive, but you're dropping a bunch of ice straight into your farm. It cools the air very quickly.
  #213  
Old 07-13-2018, 07:22 AM
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A fast and easy solution that's more effective than airlocks is ice sculptures. They're labor intensive, but you're dropping a bunch of ice straight into your farm. It cools the air very quickly.
Better yet, put them in the water supply. IME the major way that crops die is that they're being irrigated with warm water. But an ice block melts instantaneously in warm water. I had a little while when I would build 7 ice blocks in a row in my reservoir, then repeat and repeat, until I'd lowered the water temperature from about 35 to about 25, enough to keep my bristle blossoms happy for a long time.
  #214  
Old 07-13-2018, 01:39 PM
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The more adventurous among you may want to try the preview of the expressive update which includes:
New "work time" during the day:
Duplicants will avoid eating or peeing during work
After work, Duplicants will eat, pee, and enjoy their leisure time

Many new Duplicant "reactions" to:
Status effects
Fellow Duplicants
Environmental factors
Duplicants will converse with each other occasionally
Including animated mouths and eyes!
Quality of Life to replace food/decor expectations
Food, rooms, and recreation improve Quality of Life
Save camera positions with Shift 1-9, jump to them with Ctrl 1-9

Video explanation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bv6P5Ubfrc


Here's how to access it:
In Steam, click on Library > Games.
Scroll down to Oxygen Not Included.
Right-click and select Properties.
Go to the BETAS tab.
In the dropdown, select the name of the branch you want to play. In this case, the branch name is "expressive_upgrade_testing"
This branch does not require a password.
In that same Properties window, go to the Local Files tab and press "Verify Integrity Of Game Cache."
Your game will be updated to the the previous branch.
Launch and play Oxygen Not Included

Much of this is copy & pasted from other forum posts. Keep in mind that you'd be trying the beta version of an update to a game in alpha so expect the possibility of bugs. The upside is that developers will be particularly attentive to the feedback they get to people who try the beta branch of the update so if you want to see what updates are like when still a work in progress and you want your feedback to have the most impact, this is the best opportunity.

Last edited by MichaelEmouse; 07-13-2018 at 01:42 PM.
  #215  
Old 07-13-2018, 03:21 PM
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I'm getting ready to go on a trip with my laptop and will try the expressive update with a new game. One small but important change in the expressive update changelog:
Quote:
Increased Plastic melting point to 160C
  #216  
Old 07-13-2018, 06:30 PM
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Well, I've been playing this game off and on for a week, but I am always hitting a wall. I can usually get my base to expand and a water system in place (the air system is really finicky and frustrating), but eventually my entire little colony collapses. I can never find coal, oil or some of the other elements needed to run to higher level things. I put stuff in place to process slime and dirty water, but it doesn't seem to keep up with demand. I haven't even successfully grown freaking mushrooms yet, can't figure out what you are supposed to do with critters or even how to have my cook be able to prepare more than fried mush! Half the time I'll go to build an expansion and then get tied up with jammed pipes or air vents or something isn't right but can't figure out what and by the time I work it out the base is in a downward spiral, usually due to food and/or air quality.
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  #217  
Old 07-13-2018, 08:26 PM
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Well, I've been playing this game off and on for a week, but I am always hitting a wall. I can usually get my base to expand and a water system in place (the air system is really finicky and frustrating), but eventually my entire little colony collapses. I can never find coal, oil or some of the other elements needed to run to higher level things. I put stuff in place to process slime and dirty water, but it doesn't seem to keep up with demand. I haven't even successfully grown freaking mushrooms yet, can't figure out what you are supposed to do with critters or even how to have my cook be able to prepare more than fried mush! Half the time I'll go to build an expansion and then get tied up with jammed pipes or air vents or something isn't right but can't figure out what and by the time I work it out the base is in a downward spiral, usually due to food and/or air quality.
How many dupes do you have? Remember to refuse most dupes--no more than half a dozen by the 50th cycle!

I always put a grill up as soon as I can--make pickled meal lice so you don't worry about food rotting, then get bristle blossoms going ASAP. Don't worry about ventilation for a long time, as long as you have oxygen generation.

