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  #951  
Old 12-15-2018, 08:36 PM
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NBC uploaded a video with some behind-the-scenes clips of D'Arcy Carden explaining how it was done.
  #952  
Old 12-15-2018, 08:56 PM
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Really, I just want to know what happened ca. 1497

In fourteen hundred and ninety-seven, Giovanni Borgia went to Heaven.
  #953  
Old 01-07-2019, 08:43 AM
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E! had the best joke of the Golden Globes -- and it's based on The Good Place. Funny on so many levels.

If you don't want to click on the link:
SPOILER:
Jameela Jamil was identified on the red carpet as Kamilah al-Jamal.


BTW, Jameela also tweeted that she wore jeans under her dress because it was so cold.

Last edited by RealityChuck; 01-07-2019 at 08:45 AM.
  #954  
Old 01-07-2019, 09:02 AM
Dale Sams Dale Sams is offline
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E! had the best joke of the Golden Globes -- and it's based on The Good Place. Funny on so many levels.


BTW, Jameela also tweeted that she wore jeans under her dress because it was so cold.
Oh Tahani...I think your sister would be more outraged that you were identified as her,

Last edited by Dale Sams; 01-07-2019 at 09:02 AM.
  #955  
Old 01-08-2019, 11:43 AM
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Eleanor was definitely "Bad", and so was Jason. But Chidi and Tahani? Flawed, yes, but not "bad".
It made sense in the context they showed it, though. Because motivation and impact were factors, Tahani (whose motives were always impure) and Chidi (whose impact was always minimal because he couldn't commit to anything) came out as fairly neutral. And neutral wasn't good enough. It was always implied that the Good Place had a pretty high bar, since most of the fake inhabitants were suggested to be, essentially, paragons.
  #956  
Old 01-08-2019, 01:06 PM
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Then why not send Chidi to the Neutral Place?
  #957  
Old 01-08-2019, 01:42 PM
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Because Mike Schur has not thought nearly as much about the world he's building as people on the internet do.

Since this thread has been bumped, here's what Janet does in her void.

Last edited by Inner Stickler; 01-08-2019 at 01:42 PM.
  #958  
Old 01-08-2019, 03:02 PM
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SPOILER:
omg I thought it said five minutes. "Sure I can check that out for five minutes", I said to myself. But . . . shudder!
  #959  
Old 01-08-2019, 03:09 PM
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Because Mike Schur has not thought nearly as much about the world he's building as people on the internet do.
That's quite often true. Look, for instance, at how people have analyzed Quidditch and found that the scoring makes no sense.
  #960  
Old 01-08-2019, 03:25 PM
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I fast forwarded -- I found two times she boops out (around 1:15:10 and 4:19:20)
Must have been an interesting shoot "D'Arcy -- just stand there for a few hours" (probbaly not one take...)

Brian
  #961  
Old 01-08-2019, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by RealityChuck View Post
E! had the best joke of the Golden Globes -- and it's based on The Good Place. Funny on so many levels.

If you don't want to click on the link:
SPOILER:
Jameela Jamil was identified on the red carpet as Kamilah al-Jamal.


BTW, Jameela also tweeted that she wore jeans under her dress because it was so cold.
Heh... chyron humor.

So if they had shown Tehani as a centaur, would that have been Chiron humor?
  #962  
Old 01-08-2019, 06:02 PM
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Then why not send Chidi to the Neutral Place?
Because the Medium Place is weird. It's not where Medium People go. According to the Good Place wiki, Mindy was sent there not because she was morally "neutral," but because the Good and Bad Place folks couldn't reach a consensus for whether she deserved credit for INTENDING to do something that would have gotten her into the Good Place but dying before she personally achieved it.

I think Mindy's case also plays into what I think is the growing story of the show: the Bad Place isn't "hacking the system." The system is fundamentally broken, and judging point totals for actions is the wrong approach.
  #963  
Old 01-08-2019, 08:27 PM
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That's quite often true. Look, for instance, at how people have analyzed Quidditch and found that the scoring makes no sense.
It really didn't take much analysis. Maybe a minute or so.
  #964  
Old 01-10-2019, 10:09 PM
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Not sure how I feel about the point revelation in this episode.

But I did enjoy Nicole Byer's turn as the mailwoman.
  #965  
Old 01-11-2019, 12:55 AM
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Four Oreos From Heaven. Band name.
  #966  
Old 01-11-2019, 01:48 AM
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Not sure how I feel about the point revelation in this episode.
It's an interesting idea... but would it really have started 500 years ago? Presumably there were plenty of indigenous people 500 years ago whose lives had not yet been massively overcomplicated by the intricacies of modern industrialized society.