Also, I rely on hamster wheel power for a really long time, until I can set up a smart battery feedback loop (so coal generators only run when necessary).
  #218  
Old 07-13-2018, 10:42 PM
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Well, I've been playing this game off and on for a week, but I am always hitting a wall. I can usually get my base to expand and a water system in place (the air system is really finicky and frustrating), but eventually my entire little colony collapses. I can never find coal, oil or some of the other elements needed to run to higher level things. I put stuff in place to process slime and dirty water, but it doesn't seem to keep up with demand. I haven't even successfully grown freaking mushrooms yet, can't figure out what you are supposed to do with critters or even how to have my cook be able to prepare more than fried mush! Half the time I'll go to build an expansion and then get tied up with jammed pipes or air vents or something isn't right but can't figure out what and by the time I work it out the base is in a downward spiral, usually due to food and/or air quality.
My biggest tip for someone starting out is to take it slow. You don't need all the dupes you can get, and you don't need a big, elaborate system when a water pump and a couple sieves will do the trick, at least to start.

My most recent game is almost to cycle 75, and I haven't even built a coal generator or gone diving for oil. I've planned everything out to avoid any crises, rather than bounce from one half-finished project to the next, putting out fires.

ETA: Dont be afraid to fail in new and exciting ways - only be afraid to fail to learn something from it.

Last edited by Chisquirrel; 07-13-2018 at 10:43 PM.
  #219  
Old 07-14-2018, 08:13 PM
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Ran into an unanticipated problem. I've got a steam geyser creating a pool of water at 160F. It was overheating my crops to pump it into my base directly. So I ran some pipes into a frozen zone, ran them through some radiated pipes, then insulated pipes back to my base.

Problem is - water use is inconsistent. Sometimes a bunch of water is being used and it flows relatively quickly, other times the base will use no water at all and it just sits there in the pipes. Problem was - the way sitting in the radiator pipes would keep getting colder under they got below freezing when the water wasn't moving, which damages the pipes

So I figure I'll run the water to an intermediate resorvoir after cooling that will sit in my base. That way the water flow will be consistent and I can set the temperature by the length of radiated pipes. As a side bonus, if I deliver water at just above freezing, I can use it as a heat sink for the rest of my base.

Ran into another weird oil refinery problem. For about 30 cycles the refinery was running just fine - someone would go out there and pump it all day and I had a full resorvoir of petroleum. So I decide to reduce the priority on the refinery until I used some of that petroleum up. And I did.... so I go back to the refinery and set it to priority 9 again. Except now no one is coming to pump it all day - the petroleum resorvoir is dry because we're back to no one pumping the damn oil refinery. Same setup, all I changed was the priority (and back). Not sure why the oil refinery is always such a problem.

Last edited by SenorBeef; 07-14-2018 at 08:14 PM.
  #220  
Old 07-14-2018, 08:30 PM
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Figured it out - probably. My original source of oil ran dry.

One pet peeve/flaw in the game: it's kinda silly that you still need to use the manual hand pump and the bottle emptier in late game. You've got sinks and a plumbing network - use them. But if I mop up, or I need water for cooking or some other purpose, my guys have to run down to those beginner utilities to get them. Becomes a problem later when your water sources get further away and you isolate your dump sites further from your base.
  #221  
Old 07-14-2018, 10:57 PM
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Figured it out - probably. My original source of oil ran dry.

One pet peeve/flaw in the game: it's kinda silly that you still need to use the manual hand pump and the bottle emptier in late game. You've got sinks and a plumbing network - use them. But if I mop up, or I need water for cooking or some other purpose, my guys have to run down to those beginner utilities to get them. Becomes a problem later when your water sources get further away and you isolate your dump sites further from your base.
Once you move past algae terrariums for oxygen, you shouldn't need the bottle stuffs. Hydroponic tiles can be fed by pipe, and the best food doesn't use water. Keeping a bottle emptier over a dump reservoir is still a good practice, for the aforementioned mopping, but most else can be run by pump.
  #222  
Old 07-17-2018, 04:39 AM
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I think I've... beaten the game. Well, not really, but I have hundreds of cycles (maybe thousands) worth of resources and no outstanding crises. The dupes are stress-free and healthy.

I finally de-germified my secondary reservoir. I think I ran into a weird issue--there was a kind of persistent "bubble" in my tank which I think was somehow amplifying the germ level to insane levels (1 billion+ germs/tile). I fixed that by filling in the bubble and then deleting the tile. The germ levels then started dropping rapidly; like 50% per cycle (but exponential, so it took a few dozen cycles). I was cooling at the same time but I don't think that was the fundamental issue. At any rate, the whole tank is at zero germs.

My polluted water tank is pretty contaminated with food poisoning, but I'm not too worried about that; I don't really need it for anything. I can use it for toilet flushing if necessary after a filter.

Regolith keeps coming in so I won't run out of filter material. Heat buildup has been solved. And I have a near-infinite supply of energy from oil->petroleum->natural gas cracking. Just have to open up a new magma pool every so often. Plus I have some geysers.

Maybe time to try the Expressive beta per MichaelEmouse's suggestion!
  #223  
Old 07-17-2018, 05:39 PM
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Maybe time to try the Expressive beta per MichaelEmouse's suggestion!
I'd be curious to hear your professional opinion as to its work-in-progress-ness.


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I think I've... beaten the game. Well, not really, but I have hundreds of cycles (maybe thousands) worth of resources and no outstanding crises. The dupes are stress-free and healthy.
I'm sure the game will keep adding layers with further updates. Perhaps for now, a good challenge would be to have a near indefinite lasting base without using nullifiers, wheezeworts, geysers or other types of buildings which go against the laws of physics or have bottomless resources, with the exception of solar panels whose practical infinity is fair enough.

I'm quite curious to see what such a base looks like.
  #224  
Old 07-17-2018, 06:26 PM
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I'm quite curious to see what such a base looks like.
That's going to be really tough without some kind of alternative. Real stuff in space has giant radiators to get rid of heat (frequently, the solar panels serve a double-purpose as radiators). I kinda wanted to try this out but it's honestly impossible given the frequency of meteor storms--they bury just about anything in very hot regolith within a handful of cycles. Maybe if there were a way to turn that off, I could build a marginally realistic space radiator that wasn't destroyed immediately.

Heat exchangers in ice work for a while, but not long enough, and once they're gone they're gone.
  #225  
Old 07-17-2018, 06:36 PM
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Sorry, I meant that I was curious to see what a base that could last for hundreds of cycles looks like. It feels a bit like we're building a mix between an ant farm, a GI Joe base and a Barbie playhouse. Everyone will show their personality through the choices they made.


Can't you use a bunker door and sensors to protect surface gear?
  #226  
Old 07-17-2018, 07:04 PM
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Sure, I'm happy to upload my current base to a Google drive or something. It's still a bit messy but fairly smooth running at the moment. I'll probably continue making small tweaks to it.

Bunker doors are not too useful today. Yes, they can protect stuff beneath them, but regolith piles up on top and has to be cleaned out constantly. I built some, and when I tried to actually use them, they melted--there must have been some really hot regolith in there. I probably see around a tile of buildup per cycle; that's just too much to deal with. I need an automatic cleaning system, or maybe a meteor deflection system or something.
  #227  
Old 07-18-2018, 02:16 AM
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You can download my base here. I think you can just save it in your "C:\Users\Username\Documents\Klei\OxygenNotIncluded\save_files" directory. Have a few projects in various states of completion, as well as plenty of cruft from leftover experiments, but it's mostly in working order.
  #228  
Old 07-18-2018, 06:44 AM
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it's mostly in working order.
I encourage others to download it and see for themselves. It's easily an order of magnitude above what I have going.
  #229  
Old 07-18-2018, 11:06 AM
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I've been watching a series of videos on YouTube that teach the game by a guy named CrypticFox. It's been helpful. I didn't have any idea of all the stuff that was going on.
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  #230  
Old 07-18-2018, 06:57 PM
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I encourage others to download it and see for themselves. It's easily an order of magnitude above what I have going.
A lot of it is less complicated than it looks .