Definitely a fun episode, however. Tahani's favorite smell is the smell of the curtain closing between first class and coach
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  #967  
Old 01-11-2019, 06:31 AM
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Episode: "The Book of Dougs"
Discussion started in #964

I've given up Netflix temporarily in favour of Amazon Prime and will probably not see any of the rest of the season until it's over, so could I request that the first person to start talking about a new episode makes it clear this is where the new episode discussion starts? Or at least one of the next couple of posters make a post like this one?
  #968  
Old 01-11-2019, 06:39 AM
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You can watch on nbc.com for free (with ads)

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  #969  
Old 01-11-2019, 07:09 AM
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You can watch on nbc.com for free (with ads)

Brian
Not in the UK
  #970  
Old 01-11-2019, 11:02 AM
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Tahani had me rolling with laughter last night - she got the best lines.
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  #971  
Old 01-11-2019, 02:40 PM
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Not sure how I feel about the point revelation in this episode.

But I did enjoy Nicole Byer's turn as the mailwoman.
I don't think the show is trying to say the change in how points are allocated is fair or right. Rather, that is that is how the Bad Place gamed the system.
  #972  
Old 01-11-2019, 02:46 PM
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I get that. I think I'm just hoping for a resolution that is "The point system is fundamentally flawed" and not "We've re-weighted the point system and everything is fine (maybe)."
  #973  
Old 01-11-2019, 02:47 PM
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I get that. I think I'm just hoping for a resolution that is "The point system is fundamentally flawed" and not "We've re-weighted the point system and everything is fine (maybe)."
My suspicion is that that's the conversation that Michael is hoping to have with the Judge in the next episode.

Of course, it being Michael, everything will go pear-shaped almost instantly.
  #974  
Old 01-11-2019, 02:48 PM
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It's Good to be back, but it wasn't one of the better episodes. Heaven as a cheerful, banal and nave legalistic collective doesn't really seem that great. Maybe it's better for the actual humans in it, but the Council really didn't seem very concerned about humans. Eleanor seemed to ricochet from one emotional outburst to another. But, there were good parts. I liked Michael's realization that the point system was broken, not hacked. Loved D'Arcy Carden / Janet as usual. ("I'm worried that my emotions will start leaking out. (whisper) What if they come out my butt?" Chidi in the mail outfit was sweet and I loved that Michael wouldn't give him a minute to change before heading out to IHOP.

"Is everything all right in there?"
"Um, yes, we're fine.."
"Okay! No follow-up questions!"
  #975  
Old 01-11-2019, 04:24 PM
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Heaven as a cheerful, banal and nave legalistic collective doesn't really seem that great.
I definitely agree with that, and I hope we'll learn that there's something more going on. "Good people can't get stuff done because they spend all their time forming well-meaning committees" is an INCREDIBLY trite and banal bit of social commentary, which _The Good Place_ is usually better than.
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  #976  
Old 01-11-2019, 04:43 PM
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I definitely agree with that, and I hope we'll learn that there's something more going on. "Good people can't get stuff done because they spend all their time forming well-meaning committees" is an INCREDIBLY trite and banal bit of social commentary, which _The Good Place_ is usually better than.
I viewed it more as, "the scoring system is a mess, and most of the actual 'good people' can't actually get into the place, as a result. So, the God Place winds up being filled with painfully nice, well-meaning people, who never actually do anything."
  #977  
Old 01-11-2019, 05:01 PM
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Is the committee good people or the angelic counterpart to the accountants and the demons?
  #978  
Old 01-11-2019, 05:37 PM
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The current system seems to discount intent when it determines points primarily based on unintended consequences.

I know there is a name for the debate over which matters more from an ethical culpability and responsibility perspective, intent or consequences, but I can't remember what the argument is called. Anyone?
  #979  
Old 01-11-2019, 08:57 PM
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Is the committee good people or the angelic counterpart to the accountants and the demons?
Yep; committee members being higher ranking than the mailwoman.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kenobi 65 View Post
My suspicion is that that's the conversation that Michael is hoping to have with the Judge in the next episode.

Of course, it being Michael, everything will go pear-shaped almost instantly.
I can't wait to see that.

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It's an interesting idea... but would it really have started 500 years ago? Presumably there were plenty of indigenous people 500 years ago whose lives had not yet been massively overcomplicated by the intricacies of modern industrialized society...
There are still isolated tribes living more or less the same way their ancestors did 500 years ago; presumably it shouldn't be any harder for them to get into the Good Place. Also there's still the matter of intellectually disabled people or people who die in childhood or infancy that the show hasn't addressed (not that I think they ever will).
  #980  
Old 01-11-2019, 09:10 PM
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"Is everything all right in there?"
"Um, yes, we're fine.."
"Okay! No follow-up questions!"
The mailwoman was a wonderful character.