I have three Nullifiers but several more coolant loops--some are disconnected, while others are sorta useless because they went through a heat exchanger already. Sometimes I have two or three sets of plumbing going to something, only one of which is connected for one reason or another. And in some cases I have some temporary plumbing set up just to move stuff around.

The same goes for automation wiring and other stuff--lots of temporary setups in there. And then, some stuff that is active but not really working as expected.

That said, there's some stuff that works well, like the natural gas cracker. Almost no maintenance needed on that, and a big reserve in case something goes awry and I need a few cycles for maintenance.

One unusual thing you may have noticed: I use a lot of bridges when they don't seem necessary. It's actually for a good reason. The game is quirky when splitting fluid flows--for a T junction, it alternates paths, but if one side is blocked it just skips that "round" of pumping. So if one path goes somewhere that doesn't need a huge amount of flow, like an atmo suit station, then it'll get backed up and the preceding T-junction will only have a 50% flow to the other side.

The solution, for whatever reason, is to use a bridge. Tee directly off the bridge outlet, and it will equally serve all outlets but never get backed up. This can even go four ways--three can get backed up and the fourth still gets the full flow. This is great for atmo suits; set them up in blocks of four and use a bridge with each of the output paths going to one suit. I had some serious ventilation problems until I discovered this trick.
  #231  
Old 07-18-2018, 07:17 PM
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One unusual thing you may have noticed: I use a lot of bridges when they don't seem necessary. It's actually for a good reason. The game is quirky when splitting fluid flows--for a T junction, it alternates paths, but if one side is blocked it just skips that "round" of pumping. So if one path goes somewhere that doesn't need a huge amount of flow, like an atmo suit station, then it'll get backed up and the preceding T-junction will only have a 50% flow to the other side.

The solution, for whatever reason, is to use a bridge. Tee directly off the bridge outlet, and it will equally serve all outlets but never get backed up. This can even go four ways--three can get backed up and the fourth still gets the full flow. This is great for atmo suits; set them up in blocks of four and use a bridge with each of the output paths going to one suit. I had some serious ventilation problems until I discovered this trick.
I hope you post that on the Steam forums so others can know that trick and most importantly, so the developers see it. That quirky liquid flow must be causing problems for many other players and they likely don't even realize it. Your improvised solution would likely help others and the developers could learn from it and code a more economical solution into the main game.

I think the reason why it works may be because flow links (whether gas, liquid, solid) send down their content to 1 receiver at any one cycle whereas buildings (bridges being buildings) send to all which are connected to its output. Not sure though.
  #232  
Old 07-18-2018, 07:22 PM
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The most advanced bit is probably the electrolyzer system. This system serves two purposes--oxygen for the base and hydrogen for the Nullifiers. But the Nullifiers don't need much most of the time, so I have to do something with remaining hydrogen output. Otherwise the whole thing would come to a halt, starving the base of oxygen.

To deal with this, I have a gas sensor in the main hydrogen pipe that checks how backed up it is. If it's backed up, then I have plenty of hydrogen and I need to divert the excess. So I close a valve which sends it to hydrogen generators to (partly) power the base.

There's a tricky aspect here, though, because I don't want to close the valve every time a gas packet passes through. I only want to close it when it's continuously backed up. Fortunately, there is a gate (the FILTER gate) which only goes active if the input is active for N seconds. That worked well here since a single passing gas packet wouldn't trigger it, just a sustained blockage.
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Old 07-18-2018, 07:25 PM
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I hope you post that on the Steam forums so others can know that trick and most importantly, so the developers see it.
It's on the Klei forums at least. But yeah, hopefully the devs fix this at some point. Your explanation seems reasonable; that the bridge counts as a "building" and has different behavior.
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Old 07-18-2018, 07:47 PM
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There's a tricky aspect here, though, because I don't want to close the valve every time a gas packet passes through. I only want to close it when it's continuously backed up. Fortunately, there is a gate (the FILTER gate) which only goes active if the input is active for N seconds. That worked well here since a single passing gas packet wouldn't trigger it, just a sustained blockage.
Something it took me some time to realize: You can change that N seconds in both the filter and buffer gates, it doesn't need to be the default time. That could be useful to finetune some flows.

I suppose the buffer gate, which stays active for N seconds after being triggered, could be useful for something related but I'm not sure what.

I don't know what other gates people will improvise based on the simple building blocks already present or whether the devs will add more advanced gates in future updates.
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Old 07-18-2018, 11:14 PM
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Something it took me some time to realize: You can change that N seconds in both the filter and buffer gates, it doesn't need to be the default time. That could be useful to finetune some flows.
Yup. I didn't need it, but that feature could certainly be useful.

Another useful one is the memory toggle gate, which is excellent for hysteresis. That is to say, suppose you have a tank which you want to fill until you reach a high-water mark, but then don't touch until it reaches a low-water mark. The gap is useful because otherwise the pump or whatever is going to be turning on in little spurts and thus inefficient.

When I was burning petroleum, I used one of those to control the production. I didn't want the dupes to be constantly running back and forth as I dip below some threshold. Instead, with the hystersis, I could have them operate the machines for most of a cycle, and then for the next couple of cycles ignore it completely. They don't waste time running across my base only to turn the refinery handle a few times and then leave.
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Old 07-19-2018, 03:17 AM
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Looks like there's a few more things to fill out on my map. I scoured it for more geysers, which you can spot from their neutronium base (a 4x1 rectangle). Found a gold geyser (not that useful), a CO2 geyser (which I think I'll use to feed my slickster farm, which is always on the verge of starvation now that I have more efficient power generation), and a couple of cold slush geysers (which put out polluted water). They're pretty scattered, though, so it'll take a bit of effort to hook them up.
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Old 07-19-2018, 08:56 AM
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Another useful one is the memory toggle gate, which is excellent for hysteresis. That is to say, suppose you have a tank which you want to fill until you reach a high-water mark, but then don't touch until it reaches a low-water mark. The gap is useful because otherwise the pump or whatever is going to be turning on in little spurts and thus inefficient.
Oh, that is a good use for it. I'm not sure that having the pump turn on for 1 second 10 times over a minute is less efficient than having it turn on for 1 10 second stretch every minute. Maybe it is in which case I've been doing it wrong.

But what is definitely less efficient is for Dupes to produce 1 unit of A then commute to another part of the base to produce 1 unit of B then commute to another part of the base to produce 1 unit of C then commute to another part of the base to produce 1 unit of A etc. It's much better for a Dupe to crank out a batch of A until you have enough for a while then commute to another part of the base to crank out a batch of B until you have enough for a while etc.

The memory toggle, by turning on/off Dupe-operated machinery on the basis of batches, makes that machinery selectively available to the Dupe which helps to ensure the Dupes are less ADD in their task selection, thus wasting less time on commuting.

TLDR: Task-switching has costs for the most precious resource: the Dupes' time. The memory toggle gate enables you to use that resource more efficiently by consolidating tasks into batches/packets.

Last edited by MichaelEmouse; 07-19-2018 at 09:00 AM.
  #238  
Old 07-19-2018, 02:48 PM
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Oh, jeeze. I didn't realize that filtering polluted water into clean water didn't do anything to the germs in the water. As a result my dupe's health levels have nosedived in the past few cycles. It doesn't help that my research assistant seems to be obsessed with rolling around in slime then running back through the whole base back to the supercomputer.

Not sure if I can save them, even if I go back a few days. The starter biome that this base is built in only had two clean water cisterns in it, and neither was that big. I can see a cold steam vent off to the side, but I'm not sure if I can dig to it and get it set up before running out the original water.