"Michael, have you all been lying to me this whole time? That upsets me! I'm gonna try to shake my fist at you!"

*lifts hand, begins waving cheerily, looks at hand*

"Oh, gosh darn it!"
  #981  
Old 01-11-2019, 10:24 PM
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"It's really weird that you guys won a contest to be in this building..."

"Oh...take that up with the folks at Weird Contest Magazine."




ps: As a fan of How Did This Get Made?, it was fun seeing Paul Scheer.

Last edited by blondebear; 01-11-2019 at 10:28 PM.
  #982  
Old 01-12-2019, 12:05 PM
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I viewed it more as, "the scoring system is a mess, and most of the actual 'good people' can't actually get into the place, as a result. So, the God Place winds up being filled with painfully nice, well-meaning people, who never actually do anything."
I don't think that the committee members are intended to be former humans who themselves made it into the good place, any more than Michael and Trevor are former humans who ended up in the bad place. But... hard to say.
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  #983  
Old 01-12-2019, 08:56 PM
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I don't think that the committee members are intended to be former humans who themselves made it into the good place, any more than Michael and Trevor are former humans who ended up in the bad place. But... hard to say.
Agreed. The committee members were talking about things that happened 200k years ago, when all that stabbing stuff started - so clearly not human. The Good Place equivalent of Sean's team, but without a Sean to take control.

Mindy St. Clair was a hint about unintended consequences - a bad person who accidentally did a lot of good and got credit for it. Just need to turn it around to see a lot of good people who accidentally did bad and got discredit for it.

And once again: I did not see that coming.
  #984  
Old 01-12-2019, 09:06 PM
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The 'angels' are, just like the demons, ridiculous characters who seem to genuinely love what they do.

I've been wondering for a while if that's an important detail. Everything we've seen about the demons shows them to be endlessly fascinated by bad humans. Are we seeing a situation where the angels and demons are both shaped by the actions of humans?
  #985  
Old 01-13-2019, 01:25 PM
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I definitely agree with that, and I hope we'll learn that there's something more going on. "Good people can't get stuff done because they spend all their time forming well-meaning committees" is an INCREDIBLY trite and banal bit of social commentary, which _The Good Place_ is usually better than.
I get the criticism, but I wouldn't say the "fart and noogie" vibe of the demons is a particularly nuanced portrayal, either. I think ineffectually-cautious bureaucrats is fairly equivalent, but not necessarily as fun on screen.
  #986  
Old 01-13-2019, 05:20 PM
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Rather, that is that is how the Bad Place gamed the system.
I think Michael's insight is that no one game the system. The Bad Place folks may not even be aware that no one has made it to the Good Place for 500 years - it certainly was news to the accountant.
  #987  
Old 01-13-2019, 06:41 PM
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The Bad Place folks may not even be aware that no one has made it to the Good Place for 500 years - it certainly was news to the accountant.
Sean knew - he told Michael that Doug Forcett would be going to the Bad Place.
  #988  
Old 01-13-2019, 08:27 PM
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I think Michael's insight is that no one game the system. The Bad Place folks may not even be aware that no one has made it to the Good Place for 500 years - it certainly was news to the accountant.
And to Michael, who is one of the bad place folks.
  #989  
Old 01-13-2019, 10:29 PM
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If anyone gamed the system, my bet is on the people in the good place. Maybe they like heaven a lot more without thousands of pesky humans arriving every day.

Or, this is commentary about the social media age, and how anyone's actions can be found to be problematic if you just look far enough downstream. Sort of like 'Six degrees of separation from evil'.

Last edited by Sam Stone; 01-13-2019 at 10:29 PM.
  #990  
Old 01-14-2019, 11:07 AM
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Or, this is commentary about the social media age, and how anyone's actions can be found to be problematic if you just look far enough downstream. Sort of like 'Six degrees of separation from evil'.
Maybe... but that wouldn't have been in full swing everywhere in the world for the past 500 years, would it?
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  #991  
Old 01-14-2019, 11:31 AM
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I think Michael's insight is that no one game the system. The Bad Place folks may not even be aware that no one has made it to the Good Place for 500 years - it certainly was news to the accountant.
It was not credible that the accountant did not know that no human had made it to the good place in a year, let alone 500 years. A supervisor looks at the big picture.