Then again, I have this cunning/stupid plan for a new base that only accepts flatulent dupes and powers everything off the gas they produce. I'll call it "Bartertown".
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Old 07-19-2018, 04:54 PM
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Oh, jeeze. I didn't realize that filtering polluted water into clean water didn't do anything to the germs in the water.
Yup. Even crazier--electrolyzing germy water just puts the germs into the air. This isn't necessarily a disaster, since oxygen will kill germs over time. But if there are a lot of germs, it's not good enough and the dupes will still get sick.
  #240  
Old 07-20-2018, 08:06 AM
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Yup. Even crazier--electrolyzing germy water just puts the germs into the air. This isn't necessarily a disaster, since oxygen will kill germs over time. But if there are a lot of germs, it's not good enough and the dupes will still get sick.
You can actually dump the filtered (germ infested) water into one of the hot zones (if you have access to a geyser that's the best place) and fill the air around it with chlorine gas. It doesn't take long for the water to become germ free. Then pump it into your fresh water tank. I actually have mine going through a series of areas, from highly polluted either where my sewer is or just pockets of polluted water, then through the water sieve filter thingy, then into a tank I built by a cold geyser (which gives you some fresh water anyway) where it sits until the tank is nearly full, then pumped into my main bases fresh water tank.

My main problem in my current game is oxygen. I finally solved the heat problem I had in the last game by getting a bunch of those cold generating cactus thingies and putting them throughout the base, especially where the generators are running but mainly by my farms.
Air though is an issue. I rely on scrubbers, algae air producers, carbon scrubbers and the like, and they just aren't keeping up, plus I have a lot of other gasses that have gotten in (especially hydrogen and natural gas). I finally have a food system that is keeping up and giving me a good buffer for when something breaks, I have the upper level of materials in the pipeline, but it's just the air that's slowly killing the base and I don't seem to be able to fix the issue.

Also, I can't get the exo-suit system to work. I have a forge, I have a rack and checkpoint, but the forge says I need copper ore...but there is copper ore laying about everywhere. I'm not sure what I'm missing. I've gotten this thing to work in the past, but don't remember what I did or what I'm doing wrong. So, I've been using the doors to limit access to the slime zone to only 2 duplicates and I have them going through a series of clean rooms going in and out. So far neither has contracted slime lung, but I had to really crank up making meds to keep them healthy and it's a huge pain in the butt.
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  #241  
Old 07-20-2018, 08:11 AM
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Air though is an issue. I rely on scrubbers, algae air producers, carbon scrubbers and the like, and they just aren't keeping up, plus I have a lot of other gasses that have gotten in (especially hydrogen and natural gas). I finally have a food system that is keeping up and giving me a good buffer for when something breaks, I have the upper level of materials in the pipeline, but it's just the air that's slowly killing the base and I don't seem to be able to fix the issue.
How many Dupes do you have?

How much soylent green?
  #242  
Old 07-20-2018, 09:03 AM
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How many Dupes do you have?

How much soylent green?
I have 12. That seems to be the stable number I can feed with my system and still have some surplus. I know what 'soylent green' is in the movie, but if you mean the mush making machines, I have one. My farms are mainly mealwood, bristle blossoms and sleet wheat. I have some others that were basically just left as I found them and I have set to autoharvest, and I have a huge farm of mushrooms that aren't growing because it's too warm and I've basically abandoned.
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Old 07-20-2018, 09:07 AM
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I have 12. That seems to be the stable number I can feed with my system and still have some surplus. I know what 'soylent green' is in the movie, but if you mean the mush making machines, I have one. My farms are mainly mealwood, bristle blossoms and sleet wheat. I have some others that were basically just left as I found them and I have set to autoharvest, and I have a huge farm of mushrooms that aren't growing because it's too warm and I've basically abandoned.
Small note--do you have a peppernut patch? Setting it up near a geyser to take advantage of the heat is a good idea, and it lets you make the best foods.

Not sure what's wrong with the forge. Do you have the fibers, and do you have an engineer (can't remember if the forge requires the latter)? I might set a storage unit next to the forge, tell it to take the fibers and copper, and set it to priority 9, while emptying copper and fibers out of other units.
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Old 07-20-2018, 09:14 AM
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Small note--do you have a peppernut patch? Setting it up near a geyser to take advantage of the heat is a good idea, and it lets you make the best foods.

Not sure what's wrong with the forge. Do you have the fibers, and do you have an engineer (can't remember if the forge requires the latter)? I might set a storage unit next to the forge, tell it to take the fibers and copper, and set it to priority 9, while emptying copper and fibers out of other units.
There were a few of those peppernut plants in the area with the geyser so I just left them in place and set them to auto-harvest.

I do have an exo-suit engineer. As far as I know I have all the materials. It just won't make the suit. I'm getting around it by basically just taking a chance with 2 duplicates health, but would be nice to figure out why it's not working. Worked fine in the last game, once I realized the checkpoint has to be right next to the suit recharge holder thingy...and that you need to pump fresh oxygen into it, not just any old air.
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  #245  
Old 07-20-2018, 09:33 AM
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There were a few of those peppernut plants in the area with the geyser so I just left them in place and set them to auto-harvest.

I do have an exo-suit engineer. As far as I know I have all the materials. It just won't make the suit. I'm getting around it by basically just taking a chance with 2 duplicates health, but would be nice to figure out why it's not working. Worked fine in the last game, once I realized the checkpoint has to be right next to the suit recharge holder thingy...and that you need to pump fresh oxygen into it, not just any old air.
Maybe rebuild the forge elsewhere? It doesn't need to be anywhere near the checkpoint.
  #246  
Old 07-20-2018, 09:36 AM
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Maybe rebuild the forge elsewhere? It doesn't need to be anywhere near the checkpoint.
Yeah, I'll try that if I get the oxygen situation under control before the whole game spirals out of control and they all die. I'm on cycle 145 and it's already starting to go down hill. Out of desperation I went the slime route with algae makers and so far it has helped but only a matter of time before it goes tits up I think.
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  #247  
Old 07-20-2018, 02:15 PM
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I have 12. That seems to be the stable number I can feed with my system and still have some surplus. I know what 'soylent green' is in the movie, but if you mean the mush making machines, I have one.
I meant that you may simply have too many Dupes breathing too much oxygen so it may be time to do some culling.

Maybe at some point, someone will come up with a mod that allows you to recycle the remains of Dupes. You could call it the Timothy mod: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqDu5LBT8_Y
  #248  
Old 07-23-2018, 01:08 PM
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Is it possible to make a sustainable base by creating a "Pit of Tears/Vomit"? What I'm thinking of is after I have my core team of 6-9 dupes doing actual work, just lock down the area around the dupe printer and keep printing "Ugly Cryers" and "Stress Vomiters". Don't give them any food or a bathroom or anything. Just let them stress out until their tears and ...other stuff falls through the mesh floor into a catch-basin for recycling. That way, I can just keep endlessly producing water for electrolysis and hydrogen generators.

Or is that sort of frowned upon?
  #249  
Old 07-23-2018, 02:04 PM
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Is it possible to make a sustainable base by creating a "Pit of Tears/Vomit"? What I'm thinking of is after I have my core team of 6-9 dupes doing actual work, just lock down the area around the dupe printer and keep printing "Ugly Cryers" and "Stress Vomiters". Don't give them any food or a bathroom or anything. Just let them stress out until their tears and ...other stuff falls through the mesh floor into a catch-basin for recycling. That way, I can just keep endlessly producing water for electrolysis and hydrogen generators.

Or is that sort of frowned upon?

To decrease comfort further, create that prison in the hot bottom pit of the map, you'll have Hell as a source of infinite sustainment. Call your map UAC.

Last edited by MichaelEmouse; 07-23-2018 at 02:05 PM.
  #250  
Old 07-23-2018, 02:40 PM
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Is it possible to make a sustainable base by creating a "Pit of Tears/Vomit"? What I'm thinking of is after I have my core team of 6-9 dupes doing actual work, just lock down the area around the dupe printer and keep printing "Ugly Cryers" and "Stress Vomiters". Don't give them any food or a bathroom or anything. Just let them stress out until their tears and ...other stuff falls through the mesh floor into a catch-basin for recycling. That way, I can just keep endlessly producing water for electrolysis and hydrogen generators.

Or is that sort of frowned upon?
I like the way you think, but I suspect the buildup of corpses would increase your actual worker stress. I didn't notice that one of my dupes had gotten her head encased in a tile and died except that there was a big jump in stress and everyone had a "mourning" status.

Bartertown was a bust. After about 40 cycles my little fartmeisters did build up a nice thick layer of natural gas, but a single generator burned through it all in about three cycles. Not worth it. I'm not even sure the power generated made up for the power draw of the air pump and filter the system needed.
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