Last time I brought it up we discussed that maybe the accountants were in on not wanting humans to get to the good place. But if the situation is really just point creep that was not adjusted for, then what is up with the accountants not monitoring the situation they are in charge of? There are billions of them.
  #992  
Old 01-14-2019, 11:37 AM
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Not sure if I felt a lot of chemistry between Chidi and Eleanor, now that they are finally together. Maybe they have known each other so long they are now at the old married couple stage.

Hopefully, Michael realizes after being let down again that he will have to be in charge of whatever changes might be made.

Last edited by Mikemike2; 01-14-2019 at 11:38 AM.
  #993  
Old 01-14-2019, 11:50 AM
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My favourite line was Jason to Tahani "It's nice to know I can talk about girls with my wife!...
  #994  
Old 01-14-2019, 02:13 PM
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It was not credible that the accountant did not know that no human had made it to the good place in a year, let alone 500 years. A supervisor looks at the big picture.
It really depends on the time scales they are used to dealing with. If they really have been at this for many 100,000 years, then a 500 year dry spell might not be something they would notice. Remember the remark about stabbing.

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Not sure if I felt a lot of chemistry between Chidi and Eleanor, now that they are finally together.
My wife made the same comment.
  #995  
Old 01-14-2019, 02:45 PM
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It was not credible that the accountant did not know that no human had made it to the good place in a year, let alone 500 years. A supervisor looks at the big picture.

Last time I brought it up we discussed that maybe the accountants were in on not wanting humans to get to the good place. But if the situation is really just point creep that was not adjusted for, then what is up with the accountants not monitoring the situation they are in charge of? There are billions of them.
I mean, obviously that's a bit of a goof but I think it's pretty much just a dig at "bean counters." The head accountant's job is just to make sure the numbers add up. He's NOT looking at the bigger picture of what the numbers DO. He just makes sure his team is following the rules. And the fact that they are apparently cross-checked by oodles of other accountants and come to the same results apparently means they ARE doing it right.

It's worth being aware that the impossibility of an accurate (or even "accurate enough") "felicific calculus" to tally the effects of an action has long been considered a major problem with utilitarian ethics. Just like Season 2 built a lot of its ethical points around dissecting the Trolley Problem, Season 3 seems to be aiming to undermine the problems of utilitarianism.
  #996  
Old 01-14-2019, 04:08 PM
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I've finished the second season on Netflix, and sadly have to wait for more.

D’Arcy Carden (Janet) looks and sounds so uncannily like the girl I dated in 1990-92 that I had to look her up on IMDB. Nope, not her, and she's about a decade too young.
  #997  
Old 01-14-2019, 06:58 PM
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I mean, obviously that's a bit of a goof but I think it's pretty much just a dig at "bean counters." The head accountant's job is just to make sure the numbers add up. He's NOT looking at the bigger picture of what the numbers DO. He just makes sure his team is following the rules. And the fact that they are apparently cross-checked by oodles of other accountants and come to the same results apparently means they ARE doing it right.

It's worth being aware that the impossibility of an accurate (or even "accurate enough") "felicific calculus" to tally the effects of an action has long been considered a major problem with utilitarian ethics. Just like Season 2 built a lot of its ethical points around dissecting the Trolley Problem, Season 3 seems to be aiming to undermine the problems of utilitarianism.
Yes, I think so, too. And of course, a major point is being made about modern culture---particularly the social-media component of it---in which "judging other people" has become a major pastime for millions.

You bought your mother flowers? And you think you're going to get praise for it? Well, how about all the ____________________________________________________ [insert long list of Negative Unintended Consequences, only some of which were mentioned in this episode!]

Scolding other people for Being Thoughtless or for Enabling Exploitation or for Killing the Rain Forest, etc. etc. etc. far into the night, is pretty much what we do, these days.

'Pleasure in shaming others' as an orientation to life is something Michael Schur is skewering, here.


(my emphasis in the quote)
  #998  
Old 01-14-2019, 07:35 PM
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If you want to get deep you could say the theme is that all systems start out with good intentions and good purposes but eventually they lose the purpose and only serve to perpetuate the system itself. Yes, The Good Place is basically The Wire.
  #999  
Old 01-14-2019, 07:45 PM
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Yes, The Good Place is basically The Wire.
Please let the series end with Michael saying what the fork did I do? while dropping Eleanor off in Phoenix
  #1000  
Old 01-17-2019, 10:06 PM
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Episode: "Chidi Sees the Time-Knife"
Discussion started in #1000 Wait, really?

I liked the Niednagel joke.

Last edited by Inner Stickler; 01-17-2019 at 10:06 PM.
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